Rutsey Excluded from RRHoF Induction

[Cygnus 2112]

How many of us here were around in 1974, bought the debut album when it was released, loved it and then became angered when Rutsey was not involved in the tour and Fly By Night?

 

RUSH played at my friends moms Prom in 73 and she says she remembers the drummer introducing songs and the singer sounding like a whiny woman and she couldn't handle his voice.

[goingbald]

3. When Rutsey was alive, he was totally over not being in Rush.

 

How do you know that? Information about him was pretty scarce post-1974. Almost nothing is known about what happened with him other than Alex knew him for a few more years and he was into bodybuilding professionally at some point. No one has even seen a picture of him post-1974, much less heard an interview or anything about his feelings about Rush after the fact...

 

It's well documented that he left the band for health reasons and the fact that he didn't want to pursue a career in music...he was in it more for fun than a serious career. He stopped playing shortly after leaving and got into bodybuilding, as you mentioned. It sure doesn't sound like he was practicing for hours on end in his basement hoping for another shot.

 

Even if he didn't leave because of health reasons, their musical direction was changing after the first album. I believe Geddy said that John was more into basic 'bad company' blues rock and Ged and Al wanted to move into the 'Yes' proggy direction. The break-up was bound to happen sooner or later.

 

If one of the 9 year olds that I coached in Little League years ago doesn't give me credit when being inducted into the Baseball Hall of Fame, I won't get bent out of shape about it.

[rushgoober]

3. When Rutsey was alive, he was totally over not being in Rush.

 

How do you know that? Information about him was pretty scarce post-1974. Almost nothing is known about what happened with him other than Alex knew him for a few more years and he was into bodybuilding professionally at some point. No one has even seen a picture of him post-1974, much less heard an interview or anything about his feelings about Rush after the fact...

 

It's well documented that he left the band for health reasons and the fact that he didn't want to pursue a career in music...he was in it more for fun than a serious career. He stopped playing shortly after leaving and got into bodybuilding, as you mentioned. It sure doesn't sound like he was practicing for hours on end in his basement hoping for another shot.

 

Even if he didn't leave because of health reasons, their musical direction was changing after the first album. I believe Geddy said that John was more into basic 'bad company' blues rock and Ged and Al wanted to move into the 'Yes' proggy direction. The break-up was bound to happen sooner or later.

 

If one of the 9 year olds that I coached in Little League years ago doesn't give me credit when being inducted into the Baseball Hall of Fame, I won't get bent out of shape about it.

 

What I meant is, how do you know he didn't regret it or was resentful or was jealous of their success or was really "over it?" Too little is known about him to know that.

Edited April 13, 2013 by rushgoober

[Xanadoood]

How many of us here were around in 1974, bought the debut album when it was released, loved it and then became angered when Rutsey was not involved in the tour and Fly By Night?

 

I was around, but I was 5.

 

 

Yeah, but were you angered?

 

I got mad at naps and asparagus back then.

 

Broccoli for me. Hated that shit.

[Ancient Ways]

IMO rutsey should not be inducted.

[gangsterfurious]

How many of us here were around in 1974, bought the debut album when it was released, loved it and then became angered when Rutsey was not involved in the tour and Fly By Night?

 

I was around, but I was 5.

 

Yeah, but were you angered?

 

I got mad at naps and asparagus back then.

 

Yes and now you probably realize that naps and asparagus are two of the greatest things a human can have in this life.

[The Owl]

Don't know this and can't be arsed to google it, but was Pete Best inducted with the Beetles?

Good qustion. No, Pete Best was not inducted with The Beatles.

 

Was Syd Barrett included in Floyd's induction?

[CygnusGal]

He's in the bio.

 

Rush was formed in August 1968 in the Willowdale neighborhood of Toronto. The original lineup included Alex Lifeson on guitar, Jeff Jones on bass and John Rutsey on drums. Jones was soon replaced by Geddy Lee, and, in 1974, after the release of the group’s debut album, Rutsey left and was replaced by Neil Peart. That lineup – Lee on vocals, bass and keyboards; Lifeson on guitar, and Peart on drums – has remained stable throughout the years.

 

http://rockhall.com/...ctees/rush/bio/

 

I guess I fail to see the issue.

[goingbald]

It might be different if Rutsey was playing on the first 3 or 4 albums. Let's face it...the drumming on the first album was garage band basic. Can anyone in their right mind say that he played a major contribution in what Rush became? Didn't think so. It's not like anyone is trying to piss on his grave, but this is not a issue worth arguing over. What about Jeff Jones, the bassist before Geddy? Or the guy that Alex jammed with in 8th grade?

 

This is like my girlfriend 40 years ago not inviting me to her wedding. Old news...big effin deal...get over it.

[rushgoober]

Don't know this and can't be arsed to google it, but was Pete Best inducted with the Beetles?

Good qustion. No, Pete Best was not inducted with The Beatles.

 

Was Syd Barrett included in Floyd's induction?

 

If he wasn't, he should have been. Unlike Rutsey, it's without question or argument that without Barrett there would be no Pink Floyd. He propelled them into stardom. That's not to put down the other members, as obviously they persevered and did quite well. Obviously the other members were immensely talented, and David Gilmour was no slouch as a replacement member. That said, the rest of the members went to ridiculous lengths to pay tribute to Syd, so whether he was technically inducted or not, everyone knows what a crucial role he played.

 

Rush, on the other hand, owe little to Rutsey. Yes, he was an above average drummer, and he was in the band when they first broke through, but his contribution was relatively minor and his influence was very short lived.

[calirush]

It might be different if Rutsey was playing on the first 3 or 4 albums. Let's face it...the drumming on the first album was garage band basic. Can anyone in their right mind say that he played a major contribution in what Rush became? Didn't think so. It's not like anyone is trying to piss on his grave, but this is not a issue worth arguing over. What about Jeff Jones, the bassist before Geddy? Or the guy that Alex jammed with in 8th grade?

 

This is like my girlfriend 40 years ago not inviting me to her wedding. Old news...big effin deal...get over it.

 

This^

[Enemy Within 77]

He shouldn't be included. We all know they didn't become Rush until Neil. He wasn't even that great of a drummer. Now, Mark Evans from AC/DC not being included is a whole other story. Just for the reason that he played on Let There Be Rock is enough for me.

[zappafrank]

In an almost ironic way, the fact that so much discussion has been dedicated to whether or not Rutsey had a lasting impact on the band as we know it sort of answers the question in a roundabout way.

 

I also think much of it comes from the fact that Rush *doesn't* have a list of former members, but the sheer fact that that there is an asterick next to the line-up indicating "John Rutsey on drums on the 1st album" is enough for some people to take a moment and say, "Oh yeah..."

 

I could see the argument being made that John at least deserves a mention for the fact that he did do a lot for the band in the pre-album days, right? Rush had existed in some incarnation for about 5 years prior to the 1st album, and I think it's fair to say that at least for those 5 years, John pulled his weight. Hell, wasn't John's brother the one who came up with the name Rush? I'm not saying that his brother should be inducted, too, but my point is that really, for the early days, John wasn't just "some guy in the band," the way, say, Dennis Stratton was when it came to Maiden (was only on the 1st album) or those early drummers were for Judas Priest, who each only appeared on a single album.

 

But really, I originally sat down just to write that 1st part - In an almost ironic way, the fact that so much discussion has been dedicated to whether or not Rutsey had a lasting impact on the band as we know it sort of answers the question in a roundabout way - but I guess it turned into a bit more. :P

Edited April 14, 2013 by zappafrank

[Slack jaw gaze]

I'm outraged the CA orchestra is not being inducted. They played on an album AND toured.

 

Also, whoever put Alex and Geddy in all the same classes in grade 9 should be in. Rush would not exist if not for that.

[greg2112]

Who cares. He shouldnt be part of the induction. A shout out by Geddy or better yet Neil in their acceptance speech is all that can or should be expected.

[rushgoober]

I'm outraged the CA orchestra is not being inducted. They played on an album AND toured.

 

Also, whoever put Alex and Geddy in all the same classes in grade 9 should be in. Rush would not exist if not for that.

 

And don't forget Aimee Mann. Without her, Time Stand Still would have been a slightly different song.

[Babycat]

Whether or not he's inducted, he at least deserves a mention.

[Motorshooter]

Don't know this and can't be arsed to google it, but was Pete Best inducted with the Beetles?

Good qustion. No, Pete Best was not inducted with The Beatles.

 

Thanks... then I don't see an issue in Rutsy not being inducted as part of Rush. Really, Rush is Alex, Neil and Ged... I mean, what about the 'other' bassist in Rush (the dude who played bass for Red Rider)... I'm sure he's not POed about not being listed as an inductee to the RRHOF. ;)

He did play on that first album, unlike Best, so..

 

I'm not seeing it as an outrage though. I'm sure Geddy or Alex will give Rutsey his due props during the induction speech.

 

 

-Nope, didn't happen......blah, blah, bla

[Brucey]

Ben Mink should have been inducted because he played the Electric Violin on "Losing It"........

[beneathbetweenbehindyourmom]

What about Ray Daniels or Terry Brown? And what about Hitler? If there was no Holocaust then... ok this is just getting ridiculous.

[GeminiRising79]

Minimum, he should get an honorable mention somewhere, even if footnoted. Otherwise, swept under the rug by the big machine.

 

No doubt, Terry should be acknowledged somewhere (more prominently) as well.

Edited January 4, 2014 by GeminiRising79

[MMCXII]

I haven't read this whole thread so forgive me but Rutsey wasn't EXCLUDED. He just wasn't INCLUDED. And maybe for a reason, he's not part of the band..

 

I think it would've been nice if his name was mentioned and I'm surprised Ged or Al didn't, but I think fans' views on the matter are different from the band's because we just see this band and their 21 or so albums. From the bands point of view the time factor comes in. Rutsey was part of the band 40 years ago and it wasn't even really the same band. He didn't even get to play that first album live..

 

Forward thinkers that they are, Ged and Al would probably feel like a current Stanley cup winner thanking Bobby Orr..

 

But ya, still would've been nice to see his name come up, especially since he's no longer with us..

[Narps]

I haven't read this whole thread so forgive me but Rutsey wasn't EXCLUDED. He just wasn't INCLUDED. And maybe for a reason, he's not part of the band..

 

I think it would've been nice if his name was mentioned and I'm surprised Ged or Al didn't, but I think fans' views on the matter are different from the band's because we just see this band and their 21 or so albums. From the bands point of view the time factor comes in. Rutsey was part of the band 40 years ago and it wasn't even really the same band. He didn't even get to play that first album live..

 

Forward thinkers that they are, Ged and Al would probably feel like a current Stanley cup winner thanking Bobby Orr..

 

But ya, still would've been nice to see his name come up, especially since he's no longer with us..

You would think... . If that team had won their first 5 or ten games with Bobby Orr then..... ? :)

[MMCXII]

Look how much Neil has done for the band and he's still just the new guy lookin for a raise.. Rutsey don't stand a chance ;)

[MMCXII]

I haven't read this whole thread so forgive me but Rutsey wasn't EXCLUDED. He just wasn't INCLUDED. And maybe for a reason, he's not part of the band..

 

I think it would've been nice if his name was mentioned and I'm surprised Ged or Al didn't, but I think fans' views on the matter are different from the band's because we just see this band and their 21 or so albums. From the bands point of view the time factor comes in. Rutsey was part of the band 40 years ago and it wasn't even really the same band. He didn't even get to play that first album live..

 

Forward thinkers that they are, Ged and Al would probably feel like a current Stanley cup winner thanking Bobby Orr..

 

But ya, still would've been nice to see his name come up, especially since he's no longer with us..

You would think... . If that team had won their first 5 or ten games with Bobby Orr then..... ? :)

 

Hmm that might even be a stretch I think