Lost-great show or major addiction?

[hunter]

Now...

 

Sideways World:

 

Sideways world is where it gets really cool in terms of theology and metaphysical discussion (for me at least -- because I love history/religion theories and loved all the talks in the writer's room about it). Basically what the show is proposing is that we're all linked to certain people during our lives. Call them soul mates (though it's not exactly the best word). But these people we're linked to are with us during "the most important moments of our lives" as Christian said. These are the people we move through the universe with from lifetime to lifetime. It's loosely based in Hinduism with large doses of western religion thrown into the mix.

 

The conceit that the writers created, basing it off these religious philosophies, was that as a group, the Lostaways subconsciously created this "sideways" world where they exist in purgatory until they are "awakened" and find one another. Once they all find one another, they can then move on and move forward. In essence, this is the show's concept of the afterlife. According to the show, everyone creates their own "Sideways" purgatory with their "soul mates" throughout their lives and exist there until they all move on together. That's a beautiful notion. Even if you aren't religious or even spiritual, the idea that we live AND die together is deeply profound and moving.

 

It's a really cool and spiritual concept that fits the whole tone and subtext the show has had from the beginning. These people were SUPPOSED to be together on that plane. They were supposed to live through these events -- not JUST because of Jacob. But because that's what the universe or God (depending on how religious you wish to get) wanted to happen. The show was always about science vs. faith -- and it ultimately came down on the side of faith. It answered THE core question of the series. The one question that has been at the root of every island mystery, every character back-story, every plot twist. That, by itself, is quite an accomplishment.

 

How much you want to extrapolate from that is up to you as the viewer. Think about season 1 when we first found the Hatch. Everyone thought that's THE answer! Whatever is down there is the answer! Then, as we discovered it was just one station of many. One link in a very long chain that kept revealing more, and more of a larger mosaic.

 

But the writer's took it even further this season by contrasting this Sideways "purgatory" with the Island itself. Remember when Michael appeared to Hurley, he said he was not allowed to leave the Island. Just like the MIB. He wasn't allowed into this sideways world and thus, was not afforded the opportunity to move on. Why? Because he had proven himself to be unworthy with his actions on the Island. He failed the test. The others, passed. They made it into Sideways world when they died -- some before Jack, some years later. In Hurley's case, maybe centuries later. They exist in this sideways world until they are "awakened" and they can only move on TOGETHER because they are linked. They are destined to be together for eternity. That was their destiny.

 

They were NOT linked to Anna Lucia, Daniel, Roussou, Alex, Miles, Lupidis, (and all the rest who weren't in the church -- basically everyone who wasn't in season 1). Yet those people exist in Sideways world. Why? Well again, here's where they leave it up to you to decide. The way I like to think about it, is that those people who were left behind in Sideways world have to find their own soul mates before they can wake up. It's possible that those links aren't people from the island but from their other life (Anna's partner, the guy she shot --- Roussou's husband, etc etc).

 

A lot of people have been talking about Ben and why he didn't go into the Church. And if you think of Sideways world in this way, then it gives you the answer to that very question. Ben can't move on yet because he hasn't connected with the people he needs to. It's going to be his job to awaken Roussou, Alex, Anna Lucia (maybe), Ethan, Goodspeed, his father and the rest. He has to atone for his sins more than he did by being Hurley's number two. He has to do what Hurley and Desmond did for our Lostaways with his own people. He has to help them connect. And he can only move on when all the links in his chain are ready to. Same can be said for Faraday, Charlotte, Whidmore, Hawkins etc. It's really a neat, and cool concept. At least to me.

 

But, from a more "behind the scenes" note: the reason Ben's not in the church, and the reason no one is in the church but for Season 1 people is because they wrote the ending to the show after writing the pilot. And never changed it. The writers always said (and many didn't believe them) that they knew their ending from the very first episode. I applaud them for that. It's pretty fantastic. Originally Ben was supposed to have a 3 episode arc and be done. But he became a big part of the show. They could have easily changed their ending and put him in the church -- but instead they problem solved it. Gave him a BRILLIANT moment with Locke outside the church ... and then that was it. I loved that. For those that wonder -- the original ending started the moment Jack walked into the church and touches the casket to Jack closing his eyes as the other plane flies away. That was always JJ's ending. And they kept it.

 

 

In the end, for me, LOST was a touchstone show that dealt with faith, the afterlife, and all these big, spiritual questions that most shows don't touch. And to me, they never once wavered from their core story -- even with all the sci-fi elements they mixed in. To walk that long and daunting of a creative tightrope and survive is simply astounding.

[rushgoober]

QUOTE (Jack Aubrey @ May 26 2010, 04:00 AM)

OK, I've processed the finale some more and I've come to the conclusion that it was pretty awesome.

I can only imagine the intricate convolutions through the grooves of your brain that had to take place before the processing was complete and you arrived at your conclusion.

 

I, for one, haven't really thought much about it the last couple of days, but when I get a free moment I will re-watch the final episode (and eventually the final season) to see if I can come to terms and be at peace with the ending. I already knew that I enjoyed it and that it was emotionally powerful, so it got me on an emotional level. On the mental level, it's still traveling through the grooves of my brain seeking resolution. Maybe you have a more recent intel processing chip than I do.

[Test4VitalSigns]

QUOTE (hunter @ May 26 2010, 11:24 AM)

Now... Sideways World: Sideways world is where it gets really cool in terms of theology and metaphysical discussion (for me at least -- because I love history/religion theories and loved all the talks in the writer's room about it). Basically what the show is proposing is that we're all linked to certain people during our lives. Call them soul mates (though it's not exactly the best word). But these people we're linked to are with us during "the most important moments of our lives" as Christian said. These are the people we move through the universe with from lifetime to lifetime. It's loosely based in Hinduism with large doses of western religion thrown into the mix. The conceit that the writers created, basing it off these religious philosophies, was that as a group, the Lostaways subconsciously created this "sideways" world where they exist in purgatory until they are "awakened" and find one another. Once they all find one another, they can then move on and move forward. In essence, this is the show's concept of the afterlife. According to the show, everyone creates their own "Sideways" purgatory with their "soul mates" throughout their lives and exist there until they all move on together. That's a beautiful notion. Even if you aren't religious or even spiritual, the idea that we live AND die together is deeply profound and moving. It's a really cool and spiritual concept that fits the whole tone and subtext the show has had from the beginning. These people were SUPPOSED to be together on that plane. They were supposed to live through these events -- not JUST because of Jacob. But because that's what the universe or God (depending on how religious you wish to get) wanted to happen. The show was always about science vs. faith -- and it ultimately came down on the side of faith. It answered THE core question of the series. The one question that has been at the root of every island mystery, every character back-story, every plot twist. That, by itself, is quite an accomplishment. How much you want to extrapolate from that is up to you as the viewer. Think about season 1 when we first found the Hatch. Everyone thought that's THE answer! Whatever is down there is the answer! Then, as we discovered it was just one station of many. One link in a very long chain that kept revealing more, and more of a larger mosaic. But the writer's took it even further this season by contrasting this Sideways "purgatory" with the Island itself. Remember when Michael appeared to Hurley, he said he was not allowed to leave the Island. Just like the MIB. He wasn't allowed into this sideways world and thus, was not afforded the opportunity to move on. Why? Because he had proven himself to be unworthy with his actions on the Island. He failed the test. The others, passed. They made it into Sideways world when they died -- some before Jack, some years later. In Hurley's case, maybe centuries later. They exist in this sideways world until they are "awakened" and they can only move on TOGETHER because they are linked. They are destined to be together for eternity. That was their destiny. They were NOT linked to Anna Lucia, Daniel, Roussou, Alex, Miles, Lupidis, (and all the rest who weren't in the church -- basically everyone who wasn't in season 1). Yet those people exist in Sideways world. Why? Well again, here's where they leave it up to you to decide. The way I like to think about it, is that those people who were left behind in Sideways world have to find their own soul mates before they can wake up. It's possible that those links aren't people from the island but from their other life (Anna's partner, the guy she shot --- Roussou's husband, etc etc). A lot of people have been talking about Ben and why he didn't go into the Church. And if you think of Sideways world in this way, then it gives you the answer to that very question. Ben can't move on yet because he hasn't connected with the people he needs to. It's going to be his job to awaken Roussou, Alex, Anna Lucia (maybe), Ethan, Goodspeed, his father and the rest. He has to atone for his sins more than he did by being Hurley's number two. He has to do what Hurley and Desmond did for our Lostaways with his own people. He has to help them connect. And he can only move on when all the links in his chain are ready to. Same can be said for Faraday, Charlotte, Whidmore, Hawkins etc. It's really a neat, and cool concept. At least to me. But, from a more "behind the scenes" note: the reason Ben's not in the church, and the reason no one is in the church but for Season 1 people is because they wrote the ending to the show after writing the pilot. And never changed it. The writers always said (and many didn't believe them) that they knew their ending from the very first episode. I applaud them for that. It's pretty fantastic. Originally Ben was supposed to have a 3 episode arc and be done. But he became a big part of the show. They could have easily changed their ending and put him in the church -- but instead they problem solved it. Gave him a BRILLIANT moment with Locke outside the church ... and then that was it. I loved that. For those that wonder -- the original ending started the moment Jack walked into the church and touches the casket to Jack closing his eyes as the other plane flies away. That was always JJ's ending. And they kept it. In the end, for me, LOST was a touchstone show that dealt with faith, the afterlife, and all these big, spiritual questions that most shows don't touch. And to me, they never once wavered from their core story -- even with all the sci-fi elements they mixed in. To walk that long and daunting of a creative tightrope and survive is simply astounding.

[rushgoober]

Wow!

 

Hunter, thank you for that insane explanation, that really clears up a lot.

 

My unresolved issues are still somewhat unresolved, so I'm open to more feedback about how all of this explanation fits in.

 

Some of the characters in the sideways world didn't really come to any resolutions in terms of atoning for their sins, the most extreme examples being Sawyer, Kate, and especially Sayid. I guess with Sawyer and Kate, even though she did kill her father, there was still some nobility in why she did it? Sawyer did kill that innocent man in Australia and con a lot of people (so did Kate). Perhaps they had done enough good on the island and were able to come to some sort of atonement and peace with who they were and what they had done? Also Sawyer was a cop who seemed to be doing good in sideways world, and even though Kate was a fugitive, she did give selflessly to help Claire at her own peril. Maybe they had just suffered and been miserable long enough and that was part of their atonement as well? Sayid I have a harder time seeing as atoning and coming to some kind of peace and resolution. Even though he could be a very nice guy, he was also a ruthless killer and torturer before, during and after being on the island.

 

And then why give Jack a son? My wife has a theory that maybe somewhere earlier in the series he verbally regretted never having a child (honestly, I can't remember), or perhaps within this new theory/explanation you could say that his son was part of his more spiritual family that he needed to connect with, but if so, why wouldn't he be in the church? I can't seem to reconcile the son yet under any scenario.

 

Still, it's a beautiful explanation that says a lot; some of which I figured out on my own, and some which I hadn't...

Edited May 26, 2010 by rushgoober

[Test4VitalSigns]

Edited May 26, 2010 by Test4VitalSigns

[Rushman14]

[Jack Aubrey]

[Test4VitalSigns]

Edited May 26, 2010 by Test4VitalSigns

[rushgoober]

[Test4VitalSigns]

[Rushman14]

[Test4VitalSigns]

Edited May 26, 2010 by Test4VitalSigns

[rushgoober]

[hunter]

[treeduck]

I don't have a clue what any of you are talking about, I never watched this Robinson Crusoe wannabe, I just wish you'd fight harder in here and give me some entertainment too!!

 

Fight you Lost Rush puppets, fight for my entertainment I command thee arrrrrr!!

 

Edited May 26, 2010 by treeduck

[Some Half-Forgotten Stranger]

THANKS HUNTER!!!!

 

That was really satisfying to read as it all works for me. See that Testy...I'm satisfied...who'da thunk it!!!???

 

And thanks Rushman14 for the EW stuff as well. I had actually forgotten about that final scene on the beach. I quickly debated its significance as to weather it was to say they all died or not.

 

I see its use as more like a family photo...like sometimes at the end of movies, or stories (like Watchmen) they pan to or show an old photograph as if to indicate "this is what we were" or "this is what it was all about" or "this is how the whole adventure began"...That's how I see that final beach shot.

 

And Mr. Ducky... I see you have poked your head in here a little late...mock us all you like. You know you are intrigued and want to see what all the hype is about. Just start at the beginning.

Edited May 26, 2010 by Some Half-Forgotten Stranger

[Test4VitalSigns]

QUOTE (Some Half-Forgotten Stranger @ May 26 2010, 06:44 PM)

THANKS HUNTER!!!! That was really satisfying to read as it all works for me. See that Testy...I'm satisfied...who'da thunk it!!!??? And thanks Rushman14 for the EW stuff as well. I had actually forgotten about that final scene on the beach. I quickly debated its significance as to weather it was to say they all died or not. I see its use as more like a family photo...like sometimes at the end of movies, or stories (like Watchmen) they pan to or show an old photograph as if to indicate "this is what we were" or "this is what it was all about" or "this is how the whole adventure began"...That's how I see that final beach shot. And Mr. Ducky... I see you have poked your head in here a little late...mock us all you like. You know you are intrigued and want to see what all the hype is about. Just start at the beginning.

[treeduck]

QUOTE (Some Half-Forgotten Stranger @ May 26 2010, 05:44 PM)

THANKS HUNTER!!!! That was really satisfying to read as it all works for me. See that Testy...I'm satisfied...who'da thunk it!!!??? And thanks Rushman14 for the EW stuff as well. I had actually forgotten about that final scene on the beach. I quickly debated its significance as to weather it was to say they all died or not. I see its use as more like a family photo...like sometimes at the end of movies, or stories (like Watchmen) they pan to or show an old photograph as if to indicate "this is what we were" or "this is what it was all about" or "this is how the whole adventure began"...That's how I see that final beach shot. And Mr. Ducky... I see you have poked your head in here a little late...mock us all you like. You know you are intrigued and want to see what all the hype is about. Just start at the beginning.

Naaa the whole desert island scenario doesn't appeal to me and it's been done many times, swiss Family Robinson, Robinson Crusoe, Lord of the Flies, Castaway, The Mysterious Island and so on...

[Test4VitalSigns]

This video for you Stranger

 

A "few" unanswered questions from Lost

 

 

http://www.collegehumor.com/video:1936291

[Jack Aubrey]

QUOTE (treeduck @ May 26 2010, 04:53 PM)

I don't have a clue what any of you are talking about, I never watched this Robinson Crusoe wannabe, I just wish you'd fight harder in here and give me some entertainment too!! Fight you Lost Rush puppets, fight for my entertainment I command thee arrrrrr!!

I'm sure the Weekly World News website is missing you terribly right now.

[treeduck]

QUOTE (Jack Aubrey @ May 26 2010, 06:15 PM)

QUOTE (treeduck @ May 26 2010, 04:53 PM) I don't have a clue what any of you are talking about, I never watched this Robinson Crusoe wannabe, I just wish you'd fight harder in here and give me some entertainment too!! Fight you Lost Rush puppets, fight for my entertainment I command thee arrrrrr!!         I'm sure the Weekly World News website is missing you terribly right now. Never heard of it, must be something you read, you ought to improve your reading list...

[Test4VitalSigns]

It was ALL A DREAM BY VINCENT!!!! (don't look if you haven't see finale)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

http://i969.photobucket.com/albums/ae180/captaincomeback4009/lost-ending.gif

Edited May 26, 2010 by Test4VitalSigns

[Some Half-Forgotten Stranger]

QUOTE (Test4VitalSigns @ May 26 2010, 06:29 PM)

It was ALL A DREAM BY VINCENT!!!! (don't look if you haven't see finale) http://i969.photobucket.com/albums/ae180/captaincomeback4009/lost-ending.gif

[Some Half-Forgotten Stranger]

QUOTE (Test4VitalSigns @ May 26 2010, 06:09 PM)

This video for you Stranger A "few" unanswered questions from Lost http://www.collegehumor.com/video:1936291

AWESOME!!!!!!!!

 

That's for jogging my memory...forget being satisfied!!!!

 

I WANT ANSWERS!!!

 

That was great thanks...I'll be forwarding that to a few people.

[The Owl]

Yeah, Pretty Stupid move by ABC there...... they should know by now that LOST fans scrutinize everything they see, and that inserting that footage would piss alot of people off.

 

 

and T4VS...

 

http://i969.photobucket.com/albums/ae180/captaincomeback4009/lost-ending.gif

 

Best Laugh I've had all day!