Peyton Manning

[liquidcrystalcompass]

Manning is the best passer under the current NFL rules. He runs the offense like no other QB of his time, and he does it with brains more than physical skill. He's the best of his generation, and among the best ever.

Not in big games he isn't.

[Slack jaw gaze]

Hit Manning and he will quit. He has a proven track record of it that people often turn a blind eye to.

Hit any quarterback and you will probably win. Ain't nobody a hall of famer with Decon Jones in his grill. I've seen every Peyton Manning game (save a handful) since 2001 and I've never seen this mythical "quit" that you seem to deduce from facial expressions I assume.

 

Browse the statistics here for absolutely no evidence to support your assertion.

Yes there is. It is his overall playoff record vs. his regular season one. In the regular season, his stats are undeniable. In the post season they are slightly less stellar. But in critical times in big games, you can rattle the man to the point he can't regroup. Take Manning out of his rhythm in a really big game and more cases than not, he won't recover. Maybe "quit" was the wrong word but in a sense it is the right one. He will quit playing to his potential when put in the circumstances I just stated. That is one of the reason why Brady owns him. Peyton is a HOF QB no doubt. He's just not the best nor should be mentioned with the best. Big games are the main reason why. I just don't like him being mentioned as the greatest of all time when he wasn't even the greatest in his own era.

Largest championship game comeback of all time.

 

New England Patriots @ Indianapolis Colts – January 21, 2007 - In what became the best rivalry of the early 21st century, the Colts were finally able to break the spell and beat New England in the playoffs, though they needed a miraculous return to do it. The Patriots took a 21-3 lead, while the Colts could only take it to 21-6 at halftime. Peyton Manning helped tie the game at 21 in the third quarter, and even as New England took the lead on three different occasions, the Colts persevered to win 38-34. It certainly was one of the best games in modern NFL history.

[liquidcrystalcompass]

Hit Manning and he will quit. He has a proven track record of it that people often turn a blind eye to.

Hit any quarterback and you will probably win. Ain't nobody a hall of famer with Decon Jones in his grill. I've seen every Peyton Manning game (save a handful) since 2001 and I've never seen this mythical "quit" that you seem to deduce from facial expressions I assume.

 

Browse the statistics here for absolutely no evidence to support your assertion.

Yes there is. It is his overall playoff record vs. his regular season one. In the regular season, his stats are undeniable. In the post season they are slightly less stellar. But in critical times in big games, you can rattle the man to the point he can't regroup. Take Manning out of his rhythm in a really big game and more cases than not, he won't recover. Maybe "quit" was the wrong word but in a sense it is the right one. He will quit playing to his potential when put in the circumstances I just stated. That is one of the reason why Brady owns him. Peyton is a HOF QB no doubt. He's just not the best nor should be mentioned with the best. Big games are the main reason why. I just don't like him being mentioned as the greatest of all time when he wasn't even the greatest in his own era.

Largest championship game comeback of all time.

 

New England Patriots @ Indianapolis Colts – January 21, 2007 - In what became the best rivalry of the early 21st century, the Colts were finally able to break the spell and beat New England in the playoffs, though they needed a miraculous return to do it. The Patriots took a 21-3 lead, while the Colts could only take it to 21-6 at halftime. Peyton Manning helped tie the game at 21 in the third quarter, and even as New England took the lead on three different occasions, the Colts persevered to win 38-34. It certainly was one of the best games in modern NFL history.

But more times than not, he got his ass kicked. A broken clock is right twice a day.

 

My point is that he shouldn't be in the conversation for the greatest of all time because he routinely sucks in the playoffs.

[LedRush]

Hit Manning and he will quit. He has a proven track record of it that people often turn a blind eye to.

Hit any quarterback and you will probably win. Ain't nobody a hall of famer with Decon Jones in his grill. I've seen every Peyton Manning game (save a handful) since 2001 and I've never seen this mythical "quit" that you seem to deduce from facial expressions I assume.

 

Browse the statistics here for absolutely no evidence to support your assertion.

Yes there is. It is his overall playoff record vs. his regular season one. In the regular season, his stats are undeniable. In the post season they are slightly less stellar. But in critical times in big games, you can rattle the man to the point he can't regroup. Take Manning out of his rhythm in a really big game and more cases than not, he won't recover. Maybe "quit" was the wrong word but in a sense it is the right one. He will quit playing to his potential when put in the circumstances I just stated. That is one of the reason why Brady owns him. Peyton is a HOF QB no doubt. He's just not the best nor should be mentioned with the best. Big games are the main reason why. I just don't like him being mentioned as the greatest of all time when he wasn't even the greatest in his own era.

Largest championship game comeback of all time.

 

New England Patriots @ Indianapolis Colts – January 21, 2007 - In what became the best rivalry of the early 21st century, the Colts were finally able to break the spell and beat New England in the playoffs, though they needed a miraculous return to do it. The Patriots took a 21-3 lead, while the Colts could only take it to 21-6 at halftime. Peyton Manning helped tie the game at 21 in the third quarter, and even as New England took the lead on three different occasions, the Colts persevered to win 38-34. It certainly was one of the best games in modern NFL history.

But more times than not, he got his ass kicked. A broken clock is right twice a day.

 

My point is that he shouldn't be in the conversation for the greatest of all time because he routinely sucks in the playoffs.

 

Yet he has a better playoff QBR than Brady, who routinely loses playoff games in which he is favored. So, in the current generation of QBs, who is better?

[Tombstone Mountain]

Most passing TDs, most passing yards by the time he hangs it up, seasonal record for all time TD passes by 5, most yards in a season, most career AV since 1950 7 straight 12 win seasons with not a lot of talent on defense. As a regular season QB, I don't think there's much question he's the greatest.

 

Mediocre at best playoff record knocks him out of contention for the all time greatest but still a top 5 QB all time.

Competition amps up x10 in post season. I think we can all say he's "must see TV" everytime he laces up the cleats. No one can win games by themselves

[Tombstone Mountain]

When in a physical game, where slobber-knockers are everywhere, Manning quietly loses.

 

All NFL games are physical. What you seem to be saying is when his team is on the business end of an ass-whipping his team loses. Yeah, that's kind of how football works.

 

Indeed.....Manning, Brady, Rodgers and Brees have all lost "physical" games in similar fashion; the opposing defenses get a strong pass rush. Too often these days, people say that a team has "shown the blueprint" for beating a certain QB. Well, that blueprint has been well-known for the past 40 years; it's a good, strong pass rush.

 

Every defense plays physical football, but some defenses are better at it than others. The better defenses can beat the great QB's of today's pass-happy game.

 

I agree 1 billion percent (does that exist?). Nothing makes me angrier than seeing the Patriots slightly ahead late in the game and seeing Brady in the shotgun on first down. Last year in the playoffs LeGarrett Blount gashes the Colts for 200 yards, the next week he didn't need his helmet. Want to slow a pass rush down? Run the ball effectively. Want to make a marquee QB better? Run the ball effectively.

Matlock speaks the "truuf". I'm thinking Blount is ready to make a dent into some defenses.

 

I still think about him decking dude from Boise State. I think teeth came out from that punch. You don't talk shit to Blount. Bad move

[liquidcrystalcompass]

Hit Manning and he will quit. He has a proven track record of it that people often turn a blind eye to.

Hit any quarterback and you will probably win. Ain't nobody a hall of famer with Decon Jones in his grill. I've seen every Peyton Manning game (save a handful) since 2001 and I've never seen this mythical "quit" that you seem to deduce from facial expressions I assume.

 

Browse the statistics here for absolutely no evidence to support your assertion.

Yes there is. It is his overall playoff record vs. his regular season one. In the regular season, his stats are undeniable. In the post season they are slightly less stellar. But in critical times in big games, you can rattle the man to the point he can't regroup. Take Manning out of his rhythm in a really big game and more cases than not, he won't recover. Maybe "quit" was the wrong word but in a sense it is the right one. He will quit playing to his potential when put in the circumstances I just stated. That is one of the reason why Brady owns him. Peyton is a HOF QB no doubt. He's just not the best nor should be mentioned with the best. Big games are the main reason why. I just don't like him being mentioned as the greatest of all time when he wasn't even the greatest in his own era.

Largest championship game comeback of all time.

 

New England Patriots @ Indianapolis Colts – January 21, 2007 - In what became the best rivalry of the early 21st century, the Colts were finally able to break the spell and beat New England in the playoffs, though they needed a miraculous return to do it. The Patriots took a 21-3 lead, while the Colts could only take it to 21-6 at halftime. Peyton Manning helped tie the game at 21 in the third quarter, and even as New England took the lead on three different occasions, the Colts persevered to win 38-34. It certainly was one of the best games in modern NFL history.

But more times than not, he got his ass kicked. A broken clock is right twice a day.

 

My point is that he shouldn't be in the conversation for the greatest of all time because he routinely sucks in the playoffs.

 

Yet he has a better playoff QBR than Brady, who routinely loses playoff games in which he is favored. So, in the current generation of QBs, who is better?

The one with all of the rings and more playoff wins than any other QB in the history of the game. Not the one with a sub .500 playoff record.

[LedRush]

Hit Manning and he will quit. He has a proven track record of it that people often turn a blind eye to.

Hit any quarterback and you will probably win. Ain't nobody a hall of famer with Decon Jones in his grill. I've seen every Peyton Manning game (save a handful) since 2001 and I've never seen this mythical "quit" that you seem to deduce from facial exp<b></b>ressions I assume.

 

Browse the statistics here for absolutely no evidence to support your assertion.

Yes there is. It is his overall playoff record vs. his regular season one. In the regular season, his stats are undeniable. In the post season they are slightly less stellar. But in critical times in big games, you can rattle the man to the point he can't regroup. Take Manning out of his rhythm in a really big game and more cases than not, he won't recover. Maybe "quit" was the wrong word but in a sense it is the right one. He will quit playing to his potential when put in the circumstances I just stated. That is one of the reason why Brady owns him. Peyton is a HOF QB no doubt. He's just not the best nor should be mentioned with the best. Big games are the main reason why. I just don't like him being mentioned as the greatest of all time when he wasn't even the greatest in his own era.

Largest championship game comeback of all time.

 

New England Patriots @ Indianapolis Colts – January 21, 2007 - In what became the best rivalry of the early 21st century, the Colts were finally able to break the spell and beat New England in the playoffs, though they needed a miraculous return to do it. The Patriots took a 21-3 lead, while the Colts could only take it to 21-6 at halftime. Peyton Manning helped tie the game at 21 in the third quarter, and even as New England took the lead on three different occasions, the Colts persevered to win 38-34. It certainly was one of the best games in modern NFL history.

But more times than not, he got his ass kicked. A broken clock is right twice a day.

 

My point is that he shouldn't be in the conversation for the greatest of all time because he routinely sucks in the playoffs.

 

Yet he has a better playoff QBR than Brady, who routinely loses playoff games in which he is favored. So, in the current generation of QBs, who is better?

The one with all of the rings and more playoff wins than any other QB in the history of the game. Not the one with a sub .500 playoff record.

 

Ok, so you're in the "Terry Bradshaw" is the second best QB of all time camp of people who ignore actual gameplay.

[Rick N. Backer]

Hit Manning and he will quit. He has a proven track record of it that people often turn a blind eye to.

Hit any quarterback and you will probably win. Ain't nobody a hall of famer with Decon Jones in his grill. I've seen every Peyton Manning game (save a handful) since 2001 and I've never seen this mythical "quit" that you seem to deduce from facial expressions I assume.

 

Browse the statistics here for absolutely no evidence to support your assertion.

Yes there is. It is his overall playoff record vs. his regular season one. In the regular season, his stats are undeniable. In the post season they are slightly less stellar. But in critical times in big games, you can rattle the man to the point he can't regroup. Take Manning out of his rhythm in a really big game and more cases than not, he won't recover. Maybe "quit" was the wrong word but in a sense it is the right one. He will quit playing to his potential when put in the circumstances I just stated. That is one of the reason why Brady owns him. Peyton is a HOF QB no doubt. He's just not the best nor should be mentioned with the best. Big games are the main reason why. I just don't like him being mentioned as the greatest of all time when he wasn't even the greatest in his own era.

Largest championship game comeback of all time.

 

New England Patriots @ Indianapolis Colts – January 21, 2007 - In what became the best rivalry of the early 21st century, the Colts were finally able to break the spell and beat New England in the playoffs, though they needed a miraculous return to do it. The Patriots took a 21-3 lead, while the Colts could only take it to 21-6 at halftime. Peyton Manning helped tie the game at 21 in the third quarter, and even as New England took the lead on three different occasions, the Colts persevered to win 38-34. It certainly was one of the best games in modern NFL history.

But more times than not, he got his ass kicked. A broken clock is right twice a day.

 

My point is that he shouldn't be in the conversation for the greatest of all time because he routinely sucks in the playoffs.

 

Yet he has a better playoff QBR than Brady, who routinely loses playoff games in which he is favored. So, in the current generation of QBs, who is better?

 

Brady. He's been to 5 Super Bowls, two of which occurred with teams that had sieve like defenses. He's won 3 of them (guess which teams didn't have sieve like defenses?). He was the MVP of 2 of them, and engineered game winning drives in both of them. If they play up to their potential he'll be making his fourth straight trip to the AFC Championship, having already played in 7 of them during his career. Can you name another team that was a playoff team in 2001, and has been there every year since then, except one? "Coincidentally," the year that Brady was recovering from knee surgery was the year they missed the playoffs. And, while I know that teams not players win football games, what other constant, besides Belichick, is there for the Patriots from 2001 to the present? And what was the Patriots' record in the first two weeks of 2001, when Drew Bledsoe was the quarterback of the team that won Super Bowl 36?

 

Brady's a man, so he isn't perfect. Looking at their careers, however, if I need to win one game, I'm taking Brady every time over Manning. I get that I'm biased, but I'm from the camp that doesn't think fantasy stats are the measuring stick for greatness.

[liquidcrystalcompass]

Hit Manning and he will quit. He has a proven track record of it that people often turn a blind eye to.

Hit any quarterback and you will probably win. Ain't nobody a hall of famer with Decon Jones in his grill. I've seen every Peyton Manning game (save a handful) since 2001 and I've never seen this mythical "quit" that you seem to deduce from facial expressions I assume.

 

Browse the statistics here for absolutely no evidence to support your assertion.

Yes there is. It is his overall playoff record vs. his regular season one. In the regular season, his stats are undeniable. In the post season they are slightly less stellar. But in critical times in big games, you can rattle the man to the point he can't regroup. Take Manning out of his rhythm in a really big game and more cases than not, he won't recover. Maybe "quit" was the wrong word but in a sense it is the right one. He will quit playing to his potential when put in the circumstances I just stated. That is one of the reason why Brady owns him. Peyton is a HOF QB no doubt. He's just not the best nor should be mentioned with the best. Big games are the main reason why. I just don't like him being mentioned as the greatest of all time when he wasn't even the greatest in his own era.

Largest championship game comeback of all time.

 

New England Patriots @ Indianapolis Colts – January 21, 2007 - In what became the best rivalry of the early 21st century, the Colts were finally able to break the spell and beat New England in the playoffs, though they needed a miraculous return to do it. The Patriots took a 21-3 lead, while the Colts could only take it to 21-6 at halftime. Peyton Manning helped tie the game at 21 in the third quarter, and even as New England took the lead on three different occasions, the Colts persevered to win 38-34. It certainly was one of the best games in modern NFL history.

But more times than not, he got his ass kicked. A broken clock is right twice a day.

 

My point is that he shouldn't be in the conversation for the greatest of all time because he routinely sucks in the playoffs.

 

Yet he has a better playoff QBR than Brady, who routinely loses playoff games in which he is favored. So, in the current generation of QBs, who is better?

 

Brady. He's been to 5 Super Bowls, two of which occurred with teams that had sieve like defenses. He's won 3 of them (guess which teams didn't have sieve like defenses?). He was the MVP of 2 of them, and engineered game winning drives in both of them. If they play up to their potential he'll be making his fourth straight trip to the AFC Championship, having already played in 7 of them during his career. Can you name another team that was a playoff team in 2001, and has been there every year since then, except one? "Coincidentally," the year that Brady was recovering from knee surgery was the year they missed the playoffs. And, while I know that teams not players win football games, what other constant, besides Belichick, is there for the Patriots from 2001 to the present? And what was the Patriots' record in the first two weeks of 2001, when Drew Bledsoe was the quarterback of the team that won Super Bowl 36?

 

Brady's a man, so he isn't perfect. Looking at their careers, however, if I need to win one game, I'm taking Brady every time over Manning. I get that I'm biased, but I'm from the camp that doesn't think fantasy stats are the measuring stick for greatness.

This is my point exactly. Brady (and others) are much better big game players. Manning can fold under pressure. A year ago, I bet against Denver when they went to Indianapolis. Why? Because I knew the pressure would get to him.

[LedRush]

Hit Manning and he will quit. He has a proven track record of it that people often turn a blind eye to.

Hit any quarterback and you will probably win. Ain't nobody a hall of famer with Decon Jones in his grill. I've seen every Peyton Manning game (save a handful) since 2001 and I've never seen this mythical "quit" that you seem to deduce from facial expressions I assume.

 

Browse the statistics here for absolutely no evidence to support your assertion.

Yes there is. It is his overall playoff record vs. his regular season one. In the regular season, his stats are undeniable. In the post season they are slightly less stellar. But in critical times in big games, you can rattle the man to the point he can't regroup. Take Manning out of his rhythm in a really big game and more cases than not, he won't recover. Maybe "quit" was the wrong word but in a sense it is the right one. He will quit playing to his potential when put in the circumstances I just stated. That is one of the reason why Brady owns him. Peyton is a HOF QB no doubt. He's just not the best nor should be mentioned with the best. Big games are the main reason why. I just don't like him being mentioned as the greatest of all time when he wasn't even the greatest in his own era.

Largest championship game comeback of all time.

 

New England Patriots @ Indianapolis Colts – January 21, 2007 - In what became the best rivalry of the early 21st century, the Colts were finally able to break the spell and beat New England in the playoffs, though they needed a miraculous return to do it. The Patriots took a 21-3 lead, while the Colts could only take it to 21-6 at halftime. Peyton Manning helped tie the game at 21 in the third quarter, and even as New England took the lead on three different occasions, the Colts persevered to win 38-34. It certainly was one of the best games in modern NFL history.

But more times than not, he got his ass kicked. A broken clock is right twice a day.

 

My point is that he shouldn't be in the conversation for the greatest of all time because he routinely sucks in the playoffs.

 

Yet he has a better playoff QBR than Brady, who routinely loses playoff games in which he is favored. So, in the current generation of QBs, who is better?

 

Brady. He's been to 5 Super Bowls, two of which occurred with teams that had sieve like defenses. He's won 3 of them (guess which teams didn't have sieve like defenses?). He was the MVP of 2 of them, and engineered game winning drives in both of them. If they play up to their potential he'll be making his fourth straight trip to the AFC Championship, having already played in 7 of them during his career. Can you name another team that was a playoff team in 2001, and has been there every year since then, except one? "Coincidentally," the year that Brady was recovering from knee surgery was the year they missed the playoffs. And, while I know that teams not players win football games, what other constant, besides Belichick, is there for the Patriots from 2001 to the present? And what was the Patriots' record in the first two weeks of 2001, when Drew Bledsoe was the quarterback of the team that won Super Bowl 36?

 

Brady's a man, so he isn't perfect. Looking at their careers, however, if I need to win one game, I'm taking Brady every time over Manning. I get that I'm biased, but I'm from the camp that doesn't think fantasy stats are the measuring stick for greatness.

This is my point exactly. Brady (and others) are much better big game players. Manning can fold under pressure. A year ago, I bet against Denver when they went to Indianapolis. Why? Because I knew the pressure would get to him.

 

As I've mentioned before, I'm sure the fact that I missed the NFL from 2000-2004 taints my image of the rivalry as I've never seen Brady win. All I know from him is that virtually every year the season ends with him coming up very small in a game they should have won. He is a system QB who benefits from great coaching and great fundamentals around him. Take him off the team and replace him with a below average QB, and the team goes 10-6 anyway. Take Manning off of his team (which is far more dependent on his success) and they become a 1-15 nightmare.

 

Luck is going to be in the same type of position Manning is. He elevates below average teams and virtually wills them into the playoffs by himself. But they won't have enough to win it all until they get more physical in the trenches and get more talent around him. He's going to end up with great numbers and a lot of playoff losses that aren't his fault. Let's just hope we won't have to suffer people arguing how Wilson is a better QB than Luck because of his big game-ability.

[Rick N. Backer]

Hit Manning and he will quit. He has a proven track record of it that people often turn a blind eye to.

Hit any quarterback and you will probably win. Ain't nobody a hall of famer with Decon Jones in his grill. I've seen every Peyton Manning game (save a handful) since 2001 and I've never seen this mythical "quit" that you seem to deduce from facial expressions I assume.

 

Browse the statistics here for absolutely no evidence to support your assertion.

Yes there is. It is his overall playoff record vs. his regular season one. In the regular season, his stats are undeniable. In the post season they are slightly less stellar. But in critical times in big games, you can rattle the man to the point he can't regroup. Take Manning out of his rhythm in a really big game and more cases than not, he won't recover. Maybe "quit" was the wrong word but in a sense it is the right one. He will quit playing to his potential when put in the circumstances I just stated. That is one of the reason why Brady owns him. Peyton is a HOF QB no doubt. He's just not the best nor should be mentioned with the best. Big games are the main reason why. I just don't like him being mentioned as the greatest of all time when he wasn't even the greatest in his own era.

Largest championship game comeback of all time.

 

New England Patriots @ Indianapolis Colts – January 21, 2007 - In what became the best rivalry of the early 21st century, the Colts were finally able to break the spell and beat New England in the playoffs, though they needed a miraculous return to do it. The Patriots took a 21-3 lead, while the Colts could only take it to 21-6 at halftime. Peyton Manning helped tie the game at 21 in the third quarter, and even as New England took the lead on three different occasions, the Colts persevered to win 38-34. It certainly was one of the best games in modern NFL history.

But more times than not, he got his ass kicked. A broken clock is right twice a day.

 

My point is that he shouldn't be in the conversation for the greatest of all time because he routinely sucks in the playoffs.

 

Yet he has a better playoff QBR than Brady, who routinely loses playoff games in which he is favored. So, in the current generation of QBs, who is better?

 

Brady. He's been to 5 Super Bowls, two of which occurred with teams that had sieve like defenses. He's won 3 of them (guess which teams didn't have sieve like defenses?). He was the MVP of 2 of them, and engineered game winning drives in both of them. If they play up to their potential he'll be making his fourth straight trip to the AFC Championship, having already played in 7 of them during his career. Can you name another team that was a playoff team in 2001, and has been there every year since then, except one? "Coincidentally," the year that Brady was recovering from knee surgery was the year they missed the playoffs. And, while I know that teams not players win football games, what other constant, besides Belichick, is there for the Patriots from 2001 to the present? And what was the Patriots' record in the first two weeks of 2001, when Drew Bledsoe was the quarterback of the team that won Super Bowl 36?

 

Brady's a man, so he isn't perfect. Looking at their careers, however, if I need to win one game, I'm taking Brady every time over Manning. I get that I'm biased, but I'm from the camp that doesn't think fantasy stats are the measuring stick for greatness.

This is my point exactly. Brady (and others) are much better big game players. Manning can fold under pressure. A year ago, I bet against Denver when they went to Indianapolis. Why? Because I knew the pressure would get to him.

 

As I've mentioned before, I'm sure the fact that I missed the NFL from 2000-2004 taints my image of the rivalry as I've never seen Brady win. All I know from him is that virtually every year the season ends with him coming up very small in a game they should have won. He is a system QB who benefits from great coaching and great fundamentals around him. Take him off the team and replace him with a below average QB, and the team goes 10-6 anyway. Take Manning off of his team (which is far more dependent on his success) and they become a 1-15 nightmare.

 

Luck is going to be in the same type of position Manning is. He elevates below average teams and virtually wills them into the playoffs by himself. But they won't have enough to win it all until they get more physical in the trenches and get more talent around him. He's going to end up with great numbers and a lot of playoff losses that aren't his fault. Let's just hope we won't have to suffer people arguing how Wilson is a better QB than Luck because of his big game-ability.

 

If we're talking about a player's greatness though, isn't how they perform in the post season more important than how they play in November?

 

It's all about perspective I guess. In my mind Brady has been the principal reason some very flawed Patriots' teams have gotten to many of those big games. Richard Seymour pulls Eli Manning to the ground, Assante Samuel holds on to the football that hits him in the hands, Rodney Harrison keeps David Tyree from catching a football with his helmet, and we're not having this conversation. And Brady is the MVP of the Super Bowl where the Patriots go 19-0, having engineered a 3rd game winning drive in the fourth quarter.

[LedRush]

Hit Manning and he will quit. He has a proven track record of it that people often turn a blind eye to.

Hit any quarterback and you will probably win. Ain't nobody a hall of famer with Decon Jones in his grill. I've seen every Peyton Manning game (save a handful) since 2001 and I've never seen this mythical "quit" that you seem to deduce from facial expressions I assume.

 

Browse the statistics here for absolutely no evidence to support your assertion.

Yes there is. It is his overall playoff record vs. his regular season one. In the regular season, his stats are undeniable. In the post season they are slightly less stellar. But in critical times in big games, you can rattle the man to the point he can't regroup. Take Manning out of his rhythm in a really big game and more cases than not, he won't recover. Maybe "quit" was the wrong word but in a sense it is the right one. He will quit playing to his potential when put in the circumstances I just stated. That is one of the reason why Brady owns him. Peyton is a HOF QB no doubt. He's just not the best nor should be mentioned with the best. Big games are the main reason why. I just don't like him being mentioned as the greatest of all time when he wasn't even the greatest in his own era.

Largest championship game comeback of all time.

 

New England Patriots @ Indianapolis Colts – January 21, 2007 - In what became the best rivalry of the early 21st century, the Colts were finally able to break the spell and beat New England in the playoffs, though they needed a miraculous return to do it. The Patriots took a 21-3 lead, while the Colts could only take it to 21-6 at halftime. Peyton Manning helped tie the game at 21 in the third quarter, and even as New England took the lead on three different occasions, the Colts persevered to win 38-34. It certainly was one of the best games in modern NFL history.

But more times than not, he got his ass kicked. A broken clock is right twice a day.

 

My point is that he shouldn't be in the conversation for the greatest of all time because he routinely sucks in the playoffs.

 

Yet he has a better playoff QBR than Brady, who routinely loses playoff games in which he is favored. So, in the current generation of QBs, who is better?

 

Brady. He's been to 5 Super Bowls, two of which occurred with teams that had sieve like defenses. He's won 3 of them (guess which teams didn't have sieve like defenses?). He was the MVP of 2 of them, and engineered game winning drives in both of them. If they play up to their potential he'll be making his fourth straight trip to the AFC Championship, having already played in 7 of them during his career. Can you name another team that was a playoff team in 2001, and has been there every year since then, except one? "Coincidentally," the year that Brady was recovering from knee surgery was the year they missed the playoffs. And, while I know that teams not players win football games, what other constant, besides Belichick, is there for the Patriots from 2001 to the present? And what was the Patriots' record in the first two weeks of 2001, when Drew Bledsoe was the quarterback of the team that won Super Bowl 36?

 

Brady's a man, so he isn't perfect. Looking at their careers, however, if I need to win one game, I'm taking Brady every time over Manning. I get that I'm biased, but I'm from the camp that doesn't think fantasy stats are the measuring stick for greatness.

This is my point exactly. Brady (and others) are much better big game players. Manning can fold under pressure. A year ago, I bet against Denver when they went to Indianapolis. Why? Because I knew the pressure would get to him.

 

As I've mentioned before, I'm sure the fact that I missed the NFL from 2000-2004 taints my image of the rivalry as I've never seen Brady win. All I know from him is that virtually every year the season ends with him coming up very small in a game they should have won. He is a system QB who benefits from great coaching and great fundamentals around him. Take him off the team and replace him with a below average QB, and the team goes 10-6 anyway. Take Manning off of his team (which is far more dependent on his success) and they become a 1-15 nightmare.

 

Luck is going to be in the same type of position Manning is. He elevates below average teams and virtually wills them into the playoffs by himself. But they won't have enough to win it all until they get more physical in the trenches and get more talent around him. He's going to end up with great numbers and a lot of playoff losses that aren't his fault. Let's just hope we won't have to suffer people arguing how Wilson is a better QB than Luck because of his big game-ability.

 

If we're talking about a player's greatness though, isn't how they perform in the post season more important than how they play in November?

 

It's all about perspective I guess. In my mind Brady has been the principal reason some very flawed Patriots' teams have gotten to many of those big games. Richard Seymour pulls Eli Manning to the ground, Assante Samuel holds on to the football that hits him in the hands, Rodney Harrison keeps David Tyree from catching a football with his helmet, and we're not having this conversation. And Brady is the MVP of the Super Bowl where the Patriots go 19-0, having engineered a 3rd game winning drive in the fourth quarter.

 

And the same amount of ifs happen, and we're talking about a QB who lost 4 SBs (because he would've reached 1 less) and is relegated to Jim Kelley level of greatness (which is much closer to where Brady belongs, though I admit he's better).

[Rick N. Backer]

Hit Manning and he will quit. He has a proven track record of it that people often turn a blind eye to.

Hit any quarterback and you will probably win. Ain't nobody a hall of famer with Decon Jones in his grill. I've seen every Peyton Manning game (save a handful) since 2001 and I've never seen this mythical "quit" that you seem to deduce from facial expressions I assume.

 

Browse the statistics here for absolutely no evidence to support your assertion.

Yes there is. It is his overall playoff record vs. his regular season one. In the regular season, his stats are undeniable. In the post season they are slightly less stellar. But in critical times in big games, you can rattle the man to the point he can't regroup. Take Manning out of his rhythm in a really big game and more cases than not, he won't recover. Maybe "quit" was the wrong word but in a sense it is the right one. He will quit playing to his potential when put in the circumstances I just stated. That is one of the reason why Brady owns him. Peyton is a HOF QB no doubt. He's just not the best nor should be mentioned with the best. Big games are the main reason why. I just don't like him being mentioned as the greatest of all time when he wasn't even the greatest in his own era.

Largest championship game comeback of all time.

 

New England Patriots @ Indianapolis Colts – January 21, 2007 - In what became the best rivalry of the early 21st century, the Colts were finally able to break the spell and beat New England in the playoffs, though they needed a miraculous return to do it. The Patriots took a 21-3 lead, while the Colts could only take it to 21-6 at halftime. Peyton Manning helped tie the game at 21 in the third quarter, and even as New England took the lead on three different occasions, the Colts persevered to win 38-34. It certainly was one of the best games in modern NFL history.

But more times than not, he got his ass kicked. A broken clock is right twice a day.

 

My point is that he shouldn't be in the conversation for the greatest of all time because he routinely sucks in the playoffs.

 

Yet he has a better playoff QBR than Brady, who routinely loses playoff games in which he is favored. So, in the current generation of QBs, who is better?

 

Brady. He's been to 5 Super Bowls, two of which occurred with teams that had sieve like defenses. He's won 3 of them (guess which teams didn't have sieve like defenses?). He was the MVP of 2 of them, and engineered game winning drives in both of them. If they play up to their potential he'll be making his fourth straight trip to the AFC Championship, having already played in 7 of them during his career. Can you name another team that was a playoff team in 2001, and has been there every year since then, except one? "Coincidentally," the year that Brady was recovering from knee surgery was the year they missed the playoffs. And, while I know that teams not players win football games, what other constant, besides Belichick, is there for the Patriots from 2001 to the present? And what was the Patriots' record in the first two weeks of 2001, when Drew Bledsoe was the quarterback of the team that won Super Bowl 36?

 

Brady's a man, so he isn't perfect. Looking at their careers, however, if I need to win one game, I'm taking Brady every time over Manning. I get that I'm biased, but I'm from the camp that doesn't think fantasy stats are the measuring stick for greatness.

This is my point exactly. Brady (and others) are much better big game players. Manning can fold under pressure. A year ago, I bet against Denver when they went to Indianapolis. Why? Because I knew the pressure would get to him.

 

As I've mentioned before, I'm sure the fact that I missed the NFL from 2000-2004 taints my image of the rivalry as I've never seen Brady win. All I know from him is that virtually every year the season ends with him coming up very small in a game they should have won. He is a system QB who benefits from great coaching and great fundamentals around him. Take him off the team and replace him with a below average QB, and the team goes 10-6 anyway. Take Manning off of his team (which is far more dependent on his success) and they become a 1-15 nightmare.

 

Luck is going to be in the same type of position Manning is. He elevates below average teams and virtually wills them into the playoffs by himself. But they won't have enough to win it all until they get more physical in the trenches and get more talent around him. He's going to end up with great numbers and a lot of playoff losses that aren't his fault. Let's just hope we won't have to suffer people arguing how Wilson is a better QB than Luck because of his big game-ability.

 

If we're talking about a player's greatness though, isn't how they perform in the post season more important than how they play in November?

 

It's all about perspective I guess. In my mind Brady has been the principal reason some very flawed Patriots' teams have gotten to many of those big games. Richard Seymour pulls Eli Manning to the ground, Assante Samuel holds on to the football that hits him in the hands, Rodney Harrison keeps David Tyree from catching a football with his helmet, and we're not having this conversation. And Brady is the MVP of the Super Bowl where the Patriots go 19-0, having engineered a 3rd game winning drive in the fourth quarter.

 

And the same amount of ifs happen, and we're talking about a QB who lost 4 SBs (because he would've reached 1 less) and is relegated to Jim Kelley level of greatness (which is much closer to where Brady belongs, though I admit he's better).

 

Maybe. But you could say the same thing about every player who plays a team game, a couple of things go a different way and their legacy is completely changed.

 

And for the record, I think Kelly deserves to be considered one of the greatest ever. Ultimately, he helped get his team to 4 straight Super Bowls.

[Turbine Freight]

In a do or die game I'd take Brady over Peyton every time.

 

 

Shame about the Ugg boots though.

[Slack jaw gaze]

The Skip Bayless line of reasoning ends with Trent Dilfer is better than Dan Marino. (He is...as an analyst)

[Principled Man]

But you could say the same thing about every player who plays a team game, a couple of things go a different way and their legacy is completely changed.

 

And for the record, I think Kelly deserves to be considered one of the greatest ever. Ultimately, he helped get his team to 4 straight Super Bowls.

 

And Buffalo's lousy defense helped lose three of those Super Bowls. What a shame for Jim Kelly, who doesn't play defense. He stood there on the sidelines, watching his defense lose three Super Bowls, and there was nothing he could have done to prevent it.

 

No, wait. An "elite" quarterback is supposed to win every game. When his defense gives up 50 points, he's supposed to score 60...all by himself. If he doesn't, he'll be blamed for each and every loss, and 20 years later, fans will be demoting him to second-tier QB status...... :crazy:

[laughedatbytime]

But you could say the same thing about every player who plays a team game, a couple of things go a different way and their legacy is completely changed.

 

And for the record, I think Kelly deserves to be considered one of the greatest ever. Ultimately, he helped get his team to 4 straight Super Bowls.

 

And Buffalo's lousy defense helped lose three of those Super Bowls. What a shame for Jim Kelly, who doesn't play defense. He stood there on the sidelines, watching his defense lose three Super Bowls, and there was nothing he could have done to prevent it.

 

No, wait. An "elite" quarterback is supposed to win every game. When his defense gives up 50 points, he's supposed to score 60...all by himself. If he doesn't, he'll be blamed for each and every loss, and 20 years later, fans will be demoting him to second-tier QB status...... :crazy:

If Scott Norwood was a better kicker, Jim Kelly would have been a much greater QB.

[liquidcrystalcompass]

Bottom line. Peyton Manning is not at his best in the playoffs.

[liquidcrystalcompass]

Nuff said.

[Rick N. Backer]

I heard this morning that he has 9 "1 and done" playoff appearances.

[nappy2112]

I heard this morning that he has 9 "1 and done" playoff appearances.

 

Great something for Andy Dalton to shoot for. :D

 

As far as Manning , they just shut them down the same way they shut down Cincy...hell it looked like the same game.

[Principled Man]

I heard this morning that he has 9 "1 and done" playoff appearances.

 

1999 - #2 Seed. Lost to Tennessee, 19-16

2000 - #6 Seed. Lost to Miami, 23-17 (OT)

2002 - #5 Seed. Lost to NY Jets, 41-0

2005 - #3 Seed. Lost to Pittsburgh, 21-18

2007 - #2 Seed. Lost to San Diego, 28-24

2008 - #5 Seed. Lost to San Diego, 23-17 (OT)

2010 - #3 Seed. Lost to NY Jets, 17-16

2012 - #1 Seed. Lost to Baltimore, 38-35 (2OT)

2014 - #2 Seed. Lost to Indianapolis, 24-13

 

2006 - Super Bowl Champions - Defeated the Chicago Bears

2009 - Super Bowl - Lost to New Orleans

2013 - Super Bowl - Lost to Seattle

 

With a better defense in certain years, Manning's post-season record would look quite different.

[Narps]

Personally I think he is done. His arm is dead and it has been painfully obvious. No matter how much you love and know the game, dinking and dunking all day won't get it done it that league...

[LedRush]

Personally I think he is done. His arm is dead and it has been painfully obvious. No matter how much you love and know the game, dinking and dunking all day won't get it done it that league...

 

The torn quad didn't help, but he looked like he was tired and tapering off before that happened.