Question for guitarists in re Alex

[TheWinslowOfWillowdale]

What would you call it? My guitar teacher called this style of picking "trilling" back when I took lessons years and years ago......You're a jackass btw. Edited January 28, 2014 by TheWinslowOfWillowdale

[Mr. Not]

What would you call it? My guitar teacher called this style of picking "trilling" back when I took lessons years and years ago......You're a jackass btw.

 

To me that looks like Tremolo picking, sometimes called "Chicken Picking" (usually) by the people who use a cleaner tone which will give each pick much more attack.

 

Trilling is when you don't pick, you rely almost solely on hammer ons and pull offs, hold an initial pick of the note you choose to root.

[Mr. Not]

He doesn't do it often and not in the classical sense. Player like Steve Vai and Yngwie so it all the time because they basically run up and down scales super fast for their leads... no heart in them like Alex. Alex uses the technique but in a 1-2 second burst just to climb the neck to a new position.

 

It definitely does not sound like a cello or violin. They are still picking, just not every note.

 

Look at 2:48 oy Alex's solo on YYZ. You'll notice (if you look at his right hand) that he picks maybe once or twice but plays way more note. Plus on the climb down into the synth part (sucks this doesn't show his right hand here) he is picking a note and then pulling off (after you fret a string you can "pull off" of it and the open string will sound) to make more notes.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zmrz0_oqe4A

 

I tend to prefer Lifeson's solos to Malmsteen or Vai's, but they're still obviously better guitarists. And I don't know so much about Yngwie, but Vai has a lot of heart

 

I don't know about better. Just because they can blaze through scales doesn't make them better IMO.

 

Alex's solos make me feel a certain way (happy, sad, exited, etc.). Overflowing with emotion.

 

The only thing I ever think after a Steve Vai or Yngwie solo is, "Wow, that was fast."

 

Shredders do absolutely nothing for me.

 

Yeah, they're better. Regardless of whos writing you like more Vai and Malmsteen are much more technically able. That's what's earned them spots as elite guitarists. And Vai proves to people often that he can do a lot more than just shred. Does Malmsteen do the same? Sort of, rarely. He'll be playing an acoustic guitar with an orchestra and for a majority of the concert he'll just be shredding and that's definitely worth a head scratch.

[KennyLee]

He doesn't do it often and not in the classical sense. Player like Steve Vai and Yngwie so it all the time because they basically run up and down scales super fast for their leads... no heart in them like Alex. Alex uses the technique but in a 1-2 second burst just to climb the neck to a new position.

 

It definitely does not sound like a cello or violin. They are still picking, just not every note.

 

Look at 2:48 oy Alex's solo on YYZ. You'll notice (if you look at his right hand) that he picks maybe once or twice but plays way more note. Plus on the climb down into the synth part (sucks this doesn't show his right hand here) he is picking a note and then pulling off (after you fret a string you can "pull off" of it and the open string will sound) to make more notes.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zmrz0_oqe4A

 

I tend to prefer Lifeson's solos to Malmsteen or Vai's, but they're still obviously better guitarists. And I don't know so much about Yngwie, but Vai has a lot of heart

 

I don't know about better. Just because they can blaze through scales doesn't make them better IMO.

 

Alex's solos make me feel a certain way (happy, sad, exited, etc.). Overflowing with emotion.

 

The only thing I ever think after a Steve Vai or Yngwie solo is, "Wow, that was fast."

 

Shredders do absolutely nothing for me.

 

Yeah, they're better. Regardless of whos writing you like more Vai and Malmsteen are much more technically able. That's what's earned them spots as elite guitarists. And Vai proves to people often that he can do a lot more than just shred. Does Malmsteen do the same? Sort of, rarely. He'll be playing an acoustic guitar with an orchestra and for a majority of the concert he'll just be shredding and that's definitely worth a head scratch.

 

Eh, we're gonna disagree. I don't think more technically proficient always means better. It's not just the writing it's the actual playing.

 

Janice Joplin for example. Could other singers hit those notes better and cleaner? Absolutely. Did she put more heart and soul into every note than anyone else could? I think so. Her passion and emotion is what made her great. Know what I mean?

[Mr. Not]

He doesn't do it often and not in the classical sense. Player like Steve Vai and Yngwie so it all the time because they basically run up and down scales super fast for their leads... no heart in them like Alex. Alex uses the technique but in a 1-2 second burst just to climb the neck to a new position.

 

It definitely does not sound like a cello or violin. They are still picking, just not every note.

 

Look at 2:48 oy Alex's solo on YYZ. You'll notice (if you look at his right hand) that he picks maybe once or twice but plays way more note. Plus on the climb down into the synth part (sucks this doesn't show his right hand here) he is picking a note and then pulling off (after you fret a string you can "pull off" of it and the open string will sound) to make more notes.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zmrz0_oqe4A

 

I tend to prefer Lifeson's solos to Malmsteen or Vai's, but they're still obviously better guitarists. And I don't know so much about Yngwie, but Vai has a lot of heart

 

I don't know about better. Just because they can blaze through scales doesn't make them better IMO.

 

Alex's solos make me feel a certain way (happy, sad, exited, etc.). Overflowing with emotion.

 

The only thing I ever think after a Steve Vai or Yngwie solo is, "Wow, that was fast."

 

Shredders do absolutely nothing for me.

 

Yeah, they're better. Regardless of whos writing you like more Vai and Malmsteen are much more technically able. That's what's earned them spots as elite guitarists. And Vai proves to people often that he can do a lot more than just shred. Does Malmsteen do the same? Sort of, rarely. He'll be playing an acoustic guitar with an orchestra and for a majority of the concert he'll just be shredding and that's definitely worth a head scratch.

 

Eh, we're gonna disagree. I don't think more technically proficient always means better. It's not just the writing it's the actual playing.

 

Janice Joplin for example. Could other singers hit those notes better and cleaner? Absolutely. Did she put more heart and soul into every note than anyone else could? I think so. Her passion and emotion is what made her great. Know what I mean?

 

I understand, and yep we're going to disagree ;)

[Xanadoood]

I consider Eddie's technique here at 4:28 trilling: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uDOFIttS69I

 

Eddie doesn't do this when he runs though scales ... it's just a "speed trick" that he usually employs on one string when he concludes a solo. Obviously here, he's using it as part of his overall showcase.....But keep in mind this trick can be used to entirely run through a scale to give the impression that one is actually proficiently alternate picking.....I know, that's how I tend to run through scales, and to the novice ear, it goes unnoticed..... ;)

I consider Eddie's technique here at 4:28 trilling: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uDOFIttS69I

 

Eddie doesn't do this when he runs though scales ... it's just a "speed trick" that he usually employs on one string when he concludes a solo. Obviously here, he's using it as part of his overall showcase.....But keep in mind this trick can be used to entirely run through a scale to give the impression that one is actually proficiently alternate picking.....I know, that's how I tend to run through scales, and to the novice ear, it goes unnoticed..... ;)

then u should "consider" learning more about the instrument.....'cause that is not even close to a trill.

 

Yeah, that's tremolo picking. I've never heard it refered to as trilling.

[TheWinslowOfWillowdale]

It's basically flicking your pick down and up as rapidly as possible whilst alternating frets w/ your left hand.....If you aren't vey good at alternate picking, you can employ this technique to run through scales giving the impression that you're actually more skilled than you really are..;)

[EagleMoon]

Shredding is for wankers.

[Mr. Not]

Shredding is for guitarists with great expertise and dedication to their craft.

 

Exactly!

[EagleMoon]

Shredding is for guitarists with great expertise and dedication to their craft.

 

Exactly!

 

Uh...not.

[GeddysMullet]

He doesn't do it often and not in the classical sense. Player like Steve Vai and Yngwie so it all the time because they basically run up and down scales super fast for their leads... no heart in them like Alex. Alex uses the technique but in a 1-2 second burst just to climb the neck to a new position.

 

It definitely does not sound like a cello or violin. They are still picking, just not every note.

 

Look at 2:48 oy Alex's solo on YYZ. You'll notice (if you look at his right hand) that he picks maybe once or twice but plays way more note. Plus on the climb down into the synth part (sucks this doesn't show his right hand here) he is picking a note and then pulling off (after you fret a string you can "pull off" of it and the open string will sound) to make more notes.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zmrz0_oqe4A

 

I tend to prefer Lifeson's solos to Malmsteen or Vai's, but they're still obviously better guitarists. And I don't know so much about Yngwie, but Vai has a lot of heart

 

I don't know about better. Just because they can blaze through scales doesn't make them better IMO.

 

Alex's solos make me feel a certain way (happy, sad, exited, etc.). Overflowing with emotion.

 

The only thing I ever think after a Steve Vai or Yngwie solo is, "Wow, that was fast."

 

Shredders do absolutely nothing for me.

 

I agree with this. I love Alex as a guitarist not because I think he's the world's most technically proficient player, but because he plays with such feeling. I think he's one of the best ever at communicating emotion through his playing.

 

Shredding is for wankers.

 

I agree with this, too. I just don't have much interest at all in cold displays of technique for technique's sake.

[Janie]

He doesn't do it often and not in the classical sense. Player like Steve Vai and Yngwie so it all the time because they basically run up and down scales super fast for their leads... no heart in them like Alex. Alex uses the technique but in a 1-2 second burst just to climb the neck to a new position.

 

It definitely does not sound like a cello or violin. They are still picking, just not every note.

 

Look at 2:48 oy Alex's solo on YYZ. You'll notice (if you look at his right hand) that he picks maybe once or twice but plays way more note. Plus on the climb down into the synth part (sucks this doesn't show his right hand here) he is picking a note and then pulling off (after you fret a string you can "pull off" of it and the open string will sound) to make more notes.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zmrz0_oqe4A

 

I tend to prefer Lifeson's solos to Malmsteen or Vai's, but they're still obviously better guitarists. And I don't know so much about Yngwie, but Vai has a lot of heart

 

I don't know about better. Just because they can blaze through scales doesn't make them better IMO.

 

Alex's solos make me feel a certain way (happy, sad, exited, etc.). Overflowing with emotion.

 

The only thing I ever think after a Steve Vai or Yngwie solo is, "Wow, that was fast."

 

Shredders do absolutely nothing for me.

Thank you! I don't want to be amazed by how speedy a show-off can be. That doesn't impress me. What does impress me is when someone can make me "feel" emotion from a piece.

[goose]

He doesn't do it often and not in the classical sense. Player like Steve Vai and Yngwie so it all the time because they basically run up and down scales super fast for their leads... no heart in them like Alex. Alex uses the technique but in a 1-2 second burst just to climb the neck to a new position.

 

It definitely does not sound like a cello or violin. They are still picking, just not every note.

 

Look at 2:48 oy Alex's solo on YYZ. You'll notice (if you look at his right hand) that he picks maybe once or twice but plays way more note. Plus on the climb down into the synth part (sucks this doesn't show his right hand here) he is picking a note and then pulling off (after you fret a string you can "pull off" of it and the open string will sound) to make more notes.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zmrz0_oqe4A

 

I tend to prefer Lifeson's solos to Malmsteen or Vai's, but they're still obviously better guitarists. And I don't know so much about Yngwie, but Vai has a lot of heart

 

I don't know about better. Just because they can blaze through scales doesn't make them better IMO.

 

Alex's solos make me feel a certain way (happy, sad, exited, etc.). Overflowing with emotion.

 

The only thing I ever think after a Steve Vai or Yngwie solo is, "Wow, that was fast."

 

Shredders do absolutely nothing for me.

MOZART: But this is absurd!

 

EMPEROR: My dear, young man, don't take it too hard. Your work is ingenious. It's quality work. And there are simply too many notes, that's all. Cut a few and it will be perfect.

 

ETA: Just watched the posted vid of Eddie's Live w/o a Net solo. Keeping in line with the feeling over shredding theme, I'll take Cathedral over Eruption any day.

Edited January 29, 2014 by goose

[KennyLee]

He doesn't do it often and not in the classical sense. Player like Steve Vai and Yngwie so it all the time because they basically run up and down scales super fast for their leads... no heart in them like Alex. Alex uses the technique but in a 1-2 second burst just to climb the neck to a new position.

 

It definitely does not sound like a cello or violin. They are still picking, just not every note.

 

Look at 2:48 oy Alex's solo on YYZ. You'll notice (if you look at his right hand) that he picks maybe once or twice but plays way more note. Plus on the climb down into the synth part (sucks this doesn't show his right hand here) he is picking a note and then pulling off (after you fret a string you can "pull off" of it and the open string will sound) to make more notes.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zmrz0_oqe4A

 

I tend to prefer Lifeson's solos to Malmsteen or Vai's, but they're still obviously better guitarists. And I don't know so much about Yngwie, but Vai has a lot of heart

 

I don't know about better. Just because they can blaze through scales doesn't make them better IMO.

 

Alex's solos make me feel a certain way (happy, sad, exited, etc.). Overflowing with emotion.

 

The only thing I ever think after a Steve Vai or Yngwie solo is, "Wow, that was fast."

 

Shredders do absolutely nothing for me.

Thank you! I don't want to be amazed by how speedy a show-off can be. That doesn't impress me. What does impress me is when someone can make me "feel" emotion from a piece.

 

I've used the analogy before.

 

Typing 300 words a minute with no errors is incredible and impressive. I would still rather have you tell me a beautiful story. ;)

[Maverick]

He's a fudger.

 

He's bisexual at most. Certainly not gay.

 

Probably your best post to date.

[Janie]

He doesn't do it often and not in the classical sense. Player like Steve Vai and Yngwie so it all the time because they basically run up and down scales super fast for their leads... no heart in them like Alex. Alex uses the technique but in a 1-2 second burst just to climb the neck to a new position.

 

It definitely does not sound like a cello or violin. They are still picking, just not every note.

 

Look at 2:48 oy Alex's solo on YYZ. You'll notice (if you look at his right hand) that he picks maybe once or twice but plays way more note. Plus on the climb down into the synth part (sucks this doesn't show his right hand here) he is picking a note and then pulling off (after you fret a string you can "pull off" of it and the open string will sound) to make more notes.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zmrz0_oqe4A

 

I tend to prefer Lifeson's solos to Malmsteen or Vai's, but they're still obviously better guitarists. And I don't know so much about Yngwie, but Vai has a lot of heart

 

I don't know about better. Just because they can blaze through scales doesn't make them better IMO.

 

Alex's solos make me feel a certain way (happy, sad, exited, etc.). Overflowing with emotion.

 

The only thing I ever think after a Steve Vai or Yngwie solo is, "Wow, that was fast."

 

Shredders do absolutely nothing for me.

Thank you! I don't want to be amazed by how speedy a show-off can be. That doesn't impress me. What does impress me is when someone can make me "feel" emotion from a piece.

 

I've used the analogy before.

 

Typing 300 words a minute with no errors is incredible and impressive. I would still rather have you tell me a beautiful story. ;)

That is a perfect analogy. :)

[Maverick]

I consider Eddie's technique here at 4:28 trilling: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uDOFIttS69I

 

Eddie doesn't do this when he runs though scales ... it's just a "speed trick" that he usually employs on one string when he concludes a solo. Obviously here, he's using it as part of his overall showcase.....But keep in mind this trick can be used to entirely run through a scale to give the impression that one is actually proficiently alternate picking.....I know, that's how I tend to run through scales, and to the novice ear, it goes unnoticed..... ;)

 

The technique Eddie uses at 4:28 is indeed tremolo picking. He is rapidly picking the same note on purpose, while also purposefully changing the note being played when he intends to. An actual trill is the rapid playing of two adjacent notes. Think of rapidly hammering on and pulling off of a F# to G sequence over and over or G to A, or even A to C. As long as those are the only two notes being played, you are playing a trill.

[Maverick]

What about here?: Go to about 3:05 or 3:06. He's goes into a real fast "scaley" run. Trilling or precise alternate picking??

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AHOoS2H1nvU

 

That is precise alternate picking, but to be honest, its not really all that fast.

 

But it's fast enough.

 

;)

[Maverick]

When Alex runs quickly through scales.....is he "trilling" or actually playing each note once at a time? For instance, in his lighting fast run in La Villa, is he fudging through the scale, flipping his pick up and down as fast as possible, or actually methodically hitting each successive note at extreme velocity?? I'm a guitarist, and have always wondered this.....

 

To answer your original question, I think that there are times where his playing is very precise. Alex was, and still is, an excellent guitarist with a lot of technical ability. But I am sure that there have been times where he has just flat out wailed it, precision be damned.

[TheWinslowOfWillowdale]

So here, at 3:27 Alex opens w/ quick alternate picking.....And at 3:47, it sounds like he switches between alternate picking and tremolo picking?: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jsTxxPOqzc4

[LedRush]

http://www.cygnus-x1.net/links/rush/guitar-techniques-01.2014.php

[hughes&kettner]

I believe it was dr. McCoy who said (while making reference to 2 young doctor "noobs" talking out of their ass): sounds like the damn spanish inquisition...

[JARG]

When Alex runs quickly through scales.....is he "trilling" or actually playing each note once at a time? For instance, in his lighting fast run in La Villa, is he fudging through the scale, flipping his pick up and down as fast as possible, or actually methodically hitting each successive note at extreme velocity?? I'm a guitarist, and have always wondered this.....

 

He's trilling.

 

Edit: in recognition of the correct term, he's employing "tremelo picking". He is not doing a 1:1 ratio of pick strikes to notes...each note is getting more than one pick strike, creating the illusion of sounding faster than he actually is (and he's pretty fast at times).

Edited January 31, 2014 by JARG

[JARG]

What would you call it? My guitar teacher called this style of picking "trilling" back when I took lessons years and years ago

 

I've always known it as trilling, too.

[GeminiRising79]

Maybe there's an undiscovered form of trilling or hammering that comes with having obese fingers. Edited January 31, 2014 by GeminiRising79