thizzellewashington Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 Haven't really seen a lot of discussion of the actual book yet. I'm about halfway done with it and I can't say I'm all that impressed. It basically reads like fan fiction, and a lot of the references to Rush lyrics come across as really obvious and forced in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StellarJetman Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 (edited) QUOTE (thizzellewashington @ Sep 6 2012, 06:10 PM) Haven't really seen a lot of discussion of the actual book yet. I'm about halfway done with it and I can't say I'm all that impressed. It basically reads like fan fiction, and a lot of the references to Rush lyrics come across as really obvious and forced in. Cracked it about a week ago at Barnes & Noble and got the same impression from the prologue and bits of the first chapter. I was going to give it a real chance when I got the time, but I don't think that I'll bother now after reading your post. Honestly, Anderson's writing has never impressed me. I know that he's Neil's friend and all, but he was definitely the wrong guy for the job. Edited September 7, 2012 by StellarJetman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CygnusGal Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 I bought it tonight. I'll give it a try. Cool graphics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Principled Man Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 I won't be reading it. I still haven't recovered from Anderson's hatchet job on the final Dune novels. He writes for 12 year-olds. He's a hack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Territorial_Game Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 QUOTE (thizzellewashington @ Sep 6 2012, 06:10 PM) Haven't really seen a lot of discussion of the actual book yet. I'm about halfway done with it and I can't say I'm all that impressed. It basically reads like fan fiction, and a lot of the references to Rush lyrics come across as really obvious and forced in. I was thinking the same thing. I'll finish the book just to complete the whole album experience, but it's really not doing it for me. Like you said, the Rush references all seem forced and bland, like he is intentionally breaking his own (mediocre at best) patterns to force in a phrase fans will recognize. There's nothing gripping about the way he tells the story, no emotion whatsoever. Neil did so much more with everything, which I guess is to be expected. Also, I tried to read some of Anderson's other stuff (Saga of Seven Suns), and never could get into it. He just doesn't do it for me. It's a bit of a letdown after such an amazing album. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thizzellewashington Posted September 7, 2012 Author Share Posted September 7, 2012 (edited) Here's the thing: I really like some of the stuff about the Watchmaker and Anarchist backstories. Just don't find Owen or any of the carnival people particularly interesting or compelling. If Neil and Kevin had done the book as a Silmarillion-type "companion to the Clockwork Angels universe" thing instead of a literal adaptation of the album, it might have worked better. As it is, this is one of the only true artistic misfires of their career. Shame, since CA is probably their best album since Power Windows. Edited September 7, 2012 by thizzellewashington Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mighty Dudad Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 I've only read the first three chapters that were previously downloadable. Kind of "meh", but I'm sure I'll eventually read the whole thing. I agree about the forced Rush references, but also think that we (hard-core Rush fans who frequent these forums) are a bit hyper-sensitive to those kids of things. It would be interesting to see how non-Rush fans react to this. My real question for this group is this: has reading CA The Novel changed your thoughts and/or appreciation of CA The Album? If you don't like the book, do you find that dislike creeping in when listening to the CD? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HalfwayToGone Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 Not really--listening to music and an album is a completely different experience from reading for me. But I've always been way more focused on the music than the lyrics when it comes to that (even with vocals--the sound and the melodies/harmonies, not the actual words so much). That said, this novel is playing to probably the most literate and discriminating crowd of any rock band fanbase in history. I expect that many Rush fans would expect a literary masterpiece rather than just another work of fiction. I read only the first chapter so far, and I'm curious to see where it's going from there, because I've always been one to question authority and be skeptical of what supposed experts say about certain things, and this story seems to be about freeing one's self from rigid ways of thinking and living or blind acceptance of the status quo, which I'm all for. I also wonder if they were aiming at a younger, less sophisticated crowd when they wrote this, to try and get a message out there to the next generation. Most of us fans are already jaded, older farts who already figured this stuff out, and don't need to learn this stuff for the first time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cygnus27 Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 QUOTE (thizzellewashington @ Sep 6 2012, 07:10 PM) Haven't really seen a lot of discussion of the actual book yet. I'm about halfway done with it and I can't say I'm all that impressed. It basically reads like fan fiction, and a lot of the references to Rush lyrics come across as really obvious and forced in. I've finished it, it was okay (I'd give it a 3/5 stars), and I just chalk it up to being a nice companion-piece to the album. I do agree that the Rush references get pretty old pretty quick, but they keep coming at you throughout the book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Animate Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 (edited) Finished. I have not read any Anderson books, however, the Neil influence is so very strong. The whole piece does seem disjointed, as if it really needed at least one more solid re-write or a good editorial overhaul and stylistic unification. Some parts flow very well, others sections seem unpolished, as if written by a high school student. However, like so much of Neil, it is almost an overreach- almost as if every thematic idea Neil has expressed over a lifetime is crammed into a fairly small tome. So many ideas- are the Watchmaker and the Anarchists and Owen Hardy actually the story of Hemispheres? Is the Watchmakers society the same one described in The Trees? Are the Watchmaker and the Anarchists actually not real people at all but reflect the inner struggle of Neil- his conflict between his extreme need for absolute control and absolute freedom at the same time? I am really looking forward to having a thread were we point out each lyrical reference. Some are blatant (e.g. "but you are a stranger, not a long-awaited friend!" or "sadly, dog years are not like people years"- really? really? did you just really have to write that??). By the same token, there are other passages that seem to be extensively paraphrased lyrical references. Wanted to wait until after the opening night excitement to start cataloguing and discussing lyrical and thematic references. It is both a very very simple, almost childish, book and yet at the same time a very complex book. So very Rush-like, would you not say? Edited September 7, 2012 by Animate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Lofty Oaks Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 I think posting my link to the blog is appropriate here in this thread. A full accounting of my thoughts about the novel are there. Too long to post here. Feel free to read and comment freely, good or bad. The Lofty Oaks - Clockwork Angels: The Novel Review Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StellarJetman Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 (edited) QUOTE (HalfwayToGone @ Sep 7 2012, 06:40 AM)That said, this novel is playing to probably the most literate and discriminating crowd of any rock band fanbase in history. The word that you're looking for is "nerdy". Nothing against nerds, but sheesh that's some hyperbole. Unless Rand, Tolkien, and Asimov constitute the literary canon now. QUOTE (HalfwayToGone @ Sep 7 2012, 06:40 AM)I expect that many Rush fans would expect a literary masterpiece rather than just another work of fiction. A book doesn't have to be a "literary masterpiece" to be a decent read. What I read was definitely more on the level of a cheap tie-in or novelization. (Which is more or less what Anderson writes most of the time anyway.) I get that that's basically what it is, but I also get the impression that it isn't supposed to be just that. QUOTE (HalfwayToGone @ Sep 7 2012, 06:40 AM)I also wonder if they were aiming at a younger, less sophisticated crowd when they wrote this, to try and get a message out there to the next generation. Don't patronize Neil and Kevin and don't insult kids' intelligence. Edited September 7, 2012 by StellarJetman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Territorial_Game Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 QUOTE (The Mighty Dudad @ Sep 7 2012, 04:53 AM) My real question for this group is this: has reading CA The Novel changed your thoughts and/or appreciation of CA The Album? If you don't like the book, do you find that dislike creeping in when listening to the CD? It hasn't done anything to the music, at least for me. I finished the book this morning, and really just think it's dismissible. CA is still in my top 10 Rush albums, and Anderson's hatchet job on the novelization of its concept won't change that for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bangster of Goats Posted September 8, 2012 Share Posted September 8, 2012 (edited) I'm in the middle of reading it right now. I agree it's a bit "meh", but I do too enjoy finding out more about the backstories of the Watchmaker and the Anarchist. It just seems a bit stiff. Now, when I read the downloadable PDF preview of it a few weeks ago and started seeing all those references to Rush lyrics, I was like "oh no... he's really going to go with that isn't he..." and yup, he certainly keeps it up all right. At the moment he worked in a reference to the Hold Your Fire album art it made me facepalm in real life and I thought "ahhh jeez, I shoulda seen THAT one coming... sigh..!" But yeah, it gives the oft-repeated-phrase-around-here "shoehorned lyrics" a whole new meaning! Edited September 8, 2012 by Bangster of Goats Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rushfanforever! Posted September 8, 2012 Share Posted September 8, 2012 Purchased a copy last night from Barnes & Noble, but haven't started to read it yet as I was following the earlier manchester tour opener info feeds. Now that I know the setlist, I can focus and read the book. Nice suprise as well that the lyrics to CA are at the end of the book. I got to get most of 'em memorized before Thursday's show!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMR Posted September 8, 2012 Share Posted September 8, 2012 I guess I agree with the comment that it is written for 12- year old's, but I have to say that I really liked it. I'll admit that some of the lyrical references made me cringe, but it was written for Rush fans, so what can you say? I loved the album to start with, and the novel only made me want to listen to the album more, so it succeeded there. Maybe someone can answer this... it kind of lost me in all the talk about the book that Owen finds that the captain said is written by his mother from a another world. Are they implying a parallel universe type of thing? Either I didn't understand that part, or they should have explained it better, or just left it out. Any Thoughts on this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HalfwayToGone Posted September 8, 2012 Share Posted September 8, 2012 QUOTE (StellarJetman @ Sep 7 2012, 02:50 PM) QUOTE (HalfwayToGone @ Sep 7 2012, 06:40 AM)That said, this novel is playing to probably the most literate and discriminating crowd of any rock band fanbase in history. The word that you're looking for is "nerdy". Nothing against nerds, but sheesh that's some hyperbole. Unless Rand, Tolkien, and Asimov constitute the literary canon now. QUOTE (HalfwayToGone @ Sep 7 2012, 06:40 AM)I expect that many Rush fans would expect a literary masterpiece rather than just another work of fiction. A book doesn't have to be a "literary masterpiece" to be a decent read. What I read was definitely more on the level of a cheap tie-in or novelization. (Which is more or less what Anderson writes most of the time anyway.) I get that that's basically what it is, but I also get the impression that it isn't supposed to be just that. QUOTE (HalfwayToGone @ Sep 7 2012, 06:40 AM)I also wonder if they were aiming at a younger, less sophisticated crowd when they wrote this, to try and get a message out there to the next generation. Don't patronize Neil and Kevin and don't insult kids' intelligence. First off you call Rush fans "nerdy," slag guys like Asimov and Tolkien, and call out Anderson as writing cheap tie-ins, but somehow I'm the one who's "patronizing Neil and Kevin and insulting kids' intelligence" for suggesting the authors might be trying to capture a younger crowd. Maybe you live on some other planet, but from where I'm standing, sophistication isn't something kids are born with. It's acquired over time and with experience. Just because a kid is intelligent, doesn't make him sophisticated--a baby may be loaded with intelligence, but it isn't born with the ability to read and understand language. So, pardon me for assuming that there might be kids out there who follow the trendsetters instead of thinking for themselves, or who might learn something from this story, or heavens forbid, get a sense of affirmation from its message if they happen to buck the trends. If you "get" that the book "is what it is," then why are you so sore? And thanks again for stereotyping Rush fans as all nerds who love Ayn Rand--you're exactly right. Include yourself? I may be going out on a limb here, but I assume you wouldn't be posting here if you weren't one of those nerdy, Rand-worshipping Rush fans. And thanks again for patronizing everyone before accusing me of doing so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StellarJetman Posted September 8, 2012 Share Posted September 8, 2012 (edited) Edited September 8, 2012 by StellarJetman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Animate Posted September 8, 2012 Share Posted September 8, 2012 QUOTE (RMR @ Sep 8 2012, 07:05 AM) I guess I agree with the comment that it is written for 12- year old's, but I have to say that I really liked it. I'll admit that some of the lyrical references made me cringe, but it was written for Rush fans, so what can you say? I loved the album to start with, and the novel only made me want to listen to the album more, so it succeeded there. Maybe someone can answer this... it kind of lost me in all the talk about the book that Owen finds that the captain said is written by his mother from a another world. Are they implying a parallel universe type of thing? Either I didn't understand that part, or they should have explained it better, or just left it out. Any Thoughts on this? That is his mom's life in another "one of many possible worlds". The whole scene in the bookstore, with "similar-yet-different" versions of Owen's favorite book and later when Owen goes back and can't find the bookstore at all, tells us that in the CA world, there are bridges or connections between many parallel universes and that there are people who move freely between them (the bookseller?). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMR Posted September 8, 2012 Share Posted September 8, 2012 QUOTE (Animate @ Sep 8 2012, 04:31 PM) QUOTE (RMR @ Sep 8 2012, 07:05 AM) I guess I agree with the comment that it is written for 12- year old's, but I have to say that I really liked it. I'll admit that some of the lyrical references made me cringe, but it was written for Rush fans, so what can you say? I loved the album to start with, and the novel only made me want to listen to the album more, so it succeeded there. Maybe someone can answer this... it kind of lost me in all the talk about the book that Owen finds that the captain said is written by his mother from a another world. Are they implying a parallel universe type of thing? Either I didn't understand that part, or they should have explained it better, or just left it out. Any Thoughts on this? That is his mom's life in another "one of many possible worlds". The whole scene in the bookstore, with "similar-yet-different" versions of Owen's favorite book and later when Owen goes back and can't find the bookstore at all, tells us that in the CA world, there are bridges or connections between many parallel universes and that there are people who move freely between them (the bookseller?). Makes sense. So, I guess the captain can move freely among worlds as well, since he can always find the bookstore and obtain more books. I thought at first that the bookseller might be Owen's mother. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HalfwayToGone Posted September 8, 2012 Share Posted September 8, 2012 (edited) @Stellar Jetman Sorry if I came off a bit hot there, but you seem to think I'm pompous and self-aggrandizing with my post, and your response was dismissive if not frankly insulting, when really I was referring to fans exactly like you (surely not myself), and trying to be complimentary rather than calling you a bunch of snobs or jerks or anything else insulting to your intelligence. Really, your entire diatribe essentially proves my point about Rush fans being highly discriminating. You're the perfect example, in fact. Perhaps I was being a bit too absolute about it, but you're possibly taking my original post a bit way too seriously and thinking I'm self-congratulatory, which I'm absolutely not (I rarely read anything aside from the interweb these days). And maybe I took your response too personally also. And yeah, I know kids read a Wrinkle In Time--it was the first summer homework I ever had as a kid, and I resented having to do homework during vacation. Tremendously. I got through it only because it was a very good book. But my point wasn't that kids don't ever read good books, it's that the basic lesson behind CA is absolutely worth telling to kids. Especially when the country is so divided with each half telling the other how they should act, think and feel about just about everything. OK, off my soapbox now. And again, sorry if I reacted too harshly last post, but hey, I didn't start out trying to insult anyone. Edited September 8, 2012 by HalfwayToGone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theredtamasrule Posted September 9, 2012 Share Posted September 9, 2012 QUOTE (thizzellewashington @ Sep 6 2012, 07:10 PM) Haven't really seen a lot of discussion of the actual book yet. I'm about halfway done with it and I can't say I'm all that impressed. It basically reads like fan fiction, and a lot of the references to Rush lyrics come across as really obvious and forced in. I read through it at B&N...not good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cygnus27 Posted September 9, 2012 Share Posted September 9, 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Animate Posted September 9, 2012 Share Posted September 9, 2012 (edited) Edited September 9, 2012 by Animate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeminiRising79 Posted September 9, 2012 Share Posted September 9, 2012 QUOTE (StellarJetman @ Sep 6 2012, 08:02 PM) Honestly, Anderson's writing has never impressed me. I know that he's Neil's friend and all, but he was definitely the wrong guy for the job. Interesting. Seems there are a few people in the Rush camp who are the wrong guys for the job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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