Terrible Neil Peart lyrics?

[Fridge]

QUOTE (Mara @ Mar 7 2011, 03:25 PM)

I can't believe no one's corrected this before now, but the line is: "For the words of the PROFITS were written on the studio walls". . . "Prophets" in Sound of Silence, "profits" in TSOR. Yes, a nod to S&G, but with a subtle twist. I for one think TSOR is perfect.

 

You beat me to it...It's actually quite a nice little bit of paraphrasing.

 

Another example is the line in The Pass (even though I'm not keen on the song), about "stars, gutter, cars" etc which is a nod to Lady Windermeres Fan by Oscar Wilde.

 

As for terrible lyrics by Neil....God, there's so many I don't even know where to start

 

But this is hard to beat for pukeworthiness:

 

I knew he was different, in his sexuality

I went to his parties, as a straight minority

It never seemed a threat to my masculinity

He only introduced me to a wider reality

 

[ghostworks]

...how about a top ten list?

 

Top Ten Worst Neil Peart Lyrics | The Excerpts

 

10.

Apollo was astonished

Dionysus thought me mad

But they heard my story further

And they wondered, and were sad

 

9.

No more lame excuses

it has to be tonight

He can take the princess

if he can take the fight

 

8.

This magic day when super-science

Mingles with the bright stuff of dreams

 

7.

Steely-eyed outside to hide the enemy within

 

6.

All of the brightest boys

To play with the biggest toys

More than they bargained for

 

5.

Folks have got to make choices

And choices got to have voices

Folks are basically decent

Conventional wisdom would say

 

4.

Playing for time

Don't want to wait for heaven

Looking for love

For an angel to forgive my sins

 

3.

The counter-revolution

At the counter of a store

People buy the things they want

And borrow for a little more

 

2.

In a dog's life

A year is really more like seven

And all too soon a canine

Will be chasing cars in doggie heaven

 

...and number 1.

Mama says some ugly words

Daddy pounds the wall

They can fight about their little girl later

Right now they don't care at all

 

 

 

and don't get me wrong - I love half of the songs I pulled lyrics from

 

the rational Rush fan knows that Neil 'misses' far more often than he 'hits' - when he does 'hit', though, yeah - phenomenal stuff

Edited March 7, 2011 by ghostworks

[Mara]

Not all lyrics translate well into spoken word/poetry, and vice versa.

[InvisibleAirwaves13]

QUOTE (StellarJetman @ Mar 6 2011, 10:49 PM)

QUOTE (CMWriter @ Mar 6 2011, 09:12 PM) I once saw someone comment that they found many of the lyrics to "Red Barchetta" rather "Middle-school" is what they used to describe them. What do you guys think? Yea or nay for "Red Barchetta"? Some of them are good, but there are phrases, especially "before the Motor Law" and "better-managed time", that really don't do it for me. "Better, vanished time"... which makes perfect sense.

[StellarJetman]

QUOTE (ReRushed @ Mar 7 2011, 09:38 AM)

Oh, please. There's no straw man argument here. There's a lot of Rush bashing on this board and, yes, some of it is justified. And there's no doubt in my mind you are going out of your way to criticize Geddy Lee. That's all.

I wasn't "criticizing" Geddy; I was mentioning a reason for why I didn't get the lyrics that he was singing. (I do think that it wasn't the best way to sing them, though.) And how could you fail to understand that I was talking about a single line in a single song? When I said "overblown delivery", I was talking about the way that he sang "OOOOOF SALESMEN!!!" like it was something on 2112. Sheesh, on the same album you have "Different Strings", and I'd hardly call that overblown.

 

QUOTE (wrekinboy @ Mar 7 2011, 09:54 AM)

SJ - before you start a thread bashing something you should probably make sure your position is reasonably sound. Whatever else Neil is, he is very well read and has a number of interests. His lyrics are therefore explained by a number of different references, themes etc. If you are not aware of them it says more about you than it does about his ability as a lyricist.

And I was informed of the reference. I'd have removed the lines from the original post, but it's locked for some reason.

 

QUOTE (wrekinboy @ Mar 7 2011, 09:54 AM)

What is worse is that now that your lack of appreciation of the lyric is revealed, you switch the attack to Ged's delivery.

I'm not "switching my attack". See my response to ReRushed.

 

Look, guys, I didn't get the line. I got that. Why do we have to argue about anything now, let alone whether or not I appreciate Geddy's singing?

Edited March 7, 2011 by StellarJetman

[ghostworks]

QUOTE (Mara @ Mar 7 2011, 11:08 AM)

Not all lyrics translate well into spoken word/poetry, and vice versa.

indeed, that is true

 

I was careful in my 'top ten' list above to choose only those that failed across the board (as they read and as they were performed/sung)

[Mara]

QUOTE (ghostworks @ Mar 7 2011, 12:19 PM)

QUOTE (Mara @ Mar 7 2011, 11:08 AM) Not all lyrics translate well into spoken word/poetry, and vice versa. indeed, that is true   I was careful in my 'top ten' list above to choose only those that failed across the board (as they read and as they were performed/sung) And it's a good list. Some of those lines are awkward, period, whether they are put to music or just read off the page.   My only disagreements would be with 10, 7 , and 6. (Really I could concede on 10, but it's Hemispheres! I have a tough time leveling criticism at Hemispheres!)   The lines from Manhattan Project and The Enemy Within work as music, but not as poetry, IMO.   I agree the others you listed fail in both dimensions - they are just really awkward.

[EmotionDetector]

I don't really think Neil has many "terrible" lyrics.

 

However...the term "Doggie Heaven" has always sounded a bit awkward to me, especially for a Rush song. I understand the humour, but that term sounds very kiddish.

 

However, unlike most people's hate for Dog Years, I still like the song. It's not one of their best, but I still think it is a good song. Some cool guitar in there as well.

[circumstantial tree]

I think "Half the World" is one of the worst. I don't remember the exact lyrics because I just never play the album but it's like this to me:

 

"half the world eats, half the world drinks

half the world cries, half the world laughs

half the world walks, half the world runs

half the world blinks, half the world opens its eyes

half the world goes, half the world doesn't go

half the world is, half the world isn't

half the world blahs, half the world doesn't blah

half the world blips, half the world doens't blip"

[GrandDesigner]

I LOVE the lyrics to Dog Years. Yeah, the metaphor is goofy but it's a whimsical song musically and the lyrics fit. If they were the lyrics to the music of Subdivisions, then I'd say they were horrible but in the musical context I find them quite innovative and interesting.

 

Agreed on Nobody's Hero - holy shit that opening line is a buzzkill.

 

Also, Second Nature always seemed a little hokey (especially the 'folks' lines)

 

Chemistry always seemed a little clunky, but since they had a lyrical menage a trois with it, I suppose it's not all Neil's fault.

 

Also, I seem to recall a majority of RTB sucking.

[wrekinboy]

QUOTE (StellarJetman @ Mar 7 2011, 05:17 PM)

QUOTE (ReRushed @ Mar 7 2011, 09:38 AM) Oh, please. There's no straw man argument here. There's a lot of Rush bashing on this board and, yes, some of it is justified. And there's no doubt in my mind you are going out of your way to criticize Geddy Lee. That's all. I wasn't "criticizing" Geddy; I was mentioning a reason for why I didn't get the lyrics that he was singing. (I do think that it wasn't the best way to sing them, though.) And how could you fail to understand that I was talking about a single line in a single song? When I said "overblown delivery", I was talking about the way that he sang "OOOOOF SALESMEN!!!" like it was something on 2112. Sheesh, on the same album you have "Different Strings", and I'd hardly call that overblown.   QUOTE (wrekinboy @ Mar 7 2011, 09:54 AM) SJ - before you start a thread bashing something you should probably make sure your position is reasonably sound. Whatever else Neil is, he is very well read and has a number of interests. His lyrics are therefore explained by a number of different references, themes etc. If you are not aware of them it says more about you than it does about his ability as a lyricist. And I was informed of the reference. I'd have removed the lines from the original post, but it's locked for some reason.   QUOTE (wrekinboy @ Mar 7 2011, 09:54 AM) What is worse is that now that your lack of appreciation of the lyric is revealed, you switch the attack to Ged's delivery. I'm not "switching my attack". See my response to ReRushed.   Look, guys, I didn't get the line. I got that. Why do we have to argue about anything now, let alone whether or not I appreciate Geddy's singing?   SJ - ok fair enough. But you'd hardly expect Ged to sing the last few lyrics to TSoR in a manner closer to Simon and Garfunkel to help listeners make the link. Remember that part of the song is a reggae-style breakdown, so he was pretty limited in the way he can sing it. Then comes the 'SALESMEN!' because it precedes a mega guitar break from Alex so it all works in terms of the dynamics of the song, imho.   I'm not saying that the song and the lyric is beyond criticism, but it seemed a strange choice for you to start a thread about terrible lyrics with additional comments on the singer's delivery, don'cha think? Let's face it, as a song TSoR is one of Neil's most successful lyrics, again imho. For me it ranks up there with 'Subdivisions' as a song where I can always remember the lyrics, because they are so well executed.

[ghostworks]

Edited March 7, 2011 by ghostworks

[StellarJetman]

QUOTE (wrekinboy @ Mar 7 2011, 11:05 AM)

SJ - ok fair enough. But you'd hardly expect Ged to sing the last few lyrics to TSoR in a manner closer to Simon and Garfunkel to help listeners make the link. Remember that part of the song is a reggae-style breakdown, so he was pretty limited in the way he can sing it. Then comes the 'SALESMEN!' because it precedes a mega guitar break from Alex so it all works in terms of the dynamics of the song, imho.

I understand that completely. However, even listening to it with that in mind, the line still doesn't work for me. I had hoped that I'd "get" it and end up appreciating it a lot more, but there's no way that I can hear the word "salesmen" and not think that it clashes horribly with the grand way in which it's emphasized.

 

QUOTE (wrekinboy @ Mar 7 2011, 11:05 AM)

I'm not saying that the song and the lyric is beyond criticism, but it seemed a strange choice for you to start a thread about terrible lyrics with additional comments on the singer's delivery, don'cha think?

Well, there's a world of difference between reading, "Of salesmen. Of salesmen. Of salesmen," and reading it with exclamation marks and whatnot.

 

I guess that it really was just the delivery that got me on that one.

Edited March 7, 2011 by StellarJetman

[Pags]

QUOTE (Kenneth @ Mar 6 2011, 10:57 PM)

^ I don't particularly love/hate tai shan nor dog years, but most TRF users think these 2 suck in every way possible.

Most? That's a stretch. Certainly, not me.

[ghostworks]

QUOTE (circumstantial tree @ Mar 7 2011, 11:44 AM)

I think "Half the World" is one of the worst...

oof

 

(how did I forget that one?)

 

Neil writes (Geddy sings) the word 'half' thirty-one times and the phrase 'half the world' twenty-two times

 

it's enough to make you think the CD player is skipping

 

[J2112YYZ]

QUOTE (wrekinboy @ Mar 7 2011, 06:02 AM)

QUOTE (J2112YYZ @ Mar 7 2011, 03:15 AM) None of those are even close to his worst. Dog Years is immediately what I think of when it comes to that. The line from TSOR fits the song perfectly. The words written on the studio walls I always thought referred to a wall that rocks stars signed while visiting a radio station studio. Or possibly autographed pictures of them hanging up on a wall in the studio. The line "echoes with the sounds of salesmen" makes perfect sense because it's referring to advertisements on the radio. And since it's a song about radio what's the big deal?   The lyrics to TSoR are a doff of the cap to 'The Sound of Silence' by Simon and Garfunkel, which goes:   "And the sign said the words of the prophets are written on the subway walls And tenement halls, and whispered in the sounds of silence"   Unfortunately we have to have a comprehensive knowledge of musical history to pick up all the references in lyrics, not just Neil's. It is similar to film directors who insert into their own movies a homage to their own heroes and sometimes it is not entirely picked up by the audience. I'm not a fan of Simon & Garfunkle but I am familiar with that song. I'm surprised I never made that connection before

[ghostworks]

QUOTE (Pags @ Mar 7 2011, 12:20 PM)

QUOTE (Kenneth @ Mar 6 2011, 10:57 PM) ^ I don't particularly love/hate tai shan nor dog years, but most TRF users think these 2 suck in every way possible. Most? That's a stretch. Certainly, not me.   I see   so one guy likes Dog and Tai and now the general consensus of the board is irrelevant   that's some sexy logic, P

Edited March 7, 2011 by ghostworks

[Pags]

QUOTE (ghostworks @ Mar 7 2011, 12:24 PM)

QUOTE (Pags @ Mar 7 2011, 12:20 PM) QUOTE (Kenneth @ Mar 6 2011, 10:57 PM) ^ I don't particularly love/hate tai shan nor dog years, but most TRF users think these 2 suck in every way possible. Most? That's a stretch. Certainly, not me.   *** Go ahead. Say what you wanted to.

[ghostworks]

QUOTE (Pags @ Mar 7 2011, 12:26 PM)

QUOTE (ghostworks @ Mar 7 2011, 12:24 PM) QUOTE (Pags @ Mar 7 2011, 12:20 PM) QUOTE (Kenneth @ Mar 6 2011, 10:57 PM) ^ I don't particularly love/hate tai shan nor dog years, but most TRF users think these 2 suck in every way possible. Most? That's a stretch. Certainly, not me.   *** Go ahead. Say what you wanted to. done (see above)

[StellarJetman]

I stood at the top of the mountain...

And doggie heaven sang to me...

[rummut71]

QUOTE (ghostworks @ Mar 7 2011, 11:20 AM)

QUOTE (circumstantial tree @ Mar 7 2011, 11:44 AM) I think "Half the World" is one of the worst... oof   (how did I forget that one?)   Neil writes (Geddy sings) the word 'half' thirty-one times and the phrase 'half the world' twenty-two times   it's enough to make you think the CD player is skipping I believe this is called 'Small Town Syndrome', first discovered and contracted by John Cougar in the mid-1980s... Highly communicable and annoying.

[Pags]

QUOTE (ghostworks @ Mar 7 2011, 12:24 PM)

QUOTE (Pags @ Mar 7 2011, 12:20 PM) QUOTE (Kenneth @ Mar 6 2011, 10:57 PM) ^ I don't particularly love/hate tai shan nor dog years, but most TRF users think these 2 suck in every way possible. Most? That's a stretch. Certainly, not me.   I see   so one guy likes Dog and Tai and now the general consensus of the board is irrelevant   that's some sexy logic, P I think it's rather simplistic to assume the majority of people would feel that way, because more people typically write negatively or through criticisms rather than with support. It's always easier to criticize than to praise. IMO songs like Dog Years and Tai Shan don't need to be praised by those who like it, nearly as much as they need to be torn down by those who don't. So you'll certainly see more toward the latter. Most times when I see crap-talk on them, I'm not compelled to respond with support. So score another for the negative.   It's really fun to watch you spin my words to an extreme. One guy (just one) claims "most TRF users think these 2 suck in every way possible", and that's okay for consensus (in your view). But my one challenge to it is somehow unacceptable to you. Interesting. Hypocritical, but interesting. I'll still maintain that most TRF users don't think these two songs 'suck in every way possible', regardless of what criticisms they may have about the lyrics.   And please, this is not a trigger for a poll. It's not my nature to vote on many polls, which may bolster a negative result rather than a positive, and risks bolstering your simplistic avenue for reaching your conclusions.

[rummut71]

I am curious about your parameters for 'most' then... Because those songs are terrible. I think I speak for a lot of Rush fans here and abroad.

[Good,bad,andrush]

QUOTE (rummut71 @ Mar 7 2011, 01:56 PM)

I am curious about your parameters for 'most' then... Because those songs are terrible. I think I speak for a lot of Rush fans here and abroad.

I'm with pags, I like the song and there are quite a few of us who do as well, we're just not vocal about it.

 

Go pags

[rummut71]

QUOTE (Good,bad,andrush @ Mar 7 2011, 12:57 PM)

QUOTE (rummut71 @ Mar 7 2011, 01:56 PM) I am curious about your parameters for 'most' then... Because those songs are terrible. I think I speak for a lot of Rush fans here and abroad. I'm with pags, I like the song and there are quite a few of us who do as well, we're just not vocal about it.   Go pags That's cool... Having bad taste is not a crime.