Official Dream Theater Thread

[TexMike]

AVFTTOTW has to be the best sounding DT studio album ever. Every instrument crystal clear and balanced in the mix. Mangini's drums finally have punch and I love the panning they do with his fills. Andy Sneap strikes gold again.

 

My top two tracks are Sleeping Giant and Answering The Call. But it's solid throughout with no skippers. Amazing release from a band who's 15 albums into a career.

[J2112YYZ]

Great to see all the love for Answering The Call.

[bluefox4000]

I think my fav is still Trancending Time. rhere are so many memorable hooks all in this one song.

 

Answering The Call too. i think this is one of the most tuneful DT albums of the modern Era.

 

I love this album.

 

Mick

Edited November 22, 2021 by bluefox4000

[TexMike]

I think the real sin with Octavarium is they sound too much like the artist's they're taking "inspiration" from. Like, Never Enough and Panic Attack especially are blatant Muse ripoffs. You can even pinpoint the exact parts of the exact songs they were copying! But, given how much I love those Muse songs, and given DT does add extra virtuosic musicianship to the equation that Muse doesn't match, I do still get a lot out of the DT songs.

 

That happened on more albums than just Octavarium. Constant Motion, for example, IS a Metallica song. You can practically sing the lyrics of "Blackened" over the verses. The styles of many other bands Portnoy was being influenced by crept in during the Six Degrees - Black Clouds period. I thought the best thing about him leaving was that DT went back to sounding like classic DT again.

[Entre_Perpetuo]

I think the real sin with Octavarium is they sound too much like the artist's they're taking "inspiration" from. Like, Never Enough and Panic Attack especially are blatant Muse ripoffs. You can even pinpoint the exact parts of the exact songs they were copying! But, given how much I love those Muse songs, and given DT does add extra virtuosic musicianship to the equation that Muse doesn't match, I do still get a lot out of the DT songs.

 

That happened on more albums than just Octavarium. Constant Motion, for example, IS a Metallica song. You can practically sing the lyrics of "Blackened" over the verses. The styles of many other bands Portnoy was being influenced by crept in during the Six Degrees - Black Clouds period. I thought the best thing about him leaving was that DT went back to sounding like classic DT again.

 

Whatever album Constant Motion is on, I’ve yet to hear it!

 

But I think it’s really overt on Octavarium. I can see it a bit on 6Degrees (there’s a Toolish song, a song with King Crimson references, and of course Solitary Shell is more than indebted to Solisbury Hill), but that still feels like DT just culling from their usual influences to me, maybe a bit more heavy handed. On Octavarium the Muse influence is brand spanking new and unmistakable, plus I Walk Beside You sees DT making a play at being U2, which is pretty foreign to them otherwise. Not to mention the title track (which I love dearly), lifts ideas from Floyd (the intro), Kansas (one of the main themes), Styx/Yes (the keyboard solo), Genesis (the structure), and then a whole bunch of artists for the lyrical miracle section full of references. It’s a very obvious album to me as far as influences go.

[Segue Myles]

Yikes I feel like the only person who thinks the album is just "very good".

 

Still, it's a highlight of the year for me. It's not impacted me the way Distance Over Time did, unfortunately.

[Entre_Perpetuo]

Yikes I feel like the only person who thinks the album is just "very good".

 

Still, it's a highlight of the year for me. It's not impacted me the way Distance Over Time did, unfortunately.

 

I'm struggling with my opinion right now. I just bought s/t the other week and I finally got started listening to it tonight for the first time in years... and it's a lot better than I remember.... like a lot better... I don't know what my rankings are anymore. I can't find the bad DT album. I even like TA! :16ton:

[stoopid]

... I can't find the bad DT album. I even like TA! :16ton:

 

You're losing your hearing and going senile.

[stoopid]

Yikes I feel like the only person who thinks the album is just "very good".

 

Still, it's a highlight of the year for me. It's not impacted me the way Distance Over Time did, unfortunately.

 

I'm somewhere between Very Good and Excellent. Distance Over Time was only very good for me, and I listen to it fairly rarely. The quality of the mix and overall 'feel' on these tracks is more organic IMO, it's got a lot to like and not a single stinker as someone mentioned a few posts back.

[Entre_Perpetuo]

... I can't find the bad DT album. I even like TA! :16ton:

 

You're losing your hearing and going senile.

 

Oh no, and before I even go to see them live. Now I'll be one of those crazy fans in the front row brushing his teeth frantically while losing my mind to Brother Can You Hear Me!

[bluefox4000]

it's ok if you don't enjoy this album as much. now you feel my pain with Distance anyway, lol

 

that album just remains in the firm ok camp. and TRF LOVES this thing so what do i know.

 

no wrong answers.

 

Mick

[Entre_Perpetuo]

it's ok if you don't enjoy this album as much. now you feel my pain with Distance anyway, lol

 

that album just remains in the firm ok camp. and TRF LOVES this thing so what do i know.

 

no wrong answers.

 

Mick

 

Mick I relistened to DT for the first time in years today and it was really really good... like... maybe the best Mangini era album good... I'm so conflicted anymore!

[bluefox4000]

it's ok if you don't enjoy this album as much. now you feel my pain with Distance anyway, lol

 

that album just remains in the firm ok camp. and TRF LOVES this thing so what do i know.

 

no wrong answers.

 

Mick

 

Mick I relistened to DT for the first time in years today and it was really really good... like... maybe the best Mangini era album good... I'm so conflicted anymore!

 

I LOVE the self titled so much it hurts, lol it's SUPER good. i'd never even put distance anywhere near the self titled's orbit.

 

 

it has a slight AOR flavor going for t too. i said the new one was my fav mangini era but no it's Self titled first all the way.

 

Mick

[J2112YYZ]

... I can't find the bad DT album. I even like TA! :16ton:

 

You're losing your hearing and going senile.

 

Oh no, and before I even go to see them live. Now I'll be one of those crazy fans in the front row brushing his teeth frantically while losing my mind to Brother Can You Hear Me!

 

Funny you bring that up as I have witnessed a few fans in the front row losing their minds when I saw them on the Systemic Chaos tour and they were playing In The Presence Of Enemies. These guys were headbanging and singing along like their life's depended on it. The one guy was even smacking his hand on the front of the stage to the beat of the drums.

[J2112YYZ]

it's ok if you don't enjoy this album as much. now you feel my pain with Distance anyway, lol

 

that album just remains in the firm ok camp. and TRF LOVES this thing so what do i know.

 

no wrong answers.

 

Mick

 

Mick I relistened to DT for the first time in years today and it was really really good... like... maybe the best Mangini era album good... I'm so conflicted anymore!

 

I LOVE the self titled so much it hurts, lol it's SUPER good. i'd never even put distance anywhere near the self titled's orbit.

 

 

it has a slight AOR flavor going for t too. i said the new one was my fav mangini era but no it's Self titled first all the way.

 

Mick

 

I saw them on that tour and all the new stuff got a great reaction. That's definitely an album most fans seem to love. I still remember the huge roar from the crowd when they started Illumination Theory. You would have thought it was an old favorite going by how they responded after the opening notes.

[Todem]

I've figured it out.

 

This album is basically Octavarium 2, the same way ADTOE is basically Images And Words 2. I've been really getting into it today. It's very dense, and the melodies I lamented not being there I'm slowly finding. They're subtle. James isn't doing anything mind-blowing, but he doesn't do anything bad either.

 

I see no comparison between this and Octavarium since half that album stinks and A View is consistently very good beginning to end.

 

Lol I don't mean quality wise, I mean like, tone, feel, a little bit of structure. You've got your 20 minute epic to close it out, your heavy and mildly chaotic extended length opener, Transcending Time is kinda the I Walk Beside You of the album. Answering The Call reminds me a lot of Panic Attack and Never Enough. Invisible Monster correlates to the slightly darker but rather pop structured tone of These Walls. These aren't quality correlations, just like mood, atmosphere, intent sort of correlations. Obviously Octavarium has its own world its living in, but I think AVFTTOTW lives in a rather similar space. The production also reminds me a bit of it, much rounder drums, almost wetter, and lots of deep hues on the chugging, with Jordan having some similar kinds of keyboard tones.

 

I'm not really seeing that other than maybe timbre. Jordan seems to be allowed do a bit more which I've always thought was a good thing. In fact, my favorite Jordan albums are Six Degrees, Octavarium and The Astonishing.

 

It may be Jordan's more active role I'm latching onto. I'm listening again right now. Answering The Call still reminds me a lot of Panic Attack and Never Enough.

 

Never Enough is a bad song though. Answering The Call is awesome. It would be funny if when they were writing the album they thought "what if Never Enough was a song people actually wanted to hear?" and Answering The Call was what they came up with. The intro to The Alien reminds me more of Panic Attack.

 

Oh I like Never Enough a lot. I definitely see what you mean though about the intro to The Alien and Panic Attack.

 

The lyrics for Never Enough really bring it down for me. I have no interest in a grown man writing lyrics that sound like a whiny teenager. The same with I Walk Beside You. I don't listen to Dream Theater to hear pop tunes. We have Phil Collins for that stuff.

 

I think they aren't the best fit for DT, but they still make it work. I think the real sin with Octavarium is they sound too much like the artist's they're taking "inspiration" from. Like, Never Enough and Panic Attack especially are blatant Muse ripoffs. You can even pinpoint the exact parts of the exact songs they were copying! But, given how much I love those Muse songs, and given DT does add extra virtuosic musicianship to the equation that Muse doesn't match, I do still get a lot out of the DT songs.

 

Like the blatant Gilmore ripoff John Petrucci does on the album closing epic? LOL. I mean....I love that song....but all I think about is Shine On You Crazy Diamond. Like it is.....a “Hey I loved Pink Floyd and this is my tribute to Gilmore”.

Edited November 25, 2021 by Todem

[Todem]

it's ok if you don't enjoy this album as much. now you feel my pain with Distance anyway, lol

 

that album just remains in the firm ok camp. and TRF LOVES this thing so what do i know.

 

no wrong answers.

 

Mick

 

Mick I relistened to DT for the first time in years today and it was really really good... like... maybe the best Mangini era album good... I'm so conflicted anymore!

 

I LOVE the self titled so much it hurts, lol it's SUPER good. i'd never even put distance anywhere near the self titled's orbit.

 

 

it has a slight AOR flavor going for t too. i said the new one was my fav mangini era but no it's Self titled first all the way.

 

Mick

 

I saw them on that tour and all the new stuff got a great reaction. That's definitely an album most fans seem to love. I still remember the huge roar from the crowd when they started Illumination Theory. You would have thought it was an old favorite going by how they responded after the opening notes.

 

Surrender To Reason may be one of my all time favorite DT songs and they have never played it live. Please......pull that gem out. AMAZING SONG.

 

DT is a fantastic Album.....the only thing that still makes my skin crawl a little is that god awful snare drum sound. And I think it has a lot to do with Mangini probably recording all hs drum parts remotely and I think they learned....they all need to get into the studio together and make an album to have that synergy going and also not letting the sonic quality get away from them.

 

The new album sonically is brilliant. And DoT was also really good. Production with this band is critical with so much going on. It is why we were so critical with Rush when they released Vapor Trails.....and CA also was too muddy in retrospect.

 

Anyway getting off track. I am pumped for the tour. We have front row John P side in Tampa and I pray we get a very diverse set of deep material along with most of the new album. Transcending Time......PLEASE PLAY THAT SONG.

Edited November 25, 2021 by Todem

[Entre_Perpetuo]

it's ok if you don't enjoy this album as much. now you feel my pain with Distance anyway, lol

 

that album just remains in the firm ok camp. and TRF LOVES this thing so what do i know.

 

no wrong answers.

 

Mick

 

Mick I relistened to DT for the first time in years today and it was really really good... like... maybe the best Mangini era album good... I'm so conflicted anymore!

 

I LOVE the self titled so much it hurts, lol it's SUPER good. i'd never even put distance anywhere near the self titled's orbit.

 

 

it has a slight AOR flavor going for t too. i said the new one was my fav mangini era but no it's Self titled first all the way.

 

Mick

 

I saw them on that tour and all the new stuff got a great reaction. That's definitely an album most fans seem to love. I still remember the huge roar from the crowd when they started Illumination Theory. You would have thought it was an old favorite going by how they responded after the opening notes.

 

Surrender To Reason may be one of my all time favorite DT songs and they have never played it live. Please......pull that gem out. AMAZING SONG.

 

DT is a fantastic Album.....the only thing that still makes my skin crawl a little is that god awful snare drum sound. And I think it has a lot to do with Mangini probably recording all hs drum parts remotely and I think they learned....they all need to get into the studio together and make an album to have that synergy going and also not letting the sonic quality get away from them.

 

The new album sonically is brilliant. And DoT was also really good. Production with this band is critical with so much going on. It is why we were so critical with Rush when they released Vapor Trails.....and CA also was too muddy in retrospect.

 

Anyway getting off track. I am pumped for the tour. We have front row Mike P side in Tampa and I pray we get a very diverse set of deep material along with most of the new album. Transcending Time......PLEASE PLAY THAT SONG.

 

The Mike P side?

[Entre_Perpetuo]

I've figured it out.

 

This album is basically Octavarium 2, the same way ADTOE is basically Images And Words 2. I've been really getting into it today. It's very dense, and the melodies I lamented not being there I'm slowly finding. They're subtle. James isn't doing anything mind-blowing, but he doesn't do anything bad either.

 

I see no comparison between this and Octavarium since half that album stinks and A View is consistently very good beginning to end.

 

Lol I don't mean quality wise, I mean like, tone, feel, a little bit of structure. You've got your 20 minute epic to close it out, your heavy and mildly chaotic extended length opener, Transcending Time is kinda the I Walk Beside You of the album. Answering The Call reminds me a lot of Panic Attack and Never Enough. Invisible Monster correlates to the slightly darker but rather pop structured tone of These Walls. These aren't quality correlations, just like mood, atmosphere, intent sort of correlations. Obviously Octavarium has its own world its living in, but I think AVFTTOTW lives in a rather similar space. The production also reminds me a bit of it, much rounder drums, almost wetter, and lots of deep hues on the chugging, with Jordan having some similar kinds of keyboard tones.

 

I'm not really seeing that other than maybe timbre. Jordan seems to be allowed do a bit more which I've always thought was a good thing. In fact, my favorite Jordan albums are Six Degrees, Octavarium and The Astonishing.

 

It may be Jordan's more active role I'm latching onto. I'm listening again right now. Answering The Call still reminds me a lot of Panic Attack and Never Enough.

 

Never Enough is a bad song though. Answering The Call is awesome. It would be funny if when they were writing the album they thought "what if Never Enough was a song people actually wanted to hear?" and Answering The Call was what they came up with. The intro to The Alien reminds me more of Panic Attack.

 

Oh I like Never Enough a lot. I definitely see what you mean though about the intro to The Alien and Panic Attack.

 

The lyrics for Never Enough really bring it down for me. I have no interest in a grown man writing lyrics that sound like a whiny teenager. The same with I Walk Beside You. I don't listen to Dream Theater to hear pop tunes. We have Phil Collins for that stuff.

 

I think they aren't the best fit for DT, but they still make it work. I think the real sin with Octavarium is they sound too much like the artist's they're taking "inspiration" from. Like, Never Enough and Panic Attack especially are blatant Muse ripoffs. You can even pinpoint the exact parts of the exact songs they were copying! But, given how much I love those Muse songs, and given DT does add extra virtuosic musicianship to the equation that Muse doesn't match, I do still get a lot out of the DT songs.

 

Like the blatant Gilmore ripoff Mike Petrucci does on the album closing epic? LOL. I mean....I love that song....but all I think about is Shine On You Crazy Diamond. Like it is.....a “Hey I loved Pink Floyd and this is my tribute to Gilmore”.

 

Sure, but I think you're mixing up the current guitarist and the old drummer, lol.

[Todem]

I've figured it out.

 

This album is basically Octavarium 2, the same way ADTOE is basically Images And Words 2. I've been really getting into it today. It's very dense, and the melodies I lamented not being there I'm slowly finding. They're subtle. James isn't doing anything mind-blowing, but he doesn't do anything bad either.

 

I see no comparison between this and Octavarium since half that album stinks and A View is consistently very good beginning to end.

 

Lol I don't mean quality wise, I mean like, tone, feel, a little bit of structure. You've got your 20 minute epic to close it out, your heavy and mildly chaotic extended length opener, Transcending Time is kinda the I Walk Beside You of the album. Answering The Call reminds me a lot of Panic Attack and Never Enough. Invisible Monster correlates to the slightly darker but rather pop structured tone of These Walls. These aren't quality correlations, just like mood, atmosphere, intent sort of correlations. Obviously Octavarium has its own world its living in, but I think AVFTTOTW lives in a rather similar space. The production also reminds me a bit of it, much rounder drums, almost wetter, and lots of deep hues on the chugging, with Jordan having some similar kinds of keyboard tones.

 

I'm not really seeing that other than maybe timbre. Jordan seems to be allowed do a bit more which I've always thought was a good thing. In fact, my favorite Jordan albums are Six Degrees, Octavarium and The Astonishing.

 

It may be Jordan's more active role I'm latching onto. I'm listening again right now. Answering The Call still reminds me a lot of Panic Attack and Never Enough.

 

Never Enough is a bad song though. Answering The Call is awesome. It would be funny if when they were writing the album they thought "what if Never Enough was a song people actually wanted to hear?" and Answering The Call was what they came up with. The intro to The Alien reminds me more of Panic Attack.

 

Oh I like Never Enough a lot. I definitely see what you mean though about the intro to The Alien and Panic Attack.

 

The lyrics for Never Enough really bring it down for me. I have no interest in a grown man writing lyrics that sound like a whiny teenager. The same with I Walk Beside You. I don't listen to Dream Theater to hear pop tunes. We have Phil Collins for that stuff.

 

I think they aren't the best fit for DT, but they still make it work. I think the real sin with Octavarium is they sound too much like the artist's they're taking "inspiration" from. Like, Never Enough and Panic Attack especially are blatant Muse ripoffs. You can even pinpoint the exact parts of the exact songs they were copying! But, given how much I love those Muse songs, and given DT does add extra virtuosic musicianship to the equation that Muse doesn't match, I do still get a lot out of the DT songs.

 

Like the blatant Gilmore ripoff Mike Petrucci does on the album closing epic? LOL. I mean....I love that song....but all I think about is Shine On You Crazy Diamond. Like it is.....a “Hey I loved Pink Floyd and this is my tribute to Gilmore”.

 

Sure, but I think you're mixing up the current guitarist and the old drummer, lol.

 

Man......a senior moment if there was ever one.

 

John P......LMFAO.

 

Happy Thanksgiving!!!

[ytserush]

I've figured it out.

 

This album is basically Octavarium 2, the same way ADTOE is basically Images And Words 2. I've been really getting into it today. It's very dense, and the melodies I lamented not being there I'm slowly finding. They're subtle. James isn't doing anything mind-blowing, but he doesn't do anything bad either.

 

I see no comparison between this and Octavarium since half that album stinks and A View is consistently very good beginning to end.

 

Lol I don't mean quality wise, I mean like, tone, feel, a little bit of structure. You've got your 20 minute epic to close it out, your heavy and mildly chaotic extended length opener, Transcending Time is kinda the I Walk Beside You of the album. Answering The Call reminds me a lot of Panic Attack and Never Enough. Invisible Monster correlates to the slightly darker but rather pop structured tone of These Walls. These aren't quality correlations, just like mood, atmosphere, intent sort of correlations. Obviously Octavarium has its own world its living in, but I think AVFTTOTW lives in a rather similar space. The production also reminds me a bit of it, much rounder drums, almost wetter, and lots of deep hues on the chugging, with Jordan having some similar kinds of keyboard tones.

 

I'm not really seeing that other than maybe timbre. Jordan seems to be allowed do a bit more which I've always thought was a good thing. In fact, my favorite Jordan albums are Six Degrees, Octavarium and The Astonishing.

 

It may be Jordan's more active role I'm latching onto. I'm listening again right now. Answering The Call still reminds me a lot of Panic Attack and Never Enough.

 

Never Enough is a bad song though. Answering The Call is awesome. It would be funny if when they were writing the album they thought "what if Never Enough was a song people actually wanted to hear?" and Answering The Call was what they came up with. The intro to The Alien reminds me more of Panic Attack.

 

Oh I like Never Enough a lot. I definitely see what you mean though about the intro to The Alien and Panic Attack.

 

The lyrics for Never Enough really bring it down for me. I have no interest in a grown man writing lyrics that sound like a whiny teenager. The same with I Walk Beside You. I don't listen to Dream Theater to hear pop tunes. We have Phil Collins for that stuff.

 

Don't mind the lyrics to Never Enough. I appreciate the sentiment and it was certainly true at the time it was recorded. Though the lyrics were probably a bit over the top.

[ytserush]

I think the real sin with Octavarium is they sound too much like the artist's they're taking "inspiration" from. Like, Never Enough and Panic Attack especially are blatant Muse ripoffs. You can even pinpoint the exact parts of the exact songs they were copying! But, given how much I love those Muse songs, and given DT does add extra virtuosic musicianship to the equation that Muse doesn't match, I do still get a lot out of the DT songs.

 

That happened on more albums than just Octavarium. Constant Motion, for example, IS a Metallica song. You can practically sing the lyrics of "Blackened" over the verses. The styles of many other bands Portnoy was being influenced by crept in during the Six Degrees - Black Clouds period. I thought the best thing about him leaving was that DT went back to sounding like classic DT again.

 

Whatever album Constant Motion is on, I’ve yet to hear it!

 

But I think it’s really overt on Octavarium. I can see it a bit on 6Degrees (there’s a Toolish song, a song with King Crimson references, and of course Solitary Shell is more than indebted to Solisbury Hill), but that still feels like DT just culling from their usual influences to me, maybe a bit more heavy handed. On Octavarium the Muse influence is brand spanking new and unmistakable, plus I Walk Beside You sees DT making a play at being U2, which is pretty foreign to them otherwise. Not to mention the title track (which I love dearly), lifts ideas from Floyd (the intro), Kansas (one of the main themes), Styx/Yes (the keyboard solo), Genesis (the structure), and then a whole bunch of artists for the lyrical miracle section full of references. It’s a very obvious album to me as far as influences go.

 

Dream Theater likes U2. They've covered Red Hill Mining Town and Bad. As long as it's honest, I don't mind at all.

[Rod in Toronto]

As I Am is pure Metallica too.

[Rod in Toronto]

Also, I don't know if you guys are familiar with their song "Build me up, break me down", from A Dramatic Turn Of Events. It's almost a carbon copy of this song:

 

[grep]

Also, I don't know if you guys are familiar with their song "Build me up, break me down", from A Dramatic Turn Of Events. It's almost a carbon copy of this song:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K3eX_uVbe1k

 

Song released on February 16, 2011.

 

While ADTOE was recorded between January and June 2011 and released Sept 12. Sources : Wikipedia.

 

I hate to think that Petrucci ripped this off, but it's so close to the DT song.....

 

 

Kind of reminds me of that lady from Chili who has a song that sounds almost exactly like a Sabbath song released about the same time...will google that tomorrow.