What is the point of cynicism and negativity?

[LyndseyG]

[ThinkingBig]

QUOTE (Gedneil Alpeart @ May 9 2012, 08:09 AM)

A new Rush album is coming.....excitement and hype abound.  I can perfectly understand fans wanting to be cautious about expectations and not wanting to hype lest raise too high and unrealistic hopes only to be disappointed.  However, some of you go beyond this....expressing pervasive cynicism and negativity about the album, which hasn't even been heard in full.  Yes, I know that some of you dont like the three songs heard so far and you have every right to express your dissatisfaction, but the attitude I also sense is of almost complete dismissal and panning...not able to salvage anything positive out of the new stuff.  I see this on other forums too, usually much worse there than on here.  Beyond expressing particular points of dissatisfaction, what gives about the bashing?  Why the trolling?  Are you indirectly expressing some sort of grudge towards the band about past expectations being smashed or utter disappointment?  Is this negativity some sort of defense mechanism against disappointment, or you just like to express dissenting opinions for attention, or vent your frustrations about other things in your lives that have nothing to do with Rush?  Do you feel envious towards those Rush fans who are enjoying new material, but you cant join the party?  Are you frustrated that Rush didnt create MP 2 or your own personal fantasy album?  Im not trying to sound like a jerk, but just curious to know the reasons behind all this negative spew I see and hear so often when it comes to new Rush. The negativity is old and tiresome.  It contributes nothing positive to discussions.  Heard it all.  Again, to be clear, Im no fan boy and dont appreciate blind praise for anything Rush puts out either.  There are many Rush songs I dont much appreciate, but I try to keep an open mind too.  Im also not talking about critical reviews or healthy analyses and debates with balanced perspectives.  Expressing general dislike for a song or album is not what I have an issue with.  You know what Im talking about....we've seen it here, elsewhere and will see it again.........unfortunately.

Great OP, well said.

 

I love the 3 songs we've heard off the new album, I think they're some of the best music RUSH has ever created. Clockwork Angels looks to be the culmination of 40 years of musical genius, combing 2112's sic-fi themes with the musical brilliance of Moving Pictures, Signals, even Snakes and Arrows.

 

During the 90's, I stopped following Rush. I've tried to go back and listen to TFE and CP, but they just don't speak to me like the albums before and after that period. That's cool, it's all good. Rush was doing their thing and still bringing new fans into the fold. They deserve all the fans and success they've earned. And the fans that bought and supported those albums deserve a nod during the live shows.

 

See, that's how I believe you express an opinion on a fan site. -- I didn't get in to TFI. It was me, my taste in music, it wasn't about RUSH lacking something. Some people need attention and therefore state their opinion in a mean spirited, emphatic manner. Whatever.

 

I'm counting the days until the new CD drops and I look forward to reading the book.

 

 

[Gedneil Alpeart]

[rushgoober]

QUOTE (ThinkingBig @ May 12 2012, 04:46 AM)

During the 90's, I stopped following Rush. I've tried to go back and listen to TFE and CP, but they just don't speak to me like the albums before and after that period. That's cool, it's all good. Rush was doing their thing and still bringing new fans into the fold. They deserve all the fans and success they've earned. And the fans that bought and supported those albums deserve a nod during the live shows. See, that's how I believe you express an opinion on a fan site. -- I didn't get in to TFE. It was me, my taste in music, it wasn't about RUSH lacking something.

This is an argument I've heard once or twice before here, and I seriously don't get it. It's something lacking in US, and OUR FAULT if Rush puts out a crappy album and we can't appreciate it?

 

Ok, obviously the assessment that an album is crappy is completely subjective, but still. My opinions might not mean anything to anyone else, but they mean a lot to me. If the music isn't good or anywhere near as good as I know they're capable of, I'm not about to blame myself. That's like saying the Star Wars prequels are as good as the originals and it's my fault if I can't see that fact. No, I blame George Lucas.

[Gedneil Alpeart]

[Gedneil Alpeart]

QUOTE (rushgoober @ May 12 2012, 08:10 AM)

QUOTE (ThinkingBig @ May 12 2012, 04:46 AM) During the 90's, I stopped following Rush.  I've tried to go back and listen to TFE and CP, but they just don't speak to me like the albums before and after that period.  That's cool, it's all good.  Rush was doing their thing and still bringing new fans into the fold.  They deserve all the fans and success  they've earned.  And the fans that bought and supported those albums deserve a nod during the live shows. See, that's how I believe you express an opinion on a fan site. -- I didn't get in to TFE.  It was me, my taste in music, it wasn't about RUSH lacking something. This is an argument I've heard once or twice before here, and I seriously don't get it. It's something lacking in US, and OUR FAULT if Rush puts out a crappy album and we can't appreciate it?   Ok, obviously the assessment that an album is crappy is completely subjective, but still. My opinions might not mean anything to anyone else, but they mean a lot to me. If the music isn't good or anywhere near as good as I know they're capable of, I'm not about to blame myself. That's like saying the Star Wars prequels are as good as the originals and it's my fault if I can't see that fact. No, I blame George Lucas. If you think Rush put out a crappy album, but many others dont think so, then yes, it is you, not the album. Even if EVERYONE were to have the same opinion about any art, it's still opinion only. Even high consensus judgements about any work of art still does not equate to truth.   Now, your individual opinion never means you are right or wrong.....thats just how you feel. Nobody's opinions about any art, negative or positive, equates to facts. Art is meant to be experienced subjectively and we have the freedom to feel and think what we want. Consensus only reveals shared views, not truth illumination. As soon as anyone insinuates that their opinion is closer to any "truth" than a different opinion when it comes to art, that to me implies ego and arrogance.

[Animate]

QUOTE (rushgoober @ May 12 2012, 08:10 AM)

QUOTE (ThinkingBig @ May 12 2012, 04:46 AM) During the 90's, I stopped following Rush.  I've tried to go back and listen to TFE and CP, but they just don't speak to me like the albums before and after that period.  That's cool, it's all good.  Rush was doing their thing and still bringing new fans into the fold.  They deserve all the fans and success  they've earned.  And the fans that bought and supported those albums deserve a nod during the live shows. See, that's how I believe you express an opinion on a fan site. -- I didn't get in to TFE.  It was me, my taste in music, it wasn't about RUSH lacking something. This is an argument I've heard once or twice before here, and I seriously don't get it. It's something lacking in US, and OUR FAULT if Rush puts out a crappy album and we can't appreciate it?   Ok, obviously the assessment that an album is crappy is completely subjective, but still. My opinions might not mean anything to anyone else, but they mean a lot to me. If the music isn't good or anywhere near as good as I know they're capable of, I'm not about to blame myself. That's like saying the Star Wars prequels are as good as the originals and it's my fault if I can't see that fact. No, I blame George Lucas. That is an interesting argument about the Star Wars prequels.   I believe the difference is in the intent of the artists. Lucus failed because he undoubtedly wanted to make three more films in pretty much the same gripping story telling vein as the first three films (only with a lot more technology).   Lucus's goal was the same as if Rush was always trying to put out albums with the same sonic and lyrical sensibility as 2112.   In contrast, each Rush album sets out to explore very different sonic and lyrical fields.   I interpret most peoples negative assessments of any one Rush album is because that individual simply has a very narrow definition of what a Rush album should sound like.

[rushgoober]

[CrossedSignals]

[rushgoober]

QUOTE (Animate @ May 12 2012, 08:08 AM)

I interpret most peoples negative assessments of any one Rush album is because that individual simply has a very narrow definition of what a Rush album should sound like.

Oh gosh no! Counterparts shocked the hell out of me. I didn't think Rush albums should or would ever sound like that, but I loved it!

 

My narrow definition of what a Rush album should sound like is that it should sound GOOD. I don't care if it's Moving Pictures II or Signals II or whatever, as long as I love and enjoy it.

[rushgoober]

[SlyJeff]

[Tigershark2112]

I like Rush.

[Gedneil Alpeart]

[losingit2k]

Thats it, we are One Month away. I proclaim today as being Anit-Negativity & Cynicism day!

 

[Tony R]

[Gedneil Alpeart]

[staunchally]

QUOTE (GeddyRulz @ May 9 2012, 09:34 AM)

"I think [Rush] just wanted to make a great album. They just want to be happy and make music. I think we did that, and I hope all the true Rush fans out there love it, too, without picking apart how loud the mastering is or analyzing the waveform." - Nick Raskulinecz

What's wrong with "picking apart" and "analyzing"? It's why the West is successful.

[Tony R]

[ThinkingBig]

QUOTE (SlyJeff @ May 12 2012, 11:57 AM)

I think Caravan is a great song

I think Caravan is one of the greatest RUSH--it has that visual feel that defines a RUSH - a view of the future from the past --which defines CA.

 

They are ending their career with an album in the same league as MP, Signals & 2112.

 

But that's just MY opinion, my taste, my deal...

 

Coolio?

[ThinkingBig]

QUOTE (rushgoober @ May 12 2012, 08:10 AM)

QUOTE (ThinkingBig @ May 12 2012, 04:46 AM) During the 90's, I stopped following Rush.  I've tried to go back and listen to TFE and CP, but they just don't speak to me like the albums before and after that period.  That's cool, it's all good.  Rush was doing their thing and still bringing new fans into the fold.  They deserve all the fans and success  they've earned.  And the fans that bought and supported those albums deserve a nod during the live shows. See, that's how I believe you express an opinion on a fan site. -- I didn't get in to TFE.  It was me, my taste in music, it wasn't about RUSH lacking something. This is an argument I've heard once or twice before here, and I seriously don't get it. It's something lacking in US, and OUR FAULT if Rush puts out a crappy album and we can't appreciate it?   There's no fault. There's just a brain in our head that likes sushi but won't eat asparagus w/o gagging. (my brain to a T)   Is that the fault of the asparagus or the brain?   Niether.   It just is.     Calling any album Crappy is, for the most part, a subjective reality which can not be proved or disproved.   Saying I think the album is crappy is a truth, because no one can disprove your thoughts, your taste, your likes or dislikes.   Rush albums always have a high production value, they are professionally produced, etc. And no one is going to make a case that RUSH can't play instruments.   However, to say these new songs are crap, on a fan board, is just trying to be disruptive and make noise - IMO. You're not stating anything that can be proved or disproved, and you're doing so using a negative tone.   It also can feel like a backhanded slight against someone who has just praised in an earlier post. In other words, you're saying in a sense "there's something wrong with you because you like crap."   Make sense?

[ThinkingBig]

QUOTE (staunchally @ May 12 2012, 02:19 PM)

QUOTE (GeddyRulz @ May 9 2012, 09:34 AM) "I think [Rush] just wanted to make a great album. They just want to be happy and make music. I think we did that, and I hope all the true Rush fans out there love it, too, without picking apart how loud the mastering is or analyzing the waveform." - Nick Raskulinecz What's wrong with "picking apart" and "analyzing"? It's why the West is successful. That + free and/or cheap labor.

[staunchally]

QUOTE (ThinkingBig @ May 12 2012, 03:20 PM)

QUOTE (staunchally @ May 12 2012, 02:19 PM) QUOTE (GeddyRulz @ May 9 2012, 09:34 AM) "I think [Rush] just wanted to make a great album. They just want to be happy and make music. I think we did that, and I hope all the true Rush fans out there love it, too, without picking apart how loud the mastering is or analyzing the waveform." - Nick Raskulinecz What's wrong with "picking apart" and "analyzing"? It's why the West is successful. That + free and/or cheap labor. Good point, but I was referring to such things as the scientific method etc.

[Gedneil Alpeart]

[Terrapin]

QUOTE (ThinkingBig @ May 12 2012, 08:02 PM)

QUOTE (SlyJeff @ May 12 2012, 11:57 AM) I think Caravan is a great song I think Caravan is one of the greatest RUSH--it has that visual feel that defines a RUSH - a view of the future from the past --which defines CA.   They are ending their career with an album in the same league as MP, Signals & 2112.   But that's just MY opinion, my taste, my deal...   Coolio? Ah, Tony R , the basement dwelling, "Prog Archivist" returns with his acerbic wit for yet another round...   Go on mate, bore me some more...