Lost In Xanadu Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 In Caravan, he's a "young man"... in Carnies, he's a "young boy" Hmmmm? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metaldad Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 That is because Neil Sucks, don't you know? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laughedatbytime Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 Thanks for wrecking CA for me, LIX! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost In Xanadu Posted June 21, 2012 Author Share Posted June 21, 2012 QUOTE (laughedatbytime @ Jun 20 2012, 07:14 PM) Thanks for wrecking CA for me, LIX! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laughedatbytime Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 QUOTE (Lost In Xanadu @ Jun 20 2012, 06:17 PM) QUOTE (laughedatbytime @ Jun 20 2012, 07:14 PM) Thanks for wrecking CA for me, LIX! How can I listen to it now? Talk about shattering the illusion of integrity! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CantStopThinkingBig Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 QUOTE (Lost In Xanadu @ Jun 20 2012, 07:03 PM) In Caravan, he's a "young man"... in Carnies, he's a "young boy" Hmmmm? and 30 years ago he was a "digital man"... wtf Neil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cygnify Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 I thought this thread was going to be about BU2B2 being placed after Headlong Flight. To me that's a real timeline goof - he returns from Wreckers and has this nostalgic looking back song saying he'd do it all again.... then he's all depressed again, grieving... seems to me like BU2B2 would have made more sense right after the Wreckers... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OGr8imL84AD8inF8sBlackSedan Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 QUOTE (cygnify @ Jun 20 2012, 09:26 PM) I thought this thread was going to be about BU2B2 being placed after Headlong Flight. To me that's a real timeline goof - he returns from Wreckers and has this nostalgic looking back song saying he'd do it all again.... then he's all depressed again, grieving... seems to me like BU2B2 would have made more sense right after the Wreckers... I noticed this today...I agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost In Xanadu Posted June 21, 2012 Author Share Posted June 21, 2012 QUOTE (OGr8imL84AD8inF8sBlackSedan @ Jun 20 2012, 08:48 PM) QUOTE (cygnify @ Jun 20 2012, 09:26 PM) I thought this thread was going to be about BU2B2 being placed after Headlong Flight. To me that's a real timeline goof - he returns from Wreckers and has this nostalgic looking back song saying he'd do it all again.... then he's all depressed again, grieving... seems to me like BU2B2 would have made more sense right after the Wreckers... I noticed this today...I agree. Yes, me too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlyJeff Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 I don't think BU2B is a timeline goof. It's not nearly as dark as people seem to think. It's about letting go and choosing life instead of relying on misplaced faith. It leads perfectly in to WTW. Essentially the narrative is some thing like "This has been a wild ride, and as crazy and painful as it was, I'd do it all over again. I realize now that the faith I clung to in the beginning was misplaced and harmful to me, but I choose life and will not be enslaved to that faith any longer. To all those who manipulated and hurt me along the road- best of luck to you- you have no foothold in my life any more and I'm moving on." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost In Xanadu Posted June 21, 2012 Author Share Posted June 21, 2012 QUOTE (SlyJeff @ Jun 20 2012, 09:10 PM) I don't think BU2B is a timeline goof. It's not nearly as dark as people seem to think. It's about letting go and choosing life instead of relying on misplaced faith. It leads perfectly in to WTW. Essentially the narrative is some thing like "This has been a wild ride, and as crazy and painful as it was, I'd do it all over again. I realize now that the faith I clung to in the beginning was misplaced and harmful to me, but I choose life and will not be enslaved to that faith any longer. To all those who manipulated and hurt me along the road- best of luck to you- you have no foothold in my life any more and I'm moving on." Good point too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slack jaw gaze Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 QUOTE (cygnify @ Jun 20 2012, 08:26 PM) I thought this thread was going to be about BU2B2 being placed after Headlong Flight. To me that's a real timeline goof - he returns from Wreckers and has this nostalgic looking back song saying he'd do it all again.... then he's all depressed again, grieving... seems to me like BU2B2 would have made more sense right after the Wreckers... I'm going to go out on a limb and say the album sequence will match the book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OGr8imL84AD8inF8sBlackSedan Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 QUOTE (Lost In Xanadu @ Jun 20 2012, 10:12 PM) QUOTE (SlyJeff @ Jun 20 2012, 09:10 PM) I don't think BU2B is a timeline goof. It's not nearly as dark as people seem to think. It's about letting go and choosing life instead of relying on misplaced faith. It leads perfectly in to WTW. Essentially the narrative is some thing like "This has been a wild ride, and as crazy and painful as it was, I'd do it all over again. I realize now that the faith I clung to in the beginning was misplaced and harmful to me, but I choose life and will not be enslaved to that faith any longer. To all those who manipulated and hurt me along the road- best of luck to you- you have no foothold in my life any more and I'm moving on." Good point too Thought of that as well and, yeah...works for me too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rush-O-Matic Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 QUOTE (Lost In Xanadu @ Jun 20 2012, 07:03 PM) In Caravan, he's a "young man"... in Carnies, he's a "young boy" Hmmmm? The character in Caravan is the father of the one in Carnies. Booyah. Mind BLOWN! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lerxster Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 There are no goofs on Rush albums. Only things we don't fully understand. I realized long ago that there is a purpose and reason to everything Neil writes, and if we don't get something it's not due to a mistake on their end.. it's that we're not getting it on our end. There's never anything haphazard about Rush. When the novel comes out, all will be understood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cygnify Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 Certainly the novel will clarify, and I'm not claiming that it was just a mistake on Neil's part as I know that he analyzes every breath he takes - but IMO the order of these songs is one of my few criticisms of this excellent album. Coming out of The Wreckers (obviously a tragedy) we get into Headlong flight: "Some days were dark I wish that I could live it all again Some nights were bright I wish that I could live it all again" Owen had good times, bad times, no regrets and would do it all again. Then followed by BU2B2: "Belief has failed me now Life goes from bad to worse No philosophy consoles me In a clockwork universe" IMO states a much stronger negative view of his world-view after just stating he wishes to live it all again. IMO it would have more continuity to have BU2B2 (and it's crushing realizations) follow The Wreckers and then begin to resolve by acknowledging bright days, dark nights, and not regretting having lived it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
losingit2k Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 (edited) QUOTE (CantStopThinkingBig @ Jun 20 2012, 08:21 PM) QUOTE (Lost In Xanadu @ Jun 20 2012, 07:03 PM) In Caravan, he's a "young man"... in Carnies, he's a "young boy" Hmmmm? and 30 years ago he was a "digital man"... wtf Neil And before that an Analog kid? Whats his obsession with younger boys? OMG Neil is a Pediphile! JK folks don't ask for my head. Edited June 21, 2012 by losingit2k Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rush-O-Matic Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 QUOTE (Lerxster @ Jun 21 2012, 11:47 AM) There are no goofs on Rush albums. Those who have copies of the CA album with 0:00 track times printed on the back, and lyrics books with portions of the prose introductions missing might disagree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlyJeff Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 QUOTE (cygnify @ Jun 21 2012, 01:57 PM) Certainly the novel will clarify, and I'm not claiming that it was just a mistake on Neil's part as I know that he analyzes every breath he takes - but IMO the order of these songs is one of my few criticisms of this excellent album. Coming out of The Wreckers (obviously a tragedy) we get into Headlong flight: "Some days were dark I wish that I could live it all again Some nights were bright I wish that I could live it all again" Owen had good times, bad times, no regrets and would do it all again. Then followed by BU2B2: "Belief has failed me now Life goes from bad to worse No philosophy consoles me In a clockwork universe" IMO states a much stronger negative view of his world-view after just stating he wishes to live it all again. IMO it would have more continuity to have BU2B2 (and it's crushing realizations) follow The Wreckers and then begin to resolve by acknowledging bright days, dark nights, and not regretting having lived it. But on BU2B2 he says despite all of the garbage and pain be chooses to live. I think that's the point. This really resonates with me because of a personal situation where all I was experiencing was pain, but the moment I finally choose to live- that was a good, if painful, moment. The looking back at a life filled with joy and pain and seeing that misplaced faith did not bring you through, yet seeing that you have a choice to make and you choose life- that's what this is about, IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lerxster Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 QUOTE (Rush-O-Matic @ Jun 21 2012, 02:31 PM) QUOTE (Lerxster @ Jun 21 2012, 11:47 AM) There are no goofs on Rush albums. Those who have copies of the CA album with 0:00 track times printed on the back, and lyrics books with portions of the prose introductions missing might disagree. That's a misprint, not a goof. Harephlemphlem.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cygnify Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 QUOTE (SlyJeff @ Jun 21 2012, 06:23 PM) QUOTE (cygnify @ Jun 21 2012, 01:57 PM) Certainly the novel will clarify, and I'm not claiming that it was just a mistake on Neil's part as I know that he analyzes every breath he takes - but IMO the order of these songs is one of my few criticisms of this excellent album. Coming out of The Wreckers (obviously a tragedy) we get into Headlong flight: "Some days were dark I wish that I could live it all again Some nights were bright I wish that I could live it all again" Owen had good times, bad times, no regrets and would do it all again. Then followed by BU2B2: "Belief has failed me now Life goes from bad to worse No philosophy consoles me In a clockwork universe" IMO states a much stronger negative view of his world-view after just stating he wishes to live it all again. IMO it would have more continuity to have BU2B2 (and it's crushing realizations) follow The Wreckers and then begin to resolve by acknowledging bright days, dark nights, and not regretting having lived it. But on BU2B2 he says despite all of the garbage and pain be chooses to live. I think that's the point. This really resonates with me because of a personal situation where all I was experiencing was pain, but the moment I finally choose to live- that was a good, if painful, moment. The looking back at a life filled with joy and pain and seeing that misplaced faith did not bring you through, yet seeing that you have a choice to make and you choose life- that's what this is about, IMO. I don't disagree with the point - despite the pain he chooses to live - it's the order that doesn't sit well with me; as the previous song (HF) he wishes he could live it all again! The timeline is like: go through hell (Wreckers) despite highs and lows, wish you could live it all again (Headlong) total depression, make the decision to live (BU2B2) emerge with better outlook (Wish them well, Garden) to me, it seems more logical to hit BU2B2 first after wreckers, then emerge from that decision wishing to "live it all again" and then a better outlook. To me, Headlong is a fairly positive song, then, BU2B2 is the rock bottom turning point. Why come back down after Headlong? That's what seems out of line to me. Certainly the novel will fill in the details and probably make sense of this for me, but it is interesting to ponder at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lerxster Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndroidOnTheRun Posted June 21, 2012 Share Posted June 21, 2012 QUOTE (SlyJeff @ Jun 20 2012, 10:10 PM) I don't think BU2B is a timeline goof. It's not nearly as dark as people seem to think. It's about letting go and choosing life instead of relying on misplaced faith. It leads perfectly in to WTW. Essentially the narrative is some thing like "This has been a wild ride, and as crazy and painful as it was, I'd do it all over again. I realize now that the faith I clung to in the beginning was misplaced and harmful to me, but I choose life and will not be enslaved to that faith any longer. To all those who manipulated and hurt me along the road- best of luck to you- you have no foothold in my life any more and I'm moving on." Mm, good point. The last 4 tracks are all in a way giving us aspects of the same moment of reflection. I also contend (as I have on another thread discussing BU2B2) that the arrangement of the last 4 tracks is subservient to the need for the album to have a satisfying arc in terms of song mood. If you think about it: Mid-tempo poppy Wreckers Epic rockfest Headlong Flight Haunting, atmospheric BU2B2 Straight-up rocker Wish Them Well Beautiful, power ballad Garden That ordering makes much more sense from the perspective of an overall album experience than if you flipped Headlong Flight and BU2B2. IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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