Prog Snobbery?

[x1yyz]

In the very early 80s, after discovering Rush, I was also listening to a bunch of other prog stuff. I liked the band U.K. with drummer Terry Bozzio. Then Bozzio went off to form Missing Persons and I couldn't believe he could go from complex rhythms to a basic 3-piece set with boring 4/4 time. It hurt. Fast-forward a handful of years to when I was actually listening to new wave stuff and I finally understood why he did that.

 

Now with the wisdom(?) I've gained over the years I will happily listen to prog stuff and new wave (and metal, punk, alternative, etc.) and like them all.

 

Interesting, why do you think he did it? What was he getting from the simple 4/4 stuff that he wasn't getting from the complex stuff? Just curious.. I'm going to guess it was more "groovy" for lack of a better term..

 

 

For better or worse, the 70s was known for a lot of long hair, musical pretension, long and complex songs, and a lot of/most rock music was based in the blues. With the advent of punk, and later new wave, all of a sudden there were brand new genres that did not drawn from the blues. Musicians had short hair, and played short songs that were simple and basic. Suddenly, instead of music associated with the slow pace of pot or LSD you had high-energy, fast stuff. In short, punk & new wave were the antithesis of 70s music.

 

So, what I think happened with Bozzio is he got tired of doing the prog thing and wanted to get involved in the energy of new wave. He did "go back to the basics." I don't know how much of an influence Dale (his wife & Missing Persons singer) was on him but they certainly ended up with something successful. Although, now that I've typed that I wonder if the desire to make money was a reason for changing styles? MP certainly was popular while U.K. wasn't.

 

Earlier today I watched a great BBC documentary called "Synth Britannia" that talked about this very thing, how artists invented the then-new genres of electronic music. They talk about some of the factors influencing this new style, including getting away from the "long hair and pretension in progressive music." I started a new thread about it (including a link to the movie on You Tube) in "Video Vertigo" so any discussion that might happen will not clutter up this thread.

[Anguyen92]

and another thing I've noticed - you'll meet a lot of prog fans who also like punk, indie, other types of music, but you'll rarely meet a PUNK who likes anything besides, well, punk. and even within punk they're still close-minded - I've talked to friends of friends about music and when I find out they only like punk, I'll try to find some common ground, like black flag, husker du, etc. and what you'll find out is that even THAT shit isn't punk enough or deviates too much from how "punk should sound" (no song longer than 2 minutes, no guitar solos, no long hair) for those idiots!

 

I know more people who are metalheads first and love a ton of punk and whatnot than I have punk fans who will give any metal a chance

 

That's an interesting observation and I agree a good amount. I frequent the Dream Theater forums and the members there discuss everything from Green Day, KISS, U2, Iron Maiden, Metallica, of course Rush, etc., but I would be pretty hard pressed to see any other band forums, that plays music that is the opposite of Dream Theater, talk about DT or Rush.

[drbirdsong]

Musicians ain't no different than the rest of us. "When we are young" we know it all. Age humbles nearly every know-it-all.

[Snyder80]

My wife knows all too well how snobby I can be about music. Most music I listen to has to challenge my mind in some way, mostly through lyrics so I find very little use for music that has mindless lyrics and music that just hangs all over sex, drugs, heartbreak and all that other bullshit. Now there are some straight forward rock acts that I've always been into, mostly for the guitar playing. Where I become defensive is when some 45 year old has been starts jabbing fun at me when Between the Wheels or Natural Science comes on and he thinks it sounds "funny" and then goes on to tell me how awesome it was to see Poison and the Bullet Boys on City Island in the late 80s. Or when my one friend looks at me like I'm the embodiment of Satan because I like the intensity of Tool's music or RATM; then proceeds to blast Justin Beiber through his iPhone at almost thirty years old. People like that are just begging to be ripped in to. I'm sorry but there is a certain separation between most people when it comes to musical taste and what I've come to realize is this: there are typically two kinds of music fans, Top 40 types and the rest of us.

 

To add to my many reasons for musical snobbery, I remember when I first discovered Randy Rhoads at around age 19 and I was listening to Blizzard of Ozz and Diary of a Madman all the time. And I do mean all the time. One day at work a guy I worked with and got along with heard what I was listening to and proceeded to tell me how Ted Nugent would "blow that guy into the clouds". You see how ridiculously easy some people make it to be pissed off?

Edited March 19, 2014 by Snyder80

[Tony R]

My wife knows all too well how snobby I can be about music. Most music I listen to has to challenge my mind in some way, mostly through lyrics so I find very little use for music that has mindless lyrics and music that just hangs all over sex, drugs, heartbreak and all that other bullshit. Now there are some straight forward rock acts that I've always been into, mostly for the guitar playing. Where I become defensive is when some 45 year old has been starts jabbing fun at me when Between the Wheels or Natural Science comes on and he thinks it sounds "funny" and then goes on to tell me how awesome it was to see Poison and the Bullet Boys on City Island in the late 80s. Or when my one friend looks at me like I'm the embodiment of Satan because I like the intensity of Tool's music or RATM; then proceeds to blast Justin Beiber through his iPhone at almost thirty years old. People like that are just begging to be ripped in to. I'm sorry but there is a certain separation between most people when it comes to musical taste and what I've come to realize is this: there are typically two kinds of music fans, Top 40 types and the rest of us.

 

To add to my many reasons for musical snobbery, I remember when I first discovered Randy Rhoads at around age 19 and I was listening to Blizzard of Ozz and Diary of a Madman all the time. And I do mean all the time. One day at work a guy I worked with and got along with heard what I was listening to and proceeded to tell me how Ted Nugent would "blow that guy into the clouds". You see how ridiculously easy some people make it to be pissed off?

 

I think it is unfortunate that you use Ozzy as an example. Rhoads was a talented guitarist but playing in a camp Vaudeville act that was "Top 40 stuff" to its core. To associate Ozzy Osbourne's, frankly moronic, output with taste really points to the heart of the problem, great music is in the ear of the beholder.

 

[Tony R]

and another thing I've noticed - you'll meet a lot of prog fans who also like punk, indie, other types of music, but you'll rarely meet a PUNK who likes anything besides, well, punk. and even within punk they're still close-minded - I've talked to friends of friends about music and when I find out they only like punk, I'll try to find some common ground, like black flag, husker du, etc. and what you'll find out is that even THAT shit isn't punk enough or deviates too much from how "punk should sound" (no song longer than 2 minutes, no guitar solos, no long hair) for those idiots!

 

I know more people who are metalheads first and love a ton of punk and whatnot than I have punk fans who will give any metal a chance

 

That's an interesting observation and I agree a good amount. I frequent the Dream Theater forums and the members there discuss everything from Green Day, KISS, U2, Iron Maiden, Metallica, of course Rush, etc., but I would be pretty hard pressed to see any other band forums, that plays music that is the opposite of Dream Theater, talk about DT or Rush.

 

Bathory's observation is a load of bollocks actually. When people are teenagers they tend to latch on one type of music for a while. Some stay with that one type others develop broader tastes over time. It's unlikely that a Justin Bieber fan forum member would start threads about, say, Tool or Meshuggah but in the grand scheme of things the bands that you mention above are probably different degrees of the same thing to a fan of non guitar orientated music.

If you care to wander over to Progarchives and read a few threads their you'll find a hardcore who seemingly only like a certain type of Prog never mind other types of music!

Edited March 19, 2014 by Tony R

[Ged Lent's sis]

keep in mind I'm not so much trying to generalize as I am speaking from my experience with those fans. it's not a fact that punk fans are bigger pricks than prog fans, but...it is for me. and yeah, very cool that lydon likes kate bush

I hear ya... didn't mean to pick on you, just thought the thread had a shape in it which, again, I asked for anyway.

 

For a number of years in my aging adult life, my circle of closer friends has included a larger percentage of folks who don't listen to/are not even aware of most popular music of any genre. By popular music, I mean even remotely popular. Also amongst my friends and acquaintances, current and otherwise, have been those who strongly identify with Goth or Prog or Punk or "80's music" (synth-pop or new wave or what-have-you) or some variation of Metal (speed, death, what-else-is-there?). I also know someone who absolutely despises anything "pop" which would include anything you'd hear on the radio other than classical. Several of these folks might fall into the (genre) snob category.

 

As I have gotten to know all of these people more closely, I inevitably discover some of their, for them, odd tastes and guilty pleasures. (I would imagine that loads of us have guilty pleasures, ie. those bands/songs that we might not in totally inhibited fashion, enthusiastically and without the slightest hesitation admit to liking to each and every person we know.)

 

So it turns out that my Speed Metal (or is it Death Metal?) friend likes ABBA. A lot. Reminds me of how, if I am not careful, I'll find myself alone getting misty eyed listening to Carpenters' Superstar.

 

So maybe my Jazz snob friend doesn't like anything from King Crimson 80s' albums, but really digs The ConstruKction Of Light. And I got a Prog Snob buddy who for some inexplicable reason cannot stand Jazz, but loves Bossa Nova, which IS JAZZ!!

 

And though I don't know him personally, John Lydon really gushes over Kate Bush. But that shouldn't surprise anyone; I discover a Kate fan around every corner.

 

 

and the thread was about prog snobbery in old interviews, and I've always thought of late 70s/early 80s rush as prog. prog and indie are marketing categories now but there was a time when indie bands were actually on independent labels. now it's come to mean coffee house shit music, just like prog has come to mean any band with 15 minute songs and an audible bass player

 

That's true. And I get that the sound on A Farewell to Kings to the conceptual structure of Caress of Steel followed some of the collegially progressive popular musicians of the time, I come to feel that Rush were always substantially different, developed their own sound.

 

Like there are bands that are their own genre, immediately identifiable no matter what they play, with and without the vocals. This is great for us who love them, but precisely what those who hate them hate about them. Other examples in Rock, in my opinion, would be Queen. Their sound is simply signature and that is precisely what I love about it.

 

OBut the question that arose is an interesting one: :codger: Are you or have you ever been a prog snob!! :spitwater:

Answer the question!

 

Sorry. Should I be?

 

Of course not. But will you name names?

Edited March 19, 2014 by Ged Lent's sis

[Snyder80]

My wife knows all too well how snobby I can be about music. Most music I listen to has to challenge my mind in some way, mostly through lyrics so I find very little use for music that has mindless lyrics and music that just hangs all over sex, drugs, heartbreak and all that other bullshit. Now there are some straight forward rock acts that I've always been into, mostly for the guitar playing. Where I become defensive is when some 45 year old has been starts jabbing fun at me when Between the Wheels or Natural Science comes on and he thinks it sounds "funny" and then goes on to tell me how awesome it was to see Poison and the Bullet Boys on City Island in the late 80s. Or when my one friend looks at me like I'm the embodiment of Satan because I like the intensity of Tool's music or RATM; then proceeds to blast Justin Beiber through his iPhone at almost thirty years old. People like that are just begging to be ripped in to. I'm sorry but there is a certain separation between most people when it comes to musical taste and what I've come to realize is this: there are typically two kinds of music fans, Top 40 types and the rest of us.

 

To add to my many reasons for musical snobbery, I remember when I first discovered Randy Rhoads at around age 19 and I was listening to Blizzard of Ozz and Diary of a Madman all the time. And I do mean all the time. One day at work a guy I worked with and got along with heard what I was listening to and proceeded to tell me how Ted Nugent would "blow that guy into the clouds". You see how ridiculously easy some people make it to be pissed off?

 

I think it is unfortunate that you use Ozzy as an example. Rhoads was a talented guitarist but playing in a camp Vaudeville act that was "Top 40 stuff" to its core. To associate Ozzy Osbourne's, frankly moronic, output with taste really points to the heart of the problem, great music is in the ear of the beholder.

 

Hence the reason I didn't mention Osbourne. I mentioned Rhoads. I listen to less than 1% of Ozzy's material outside of those two albums. My point was that there are people out there who refuse to recognize talent, even if they don't like it. And comparing Ted Nugent to Randy Rhoads is akin to comparing a firecracker to a stick of dynamite.

[bathory]

and another thing I've noticed - you'll meet a lot of prog fans who also like punk, indie, other types of music, but you'll rarely meet a PUNK who likes anything besides, well, punk. and even within punk they're still close-minded - I've talked to friends of friends about music and when I find out they only like punk, I'll try to find some common ground, like black flag, husker du, etc. and what you'll find out is that even THAT shit isn't punk enough or deviates too much from how "punk should sound" (no song longer than 2 minutes, no guitar solos, no long hair) for those idiots!

 

I know more people who are metalheads first and love a ton of punk and whatnot than I have punk fans who will give any metal a chance

 

That's an interesting observation and I agree a good amount. I frequent the Dream Theater forums and the members there discuss everything from Green Day, KISS, U2, Iron Maiden, Metallica, of course Rush, etc., but I would be pretty hard pressed to see any other band forums, that plays music that is the opposite of Dream Theater, talk about DT or Rush.

 

Bathory's observation is a load of bollocks actually. When people are teenagers they tend to latch on one type of music for a while. Some stay with that one type others develop broader tastes over time. It's unlikely that a Justin Bieber fan forum member would start threads about, say, Tool or Meshuggah but in the grand scheme of things the bands that you mention above are probably different degrees of the same thing to a fan of non guitar orientated music.

If you care to wander over to Progarchives and read a few threads their you'll find a hardcore who seemingly only like a certain type of Prog never mind other types of music!

I was talking about my own experiences, so no asshole, it's not bollocks. in my experience, it's easier to get a prog fan into the buzzcocks than it would be to get a buzzcocks fan into prog rock. never said it was fact though. and yeah progarchives does have a lot of dumbasses who only like kraut, only like italian prog, etc. what a way to live, limiting yourself to only the subgenres of other subgenres of subgenres

[drbirdsong]

Listening to only one genre or sub genre of music is a little weird. I really can't see a reason to get snobbish about prog. A lot of it is noodling for the sake of creating a longer song and even the best of it is rarely heard by modern radio listeners. My guess is that you can always find people who are snobbish about "their" thing. Sometimes it feels cool to be in on something only a few people know about at least until they write a pop hit and the bastards sell out.

[Xanadoood]

My wife knows all too well how snobby I can be about music. Most music I listen to has to challenge my mind in some way, mostly through lyrics so I find very little use for music that has mindless lyrics and music that just hangs all over sex, drugs, heartbreak and all that other bullshit. Now there are some straight forward rock acts that I've always been into, mostly for the guitar playing. Where I become defensive is when some 45 year old has been starts jabbing fun at me when Between the Wheels or Natural Science comes on and he thinks it sounds "funny" and then goes on to tell me how awesome it was to see Poison and the Bullet Boys on City Island in the late 80s. Or when my one friend looks at me like I'm the embodiment of Satan because I like the intensity of Tool's music or RATM; then proceeds to blast Justin Beiber through his iPhone at almost thirty years old. People like that are just begging to be ripped in to. I'm sorry but there is a certain separation between most people when it comes to musical taste and what I've come to realize is this: there are typically two kinds of music fans, Top 40 types and the rest of us.

 

To add to my many reasons for musical snobbery, I remember when I first discovered Randy Rhoads at around age 19 and I was listening to Blizzard of Ozz and Diary of a Madman all the time. And I do mean all the time. One day at work a guy I worked with and got along with heard what I was listening to and proceeded to tell me how Ted Nugent would "blow that guy into the clouds". You see how ridiculously easy some people make it to be pissed off?

 

I think it is unfortunate that you use Ozzy as an example. Rhoads was a talented guitarist but playing in a camp Vaudeville act that was "Top 40 stuff" to its core. To associate Ozzy Osbourne's, frankly moronic, output with taste really points to the heart of the problem, great music is in the ear of the beholder.

 

Wow, you're a real snob hah? ;)

 

In all seriousness, do you like Black Sabbath at least?

[Tony R]

My wife knows all too well how snobby I can be about music. Most music I listen to has to challenge my mind in some way, mostly through lyrics so I find very little use for music that has mindless lyrics and music that just hangs all over sex, drugs, heartbreak and all that other bullshit. Now there are some straight forward rock acts that I've always been into, mostly for the guitar playing. Where I become defensive is when some 45 year old has been starts jabbing fun at me when Between the Wheels or Natural Science comes on and he thinks it sounds "funny" and then goes on to tell me how awesome it was to see Poison and the Bullet Boys on City Island in the late 80s. Or when my one friend looks at me like I'm the embodiment of Satan because I like the intensity of Tool's music or RATM; then proceeds to blast Justin Beiber through his iPhone at almost thirty years old. People like that are just begging to be ripped in to. I'm sorry but there is a certain separation between most people when it comes to musical taste and what I've come to realize is this: there are typically two kinds of music fans, Top 40 types and the rest of us.

 

To add to my many reasons for musical snobbery, I remember when I first discovered Randy Rhoads at around age 19 and I was listening to Blizzard of Ozz and Diary of a Madman all the time. And I do mean all the time. One day at work a guy I worked with and got along with heard what I was listening to and proceeded to tell me how Ted Nugent would "blow that guy into the clouds". You see how ridiculously easy some people make it to be pissed off?

 

I think it is unfortunate that you use Ozzy as an example. Rhoads was a talented guitarist but playing in a camp Vaudeville act that was "Top 40 stuff" to its core. To associate Ozzy Osbourne's, frankly moronic, output with taste really points to the heart of the problem, great music is in the ear of the beholder.

 

Wow, you're a real snob hah? ;)

 

In all seriousness, do you like Black Sabbath at least?

 

Of course.

However anyone who can watch those Blizzard Of Ozz videos without pissing themselves laughing needs a frontal lobotomy.

 

[Tony R]

and another thing I've noticed - you'll meet a lot of prog fans who also like punk, indie, other types of music, but you'll rarely meet a PUNK who likes anything besides, well, punk. and even within punk they're still close-minded - I've talked to friends of friends about music and when I find out they only like punk, I'll try to find some common ground, like black flag, husker du, etc. and what you'll find out is that even THAT shit isn't punk enough or deviates too much from how "punk should sound" (no song longer than 2 minutes, no guitar solos, no long hair) for those idiots!

 

I know more people who are metalheads first and love a ton of punk and whatnot than I have punk fans who will give any metal a chance

 

That's an interesting observation and I agree a good amount. I frequent the Dream Theater forums and the members there discuss everything from Green Day, KISS, U2, Iron Maiden, Metallica, of course Rush, etc., but I would be pretty hard pressed to see any other band forums, that plays music that is the opposite of Dream Theater, talk about DT or Rush.

 

Bathory's observation is a load of bollocks actually. When people are teenagers they tend to latch on one type of music for a while. Some stay with that one type others develop broader tastes over time. It's unlikely that a Justin Bieber fan forum member would start threads about, say, Tool or Meshuggah but in the grand scheme of things the bands that you mention above are probably different degrees of the same thing to a fan of non guitar orientated music.

If you care to wander over to Progarchives and read a few threads their you'll find a hardcore who seemingly only like a certain type of Prog never mind other types of music!

I was talking about my own experiences, so no asshole, it's not bollocks. in my experience, it's easier to get a prog fan into the buzzcocks than it would be to get a buzzcocks fan into prog rock. never said it was fact though. and yeah progarchives does have a lot of dumbasses who only like kraut, only like italian prog, etc. what a way to live, limiting yourself to only the subgenres of other subgenres of subgenres

 

Don't call me an asshole big man.

 

 

[bathory]

and another thing I've noticed - you'll meet a lot of prog fans who also like punk, indie, other types of music, but you'll rarely meet a PUNK who likes anything besides, well, punk. and even within punk they're still close-minded - I've talked to friends of friends about music and when I find out they only like punk, I'll try to find some common ground, like black flag, husker du, etc. and what you'll find out is that even THAT shit isn't punk enough or deviates too much from how "punk should sound" (no song longer than 2 minutes, no guitar solos, no long hair) for those idiots!

 

I know more people who are metalheads first and love a ton of punk and whatnot than I have punk fans who will give any metal a chance

 

That's an interesting observation and I agree a good amount. I frequent the Dream Theater forums and the members there discuss everything from Green Day, KISS, U2, Iron Maiden, Metallica, of course Rush, etc., but I would be pretty hard pressed to see any other band forums, that plays music that is the opposite of Dream Theater, talk about DT or Rush.

 

Bathory's observation is a load of bollocks actually. When people are teenagers they tend to latch on one type of music for a while. Some stay with that one type others develop broader tastes over time. It's unlikely that a Justin Bieber fan forum member would start threads about, say, Tool or Meshuggah but in the grand scheme of things the bands that you mention above are probably different degrees of the same thing to a fan of non guitar orientated music.

If you care to wander over to Progarchives and read a few threads their you'll find a hardcore who seemingly only like a certain type of Prog never mind other types of music!

I was talking about my own experiences, so no asshole, it's not bollocks. in my experience, it's easier to get a prog fan into the buzzcocks than it would be to get a buzzcocks fan into prog rock. never said it was fact though. and yeah progarchives does have a lot of dumbasses who only like kraut, only like italian prog, etc. what a way to live, limiting yourself to only the subgenres of other subgenres of subgenres

 

Don't call me an asshole big man.

 

report me

[bathory]

My wife knows all too well how snobby I can be about music. Most music I listen to has to challenge my mind in some way, mostly through lyrics so I find very little use for music that has mindless lyrics and music that just hangs all over sex, drugs, heartbreak and all that other bullshit. Now there are some straight forward rock acts that I've always been into, mostly for the guitar playing. Where I become defensive is when some 45 year old has been starts jabbing fun at me when Between the Wheels or Natural Science comes on and he thinks it sounds "funny" and then goes on to tell me how awesome it was to see Poison and the Bullet Boys on City Island in the late 80s. Or when my one friend looks at me like I'm the embodiment of Satan because I like the intensity of Tool's music or RATM; then proceeds to blast Justin Beiber through his iPhone at almost thirty years old. People like that are just begging to be ripped in to. I'm sorry but there is a certain separation between most people when it comes to musical taste and what I've come to realize is this: there are typically two kinds of music fans, Top 40 types and the rest of us.

 

To add to my many reasons for musical snobbery, I remember when I first discovered Randy Rhoads at around age 19 and I was listening to Blizzard of Ozz and Diary of a Madman all the time. And I do mean all the time. One day at work a guy I worked with and got along with heard what I was listening to and proceeded to tell me how Ted Nugent would "blow that guy into the clouds". You see how ridiculously easy some people make it to be pissed off?

 

I think it is unfortunate that you use Ozzy as an example. Rhoads was a talented guitarist but playing in a camp Vaudeville act that was "Top 40 stuff" to its core. To associate Ozzy Osbourne's, frankly moronic, output with taste really points to the heart of the problem, great music is in the ear of the beholder.

 

Wow, you're a real snob hah? ;)

 

In all seriousness, do you like Black Sabbath at least?

 

Of course.

However anyone who can watch those Blizzard Of Ozz videos without pissing themselves laughing needs a frontal lobotomy.

 

ozzy has been hilarious to watch since the mid-70s, not sure if intentional or not though

[Tony R]

and another thing I've noticed - you'll meet a lot of prog fans who also like punk, indie, other types of music, but you'll rarely meet a PUNK who likes anything besides, well, punk. and even within punk they're still close-minded - I've talked to friends of friends about music and when I find out they only like punk, I'll try to find some common ground, like black flag, husker du, etc. and what you'll find out is that even THAT shit isn't punk enough or deviates too much from how "punk should sound" (no song longer than 2 minutes, no guitar solos, no long hair) for those idiots!

 

I know more people who are metalheads first and love a ton of punk and whatnot than I have punk fans who will give any metal a chance

 

That's an interesting observation and I agree a good amount. I frequent the Dream Theater forums and the members there discuss everything from Green Day, KISS, U2, Iron Maiden, Metallica, of course Rush, etc., but I would be pretty hard pressed to see any other band forums, that plays music that is the opposite of Dream Theater, talk about DT or Rush.

 

Bathory's observation is a load of bollocks actually. When people are teenagers they tend to latch on one type of music for a while. Some stay with that one type others develop broader tastes over time. It's unlikely that a Justin Bieber fan forum member would start threads about, say, Tool or Meshuggah but in the grand scheme of things the bands that you mention above are probably different degrees of the same thing to a fan of non guitar orientated music.

If you care to wander over to Progarchives and read a few threads their you'll find a hardcore who seemingly only like a certain type of Prog never mind other types of music!

I was talking about my own experiences, so no asshole, it's not bollocks. in my experience, it's easier to get a prog fan into the buzzcocks than it would be to get a buzzcocks fan into prog rock. never said it was fact though. and yeah progarchives does have a lot of dumbasses who only like kraut, only like italian prog, etc. what a way to live, limiting yourself to only the subgenres of other subgenres of subgenres

 

Don't call me an asshole big man.

 

report me

 

As if.

 

 

[Snyder80]

My wife knows all too well how snobby I can be about music. Most music I listen to has to challenge my mind in some way, mostly through lyrics so I find very little use for music that has mindless lyrics and music that just hangs all over sex, drugs, heartbreak and all that other bullshit. Now there are some straight forward rock acts that I've always been into, mostly for the guitar playing. Where I become defensive is when some 45 year old has been starts jabbing fun at me when Between the Wheels or Natural Science comes on and he thinks it sounds "funny" and then goes on to tell me how awesome it was to see Poison and the Bullet Boys on City Island in the late 80s. Or when my one friend looks at me like I'm the embodiment of Satan because I like the intensity of Tool's music or RATM; then proceeds to blast Justin Beiber through his iPhone at almost thirty years old. People like that are just begging to be ripped in to. I'm sorry but there is a certain separation between most people when it comes to musical taste and what I've come to realize is this: there are typically two kinds of music fans, Top 40 types and the rest of us.

 

To add to my many reasons for musical snobbery, I remember when I first discovered Randy Rhoads at around age 19 and I was listening to Blizzard of Ozz and Diary of a Madman all the time. And I do mean all the time. One day at work a guy I worked with and got along with heard what I was listening to and proceeded to tell me how Ted Nugent would "blow that guy into the clouds". You see how ridiculously easy some people make it to be pissed off?

 

I think it is unfortunate that you use Ozzy as an example. Rhoads was a talented guitarist but playing in a camp Vaudeville act that was "Top 40 stuff" to its core. To associate Ozzy Osbourne's, frankly moronic, output with taste really points to the heart of the problem, great music is in the ear of the beholder.

 

Wow, you're a real snob hah? ;)

 

In all seriousness, do you like Black Sabbath at least?

 

Absolutely. A good bit of it, actually.

[Snyder80]

My wife knows all too well how snobby I can be about music. Most music I listen to has to challenge my mind in some way, mostly through lyrics so I find very little use for music that has mindless lyrics and music that just hangs all over sex, drugs, heartbreak and all that other bullshit. Now there are some straight forward rock acts that I've always been into, mostly for the guitar playing. Where I become defensive is when some 45 year old has been starts jabbing fun at me when Between the Wheels or Natural Science comes on and he thinks it sounds "funny" and then goes on to tell me how awesome it was to see Poison and the Bullet Boys on City Island in the late 80s. Or when my one friend looks at me like I'm the embodiment of Satan because I like the intensity of Tool's music or RATM; then proceeds to blast Justin Beiber through his iPhone at almost thirty years old. People like that are just begging to be ripped in to. I'm sorry but there is a certain separation between most people when it comes to musical taste and what I've come to realize is this: there are typically two kinds of music fans, Top 40 types and the rest of us.

 

To add to my many reasons for musical snobbery, I remember when I first discovered Randy Rhoads at around age 19 and I was listening to Blizzard of Ozz and Diary of a Madman all the time. And I do mean all the time. One day at work a guy I worked with and got along with heard what I was listening to and proceeded to tell me how Ted Nugent would "blow that guy into the clouds". You see how ridiculously easy some people make it to be pissed off?

 

I think it is unfortunate that you use Ozzy as an example. Rhoads was a talented guitarist but playing in a camp Vaudeville act that was "Top 40 stuff" to its core. To associate Ozzy Osbourne's, frankly moronic, output with taste really points to the heart of the problem, great music is in the ear of the beholder.

 

Wow, you're a real snob hah? ;)

 

In all seriousness, do you like Black Sabbath at least?

 

Of course.

However anyone who can watch those Blizzard Of Ozz videos without pissing themselves laughing needs a frontal lobotomy.

 

 

Funny you mention that because I find it mind blowing that Randy isn't the focus of more camera attention. The first thirty seconds of the solo to Crazy Train they have the camera on f***ing Rudy Sarzo.

[losingit2k]

I don't think they had a chip on their shoulder. I just think they were trying to prove themselves as musicians and the genre they aspired to was being cast down by those who truly disliked it. I too would be a bit annoyed. I would in the least be perturbed and if that came off as snobby than so be it.

[Xanadoood]

My wife knows all too well how snobby I can be about music. Most music I listen to has to challenge my mind in some way, mostly through lyrics so I find very little use for music that has mindless lyrics and music that just hangs all over sex, drugs, heartbreak and all that other bullshit. Now there are some straight forward rock acts that I've always been into, mostly for the guitar playing. Where I become defensive is when some 45 year old has been starts jabbing fun at me when Between the Wheels or Natural Science comes on and he thinks it sounds "funny" and then goes on to tell me how awesome it was to see Poison and the Bullet Boys on City Island in the late 80s. Or when my one friend looks at me like I'm the embodiment of Satan because I like the intensity of Tool's music or RATM; then proceeds to blast Justin Beiber through his iPhone at almost thirty years old. People like that are just begging to be ripped in to. I'm sorry but there is a certain separation between most people when it comes to musical taste and what I've come to realize is this: there are typically two kinds of music fans, Top 40 types and the rest of us.

 

To add to my many reasons for musical snobbery, I remember when I first discovered Randy Rhoads at around age 19 and I was listening to Blizzard of Ozz and Diary of a Madman all the time. And I do mean all the time. One day at work a guy I worked with and got along with heard what I was listening to and proceeded to tell me how Ted Nugent would "blow that guy into the clouds". You see how ridiculously easy some people make it to be pissed off?

 

I think it is unfortunate that you use Ozzy as an example. Rhoads was a talented guitarist but playing in a camp Vaudeville act that was "Top 40 stuff" to its core. To associate Ozzy Osbourne's, frankly moronic, output with taste really points to the heart of the problem, great music is in the ear of the beholder.

 

Wow, you're a real snob hah? ;)

 

In all seriousness, do you like Black Sabbath at least?

 

Of course.

However anyone who can watch those Blizzard Of Ozz videos without pissing themselves laughing needs a frontal lobotomy.

 

You mean this? These were done at a small, early cable like community TV station in New York. According to the clip, Blizzard of Oz had only been out for 6 weeks...Ozzy was just coming back at the time..low budget for sure, but the energy is there..man, you ARE a snob..ha!

 

https://www.youtube....h?v=ZcoweoZ6jpM

Edited March 20, 2014 by Xanadoood

[eshine]

I think getting "snobby" about Prog is a defence mechanism. Having lived through the 70s as a teenager but a little too young to have been in the Prog movement from the start there was always a backlash against this music I liked. In some respects Prog is about infusing different styles into the rock format and that necessarily requires a relatively high degree of musicianship, and that becomes our weapon of choice when defending ourselves against the peevish masses of pop, rock, and indie fans as in "your band can't even play properly".

Nobody ever calls Classical Music pretentious yet rock musicians who aspire to painting musical soundscapes and something more esoteric than good old 4 bar boogie are sneered at. Why wouldn't you want to aspire to be the best that you can be?

 

Great post Tony

[eshine]

There is an interview out there from the early eighties with Geddy smoking a cig and talking about how easy it was to write Closer to the Heart. He comes off as a complete dick lol

 

In retrospect it's not surprising. I cant think of a band more maligned throughout their career. You have to develop a thick skin - and, frankly, an ego. They all knew how good they were. So did the fans.

 

This is part of what makes this last decade of Rush such a joy. They are more humbled and appreciative then ever - and have rightfully earned sincere recognition.

[bathory]

My wife knows all too well how snobby I can be about music. Most music I listen to has to challenge my mind in some way, mostly through lyrics so I find very little use for music that has mindless lyrics and music that just hangs all over sex, drugs, heartbreak and all that other bullshit. Now there are some straight forward rock acts that I've always been into, mostly for the guitar playing. Where I become defensive is when some 45 year old has been starts jabbing fun at me when Between the Wheels or Natural Science comes on and he thinks it sounds "funny" and then goes on to tell me how awesome it was to see Poison and the Bullet Boys on City Island in the late 80s. Or when my one friend looks at me like I'm the embodiment of Satan because I like the intensity of Tool's music or RATM; then proceeds to blast Justin Beiber through his iPhone at almost thirty years old. People like that are just begging to be ripped in to. I'm sorry but there is a certain separation between most people when it comes to musical taste and what I've come to realize is this: there are typically two kinds of music fans, Top 40 types and the rest of us.

 

To add to my many reasons for musical snobbery, I remember when I first discovered Randy Rhoads at around age 19 and I was listening to Blizzard of Ozz and Diary of a Madman all the time. And I do mean all the time. One day at work a guy I worked with and got along with heard what I was listening to and proceeded to tell me how Ted Nugent would "blow that guy into the clouds". You see how ridiculously easy some people make it to be pissed off?

 

I think it is unfortunate that you use Ozzy as an example. Rhoads was a talented guitarist but playing in a camp Vaudeville act that was "Top 40 stuff" to its core. To associate Ozzy Osbourne's, frankly moronic, output with taste really points to the heart of the problem, great music is in the ear of the beholder.

 

Wow, you're a real snob hah? ;)

 

In all seriousness, do you like Black Sabbath at least?

 

Of course.

However anyone who can watch those Blizzard Of Ozz videos without pissing themselves laughing needs a frontal lobotomy.

 

You mean this? These were done at a small, early cable like community TV station in New York. According to the clip, Blizzard of Oz had only been out for 6 weeks...Ozzy was just coming back at the time..low budget for sure, but the energy is there..man, you ARE a snob..ha!

 

https://www.youtube....h?v=ZcoweoZ6jpM

true, ozzy'd spent all his $$$ on drugs and couldn't afford a tales from topographic oceans stage set-up

[Ged Lent's sis]

To associate Ozzy Osbourne's, frankly moronic, output with taste really points to the heart of the problem, great music is in the ear of the beholder.

 

You allude to a "problem". I wasn't really thinking in problematic terms when I wrote this post—though part of what inspired it was the tendency of any thread on this forum to devolve into something slightly outside the framework of its respective topic. Granted, that is true for on-line forums in general, but I am sure you must be aware of the irony embedded in this particular response of yours.

 

I mean, the problem, as it were, is not that freedom of choice and taste. On the contrary: our freedom to enjoy whatever we like is what makes music one of the highest beauties to be taken from this earth. The problem is that there are people who insist upon giving other people grief for their taste.

[drbirdsong]

There is an interview out there from the early eighties with Geddy smoking a cig and talking about how easy it was to write Closer to the Heart. He comes off as a complete dick lol

 

In retrospect it's not surprising. I cant think of a band more maligned throughout their career. You have to develop a thick skin - and, frankly, an ego. They all knew how good they were. So did the fans.

 

This is part of what makes this last decade of Rush such a joy. They are more humbled and appreciative then ever - and have rightfully earned sincere recognition.

 

Yes, it seems the losses Neil suffered changed everyone. When they came back after the long hiatus the entire band and crew had a different energy. The fans too. Can anyone that was on this forum before we knew the band would return tell us what it was like around here during that time?