VAN HALEN'S GREATEST RECORD: 1978-1984

[rushgoober]

QUOTE (Rush Cocky @ Dec 22 2009, 11:36 AM)

QUOTE (rushgoober @ Dec 22 2009, 01:31 PM) QUOTE (tangy @ Dec 22 2009, 07:09 AM) QUOTE (GeddyRulz @ Dec 18 2009, 10:39 AM) I've said this before once or twice in other threads over the years, but I'll say it again here... I for one am not a "David Lee Roth fan" so much as I am an "Eddie Van Halen fan during the time Roth was in the band."  To me, the band has always been about Eddie; I have nothing against Hagar or for Roth per se, but it seems like Eddie's guitar playing was better back in the Roth years.  It's because of this reason that I prefer the Roth years over the Hagar years; it really doesn't have much to do with the vocalists themselves, it's just that Eddie was better back then.  (Follow?) I think there is no in hell that VH would of attained the popularity they did without DLR.   DLR was the perfect frontman/vocalist for the group. I saw Van Halen with DLR twice. Anyone who got to see them with DLR can attest that DLR was an incredibly commanding presence. Yes, EVH was a guitar god and the other two were no slouches either, but DLR drew people in. His influence on the early success of the band cannot be minimized. I have no doubt that DLR was a GREAT frontman. Had an average voice I think, but more than made up for it with showmanship.   I find highly dubious the claim that Roth's lyrics were clever, and that Sammy's were total crap. Van Halen lryics (excluding Van Hagar which I discount) are about on the same level with AC/DC and Kiss. They're fun lyrics for fun music. I would never accuse them of being particularly clever or deep. Ok, maybe occasionally clever like AC/DC's Dirty Deeds or something, but it's not really music designed to make you think, but to have a good time. Nothing wrong with that, but to call it more than that would be an error, at least IMHO.

[Xanadoood]

QUOTE (Rush Cocky @ Dec 22 2009, 10:55 AM)

I see nothing clever about any of that, but anyway..... I didn't listen to Van Halen for Dave's "clever lyrics".....I listened because every time I turned them on the other 3 would rock my ass off.

Notice how i said " compared to other hard rock bands". Against the Twisted Sisters, Quiet Riots, Poisons and Warrants of the hard rock world, VH was a bit more clever, IMO. Dave is no Bob Dylan, we all know that.

[Rush Cocky]

QUOTE (Xanadoood @ Dec 22 2009, 02:35 PM)

QUOTE (Rush Cocky @ Dec 22 2009, 10:55 AM) I see nothing clever about any of that, but anyway..... I didn't listen to Van Halen for Dave's "clever lyrics".....I listened because every time I turned them on the other 3 would rock my ass off. Notice how i said " compared to other hard rock bands". Against the Twisted Sisters, Quiet Riots, Poisons and Warrants of the hard rock world, VH was a bit more clever, IMO. Dave is no Bob Dylan, we all know that. OK cool, you're clarifying. That's fine, as I didn't catch that in your original post, which read exactly as follows:   QUOTE (Xanadoood @ Dec 22 2009, 09:32 AM) Dave was the IMAGE behind VH. And ive always thought Daves lyrics were very clever. Much more so than Hagar. Black 'n Blue anyone      As for me, I liked all of Van Halen through the 1991 album. I did NOT care for Balance all that much, but it had some good tracks on it. I think we all pretty much agree that VH III was dead on arrival.....what a waste of plastic that CD was.

[ReRushed]

A lot of the lyrics on Fair Warning are pretty dark. The lyrics are one of the reasons I think it's Van Halen's masterpiece.

[EmotionDetector]

QUOTE (Xanadoood @ Dec 22 2009, 09:32 AM)

He was a big factor, no doubt. I read an interview with Eddie where he stated that Dave encouraged him to move out in front of the stage more, be more active, and work on his stage presence. Dave was the IMAGE behind VH. And ive always thought Daves lyrics were very clever. Much more so than Hagar. Black 'n Blue anyone

It's funny, I've always thought that Van Hagar certainly had the better lyrics. The band wrote alot more serious material during the Hagar years, which to most people, probably pissed them off. But to me, it was a-okay.

 

I know, I'm one of those weird guys who actually enjoyed both sides of Van Halen throughout. Both guys were great frontmen, and this whole, "who's better than who" argument gets old. Both guys brought things to the table that the other didn't.

 

Obviously, TONS of VH's classic material was written with Diamond Dave, and believe me, that stuff kicks ass! But for people to just simply cut up everything from the Hagar years is plain ridiculous. They wrote some excellent songs during those years.

 

Again, this is all just my opinion.

[Rush Cocky]

QUOTE (EmotionDetector @ Dec 23 2009, 08:54 AM)

It's funny, I've always thought that Van Hagar certainly had the better lyrics. The band wrote alot more serious material during the Hagar years, which to most people, probably pissed them off. But to me, it was a-okay. I know, I'm one of those weird guys who actually enjoyed both sides of Van Halen throughout. Both guys were great frontmen, and this whole, "who's better than who" argument gets old. Both guys brought things to the table that the other didn't. Obviously, TONS of VH's classic material was written with Diamond Dave, and believe me, that stuff kicks ass! But for people to just simply cut up everything from the Hagar years is plain ridiculous. They wrote some excellent songs during those years.

[EmotionDetector]

Oh, and by the way, for those who don't know, the video game Guitar Hero: Van Halen was just released yesterday.

 

Should make alot of Hagar haters really happy, seeing as how they have left off any and all Van Hagar material, as well as the characters: Sammy AND Michael Anthony.

[Rush Cocky]

QUOTE (EmotionDetector @ Dec 23 2009, 08:59 AM)

left off...Michael Anthony

And why not? After all, everyone knows Wolfgang has been playing bass for Van Halen since he was in diapers.

[rushgoober]

QUOTE (Rush Cocky @ Dec 23 2009, 06:57 AM)

QUOTE (EmotionDetector @ Dec 23 2009, 08:54 AM) It's funny, I've always thought that Van Hagar certainly had the better lyrics. The band wrote alot more serious material during the Hagar years, which to most people, probably pissed them off. But to me, it was a-okay. I know, I'm one of those weird guys who actually enjoyed both sides of Van Halen throughout. Both guys were great frontmen, and this whole, "who's better than who" argument gets old. Both guys brought things to the table that the other didn't. Obviously, TONS of VH's classic material was written with Diamond Dave, and believe me, that stuff kicks ass! But for people to just simply cut up everything from the Hagar years is plain ridiculous. They wrote some excellent songs during those years. To be perfectly honest, I remember some of the "big hits" of the early Sammy years being an avid MTV watcher in the 80's. They actually had some really good songs, but it was a different band.   I admit that I was SO prejudiced against that incarnation of the band because of David Lee Roth leaving that I would never buy any of their post-DLR albums. That prejudice stands to this day - I won't go near those albums.   I know this kind of prejudice is completely irrational, but I was a HUGE Van Halen fan back in the day, and the departure of DLR, especially at the height of their popularity, was fairly devastating to me back then. Yes, the musicianship was great, but DLR was such a HUGE presence as frontman, that I just couldn't fully accept the band without him..   I remember years later someone making the point that Sammy had then been with the band for LONGER than DLR had. I thought, ok, maybe it's time to get over DLR leaving VH already.   Still though, I won't buy any of the post DLR albums, irrational or not. Sammy Hagar is a very good singer and performer, but that band without DLR is just not Van Halen. I use the term Van Hagar as somewhat of an insult, but really more realistically to specify that it's just NOT the same band.

[Xanadoood]

QUOTE (EmotionDetector @ Dec 23 2009, 08:54 AM)

QUOTE (Xanadoood @ Dec 22 2009, 09:32 AM) He was a big factor, no doubt. I read  an interview with Eddie where he stated that Dave encouraged him to move out in front of the stage more, be more active, and work on his stage presence. Dave was the IMAGE behind VH. And ive always thought Daves lyrics were very clever. Much more so than Hagar. Black 'n Blue anyone    It's funny, I've always thought that Van Hagar certainly had the better lyrics. The band wrote alot more serious material during the Hagar years, which to most people, probably pissed them off. But to me, it was a-okay.   I know, I'm one of those weird guys who actually enjoyed both sides of Van Halen throughout. Both guys were great frontmen, and this whole, "who's better than who" argument gets old. Both guys brought things to the table that the other didn't.   Obviously, TONS of VH's classic material was written with Diamond Dave, and believe me, that stuff kicks ass! But for people to just simply cut up everything from the Hagar years is plain ridiculous. They wrote some excellent songs during those years.   Again, this is all just my opinion. Dont get me wrong. I enjoy some of the Hagar stuff. 5150 is a good , solid album. For Unlawful Carnal Knowledge has some decent tunes as well. And they branched out somewhat with him in the band. I just could never get past Sammys whole " hard rock Jimmy Buffet" style. As over the top as Dave was, he had an edge to him, especially on the first 4 albums. I mean, on the first 2 albums they did with Sammy, they had 3 tunes with " Love " in the title. Love walks in, Why cant this be Love, and When its Love...they lost their edgy, rock n roll attitude with Sammy, IMO. And thats one of the reasons i loved them in the first place. I didnt want Journey, i wanted VH.

[tangy]

whats a real shame is that neither DLR or Eddie realized that they were so much better off working with each other than seperately. call it a symbiotic relationship or synergy or whatever.

 

It terms of matching up they were a musical marriage made in heaven that sadly fell apart due to pride or money ? ( why did they break up?) anyways its the classic "the whole is greater than the sum of the parts".

 

Seems like DLR put out a few good disc after leaving and VH put out a few few good discs after DLR's departure but after that the well went dry for both parties........

[EmotionDetector]

QUOTE (Rush Cocky @ Dec 23 2009, 09:05 AM)

QUOTE (EmotionDetector @ Dec 23 2009, 08:59 AM) left off...Michael Anthony And why not? After all, everyone knows Wolfgang has been playing bass for Van Halen since he was in diapers.   Yes, and just like that time before their 2007 tour when they posted the VH1 album cover on their website, with Wolfgang photo-shopped in place of Michael Anthony.   I'm sure he was thought of in 1978.

[rushgoober]

QUOTE (EmotionDetector @ Dec 23 2009, 09:43 AM)

QUOTE (Rush Cocky @ Dec 23 2009, 09:05 AM) QUOTE (EmotionDetector @ Dec 23 2009, 08:59 AM) left off...Michael Anthony And why not? After all, everyone knows Wolfgang has been playing bass for Van Halen since he was in diapers.   Yes, and just like that time before their 2007 tour when they posted the VH1 album cover on their website, with Wolfgang photo-shopped in place of Michael Anthony.   I'm sure he was thought of in 1978. Wolfgang WAS thought of in 1978!   Eddie Van Halen thought, "Gee, I think I'd like to have kids some day."

[EmotionDetector]

QUOTE (rushgoober @ Dec 23 2009, 02:46 PM)

QUOTE (EmotionDetector @ Dec 23 2009, 09:43 AM) QUOTE (Rush Cocky @ Dec 23 2009, 09:05 AM) QUOTE (EmotionDetector @ Dec 23 2009, 08:59 AM) left off...Michael Anthony And why not? After all, everyone knows Wolfgang has been playing bass for Van Halen since he was in diapers.   Yes, and just like that time before their 2007 tour when they posted the VH1 album cover on their website, with Wolfgang photo-shopped in place of Michael Anthony.   I'm sure he was thought of in 1978. Wolfgang WAS thought of in 1978!   Eddie Van Halen thought, "Gee, I think I'd like to have kids some day." Touche...

[rushgoober]

QUOTE (EmotionDetector @ Dec 23 2009, 02:51 PM)

QUOTE (rushgoober @ Dec 23 2009, 02:46 PM) QUOTE (EmotionDetector @ Dec 23 2009, 09:43 AM) QUOTE (Rush Cocky @ Dec 23 2009, 09:05 AM) QUOTE (EmotionDetector @ Dec 23 2009, 08:59 AM) left off...Michael Anthony And why not? After all, everyone knows Wolfgang has been playing bass for Van Halen since he was in diapers.   Yes, and just like that time before their 2007 tour when they posted the VH1 album cover on their website, with Wolfgang photo-shopped in place of Michael Anthony.   I'm sure he was thought of in 1978. Wolfgang WAS thought of in 1978!   Eddie Van Halen thought, "Gee, I think I'd like to have kids some day." Touche...

[KublaKhan]

Fair Warning is definitely their best album. I was originally drawn to it due to Unchained, which is probably my favorite Van Halen song, but the other songs are figgin' amazing too. Mean Street is probably my second favorite Van Halen song, just because its so awesome. Even stuff like Hear About It Later and Sinner's Swing are pretty awesome too.

 

If I had to put the 6 DLR albums in order:

 

1. Fair Warning - See Above for why its so great.

2. Van Halen I - One Good Song After Another

3. 1984 - One of Those Great Albums That You Just Never Get Tired Of (Even though it has Jump on it)

4. Women and Children First - Every Body Wants Some!! 'Nuff said.

5. Diver Down - Should Probably suck, with all the filler/covers, but the original songs (and even some of the covers) are so good, that I can't help but like it.

6. Van Halen II - Has some great songs (Light up the Sky, which is probably the best song on the album), don't get me wrong, but on the whole its a weaker album than the others.

[Earthshine]

Van Halen II.

 

 

By the way, here is the original "Hot For Teacher" beat :

 

 

 

 

Edited December 26, 2009 by Earthshine

[goose]

QUOTE (tangy @ Dec 22 2009, 10:07 AM)

I also think there is no denying that DLR's good looks were another major factor to vh's sucess. He is not much to look at now but back day he drove the ladies crazy.

 

 

 

http://i251.photobucket.com/albums/gg293/goose_trf/Van-Halen-Women-And-Childre-384747.jpg

 

 

Edited December 29, 2009 by goose

[RUSHHEAD666]

QUOTE (goose @ Dec 29 2009, 02:34 AM)

QUOTE (tangy @ Dec 22 2009, 10:07 AM) I also think there is no denying that DLR's good looks were another major factor to vh's sucess. He is not much to look at now but back day he drove the ladies crazy.       http://i251.photobucket.com/albums/gg293/goose_trf/Van-Halen-Women-And-Childre-384747.jpg He is a good looking dude no doubt about it. He was a HPM. That's Human Pussy Machine.   As for now, age is a factor. I absolutely HATED his long white hair when that crappy "Diamond Dave" solo album came out. Remember that debacle of a tour when Sammy Hagar and DLR played together? I kind of wanted to go but I didn't make it. I think they played the Selland Arena in Fresno where I have travelled to see RUSH many times. Anyway I though Dave looked a lot better on the Van Halen 2008 Tour with those killer hairy lamb chops on the sides of his balding melon.

[RUSHHEAD666]

I love seeing "Fair Warning" with 15 votes! I sure would like to see that number climb past the debut album!

[RUSHHEAD666]

This "1984" pick paragraph on eBay says it all.

The Van Hagar Era had some excellent songs but most were keyboard infused cotton candy pop.

 

I actually loved the 3.5 version of Van Halen in 2008 although Michael's voice was missed. I went to two shows!

 

"And The Cradle Will Rock!"

 

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/EDDIE-VAN-HALEN-PICK-1...1#ht_1652wt_780

[GotRush]

QUOTE (EmotionDetector @ Dec 23 2009, 11:43 AM)

QUOTE (Rush Cocky @ Dec 23 2009, 09:05 AM) QUOTE (EmotionDetector @ Dec 23 2009, 08:59 AM) left off...Michael Anthony And why not? After all, everyone knows Wolfgang has been playing bass for Van Halen since he was in diapers.   Yes, and just like that time before their 2007 tour when they posted the VH1 album cover on their website, with Wolfgang photo-shopped in place of Michael Anthony.   This is why I refuse to support the current VH in any way   Eddie is a JERK ! Period .   BTW...........   VH (1) is the winner ( one of only a handful of albums I "wore" out & had to replace )

[rushgoober]

QUOTE (RUSHHEAD666 @ Dec 30 2009, 02:03 AM)

This "1984" pick paragraph on eBay says it all. The Van Hagar Era had some excellent songs but most were keyboard infused cotton candy pop. I actually loved the 3.5 version of Van Halen in 2008 although Michael's voice was missed. I went to two shows! "And The Cradle Will Rock!" http://cgi.ebay.com/EDDIE-VAN-HALEN-PICK-1...1#ht_1652wt_780

He wants $185 for a signed guitar pick?

 

 

[Presto-digitation]

Looking at the poll results, I'll say Diver Down -- while not their best album -- is underrated just the same. So there!

[metaldad]

QUOTE (GotRush @ Dec 30 2009, 06:28 AM)

QUOTE (EmotionDetector @ Dec 23 2009, 11:43 AM) QUOTE (Rush Cocky @ Dec 23 2009, 09:05 AM) QUOTE (EmotionDetector @ Dec 23 2009, 08:59 AM) left off...Michael Anthony And why not? After all, everyone knows Wolfgang has been playing bass for Van Halen since he was in diapers.   Yes, and just like that time before their 2007 tour when they posted the VH1 album cover on their website, with Wolfgang photo-shopped in place of Michael Anthony.   This is why I refuse to support the current VH in any way   Eddie is a JERK ! Period .   BTW...........   VH (1) is the winner ( one of only a handful of albums I "wore" out & had to replace ) Did You Ever Meet Him ??? I am Thinking No So Please Stop Talking Out Your Ass . He is a great guy