Bernie Grundman

[Mr. Henry Gale]

QUOTE (Merely Space @ Jun 12 2012, 03:39 PM)

Sorry, mastering sounds fine to me.

Some thought on this.

 

I. Objectively (IMO) this album is poorly mastered (note: this album might sound better than other modern albums. But it doesn't mean it's technically good, or done well. I'm comparing this album to all albums ever mastered.)

 

II. Some people don't care, as it's not a big enough of a deal to affect their enjoyment.

 

III. Some fans take personal offense when you bring up these kind of things. I don't know why, it's almost as if they feel like you are attacking the band.

 

IV. People just get used to it. After your ears have been pummeled with bad mastering and recording for the last 10 years, your ears adjust to the loudness.

 

In conclusion, I think those that really think this has GREAT mastering - should really A/B 80s rush albums (or even bands outside of Rush) and tell me CA sounds great.

 

It really doesn't

Edited June 13, 2012 by Mr. Henry Gale

[Mr. Henry Gale]

QUOTE (GUP1771 @ Jun 12 2012, 04:57 PM)

People must have really picky ears. I have no problem with people expressing their opinions, but people just get too picky at times. Hell, I blasted the songs in the crappy, leaked mp3 format in my cars stereo and while points were a bit harsh, it was overall alright. I can't imagine what it will sound like once I get the CD to play in my car. The music sounds fine. It might not be as good as you'd like, but come on, people are exaggerating something to the point of insanity.

Aren't you a consumer? You pay for the music right? You should be picky. It's your money.

 

If you could get the best sounding version of the album, but you aren't (due to poor practices and choices) - you're saying you are happy about that?

 

Imagine paying for a DVD of a movie or TV show, and they did a bad job transferring the image to disc. Would you not be pissed? Or at the very least dissatisfied with your purchase?

Edited June 13, 2012 by Mr. Henry Gale

[Mr. Henry Gale]

QUOTE (Snaked @ Jun 12 2012, 04:47 PM)

RUSH could release an album that sounds like The Nightfly and people on these forums would spout off nonsense like "zOMG! It's got teh brIckwAllzzzz!" Relax people.. it's fine.

Wonder if anyone tried defending VT when it first came out.

 

What you guys talking about, this shit sounds great.

[RushIslander]

Is this a joke thread?

 

 

 

[Mr. Henry Gale]

QUOTE (RushIslander @ Jun 12 2012, 05:04 PM)

Is this a joke thread?

It seems like a joke that people are actually defending the album as sounding great. Definitely.

 

I actually enjoy this album, and am not even bothered by the mastering. But how anyone can say the album sounds "great" is beyond me. Seems peoples standards for good sounding albums has really gone down.

Edited June 13, 2012 by Mr. Henry Gale

[LeaveMyThingAlone]

I've been cranking it all day in my car and it sounds fine to me....I don't really understand the issue people have with it, but whatever...impossible to please everyone.

 

I do agree that it pales in comparison to the Permanent Waves and Moving Pictures recordings...I wish it sounded as crisp as they do, but I certainly don't think it's as dramatic as the OP does

[Zanadoo]

I really believe some people have more sensitive ears than others to this sort of thing. To me, there are points where the music can get drowned out by this really harsh high end. I love this album and it's competing for my favorite Rush record to date, but for some, mastering can be very noticeable. If you don't hear the problems, you don't have to respond. Edited June 13, 2012 by Zanadoo

[GUP1771]

QUOTE (Mr. Henry Gale @ Jun 12 2012, 08:08 PM)

QUOTE (RushIslander @ Jun 12 2012, 05:04 PM) Is this a joke thread? It seems like a joke that people are actually defending the album as sounding great. Definitely.   I actually enjoy this album, and am not even bothered by the mastering. But how anyone can say the album sounds "great" is beyond me. Seems peoples standards for good sounding albums has really gone down.   I never said it sounds amazing, but I don't get why people are screaming bloody murder and calling for the guy who mastered it to be hung. Saying that it sounds "dreadful" is just crazy and blowing something out of proportion.   EDIT: If your going to argue that it's a joke when there are people who argue and think it's "great", shouldn't the same be said for those who say vice versa? Isn't it a joke how people are blowing it out of proportion using words "dreadful"?

Edited June 13, 2012 by GUP1771

[Terrapin]

QUOTE (Snaked @ Jun 13 2012, 12:47 AM)

RUSH could release an album that sounds like The Nightfly and people on these forums would spout off nonsense like "zOMG! It's got teh brIckwAllzzzz!" Relax people.. it's fine.

Um, no...

 

Are you seriously comparing Donald Fagens "Nightfly" to this abysmal rubbish?

 

There is NO comparison, musically and/or sonically.

 

Nightfly has and IS used in countless venues and recording studios as a metaphorical yardstick of how music SHOUD sound and relate to the listener, irregardless of musical taste.

 

There is no degree of compression and subsequent loss of sonic quality.

 

In my DAW (Logic 9) CA is peaking all over the place, NF is tame and where it should be.

 

Again, maybe it's my age (the age)

 

Still, the songs are quite good ;-)

[GUP1771]

QUOTE (Terrapin @ Jun 12 2012, 08:13 PM)

QUOTE (Snaked @ Jun 13 2012, 12:47 AM) RUSH could release an album that sounds like The Nightfly and people on these forums would spout off nonsense like "zOMG! It's got teh brIckwAllzzzz!" Relax people.. it's fine.         Um, no...   Are you seriously comparing Donald Fagens "Nightfly" to this abysmal rubbish?   There is NO comparison, musically and/or sonically.   Nightfly has and IS used in countless venues and recording studios as a metaphorical yardstick of how music SHOUD sound and relate to the listener, irregardless of musical taste.   There is no degree of compression and subsequent loss of sonic quality.   In my DAW (Logic 9) CA is peaking all over the place, NF is tame and where it should be.   Again, maybe it's my age (the age)   Still, the songs are quite good ;-) Missed the point there, bud.

[Mr. Henry Gale]

QUOTE (GUP1771 @ Jun 12 2012, 05:12 PM)

QUOTE (Mr. Henry Gale @ Jun 12 2012, 08:08 PM) QUOTE (RushIslander @ Jun 12 2012, 05:04 PM) Is this a joke thread? It seems like a joke that people are actually defending the album as sounding great. Definitely.   I actually enjoy this album, and am not even bothered by the mastering. But how anyone can say the album sounds "great" is beyond me. Seems peoples standards for good sounding albums has really gone down.   I never said it sounds amazing, but I don't get why people are screaming bloody murder and calling for the guy who mastered it to be hung. Saying that it sounds "dreadful" is just crazy and blowing something out of proportion.   EDIT: If you argue it's a joke that people are arguing people who think it's "great", shouldn't the same be said for those who say vice versa? Isn't it a joke how people are blowing it out of proportion using words "dreadful"? We are on the same page then.   Sorry if my posts came out sounding super defensive. I actually don't have an issue with CA's mastering (the way I have an issue with VT). I can listen to this album and enjoy it.   I just kind of get irritated that people say it's "great' mastering. And as much as some of you get annoyed by people complaining about this stuff - I actually wish more people WOULD complain, so that they would stop mixing and mastering shit so loud.   But alas, that won't ever happen. It's always going to be the minority that complains, and the rest not caring. But I think that's really unfortunate. Because people don't realize that they aren't getting the best sounding version of the album that they could have.   I can't think of any other art medium, where the art is purposely degraded on a mass level (as a common practice) - and where no one does anything about it. It's absolutely insane to me. Mostly because it's audio (sound) - something a lot easier to tweak without people getting upset. But imagine if movies had a practice where it made the film look worse (no one say 3D i'll smack you lol) - you better believe more people would notice and complain (as visual is obviously more upfront than audio).

Edited June 13, 2012 by Mr. Henry Gale

[Terrapin]

QUOTE (GUP1771 @ Jun 13 2012, 01:12 AM)

QUOTE (Mr. Henry Gale @ Jun 12 2012, 08:08 PM) QUOTE (RushIslander @ Jun 12 2012, 05:04 PM) Is this a joke thread? It seems like a joke that people are actually defending the album as sounding great. Definitely.   I actually enjoy this album, and am not even bothered by the mastering. But how anyone can say the album sounds "great" is beyond me. Seems peoples standards for good sounding albums has really gone down.   I never said it sounds amazing, but I don't get why people are screaming bloody murder and calling for the guy who mastered it to be hung. Saying that it sounds "dreadful" is just crazy and blowing something out of proportion. I didn't say "hung" I said "hanged" Pictures are hung, people are hanged. Grammar can be an interesting subject, learn it...

[GUP1771]

QUOTE (Mr. Henry Gale @ Jun 12 2012, 08:19 PM)

QUOTE (GUP1771 @ Jun 12 2012, 05:12 PM) QUOTE (Mr. Henry Gale @ Jun 12 2012, 08:08 PM) QUOTE (RushIslander @ Jun 12 2012, 05:04 PM) Is this a joke thread? It seems like a joke that people are actually defending the album as sounding great. Definitely.   I actually enjoy this album, and am not even bothered by the mastering. But how anyone can say the album sounds "great" is beyond me. Seems peoples standards for good sounding albums has really gone down.   I never said it sounds amazing, but I don't get why people are screaming bloody murder and calling for the guy who mastered it to be hung. Saying that it sounds "dreadful" is just crazy and blowing something out of proportion.   EDIT: If you argue it's a joke that people are arguing people who think it's "great", shouldn't the same be said for those who say vice versa? Isn't it a joke how people are blowing it out of proportion using words "dreadful"? We are on the same page then.   Sorry if my posts came out sound super defensive. I actually don't have an issue with the CA's mastering myself (the way I have an issue with VT). I can listen to this album and enjoy it.   I just kind of get irritated that people say it's "great' mastering. And as much as some of you get annoyed by people complaining about this stuff - - I actually wish more people would complain about the bad practices in the industry, so that they would stop mixing and mastering shit so loud.   But alas, that won't ever happen. It's always going to be the minority that complains, and the rest not caring. But I think that's really unfortunate. Because people don't realize that they aren't getting the best sounding version of the album that they could have. No worries, and I hope I didn't come off as overly defensive too. Like I said, I'm not picky with sound, but I can't listen to VT because it's unlistenable for me. If it's unlistenable for me, I can't imagine what those with a more sensitive ear must think.   I suppose another reason why I'm not so sensitive is because I grew up around this modern music. I didn't grow up in the past when records were made with a different sound. I guess I look towards the material over sound because I've grown up in a time where, in my opinion, a lot of music is mediocre, so I value the songwriting, lyrics, etc. over sound because I've been unfortunate to grow up around quality music.

[RushIslander]

So it is a joke...no kidding.

 

Write up a resume and right what's wrong in the industry already...fax it to Anthem.

 

[GUP1771]

QUOTE (Terrapin @ Jun 12 2012, 08:25 PM)

QUOTE (GUP1771 @ Jun 13 2012, 01:12 AM) QUOTE (Mr. Henry Gale @ Jun 12 2012, 08:08 PM) QUOTE (RushIslander @ Jun 12 2012, 05:04 PM) Is this a joke thread? It seems like a joke that people are actually defending the album as sounding great. Definitely.   I actually enjoy this album, and am not even bothered by the mastering. But how anyone can say the album sounds "great" is beyond me. Seems peoples standards for good sounding albums has really gone down.   I never said it sounds amazing, but I don't get why people are screaming bloody murder and calling for the guy who mastered it to be hung. Saying that it sounds "dreadful" is just crazy and blowing something out of proportion. I didn't say "hung" I said "hanged" Pictures are hung, people are hanged. Grammar can be an interesting subject, learn it... Really? You're going to pull that card on me? You're going deviate from the discussion and attack me because I made a grammar mistake instead of having a civil debate? Nice one.

Edited June 13, 2012 by GUP1771

[Slack jaw gaze]

QUOTE (Terrapin @ Jun 12 2012, 08:25 PM)

I didn't say "hung" I said "hanged" Pictures are hung, people are hanged. Grammar can be an interesting subject, learn it...

Indeed.

 

QUOTE (Terrapin @ Jun 13 2012, 01:12 AM)

...irregardless...

 

Send Rush your resume. When the phone don't ring, you'll know it's them.

[Terrapin]

Well then, I'm off to listen to my MP3 version of Hemispheres which, I hasten to add, sounds infinitely superior to CA despite the "low-quality" and "old fashioned" recording methods... It's all about technique and mic placement ;-)

 

I'll leave you youngun's to continue the debate... :-)

[Terrapin]

[ThinkingBig]

QUOTE (Terrapin @ Jun 12 2012, 08:39 PM)

Well then, I'm off to listen to my MP3 version of Hemispheres which, I hasten to add, sounds infinitely superior to CA despite the "low-quality" and "old fashioned" recording methods... It's all about technique and mic placement ;-) I'll leave you youngun's to continue the debate... :-)

Looks like trollie got his attention for day.

[Analog_Bro]

QUOTE (Mr. Henry Gale @ Jun 12 2012, 08:19 PM)

QUOTE (GUP1771 @ Jun 12 2012, 05:12 PM) QUOTE (Mr. Henry Gale @ Jun 12 2012, 08:08 PM) QUOTE (RushIslander @ Jun 12 2012, 05:04 PM) Is this a joke thread? It seems like a joke that people are actually defending the album as sounding great. Definitely.   I actually enjoy this album, and am not even bothered by the mastering. But how anyone can say the album sounds "great" is beyond me. Seems peoples standards for good sounding albums has really gone down.   I never said it sounds amazing, but I don't get why people are screaming bloody murder and calling for the guy who mastered it to be hung. Saying that it sounds "dreadful" is just crazy and blowing something out of proportion.   EDIT: If you argue it's a joke that people are arguing people who think it's "great", shouldn't the same be said for those who say vice versa? Isn't it a joke how people are blowing it out of proportion using words "dreadful"? We are on the same page then.   Sorry if my posts came out sounding super defensive. I actually don't have an issue with CA's mastering (the way I have an issue with VT). I can listen to this album and enjoy it.   I just kind of get irritated that people say it's "great' mastering. And as much as some of you get annoyed by people complaining about this stuff - I actually wish more people WOULD complain, so that they would stop mixing and mastering shit so loud.   But alas, that won't ever happen. It's always going to be the minority that complains, and the rest not caring. But I think that's really unfortunate. Because people don't realize that they aren't getting the best sounding version of the album that they could have.   I can't think of any other art medium, where the art is purposely degraded on a mass level (as a common practice) - and where no one does anything about it. It's absolutely insane to me. Mostly because it's audio (sound) - something a lot easier to tweak without people getting upset. But imagine if movies had a practice where it made the film look worse (no one say 3D i'll smack you lol) - you better believe more people would notice and complain (as visual is obviously more upfront than audio). I agree.   While I wish the mastering was better, it doesn't detract from my listening of the album to the point where it degrades the songs   But at the same time I could only image what it would sound like if Steven Wilson was behind the desk, that dude knows how to make a great sounding record!

Edited June 13, 2012 by Analog_Bro

[ThinkingBig]

[Snaked]

QUOTE (Terrapin @ Jun 12 2012, 09:13 PM)

QUOTE (Snaked @ Jun 13 2012, 12:47 AM) RUSH could release an album that sounds like The Nightfly and people on these forums would spout off nonsense like "zOMG! It's got teh brIckwAllzzzz!" Relax people.. it's fine.         Um, no...   Are you seriously comparing Donald Fagens "Nightfly" to this abysmal rubbish?   There is NO comparison, musically and/or sonically.   Nightfly has and IS used in countless venues and recording studios as a metaphorical yardstick of how music SHOUD sound and relate to the listener, irregardless of musical taste.   There is no degree of compression and subsequent loss of sonic quality.   In my DAW (Logic 9) CA is peaking all over the place, NF is tame and where it should be.   Again, maybe it's my age (the age)   Still, the songs are quite good ;-) Why don't you read my post again... you missed my point completely.

[Slack jaw gaze]

QUOTE (Terrapin @ Jun 12 2012, 08:42 PM)

Don't ring... C'mon ..  u kan do bedder dan dat? ;-)

https://www.google.com/search?q=%22When+the...ow+it%27s+me%22

[marblesmike]

Also, while I agree with the general gist of the OP, Berne Grundman himself didn't master the album. He did master (speaking of Fagen) some Steely Dan lps in the 70s.

 

And how is honestly expressing an opinion trolling? Some of you fanboys need to lighten up when people criticize the Holy Trinity.

[Dylan2712]

QUOTE (Terrapin @ Jun 12 2012, 06:13 PM)

In my DAW (Logic 9) CA is peaking all over the place,

is it peaking at or above 0.0db ? I hate using logic for anything other than composing MIDI because of this reason. it needs to be really quiet or else theres digital peaking -it's bullshit. im dead sure they used analog equipment to mix and master this mofo and if they had brick walled this album everyone would be able to tell.

 

Everyone who has complained about the loudness of this album, S&A, and the sector releases are usually just blowing smoke out of their asses. i have several modern albums that have been mastered at least 3db louder than any Rush album. i literally have to turn my speakers down when i go from La Villa Strangiato (sectors version) to say, a Gob album.

 

It can always be worse, so trolls, kindly shut the hell up