Learning from music

**Rick N. Backer** · November 28, 2018

See? Subtle.

**MalformedEarthborn** · November 28, 2018

Pavement always had some obscure political, historical, and literary references.

Not to mention "What about the voice of Geddy Lee? How did it get so high? I wonder if her speaks like an ordinary guy?"

**laughedatbytime** · November 28, 2018

This is either completely, insanely brilliant or submoronic...after five minutes with Wikipedia, my bet is on the latter, a bunch of postmodern twaddle. Give me Coverdale or Hagar, at least they're harmless.

Edited November 28, 2018 by laughedatbytime

**goose** · November 28, 2018

When I think of content-heavy lyrics, Paul Simon, Sting, & Bob Dylan are three artists that come to mind.

**MalformedEarthborn** · November 28, 2018

Wouldn't have been my #1 choice of lyrics from them but give them some credit for stuffing all that into a rock song.

**Fridge** · November 28, 2018

So what do you think it means then?

**laughedatbytime** · November 28, 2018

I'll give them just as much credit as I give Billy Joel for "We didn't start the fire"

**laughedatbytime** · November 28, 2018

No f***ing clue, (although it would probably be worse if there was actual though twisted coherence behind it) it's just a name check of some of history's worst people (along with Yeltsin and Chamberlain for some reason), along with comments that have nothing to do with the evils they've sprung on the world to the tune of 9 figure casualties. Any side in the Kulturkampf someone who sides with a piece of shit like Castro is the wrong one. Hate the Nazis, sure. But there are other choices that aren't just as evil and sadistic.

it just seems like the musical equivalent of diarrhea thrown at a wall, framed, and hung in some art museum with an absurd origin story.

Edited November 28, 2018 by laughedatbytime

**Fridge** · November 28, 2018

In other words, you have no idea, which is what I thought.

To be fair, it does require a little research, and I've cut and pasted a little from various comments as well as adding my own.

Richey's (the songs writer) comments on this were : "Revol/Lover - All adolescent leaders of men FAILED. All love FAILS. If men of the calibre of Lenin and Trotsky failed, then how can anyone expect anything to change? Won't get fooled again."

Mr. Lenin - awaken the boy

Lenin, as the revolutionary leader of 1917, 'awakened' socialism/marxism

Mr. Stalin - bisexual epoch

Once again, love/sex symbolism is used - 'bisexual' refers not to Stalin's sexual orientation but his seemingly dualistic appearance.

Kruschev - self love in his mirrors

Kruschev, as Stalin's successor cultivated a different kind of image of himself. "Self-love in his mirrors" possibly refers to his apparent jocular approach in front of the cameras.

Brezhnev - married into group sex

Perhaps this refers to Brezhnev's interventionist foreign policy, more commonly known as "The Brezhnev doctrine" under which the Soviet Union reserved the right to intervene, with its Warsaw Pact allies, in the domestic affairs of satellite states in defense of socialism.

Gorbachev - celibate self importance

As president, Gorbachev witnessed the demise of the Soviet Union - his failure (which Richey drew upon) was his inability to prevent the breakup of his country into smaller independent states.

Yeltsin - failure is his own impotence

Economic meltdown, internal unrest, the reemergence of the communist party, and growing humiliation

All the other statements are analogies such as above....the idea is that all leaders and revolutions fail ultimately, there is no particular political allegiance

**laughedatbytime** · November 28, 2018

Thanks, though I was right about being better off not knowing. Give me Poundcake over this kind of obscurantist bullshit any day. Or Spinal Tap's analogies about taking the subject of sex and putting it on a farm. At least those were funny.

The caliber of Lenin and Trotsky? I guess murderers and looters do have things they're good at. As thinkers, not so much.

Edited November 28, 2018 by laughedatbytime

**Fridge** · November 28, 2018

You really need to get past your right-wing hard-on and accept that there is intelligent thinking behind ideologies you may not agree with.

**pjbear05** · November 28, 2018

I learned you can tune a piano but you can't tuna fish.

I learned everybody must get stoned.

I learned to turn out the lights when the music's over.

i learned you gotta fight for your right to party.

And most importantly, I learned that right now it's time to kick out the jams, motherf---er! :Alex: :geddy: :NP: :haz:

Edited November 28, 2018 by pjbear05

**laughedatbytime** · November 28, 2018

There is no intelligent thinking associated with Communism, just theft and butchery. That is not a right wing position, it is a sentient one. One which notices things like 100 million dead within 100 years because of it.

**Fordgalaxy** · November 28, 2018

That's not Communism any more than our government is a Democracy. It may have started as such, but somewhere along the way, the people in charge lost they minds.

**laughedatbytime** · November 28, 2018

Lenin wasn't a Communist? Mao wasn't a Communist? Lol pot wasn't a Communist? Castro wsnt a Communist?I

Even if you buy this silly argument, why do Communist regimes always devolve into murderous ones? Face it, the whole sick theory is based on theft.

**MalformedEarthborn** · November 29, 2018

"Lol Pot"

**laughedatbytime** · November 29, 2018

That was spell check. But it was definitely worth leaving that way.

**goose** · November 29, 2018

**laughedatbytime** · November 29, 2018

Even though their politics are diametrically opposed to mine their takedown of leftists who apologize for evil while living safe, comfortable lives far from those whose lives they're so sanguine about having ruined in the name of "progress" or "equality" is pure genius and even more relevant today. #resist #sjw :wacko:

**Fridge** · November 29, 2018

That was kind of the whole point of the song...not all the Revols/Lovers were Communists....the point is that every system fails or becomes something it wasn't supposed to due to human failings.

**Fridge** · November 29, 2018

No one is saying that the practical application of Communism is a good thing.

In theory it is a well-meaning bunch of twaddle which has no chance of working due to basic human nature...the withering away of the state described in Das Kapital would never happen in real life, and in fact has never happened....the initial application of Communism provides ideal conditions for the strong and ruthless to seize power.

Again, the song is not supporting Communism at all.

**bathory** · November 29, 2018

christ alfuckingmighty. move this thread to SOCN because mentioning the left gave this guy another forum-induced aneurysm

**bathory** · November 29, 2018

wasting your time

**laughedatbytime** · November 29, 2018

No, not all, but I don't see any reason to think that the ones I mentioned in the post above were not true believers, and the death and destruction they left is enough to discredit the system whether or not some who followed were only sadistic, power hungry opportunists.

**laughedatbytime** · November 29, 2018

Of course, true Communism as described in Marxist theory could never happen, being completely contrary to the nature of most humans. And I'll give you that it's twaddle.

But it ceases to be well-meaning the first time someone opposed to its precepts is forced into its circle. If someone voluntarily wants to submit to it, fine. But forcing it on others is far from well-meaning, it's abhorrent.

Learning from music

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