zappafrank Posted September 17, 2012 Author Share Posted September 17, 2012 (edited) Edited September 17, 2012 by zappafrank Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gangsterfurious Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 QUOTE (Lost In Xanadu @ Sep 17 2012, 09:15 AM) Well, only one in two million people has what we call the "evil gene". Hitler had it, Walt Disney had it, and Freddy Quimby has it.... along with all the setlist haters, I'm sure that is the common link. I wouldn't put them on the same level as those two... yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moedrabowsky Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 QUOTE (zappafrank @ Sep 17 2012, 12:55 PM) To anyone who took issue with my "true fans" comment(s), I apologize. I just *really* like the current set list, and am still reveling in the fact that so much of the stuff I never thought I'd get a chance to see was represented. Passion, etc. Again, I apologize. No worries. I've seen every tour since GUP and this is the worst setlist I've ever seen from them. I'll have a good time at the show, but it's not a rocking (or even familiar) setlist for most people, judging by the comments on various non-Rush fan boards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zappafrank Posted September 17, 2012 Author Share Posted September 17, 2012 QUOTE (GeddyRulz @ Sep 17 2012, 12:49 PM) You'll have to look closer at the setlists for Grace Under Pressure and Power Windows, etc. Even on those tours (which I saw), there wasn't THIS MUCH Keyboard Era stuff! Back then, half the setlist was Keyboard Era stuff (the then-"new" stuff), and half was 1974-1981 crowd-pleasers. This time, roughly half is the new album, and half is Keyboard Era. The years 1974-1981 are represented by only a couple tracks. See, I thought that at least on p/g, the entire album was represented over the course of the legs of the tour (same for PoW). In all seriousness and respect, I would think that for people who don't like the current set list, those tours would have been awful for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeddyRulz Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 QUOTE (moedrabowsky @ Sep 17 2012, 01:00 PM) I've seen every tour since GUP and this is the worst setlist I've ever seen from them. I'm exactly the same. My first show was GUP, I've seen them fourteen times since, and I think this is the worst setlist. Rush are never bad, but this is the worst set I've seen. I kind of wish I had seen a show later in the tour and knew what was coming, so I could've prepared myself. Seeing them on opening night and being SURPRISED by this poor set... disappointing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drgrendel Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 QUOTE (GeddyRulz @ Sep 17 2012, 01:57 PM) QUOTE (zappafrank @ Sep 17 2012, 12:55 PM) To anyone who took issue with my "true fans" comment(s), I apologize. I just *really* like the current set list, and am still reveling in the fact that so much of the stuff I never thought I'd get a chance to see was represented. Passion, etc. Again, I apologize. Thank you. Glad you liked it. Of the 14 shows I've seen, I think it was the worst setlist, but that's me. That would be 20 shows for me and I would agree with your assessment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Babycat Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 I've never been disappointed in anything I've heard - I must be in the minority. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drgrendel Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 In all seriousness and respect, I would think that for people who don't like the current set list, those tours would have been awful for them. Why? Look at those tours and see what was played along with the new album that was out at the time. A nice sprinkiling of tunes served RUSH-style. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moedrabowsky Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 QUOTE (GeddyRulz @ Sep 17 2012, 01:06 PM) QUOTE (moedrabowsky @ Sep 17 2012, 01:00 PM) I've seen every tour since GUP and this is the worst setlist I've ever seen from them. I'm exactly the same. My first show was GUP, I've seen them fourteen times since, and I think this is the worst setlist. Rush are never bad, but this is the worst set I've seen. I kind of wish I had seen a show later in the tour and knew what was coming, so I could've prepared myself. Seeing them on opening night and being SURPRISED by this poor set... disappointing! Yeah, that would have been a huge deflating not knowing what to expect. I'm going with three other die-hards -- two of whom saw Rush on the AFTK tour the first time -- and none of us are pinching ourselves about hearing cuts from our least favorite era. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeddyRulz Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 QUOTE (drgrendel @ Sep 17 2012, 01:14 PM) In all seriousness and respect, I would think that for people who don't like the current set list, those tours would have been awful for them. Why? Look at those tours and see what was played along with the new album that was out at the time. A nice sprinkiling of tunes served RUSH-style. Agreed. I wasn't at all disappointed with those setlists at the time. We're talking about 1984, '85, '87, etc. Rush was only 10-12 years old at the time. Sure, they'd play a lot of new stuff, but also a lot of "older" stuff... which wasn't very old! The setlists were half-70s, half-80s. I swear, on the current tour, they're playing more "Keyboard Era" stuff than they played DURING the Keyboard Era! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moedrabowsky Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 QUOTE (GeddyRulz @ Sep 17 2012, 01:28 PM) I swear, on the current tour, they're playing more "Keyboard Era" stuff than they played DURING the Keyboard Era! I agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zappafrank Posted September 17, 2012 Author Share Posted September 17, 2012 Well, let's change it up a bit, then: culling from a number of posts (min included) about what people expect to hear, the composition of any given audience at a show (die-hards vs. more casual fans... someone else's words, not mine ), who likes vs. hates and/or is disappointed with the current set list... do you think the boys themselves have certain expectations as to the kind of people who come to their show? It reminds me of a quote from Zappa: someone asked him why he has so many versions of the same song across albums. He said in the booklet to The Lost Episodes, "You don't know my fans. Not that they'll buy any crap that I put out there - but they just love hearing a different version of things [...] That's how my fans are." Granted, Rush doesn't play with things the way Zappa did (structure, execution, etc.), so I realize it might be apples and oranges. But along the same basic line of thinking (i.e., the sense of "a fan of this music has these characteristics"), do you think Rush is of the same mindset, that the people who are seeing them are the ones who do love (most) everything they do? People have talked about Rush earning the right to do what they want, playing for themselves and not the fans, etc. But do you think the choice of set list (and vocal backlash) is partly b/c they've misconstrued who they're playing to? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tangy Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 QUOTE (moedrabowsky @ Sep 17 2012, 01:00 PM) QUOTE (zappafrank @ Sep 17 2012, 12:55 PM) To anyone who took issue with my "true fans" comment(s), I apologize. I just *really* like the current set list, and am still reveling in the fact that so much of the stuff I never thought I'd get a chance to see was represented. Passion, etc. Again, I apologize. No worries. I've seen every tour since GUP and this is the worst setlist I've ever seen from them. I'll have a good time at the show, but it's not a rocking (or even familiar) setlist for most people, judging by the comments on various non-Rush fan boards. and i have i have seen every tour since permanent waves minus the presto tour and its the worst set list i have seen from them. i was a rush fanboi before the term existed. from age 10 on i was in love with and a huge proponent of the group. to a large extent the keyboard years cured me of that but i remained a fan. been there, done that and don't want to do it again. in terms of rarities and digging deep, i just don't see and really treeduck nailed when he said its a show of hands plus clockwork angels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tangy Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 QUOTE (moedrabowsky @ Sep 17 2012, 01:34 PM) QUOTE (GeddyRulz @ Sep 17 2012, 01:28 PM) I swear, on the current tour, they're playing more "Keyboard Era" stuff than they played DURING the Keyboard Era! I agree. its true and touch too much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moedrabowsky Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 (edited) QUOTE (zappafrank @ Sep 17 2012, 01:38 PM) Well, let's change it up a bit, then: culling from a number of posts (min included) about what people expect to hear, the composition of any given audience at a show (die-hards vs. more casual fans... someone else's words, not mine ), who likes vs. hates and/or is disappointed with the current set list... do you think the boys themselves have certain expectations as to the kind of people who come to their show? It reminds me of a quote from Zappa: someone asked him why he has so many versions of the same song across albums. He said in the booklet to The Lost Episodes, "You don't know my fans. Not that they'll buy any crap that I put out there - but they just love hearing a different version of things [...] That's how my fans are." Granted, Rush doesn't play with things the way Zappa did (structure, execution, etc.), so I realize it might be apples and oranges. But along the same basic line of thinking (i.e., the sense of "a fan of this music has these characteristics"), do you think Rush is of the same mindset, that the people who are seeing them are the ones who do love (most) everything they do? People have talked about Rush earning the right to do what they want, playing for themselves and not the fans, etc. But do you think the choice of set list (and vocal backlash) is partly b/c they've misconstrued who they're playing to? That's another thing -- if Rush only wanted to "play for themselves" they would stay home wrapped in their wealth and would just have daily jam sessions. The fact is that Rush is taking this music on tour to make money. No more, no less. And if you decide you'll "do what you want" then you have to be prepared that some, maybe many, people will not be interested. And that's when the bottom line gets highlighted. Edited September 17, 2012 by moedrabowsky Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moedrabowsky Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 For some reason this got left off the last post: Yes, I think Rush has a history of misunderstanding their fan base. I know they love to talk about their devoted fans -- and Lord knows those fans like talking about themselves -- but they have a broad popularity and they tend to forget that. We're not talking broad like AC-DC or Aerosmith, but much broader than the "cult band" image they like to perptuate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
losingit2k Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 (edited) Look I'm a real big fan of the 80's and a hugh fan of Clockwork Angels. I was turned on to RUSH during the Keyboard era, Signals to be exact. So this setlist is a wet dream for me. However, I can also see the big picture and place myself in others people's shoes. To them this setlist is pretty one-sided. Excluding any CA newbies, they have completely ignored their 70's and post Roll the Bones fans. (I'm sure they are out there). Even I could have used some older or rarer stuff now that I'm familiar with there entire catalog. Just about everyone was expecting Jacobs Ladder or Xanadu this time around. Not only did they not get those but we didn't get anything from that era, nor anything from CP or VT. Everyone want to hear the songs from the era they fell in love with RUSH in and with such a vast catalog encompassing their career its becomes increasingly difficult to satisfy everyone. However, they could have at least provided some tunes from all eras in question. 70s's: Finding My Way, Fly By Night, Xanadu, By-Tor & Snowdog, Passage to Bangkok, Cygnus X-1, Hemisphere (Prelude) La Villa, The Trees, Closer to the Heart, Classic Era: Jacobs Ladder, Red Barchetta, Freewill or Limelight 80's: Overly represented 90's+00's Cut to the Chase, Cold Fire, Alien Shore, Vapor Trails, Secret Touch, One Little Victory, Driven, Test for Echo, Limbo S&A and CA: Well Represented. Basically a more well rounded setlist, Include everyone! They should always include every era in their setlist at least one to two songs. Thats why The Sankes and Arrows tour was well received. It contained songs from basically every era as did the Time Machine Tour. The current setlist moved away from that and it really left many asking "How about us?" They could have chosen Xanadu instead of Working Man, Limelight Instead of Bravado, Jacobs Ladder instead of Territories and Cut to the Chase or Test for Echo instead of The Big Money. The People that are disappointed aren't disgruntaled. They just want a seat at the table. They want a piece of feast. This setlist, however appetizing, is all turkey without any sides. Everyone is hungry and everyone knows the restaurant is nearing its closing. Its great that the current changes including 2112 and The Spirit of Radio might become permanent. This is a big move in the right direction. Now if they could only switch out Red Sector A for Xanadu or Jacobs Ladder. People might just stop complaining...........Maybe? Edited September 17, 2012 by losingit2k Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YeOldeRushFan Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 QUOTE (zappafrank @ Sep 17 2012, 12:39 PM)THANK YOU. I get so perplexed by people's reactions b/c you've got people saying, "I've listened to them for 30 years and never once have I been so disappointed!" And I'm thinking, "Wait, for a good 7 to 10 of those years they played stuff like the majority if the 1st set. What in the world did you do for those years? Were you miserable that entire time? Did you refuse to go see them?" I am new to this forum, but let me add a few thoughts: I am a long-time Rush fan, but not a fanatic; I like their music a lot, but I have only seen them twice in concert. Once was when I was a teenager, and they weren't even the headliner (they were sandwiched between Foghat and Montrose). The other was last week in Pittsburgh. And I LOVED the show, and had no problems with the setlist. The show itself was amazing -- Geddy was in good voice, the sound quality was very good, and their musicianship was incredible. It helped that they really seemed happy to be there -- Geddy talked about how Pittsburgh was the first headline show they played in America and how they have played here more than any other city, and he and the boys seemed really into giving us a good show. And they didn't skimp on all the extras either. I took my 17-year-old son -- his first arena concert. He is a casual fan, and didn't know most of the songs, and he was blown away. Did I miss hearing the "hits"? Not at all -- our local "classic rock" station plays them constantly, as does Sirius/XM (e.g., Ozzie's Boneyard). I am a fan of both metal and prog rock, so I like the "keyboard era" stuff as much as the old stuff; that helped too, I guess. (I also think "Caravan" is their best album in years.) Bottom line: I respect fans who are disappointed with the setlist; everyone is entitled to an opinion. But I am not among those. Fantastic show, and I am now more of a fan than ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tjtull Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eshine Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 This is a monster of a show, one of their best live presentations. Haters and whiners of this set - I actually don't even believe you. It sounds forced. You cant be serious whining about the lack of "hits" and "70's" stuff. Are we even following the same band?? But if you are truly that upset by 80s stuff and the fact that (gasp) they play a whole bunch of new stuff... Sell your tickets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmm_donuts Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 IMO, it seems like the setlist 'haters' can be divided into 2 camps: 1. The Neanderthals...the people who like nothing but the 8-10 standards they seemingly play every tour sprinkled with Fly by Night and Anthem. These guys also get upset that they dare take up concert time with their current albums. I like to refer to them as 'stoopid frickin dinosaurs'. There's little hope for them because they don't like any change in their image of Rush and they're usually drunk by the 2nd set anyway. They would prefer to see trained monkeys rather than a group of thinking musicians. 2. The people who just don't prefer the setlist due to taste. Usually the main reason is they don't like the snythy period. I can empathize with them...Rush sort of lost me during the late 80s (Hold Your Fire was more like Hold Your Nose). Still not being a fan of the synthy period, I still enjoyed Chicago tremendously. I think their current sound adds alot of 'bite' to the synthy stuff...not nearly as dry and antiseptic as it was recorded back in the day. You also have to take into consideration what Geddy can sing...he's stated that it's extremely difficult for him to sing the 70s tunes. If you absolutely don't like the broccoli, then don't eat the damn broccoli. But try it, you might like it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
losingit2k Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 (edited) The Big Picture: RUSH: ...........................1 .......Working Man (Perhaps Gone) Fly By Night:.................0 Caress of Steel.............0 2112..............................1 ......2112 (Plus 2 extra parts) A Farewell to Kings.......0 Hemispheres.................0 Permanent Waves.........1......The Spirit Of Radio (No Wonder its in distress) 1-0-0-1-0-0-1 Moving Pictures............2......Tom Sawyer, YYZ Signals..........................2.......Subdivsions, The Analog Kid Grace Under Pressure..2......The Body Electric, Red Sector A Power Windows.............5......Big Money, Territories, Middletown Dreams, Grand Design, Mahattan Project Hold Your Fire...............1......Force 10 Presto............................1......The Pass Roll The Bones...............3......Bravado, Dreamline, Where's My Thing? Counterparts..................0 Test for Echo..................0 Vapor Trails....................0 Snake and Arrows..........1.....Far Cry Clockwork Angels...........10...All less BU2B & BU2B2 Wow! Do you think there's a hidden message in the first 7 Albums fortelling their future appearances? Edited September 17, 2012 by losingit2k Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
treeduck Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 It's the Clockwork Windows tour! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
losingit2k Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 QUOTE (treeduck @ Sep 17 2012, 04:27 PM) It's the Clockwork Windows tour! You know there's something strange going on when there's the same amount of songs represented from Roll the Bones as Moving Pictures and Permanent Waves combined. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
treeduck Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 QUOTE (losingit2k @ Sep 17 2012, 04:31 PM) QUOTE (treeduck @ Sep 17 2012, 04:27 PM) It's the Clockwork Windows tour! You know there's something strange going on when there's the same amount of songs represented from Roll the Bones as Moving Pictures and Permanent Waves combined. It's the Power Angels tour! Maybe they'll sell kung fu power angel dolls as souvenirs? Maybe they'll make a saturday morning cartoon out of them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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