What was the last truly great album?

[SlyJeff]

QUOTE (rushgoober @ Dec 28 2010, 08:30 AM)

QUOTE (SlyJeff @ Dec 28 2010, 06:13 AM) QUOTE (rushgoober @ Dec 28 2010, 06:00 AM) There is no objective measure for quality.   Tell this to my music professors. But again, "Quality" and "What I Like" are not always the same thing. Exactly. Sorry, but with any form of art, a dry academic dissection and explanation of what constitutes quality will always be trumped by if it moves you or not. Of course- you'll find no disagreement here. Nor would my professors. But the point is, none of us listen to music in a vacuum. What moves us is defined by more than just the music itself. That objective measure is cold and academic, and useful for learning, not listening.   I cannot listen to "Dreamline" and not remember exactly where I was, in my friend's car on the way to school, and thinking "This is different. What kind of a band is this?" Hearing it always evokes the memory of discovering the band for the first time- and because of that it will always be my favorite song by the band. It just moves me. I have a sense of a door opening and beginning a journey every time I hear it. The lyrics help that, of course, but I know I'm bringing a lot of myself to the experience.   Objectively I think "Subdivisions" is a stronger song in every way: musically, lyrically, and delivery. And it is my second favorite Rush song for those reasons, but it will never trump the way I feel when I hear "Dreamline".   We are complex beings and we bring all of that complexity to the experience when we hear a song- I don't think any of us are capable of drowning out the baggage, and why would we want to anyway? I just draw the line at using this as a means of measuring the bands quality- it'll never be a fair measure because it hinges so much on stuff the listener brings to the experience- in my opinion of course.

[Tick]

QUOTE (SlyJeff @ Dec 27 2010, 10:22 PM)

It sucks to ask this question and tell me that my opinion is not valid.

yeah...that totally sucks!

 

You need to pick a better great Rush album.

 

[ReflectedLight]

let me sum it all up. different strokes for different folks.

i might not like the two new songs while the guy next to me thinks they're amazing. there's something for everybody out there.

[flybyknight]

Without a doubt it would be Roll The Bones and everything after T4E is substandard, with exception to the Hammersmith disk on Different Stages, hope Clockwork Angels remedies this!

[Tick]

QUOTE (flybyknight @ Dec 28 2010, 10:29 AM)

Without a doubt it would be Roll The Bones and everything after T4E is substandard, with exception to the Hammersmith disk on Different Stages, hope Clockwork Angels remedies this!

What exactly makes Roll The Bones a great album? Is it You Bet Your Life? or perhaps, Faceup? Maybe its Heresy?

 

Seriously though, in my opinion, Bravado and Ghost Of A Chance are truly outstanding songs. The rest of them including Dreamline are too dated sounding. I loved the album when it came out but it didn't age well for me.

 

I can still listen to it and enjoy it but its just all right for me.

[circumstantial tree]

Heresy is my favorite song on RTB, particularly those lines of "all those wasted years" towards the end when Geddy is repeating the line. There's something about the way he sings it. The military style percussion adds to the atmosphere.

[ReflectedLight]

QUOTE (circumstantial tree @ Dec 28 2010, 09:55 AM)

Heresy is my favorite song on RTB, particularly those lines of "all those wasted years" towards the end when Geddy is repeating the line. There's something about the way he sings it. The military style percussion adds to the atmosphere.

heresy is a good tune i'll listen to on occasion but the rest of the album didn't stand the test of time for me. i could stomach listening to bravado live but the rest is a skip for me.

[Mr. Krinkle]

QUOTE (rushgoober @ Dec 28 2010, 05:54 AM)

It seems like people often come up with elaborate reasons to defend latter-day Rush, like that it's not the band's fault if we don't like their newer music, they're just evolving and we're not up to the task somehow of being able to appreciate what they've evolved into, or that we're not grateful enough to just get anything from them at this point, or that somehow we're too jaded by our love of their earlier material and how it made us feel growing up that nothing could possibly live up to it. .......

Rush has had a lot of musicians in their audience since around 1975-76. The music that they produced during the FBN,COS-Power Windows era challenged these particular fans with their own musical ambitions and was a source for inspiration. When Rush made that change in the mid eighties, it was an end of the musical statements and the 'expirimentation' began. Less focus on complex arrangements but more focus on complex instruments and sounds. That drove the 'musician' crowd away and ushered in the tech generation.

Getting, or trying to get back to that original, raw musician level Rush will take some epic songwriting and longer tracks with some ambience.

Caravan and BU2B are great tracks, but the album is going to have to breathe for it to get back to that great raw power that they are still known for. They have been trying since 1994 and I think that Clockwork Angels will finally be the balance that they have been trying to get to since then.

 

Acoustic guitars, acapella vocals, some reverb, not so dry and in your face, some outside 'sounds', some mini moog, mellotron, bells, clear articulate instrumentation and tone from each of them.

I want to hear everything that they are playing clearly instead of trying to sift out each part buired in a clipped out, distorted big time rock and roll 'sound'.

[losingit2k]

The last truly great album was Snake & Arrows, prior to that I would go with Counterparts!

 

 

 

[Mr. Krinkle]

Oh, and I want some clear Moog Taurus pedals too. Not just the low end. Any pedals can produce 'low end' notes.

Taurus pedals where I can hear them and say "Moog Taurus Pedals!!", like at the beginning of Xanadu or Jacobs Ladder for examples.

[Todem]

QUOTE (Mr. Krinkle @ Dec 28 2010, 10:54 AM)

QUOTE (rushgoober @ Dec 28 2010, 05:54 AM) It seems like people often come up with elaborate reasons to defend latter-day Rush, like that it's not the band's fault if we don't like their newer music, they're just evolving and we're not up to the task somehow of being able to appreciate what they've evolved into, or that we're not grateful enough to just get anything from them at this point, or that somehow we're too jaded by our love of their earlier material and how it made us feel growing up that nothing could possibly live up to it. ....... Rush has had a lot of musicians in their audience since around 1975-76. The music that they produced during the FBN,COS-Power Windows era challenged these particular fans with their own musical ambitions and was a source for inspiration. When Rush made that change in the mid eighties, it was an end of the musical statements and the 'expirimentation' began. Less focus on complex arrangements but more focus on complex instruments and sounds. That drove the 'musician' crowd away and ushered in the tech generation. Getting, or trying to get back to that original, raw musician level Rush will take some epic songwriting and longer tracks with some ambience. Caravan and BU2B are great tracks, but the album is going to have to breathe for it to get back to that great raw power that they are still known for. They have been trying since 1994 and I think that Clockwork Angels will finally be the balance that they have been trying to get to since then.   Acoustic guitars, acapella vocals, some reverb, not so dry and in your face, some outside 'sounds', some mini moog, mellotron, bells, clear articulate instrumentation and tone from each of them. I want to hear everything that they are playing clearly instead of trying to sift out each part buired in a clipped out, distorted big time rock and roll 'sound'. I have to disagree,   I started listening to Rush in 1981 (11 years of age) and began playing guitar at age 10. When Rush started their shift, it inspired me as well. I loved 2112, Hemispheres, Waves and Pictures and those were the foundation for me as a player who was heavily influenced by Rush. I learned to play drums and bass as they really blew me away. But starting with Grace Under Pressure and then of course Windows anf HYF I felt the urge to experiement as well and my love for them grew even stronger during the Keyboard years. Yeah there was a contingent of other musician Rush fans who frowned on that movement but there was a huge group of us who were further inspired to stretch our soundscapes. I loved Alex's guitar work on those records. yeah he looked back on those with some disdain but i found some of his very best guitar work on those albums (especially Grace Under Pressure and Signals) No doubt Hemi - Pictures is my favorite run of albums and guitar work for Alex, but Geddy and Neil went to some amazing heights during the "Keyboard" era and I was astoudned at an earlier post saying Geddys bass work stunk post Signals.....no way. Maybe sonically he went down a little, but technically he was on fire. Power Windows and HYF contain some of his very best bass work ever.   It's all subjective and there is no right or wrong. I hate posts that argue that. Everyone has their favorites.   It's all good.

[Spindrift82]

There's nothing wrong with not liking the recent stuff. For instance, I rank Vapor Trails and Counterparts up there with some of the best stuff they did in their 'glory days', but find Test For Echo and Snakes & Arrows really weak.

 

Now, would I rather have them give up on writing new music and just stick to touring? No way! I love hearing new stuff from them - and as someone who got into them in high school in the early 2000's, I haven't been a Rush fan for that long. I certainly want to hear new stuff from that.

 

That being said, I still enjoy Snakes & Arrows and Test For Echo. Some of my favorite Rush tracks are from those albums. I also find 2112 and Moving Pictures incredibly overrated, and would rank at least 12 albums higher than those two albums. Caress Of Steel and Fly by Night are two incredibly underrated albums, as are Presto and Roll The Bones.

 

I think that we're all Rush fans here. Some of us have favorite albums (my favorite Rush album is A Farewell To Kings), some of us don't like each other's favorite albums that much, some of us like the older stuff, some of us like the newer stuff, some of us like it all. I personally find appreciation in every single album, including Feedback. And when Clockwork Angels comes out, I'm sure I'll find that as a good album as well. Rush simply can't put out a bad album...weaker albums, yes, but a bad album? You surely jest!

 

As long as we can agree to disagree on what our favorite albums are, and what our favorite period of the band is, then we can all discover our similarities rather than our differences. We're all Rush fans here, we all like what Geddy, Alex, and Neil create. We've all seen them live, bought the t-shirts and merchandise, and bought the albums (for some of us, several times over.) That makes us all Rush fans.

 

Let's agree to disagree.

[Mr. Krinkle]

 

[trenken]

Last truly great for me I guess would be Power Windows. Not that I dont like anything after that, I think most of the albums that followed were pretty good, but if we're talking relative to everything theyve done, the last one for me that can kind of compare with their best work would be PoW.

 

Love the bass work, the interesting arrangements, drumming, vocal melodies. The album sounds very dated today with all the songs being so "grand", and the heavy synths, but I still think the song writing itself it top notch.

 

I think HYF is great too, but not from start to finish. There's a few songs on there I would consider lame filler songs, I didnt really feel PoW had any fillers, so its the last great one from start to finish for me. Its once they had to start writing more songs due to CD's is when I feel like they started writing more filler songs.

[rushgoober]

QUOTE (trenken @ Dec 28 2010, 10:23 AM)

I think HYF is great too, but not from start to finish. There's a few songs on there I would consider lame filler songs

*cough* High Water *cough* Tai Shan *cough*

 

gotta be careful about using the word "filler" around here. some people go insane when you mention that word.

[teababe27]

Probably Roll the Bones.

[ReflectedLight]

QUOTE (rushgoober @ Dec 28 2010, 09:02 PM)

QUOTE (trenken @ Dec 28 2010, 10:23 AM) I think HYF is great too, but not from start to finish. There's a few songs on there I would consider lame filler songs *cough* High Water *cough* Tai Shan *cough*   gotta be careful about using the word "filler" around here. some people go insane when you mention that word. i'll take those two "filler" songs over force ten and turn the page.

[JohnnyBlaze]

I'd probably have to say Signals. That's from beginning to end with everything superb and being an album I can listen to every day. Everything since then has been one of these: 1) very good with moments of greatness, 2) good with moments of greatness, 3) ok with moments of goodness, or 4) it has a few moments of coolness but overall I don't like it.

[circumstantial tree]

QUOTE (ReflectedLight @ Dec 28 2010, 10:18 PM)

QUOTE (rushgoober @ Dec 28 2010, 09:02 PM) QUOTE (trenken @ Dec 28 2010, 10:23 AM) I think HYF is great too, but not from start to finish. There's a few songs on there I would consider lame filler songs *cough* High Water *cough* Tai Shan *cough*   gotta be careful about using the word "filler" around here. some people go insane when you mention that word. i'll take those two "filler" songs over force ten and turn the page. I'll take all four.

[Silas Lang]

QUOTE (rushgoober @ Dec 28 2010, 06:54 AM)

It seems like people often come up with elaborate reasons to defend latter-day Rush, like that it's not the band's fault if we don't like their newer music, they're just evolving and we're not up to the task somehow of being able to appreciate what they've evolved into, or that we're not grateful enough to just get anything from them at this point, or that somehow we're too jaded by our love of their earlier material and how it made us feel growing up that nothing could possibly live up to it.

You can probably count on one hand the number of rock bands that have ever produced new material 30 years or more after their first album (only Yes and the Rolling Stones come to mind). Even less with their accepted classic lineup still intact. I don't see how any Rush wouldn't feel grateful about that fact. So for me any new material at this point is a bonus.

 

Snakes & Arrows is my least favorite but I think Vapor Trails is their best since Power Windows. Test For Echo, Counterparts and Presto were all pretty damn good too IMO. But I would never expect them to reach the peaks they routinely scaled between 1974-1985. Rock & roll is youth oriented music which is why few rock bands produce their best stuff later in their career (one of the few I can think of are Pink Floyd or the Beatles both of whom were still relatively young). But Caravan and BU2B have me thinking twice that Rush may still be capable of it.

[rushgoober]

QUOTE (ReflectedLight @ Dec 28 2010, 08:18 PM)

QUOTE (rushgoober @ Dec 28 2010, 09:02 PM) QUOTE (trenken @ Dec 28 2010, 10:23 AM) I think HYF is great too, but not from start to finish. There's a few songs on there I would consider lame filler songs *cough* High Water *cough* Tai Shan *cough*   gotta be careful about using the word "filler" around here. some people go insane when you mention that word. i'll take those two "filler" songs over force ten and turn the page.

[ReRushed]

QUOTE (rushgoober @ Dec 28 2010, 10:43 PM)

QUOTE (ReflectedLight @ Dec 28 2010, 08:18 PM) QUOTE (rushgoober @ Dec 28 2010, 09:02 PM) QUOTE (trenken @ Dec 28 2010, 10:23 AM) I think HYF is great too, but not from start to finish. There's a few songs on there I would consider lame filler songs *cough* High Water *cough* Tai Shan *cough*   gotta be careful about using the word "filler" around here. some people go insane when you mention that word. i'll take those two "filler" songs over force ten and turn the page. I think "Primer Mover" is one of the best songs Rush has ever written. The album is superb. A definite "grower". I couldn't stand it the first time I heard it.

[troutman]

They all suck!!

[Duck]

QUOTE (JohnnyBlaze @ Dec 28 2010, 10:19 PM)

I'd probably have to say Signals. That's from beginning to end with everything superb and being an album I can listen to every day. Everything since then has been one of these: 1) very good with moments of greatness, 2) good with moments of greatness, 3) ok with moments of goodness, or 4) it has a few moments of coolness but overall I don't like it.

The truth.

[Tick]

QUOTE (Duck @ Dec 29 2010, 12:43 AM)

QUOTE (JohnnyBlaze @ Dec 28 2010, 10:19 PM) I'd probably have to say Signals.  That's from beginning to end with everything superb and being an album I can listen to every day.  Everything since then has been one of these: 1) very good with moments of greatness, 2) good with moments of greatness, 3) ok with moments of goodness, or 4) it has a few moments of coolness but overall I don't like it. The truth. Well, if Signals is superb, which it is, certainly so is Grace Under Pressure.