Presto Vs. Roll The Bones

[Del_Duio]

 

That's how a lot of people bought and enjoyed albums until the early 2000s. They'd hear a couple of singles and buy it and see if they liked the rest. From GuP-Presto, Rush didn't really have anything that got too popular on the radio. But RTB had a monster hit in Dreamline, and very good radio play in Ghost of a Chance, and good radio play for Bravado and RTB. They even had other songs like Heresy on the radio a bit. This album brought in a lot of new fans or fans that had abandoned Rush in the synth days. Still today, when I force my group of friends (casual to very casual fans) to go to a Rush concert every year, they look for songs from basically 3 albums: PeW, MP and RTB.

 

Really? The only song I've ever heard off of RTB on the radio was the title track and they used to play it all the time.

[JohnnyBlaze]

Presto is my least favorite Rush album. I only really like The Pass and Presto. The rest of the songs I usually skip. The only song from RTB's that I don't care for is Face Up. RTB's songs are very singable IMO.

 

The accessibility of the album and the move towards a more guitar driven sound certainly made RTB reverse the trend of declining popularity of the band...and it remains the most popular post-Power Windows album by far. That may be why it receives all the hate from the Rush hardcore.

'That may be why it receives all the hate from the Rush hardcore'?! YOU are a hardcore Rush fan BUT you LIKE Roll the Bones. Others here are hardcore too AND they like Bones too. So how does what you said make any sense?

I'd guess that many are like me too: hardcore Rush fan but not too excited at all about Bones BECAUSE many of the songs don't do much for me. I don't give a shit about how popular they are. As a 41 year old who has been a fan since the age of 8, Rush has been not been that popular for most of my life and it NEVER mattered since I almost always got off on the music. Bones doesn't interest me that much musically. So what?

 

I didn't intend to imply (nor do I think I did) that all hardcore Rush fans think the same way. However, I believe that this album is received much worse by hardcore fans than by casual ones.

Ahhh I see. That may be true. But the casual fan probably couldn't name more than 2 or 3 songs off that album. Hell, if I only had heard Dreamline and Bravado I'd probably think the album were pretty damn good

 

That's how a lot of people bought and enjoyed albums until the early 2000s. They'd hear a couple of singles and buy it and see if they liked the rest. From GuP-Presto, Rush didn't really have anything that got too popular on the radio. But RTB had a monster hit in Dreamline, and very good radio play in Ghost of a Chance, and good radio play for Bravado and RTB. They even had other songs like Heresy on the radio a bit. This album brought in a lot of new fans or fans that had abandoned Rush in the synth days. Still today, when I force my group of friends (casual to very casual fans) to go to a Rush concert every year, they look for songs from basically 3 albums: PeW, MP and RTB.

Yeah, I know about all that radio play of RTB in '91 and '92. As for my casual Rush fans, they NEVER mention RTB. They mention 2112, PeW, and MP. And that pretty much shows (like your post just now): not a whole lot since we're just talking about a few people.

 

The only thing I'd bet on with the casual Rush fan is that they know Tom Sawyer and Limelight

[Na na na]

Presto

 

http://www.p4.no/images/gfx/Terninger/5_90px.png

 

Roll The Bones

 

http://www.p4.no/images/gfx/Terninger/4_90px.png

[lifeson90]

I remember in my 20s going camping by myself for a few weeks in the english countryside one summer seeing castles etc the weather was glorious and all i took with me was a little stove a couple ounces of dope a sony walkman and a copy of a recently released presto on cassette. good times man. good times. Edited October 11, 2013 by lifeson90

[LedRush]

Presto is my least favorite Rush album. I only really like The Pass and Presto. The rest of the songs I usually skip. The only song from RTB's that I don't care for is Face Up. RTB's songs are very singable IMO.

 

The accessibility of the album and the move towards a more guitar driven sound certainly made RTB reverse the trend of declining popularity of the band...and it remains the most popular post-Power Windows album by far. That may be why it receives all the hate from the Rush hardcore.

'That may be why it receives all the hate from the Rush hardcore'?! YOU are a hardcore Rush fan BUT you LIKE Roll the Bones. Others here are hardcore too AND they like Bones too. So how does what you said make any sense?

I'd guess that many are like me too: hardcore Rush fan but not too excited at all about Bones BECAUSE many of the songs don't do much for me. I don't give a shit about how popular they are. As a 41 year old who has been a fan since the age of 8, Rush has been not been that popular for most of my life and it NEVER mattered since I almost always got off on the music. Bones doesn't interest me that much musically. So what?

 

I didn't intend to imply (nor do I think I did) that all hardcore Rush fans think the same way. However, I believe that this album is received much worse by hardcore fans than by casual ones.

Ahhh I see. That may be true. But the casual fan probably couldn't name more than 2 or 3 songs off that album. Hell, if I only had heard Dreamline and Bravado I'd probably think the album were pretty damn good

 

That's how a lot of people bought and enjoyed albums until the early 2000s. They'd hear a couple of singles and buy it and see if they liked the rest. From GuP-Presto, Rush didn't really have anything that got too popular on the radio. But RTB had a monster hit in Dreamline, and very good radio play in Ghost of a Chance, and good radio play for Bravado and RTB. They even had other songs like Heresy on the radio a bit. This album brought in a lot of new fans or fans that had abandoned Rush in the synth days. Still today, when I force my group of friends (casual to very casual fans) to go to a Rush concert every year, they look for songs from basically 3 albums: PeW, MP and RTB.

Yeah, I know about all that radio play of RTB in '91 and '92. As for my casual Rush fans, they NEVER mention RTB. They mention 2112, PeW, and MP. And that pretty much shows (like your post just now): not a whole lot since we're just talking about a few people.

 

The only thing I'd bet on with the casual Rush fan is that they know Tom Sawyer and Limelight

 

I'm surprised casual fans would even like 2112 to the point that they would go in wanting to hear it. Do you mind if I ask how old your friends are? Mine were all in high school when RTB came out, so that may be why they like it still.

Edited October 11, 2013 by LedRush

[JohnnyBlaze]

I remember in my 20s going camping by myself for a few weeks in the english countryside one summer seeing castles etc the weather was glorious and all i took with me was a little stove a couple ounces of dope a sony walkman and a copy of a recently released presto on cassette. good times man. good times.

If I could wave my magic wand I'd make everything a slice of pizza. Man, I could use some pizza..... :smoke:

[JohnnyBlaze]

Presto is my least favorite Rush album. I only really like The Pass and Presto. The rest of the songs I usually skip. The only song from RTB's that I don't care for is Face Up. RTB's songs are very singable IMO.

 

The accessibility of the album and the move towards a more guitar driven sound certainly made RTB reverse the trend of declining popularity of the band...and it remains the most popular post-Power Windows album by far. That may be why it receives all the hate from the Rush hardcore.

'That may be why it receives all the hate from the Rush hardcore'?! YOU are a hardcore Rush fan BUT you LIKE Roll the Bones. Others here are hardcore too AND they like Bones too. So how does what you said make any sense?

I'd guess that many are like me too: hardcore Rush fan but not too excited at all about Bones BECAUSE many of the songs don't do much for me. I don't give a shit about how popular they are. As a 41 year old who has been a fan since the age of 8, Rush has been not been that popular for most of my life and it NEVER mattered since I almost always got off on the music. Bones doesn't interest me that much musically. So what?

 

I didn't intend to imply (nor do I think I did) that all hardcore Rush fans think the same way. However, I believe that this album is received much worse by hardcore fans than by casual ones.

Ahhh I see. That may be true. But the casual fan probably couldn't name more than 2 or 3 songs off that album. Hell, if I only had heard Dreamline and Bravado I'd probably think the album were pretty damn good

 

That's how a lot of people bought and enjoyed albums until the early 2000s. They'd hear a couple of singles and buy it and see if they liked the rest. From GuP-Presto, Rush didn't really have anything that got too popular on the radio. But RTB had a monster hit in Dreamline, and very good radio play in Ghost of a Chance, and good radio play for Bravado and RTB. They even had other songs like Heresy on the radio a bit. This album brought in a lot of new fans or fans that had abandoned Rush in the synth days. Still today, when I force my group of friends (casual to very casual fans) to go to a Rush concert every year, they look for songs from basically 3 albums: PeW, MP and RTB.

Yeah, I know about all that radio play of RTB in '91 and '92. As for my casual Rush fans, they NEVER mention RTB. They mention 2112, PeW, and MP. And that pretty much shows (like your post just now): not a whole lot since we're just talking about a few people.

 

The only thing I'd bet on with the casual Rush fan is that they know Tom Sawyer and Limelight

 

I'm surprised casual fans would even like 2112 to the point that they would go in wanting to hear it. Do you mind if I ask how old your friends are? Mine were all in high school when RTB came out, so that me be why they like it still.

Only some of these friends know each other. The youngest is 29, the oldest is in his late 40s, and everyone else is in the late 30s range. The late 40s guy likes 2112 (kind of an 'of course', yeah?). All of them like MP while some of them like PeW or at least TSoR. The other things they mention are the Mystic Rhythms video MTV used to show when it was released and Aimee Mann in Time Stand Still (known to them as 'that skinny blonde girl'). But Mystic Rhythms and Time Stand Still are mentioned only as recollections and not as things they like or dislike

[sitboaf]

First of all, I am flattered that my CP vs. TfE post inspired this one.

My initial vote was that I liked RTB more, mostly because I owned it when it was new, and bought Presto much, much later.

Then i did the comparisons, which don't line up all that well, but whatever, it was worth a shot.

The score came out 5 to 5!

So, I couldn't vote on the 2nd and 3rd questions.

Simply put, I feel that Presto is a little more consistent than Roll the Bones, which has slightly higher highs, but slightly lower lows.

My preference is for Roll the Bones for 1. nostalgia, and 2. better lyrics.

[LedRush]

First of all, I am flattered that my CP vs. TfE post inspired this one.

My initial vote was that I liked RTB more, mostly because I owned it when it was new, and bought Presto much, much later.

Then i did the comparisons, which don't line up all that well, but whatever, it was worth a shot.

The score came out 5 to 5!

So, I couldn't vote on the 2nd and 3rd questions.

Simply put, I feel that Presto is a little more consistent than Roll the Bones, which has slightly higher highs, but slightly lower lows.

My preference is for Roll the Bones for 1. nostalgia, and 2. better lyrics.

 

I know the songs don't line up perfectly, but I didn't want to be accused of stacking the deck by lining up songs a different way. So I did it the most natural way I could think of and allowed others to change it if they like.

[JohnnyBlaze]

First of all, I am flattered that my CP vs. TfE post inspired this one.

My initial vote was that I liked RTB more, mostly because I owned it when it was new, and bought Presto much, much later.

Then i did the comparisons, which don't line up all that well, but whatever, it was worth a shot.

The score came out 5 to 5!

So, I couldn't vote on the 2nd and 3rd questions.

Simply put, I feel that Presto is a little more consistent than Roll the Bones, which has slightly higher highs, but slightly lower lows.

My preference is for Roll the Bones for 1. nostalgia, and 2. better lyrics.

 

I know the songs don't line up perfectly, but I didn't want to be accused of stacking the deck by lining up songs a different way. So I did it the most natural way I could think of and allowed others to change it if they like.

Lining them up like that was reasonable. Just now I first put all the songs in order of my preference THEN matched them up. This is what happened:

 

1 [The Best off Both]: The Pass > Dreamline. Great IS better than good.

2 Show Don't Tell > Bravado. Barely. Lyrically, Bravado's way better though.

3 Available Light > Where's My Thing. Close one again but the lyrics give AL the win.

4 Presto > Ghost of a Chance. Honestly, Lifeson's solo is what makes Ghost a decent song. But it still ain't enough to beat Presto.

5 War Paint/Scars > Heresy. Only combined these 2 simply because they're in the middle of the pack. They massacre Heresy.

6 Red Tide > Roll the Bones. It's the rap.

7 Chain Lightning > The Big Wheel. Mediocre is still not as bad as below average.

8 Superconductor > Neurotica. Shocked? Well, I dislike Neurotica...chorus, vocals, lyrics. Believe me, Superconductor is NOT on my list of good either.

9 Anagram > Face Up. I haven't listened to Face Up in probably half a decade.

10 [bottom of the Barrel]: Hand Over Fist> You Bet Your Life. Probably my most disliked Rush tune but it's at least in the top 3. Hand Over Fist likely cracks that top 10.

 

Final score:

Presto 10, Roll The Bones 0

[LedRush]

First of all, I am flattered that my CP vs. TfE post inspired this one.

My initial vote was that I liked RTB more, mostly because I owned it when it was new, and bought Presto much, much later.

Then i did the comparisons, which don't line up all that well, but whatever, it was worth a shot.

The score came out 5 to 5!

So, I couldn't vote on the 2nd and 3rd questions.

Simply put, I feel that Presto is a little more consistent than Roll the Bones, which has slightly higher highs, but slightly lower lows.

My preference is for Roll the Bones for 1. nostalgia, and 2. better lyrics.

 

I know the songs don't line up perfectly, but I didn't want to be accused of stacking the deck by lining up songs a different way. So I did it the most natural way I could think of and allowed others to change it if they like.

Lining them up like that was reasonable. Just now I first put all the songs in order of my preference THEN matched them up. This is what happened:

 

1 [The Best off Both]: The Pass > Dreamline. Great IS better than good.

2 Show Don't Tell > Bravado. Barely. Lyrically, Bravado's way better though.

3 Available Light > Where's My Thing. Close one again but the lyrics give AL the win.

4 Presto > Ghost of a Chance. Honestly, Lifeson's solo is what makes Ghost a decent song. But it still ain't enough to beat Presto.

5 War Paint/Scars > Heresy. Only combined these 2 simply because they're in the middle of the pack. They massacre Heresy.

6 Red Tide > Roll the Bones. It's the rap.

7 Chain Lightning > The Big Wheel. Mediocre is still not as bad as below average.

8 Superconductor > Neurotica. Shocked? Well, I dislike Neurotica...chorus, vocals, lyrics. Believe me, Superconductor is NOT on my list of good either.

9 Anagram > Face Up. I haven't listened to Face Up in probably half a decade.

10 [bottom of the Barrel]: Hand Over Fist> You Bet Your Life. Probably my most disliked Rush tune but it's at least in the top 3. Hand Over Fist likely cracks that top 10.

 

Final score:

Presto 10, Roll The Bones 0

 

Yeah, if I lined them up by preference Presto wouldn't get one point. It simply doesn't have any songs that approach Dreamline and Ghost of a Chance, and once those two beat The Pass and Presto, Presto (the album) doesn't have much left in the tank to challenge Bravado, Where's My Thing, RTB, Heresy and company. It'd be a massacre even though I think Roll The Bones is merely a bit better as an album.

[sitboaf]

First of all, I am flattered that my CP vs. TfE post inspired this one.

My initial vote was that I liked RTB more, mostly because I owned it when it was new, and bought Presto much, much later.

Then i did the comparisons, which don't line up all that well, but whatever, it was worth a shot.

The score came out 5 to 5!

So, I couldn't vote on the 2nd and 3rd questions.

Simply put, I feel that Presto is a little more consistent than Roll the Bones, which has slightly higher highs, but slightly lower lows.

My preference is for Roll the Bones for 1. nostalgia, and 2. better lyrics.

 

I know the songs don't line up perfectly, but I didn't want to be accused of stacking the deck by lining up songs a different way. So I did it the most natural way I could think of and allowed others to change it if they like.

Lining them up like that was reasonable. Just now I first put all the songs in order of my preference THEN matched them up. This is what happened:

 

1 [The Best off Both]: The Pass > Dreamline. Great IS better than good.

2 Show Don't Tell > Bravado. Barely. Lyrically, Bravado's way better though.

3 Available Light > Where's My Thing. Close one again but the lyrics give AL the win.

4 Presto > Ghost of a Chance. Honestly, Lifeson's solo is what makes Ghost a decent song. But it still ain't enough to beat Presto.

5 War Paint/Scars > Heresy. Only combined these 2 simply because they're in the middle of the pack. They massacre Heresy.

6 Red Tide > Roll the Bones. It's the rap.

7 Chain Lightning > The Big Wheel. Mediocre is still not as bad as below average.

8 Superconductor > Neurotica. Shocked? Well, I dislike Neurotica...chorus, vocals, lyrics. Believe me, Superconductor is NOT on my list of good either.

9 Anagram > Face Up. I haven't listened to Face Up in probably half a decade.

10 [bottom of the Barrel]: Hand Over Fist> You Bet Your Life. Probably my most disliked Rush tune but it's at least in the top 3. Hand Over Fist likely cracks that top 10.

 

Final score:

Presto 10, Roll The Bones 0

Hmm… I don't think this is a fair way to compare things.

If you have 2 excellent albums, with "song ratings" that line up like this:

10, 9.5, 9, 8.5, 8, 7.5, 7, 6.5

versus

9.5, 9, 8.5, 8, 7.5, 7, 6.5, 6

then the first album wins eight to zero, and that's not realistic.

 

If you were to randomize the song lists, then the first album wins something like 5-3 most of the time.

LedRush's initial method is more fair.

[Mr. Not]

RTB sux.

 

Presto is basically decent, conventional wisdom would say

Edited October 12, 2013 by Mr. IsNot

[Your_Lion]

Simply put, I feel that Presto is a little more consistent than Roll the Bones, which has slightly higher highs, but slightly lower lows.

 

That sums up perfectly how I feel about these two albums, too

[lifeson90]

For me the only thing that stopped rtb becoming a top 3 all time great of the bands albums was the shitty tinny sound production. i always felt it needed just a little bit more juice, an issue that must've been recognised and ultimately rectified in the next album cp.

 

Still, i reckon rtb a great rush album, representing the band ethos at the time - more light hearted presentation almost pop in parts.

[toscanobarga]

Two of their weakest albums. I will always connect with the Pass due to my special needs son, but RTB is a slightly better album. But that's not saying much really. Edited October 13, 2013 by toscanobarga

[Todem]

Roll The Bones is a better overall album IMO.

 

It has some of Rush's best material of the 90's

 

Dreamline

Bravado

Ghost of a Chance

Roll The Bones (yes that song is freaking killer)

Wheres My Thing

 

 

Presto has some great songs too.

 

Show Don't Tell

The Pass

Available Light

 

But Bones was a much better fleshed out record. Also Alex has a couple of incredible solo's in Bravado and Ghost of a Chance.

[Pause Rewind Replay]

Show Don't Tell > Dreamline Both excellent, SDT better

Chain Lightning > Bravado Studio Bravado is just OK

The Pass = Roll The Bones

War Paint >> Face Up

Scars/Anagram >>> Where's My Thing Scars or Anagram alone would win this. Combined it's a demolition.

Presto > The Big Wheel

Superconductor >>> Heresy Heresy is their worst song since Tai Shan

Available Light > Ghost of a Chance The live GOAC on S&A would have won

Red Tide > Neurotica

Hand Over Fist = You Bet Your Life

 

RTB for me doesn't win a single matchup. All it could manage was 2 ties.

[goose]

It's sad-ish to see all the hate for these two albums. I get where people have their problems, but they are not that bad. I prefer Presto way more (around the number 11 spot for me) than roll the bones (bottom five) due to the superior song writing (in my opinion). I distinctly remember excitedly popping both albums in whenever I got them, and while presto gave me a good first listen with only one or two dry spots, once the second half of Roll The Bones started, I kind of drifted off and before I knew it, it was over, without much to remember. Anyway, the list.

Show Don't Tell < Dreamline (Both are Awesome, but Dreamline is, well, Dreamline, nothing else to say

Chain Lightning > Bravado (Bravado is bland, Chain Lightning is interesting)

The Pass > Roll The Bones (Both are great, but the pass is just way more amazing, and much closer to my heart ;) )

War Paint < Face Up (War Paint is one of those dry spots, nothing sticks out, while face up is more memorable)

Scars/Anagram < Where's My Thing (Scars is decent, Anagram is not memorable, Where's my thing is terrific)

Presto > The Big Wheel (I enjoy both, but Presto's bridge gets me every time)

Superconductor > Heresy (Easy choice, I love Superconductors overproduced sound to match it's lyrics and it's general speed for the otherwise slower album, Heresy is just kind of cheesy)

Available Light > Ghost of a Chance (Hard Choice, but I like available light just a tad bit better)

Red Tide > Neurotica (I enjoy Red Tide's Piano, Neurotica is the core of the dull songs on RTB (Except for the ending fadeout, that's really cool)

Hand Over Fist < You Bet Your Life (Not much to say, You bet your life is just a bit better)

Pretty darn close to mine, for the same reasons. The only tough choice for me was Available Light/Ghost of a Chance, which I would make a draw because I love them both. :cheers:

[goose]

 

I didn't intend to imply (nor do I think I did) that all hardcore Rush fans think the same way. However, I believe that this album is received much worse by hardcore fans than by casual ones.

You are correct in that belief.

[RushBoingo]

It's sad-ish to see all the hate for these two albums. I get where people have their problems, but they are not that bad. I prefer Presto way more (around the number 11 spot for me) than roll the bones (bottom five) due to the superior song writing (in my opinion). I distinctly remember excitedly popping both albums in whenever I got them, and while presto gave me a good first listen with only one or two dry spots, once the second half of Roll The Bones started, I kind of drifted off and before I knew it, it was over, without much to remember. Anyway, the list.

Show Don't Tell < Dreamline (Both are Awesome, but Dreamline is, well, Dreamline, nothing else to say

Chain Lightning > Bravado (Bravado is bland, Chain Lightning is interesting)

The Pass > Roll The Bones (Both are great, but the pass is just way more amazing, and much closer to my heart ;) )

War Paint < Face Up (War Paint is one of those dry spots, nothing sticks out, while face up is more memorable)

Scars/Anagram < Where's My Thing (Scars is decent, Anagram is not memorable, Where's my thing is terrific)

Presto > The Big Wheel (I enjoy both, but Presto's bridge gets me every time)

Superconductor > Heresy (Easy choice, I love Superconductors overproduced sound to match it's lyrics and it's general speed for the otherwise slower album, Heresy is just kind of cheesy)

Available Light > Ghost of a Chance (Hard Choice, but I like available light just a tad bit better)

Red Tide > Neurotica (I enjoy Red Tide's Piano, Neurotica is the core of the dull songs on RTB (Except for the ending fadeout, that's really cool)

Hand Over Fist < You Bet Your Life (Not much to say, You bet your life is just a bit better)

Pretty darn close to mine, for the same reasons. The only tough choice for me was Available Light/Ghost of a Chance, which I would make a draw because I love them both. :cheers:

Cheers to you too Goose

[GeddyLeeRoth]

Presto easily. 20 years ago I would have totally gone with Roll The Bones. RTB is the album that drew me back to Rush. They kinda lost me with HYF and Presto. 10 or 12 years ago I rediscovered Presto and really dig it now. Its more hearfelt and thoughtful(?). It has more texture too.

 

BTW, I vehemently disagree with doing Song-For-Song comparisons. It makes no sense and is a totally inaccurate and nonsensical way of comaring albums. The best way I can think of is throwing all the songs in a pile and ranking them. The album with the least accumulated points wins. If the overall scores are only a few points off, than it comes down to overall impression. (You can also do a average score if the albums have a different song count).

 

Sorry for being so nerdy. Comparing songs is cool, but like I said, the Song-For-Song thing has little bearing unless you have two albums that follow the same dynamic structure, ie. 'Epic, rocker, ballad, rocker, rocker, instrumental', or what have you.

Edited October 15, 2013 by GeddyLeeRoth

[tx_rush]

Presto for me, not even close

 

The Pass > Bravado (in your epic emotional ballad catergory)

Presto > RTB (better title track catergory)

Available Light > and song on RTB

 

Both albums have a few stinkers. I reguluarly listen to those 3 songs on Presto, and there really isnt anything on RTB I cant live without

[LedRush]

RTB is the album that drew me back to Rush. They kinda lost me with HYF and Presto.

 

Judging by album sales and radio play, this was true for you and many others...and for bringing in new fans.

[rollthebones5150]

I love presto. Show Don't Tell, Chain Lightning, The Pass, Scars are my faves off the album