marblesmike Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 (edited) QUOTE (losingit2k @ Jun 13 2012, 11:25 AM) QUOTE (marblesmike @ Jun 13 2012, 08:45 AM) QUOTE (losingit2k @ Jun 13 2012, 09:29 AM) QUOTE (The Mighty Dudad @ Jun 13 2012, 08:00 AM) I am not an audiophile, nor do I care to be one (IMO they seem to spend more time looking for flaws than enjoying the music). On my decent but far from spectacular home system, Clockwork Angels sounds great! That's my point exactly. They are more consumed with finding cracks in the armor than actually enjoying it for all its great qualitites. I'm fed up with it! It's time to call it for what it is: A systematic disruption of Modern RUSH! While I admire your enthusiasm (I don't think I've ever seen anyone use exclamation points as vigorously as you do!!!!!!!!) you need to realize that some people try to be objective, even about their favorite bands. I love Rush, I have all their albums, dvds, blu-rays, etc, and have seen them more times than any other band. However, I'm allowed to be disappointed with a FACET of their new album. It doesn't make me any less of a fan than you. I love the material, and think it is the most consistent effort they've done in years, which makes it even more disappointing to me that the sound quality of this album isn't up to par with some of the 80s output. This is a legitimate gripe, and it has the numbers and algorithms behind it to support it. It deserves to be better. With that being said, if you like the way it sounds and don't have any complaints, then great, I'm happy for you and slightly envious that you haven't been cursed with ears as sensitive as mine. But don't belittle me and others who want to objectively discuss something. You're entitled to your opinion that CA sounds great, and I'm entitled to mine. If this is being a troll, then so be, I'll sit under my bridge and be a troll. Oh, and to be honest, I think most people who are less than happy with the sonics of CA have said they love the material. So I don't know why some people are getting their thongs all up in a bunch. Clockwork Angels sounds spectacular and I would compare my hearing to yours any day of the week! I don't need any algorithms to know that this is RUSH finest effort since the early 80's! Being musically great and sonically great are two separate things. So you think CA SOUNDS better than CP, or HYF, or PoW? Edited June 13, 2012 by marblesmike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmotionDetector Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 Whatever, I do agree with the OP that the sound could definitely be better. The songs are great no doubt...but the sound is harsh at times. Definitely not at all to the horrendous levels of VT...but S&A's sound on CA would've put CA over the top as far as how fantastic it is. Again...I absolutely love the album, but I can see the OP's point-of-view as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmotionDetector Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 QUOTE (Del_Duio @ Jun 13 2012, 08:01 AM) QUOTE (treeduck @ Jun 13 2012, 05:34 AM) Thing is Grundman is probably the most storied mastering guy out there, and he does a lot of modern jazz stuff which never sounds brick walled, red lined, compressed or Vapor Trailed... http://albumcredits.com/bernie.grundman#/P...sicAlbums/82657 Hahaha, I wonder if Vapor Trailed is part of the "Sound Engineering Terminology Handbook" now. Love it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Majestyk Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 (edited) I'm afraid many on the stevehoffman forum are saying the same thing. I don't have the CD yet but I'm already disappointed because I know many of the folks over there know what they're talking about. Fortunately the HDTracks are supposed to sound a little better and the vinyl is supposed to sound even better than that. So I'm going to buy the CD AND one day download a vinyl rip when available. Edited June 13, 2012 by Majestyk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Majestyk Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 QUOTE For people who struggle with hearing "sound quality" maybe this will help them? I'm assuming you have seen HIGH DEF tv, and remember what tv used to look like ? Well, our ears can HEAR what your eyes SEE. OR... have you ever seen a well done 3D movie and you can see the DEPTH, etc. thats our ears. Just trying to help those who honestly don't understand WHY sound quality matters to us.... thanks I think the best way to single out true audiophiles is to get them to listen to a DVD from a PAL source vs one from an NTSC source. If they can easily hear the PAL speedup, then they are probably an audiophile or on the road to being one. I can hear PAL speedup right off the bat and it drives me nuts. Most don't hear it at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
losingit2k Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 QUOTE (marblesmike @ Jun 13 2012, 10:31 AM) QUOTE (losingit2k @ Jun 13 2012, 11:25 AM) QUOTE (marblesmike @ Jun 13 2012, 08:45 AM) QUOTE (losingit2k @ Jun 13 2012, 09:29 AM) QUOTE (The Mighty Dudad @ Jun 13 2012, 08:00 AM) I am not an audiophile, nor do I care to be one (IMO they seem to spend more time looking for flaws than enjoying the music). On my decent but far from spectacular home system, Clockwork Angels sounds great! That's my point exactly. They are more consumed with finding cracks in the armor than actually enjoying it for all its great qualitites. I'm fed up with it! It's time to call it for what it is: A systematic disruption of Modern RUSH! While I admire your enthusiasm (I don't think I've ever seen anyone use exclamation points as vigorously as you do!!!!!!!!) you need to realize that some people try to be objective, even about their favorite bands. I love Rush, I have all their albums, dvds, blu-rays, etc, and have seen them more times than any other band. However, I'm allowed to be disappointed with a FACET of their new album. It doesn't make me any less of a fan than you. I love the material, and think it is the most consistent effort they've done in years, which makes it even more disappointing to me that the sound quality of this album isn't up to par with some of the 80s output. This is a legitimate gripe, and it has the numbers and algorithms behind it to support it. It deserves to be better. With that being said, if you like the way it sounds and don't have any complaints, then great, I'm happy for you and slightly envious that you haven't been cursed with ears as sensitive as mine. But don't belittle me and others who want to objectively discuss something. You're entitled to your opinion that CA sounds great, and I'm entitled to mine. If this is being a troll, then so be, I'll sit under my bridge and be a troll. Oh, and to be honest, I think most people who are less than happy with the sonics of CA have said they love the material. So I don't know why some people are getting their thongs all up in a bunch. Clockwork Angels sounds spectacular and I would compare my hearing to yours any day of the week! I don't need any algorithms to know that this is RUSH finest effort since the early 80's! Being musically great and sonically great are two separate things. So you think CA SOUNDS better than CP, or HYF, or PoW? Out of those three the only one that you can really compare it too is CP. The other two album HYF and PW. have way to many keyboards which alters the sound, so I'm not comparing it to those. Apples and Apples and Oranges and Oranges. Now that said the production of CP is cleaner because its not as busy as CA. There much more in CA musically and sonically than in CP. CP was more stripped down musically so there much more room for spacing between the instruments. Regardles, I usually compare it to what just came before and in my opinion it sounds as good if not better than S & A! Thats enough for me. When it comes to sound, as long as it's not Vapor Trails its fine. If you want to Nick-pick and use algorithms And Piu36 explosive modulators to determine how an album sounds go right ahead. I'll stay hear enjoying the wonder and amazement that is Clockwork Angels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBob Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 Listen to GWAR live from mt. Fuji. And then listen to CA. CA will sound like sonic perfection compared to Live from Mt Fuji. But, LFMF just kicks ass and takes name all over the place! Long live Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
losingit2k Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 QUOTE (BigBob @ Jun 13 2012, 10:47 AM) Listen to GWAR live from mt. Fuji. And then listen to CA. CA will sound like sonic perfection compared to Live from Mt Fuji. But, LFMF just kicks ass and takes name all over the place! Long live Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gompers Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 QUOTE (Majestyk @ Jun 13 2012, 11:42 AM) I'm afraid many on the stevehoffman forum are saying the same thing. I don't have the CD yet but I'm already disappointed because I know many of the folks over there know what they're talking about. Fortunately the HDTracks are supposed to sound a little better and the vinyl is supposed to sound even better than that. So I'm going to buy the CD AND one day download a vinyl rip when available. It was mentioned in "Rush Fan Central" on Progarchives that the bass guitar throughout is hurting the sound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
losingit2k Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 QUOTE (Gompers @ Jun 13 2012, 10:50 AM) QUOTE (Majestyk @ Jun 13 2012, 11:42 AM) I'm afraid many on the stevehoffman forum are saying the same thing. I don't have the CD yet but I'm already disappointed because I know many of the folks over there know what they're talking about. Fortunately the HDTracks are supposed to sound a little better and the vinyl is supposed to sound even better than that. So I'm going to buy the CD AND one day download a vinyl rip when available. It was mentioned in "Rush Fan Central" on Progarchives that the bass guitar throughout is hurting the sound. OMG "Rush Fan Central" It must be true then! Bah Bah Bah! The bass is hurting the sound, Bah, bah, bah. The Stevehoffman forum is the last word on anything. Bah, bah, bah. I can't possibly believe anything else and I surely can't think for myself so I'll just agree! Bah, bah, Bah! Look here's a $1.00, go buy yourself a clue! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gompers Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Majestyk Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 The bass on the leaked MP3s is very bloated and unnatural sounding. I was hoping it was just the MP3's and my wishful thinking was hoping that the studio released those MP3's but intentionally tweaked them to make them sound inferior. But NOPE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stormtron Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 The album is a bit muddy, but I can't pretend I'm a person who knows if it's due to the mastering or the production and mix. Something like Mastodon's "The Hunter" seems to be mastered louder to me, but the sound is crisper and more clear than CA. CA sounds good enough to me though. Especially since I listen to a lot of old punk and metal that sounds like it was recorded in someone's ass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Majestyk Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 QUOTE OMG "Rush Fan Central" It must be true then! Bah Bah Bah! The bass is hurting the sound, Bah, bah, bah. The Stevehoffman forum is the last word on anything. Bah, bah, bah. I can't possibly believe anything else and I surely can't think for myself so I'll just agree! Bah, bah, Bah! But I know many of those people who are reporting this and trust what they are saying. I don't know who the F*@K you are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmotionDetector Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 QUOTE (Majestyk @ Jun 13 2012, 12:02 PM) QUOTE OMG "Rush Fan Central" It must be true then! Bah Bah Bah! The bass is hurting the sound, Bah, bah, bah. The Stevehoffman forum is the last word on anything. Bah, bah, bah. I can't possibly believe anything else and I surely can't think for myself so I'll just agree! Bah, bah, Bah! But I know many of those people who are reporting this and trust what they are saying. I don't know who the F*@K you are. He's simply not fond of anything negative (constructive, sarcastic, legit, trollish, or otherwise) being thrown at CA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marblesmike Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 QUOTE (losingit2k @ Jun 13 2012, 11:46 AM) QUOTE (marblesmike @ Jun 13 2012, 10:31 AM) QUOTE (losingit2k @ Jun 13 2012, 11:25 AM) QUOTE (marblesmike @ Jun 13 2012, 08:45 AM) QUOTE (losingit2k @ Jun 13 2012, 09:29 AM) QUOTE (The Mighty Dudad @ Jun 13 2012, 08:00 AM) I am not an audiophile, nor do I care to be one (IMO they seem to spend more time looking for flaws than enjoying the music). On my decent but far from spectacular home system, Clockwork Angels sounds great! That's my point exactly. They are more consumed with finding cracks in the armor than actually enjoying it for all its great qualitites. I'm fed up with it! It's time to call it for what it is: A systematic disruption of Modern RUSH! While I admire your enthusiasm (I don't think I've ever seen anyone use exclamation points as vigorously as you do!!!!!!!!) you need to realize that some people try to be objective, even about their favorite bands. I love Rush, I have all their albums, dvds, blu-rays, etc, and have seen them more times than any other band. However, I'm allowed to be disappointed with a FACET of their new album. It doesn't make me any less of a fan than you. I love the material, and think it is the most consistent effort they've done in years, which makes it even more disappointing to me that the sound quality of this album isn't up to par with some of the 80s output. This is a legitimate gripe, and it has the numbers and algorithms behind it to support it. It deserves to be better. With that being said, if you like the way it sounds and don't have any complaints, then great, I'm happy for you and slightly envious that you haven't been cursed with ears as sensitive as mine. But don't belittle me and others who want to objectively discuss something. You're entitled to your opinion that CA sounds great, and I'm entitled to mine. If this is being a troll, then so be, I'll sit under my bridge and be a troll. Oh, and to be honest, I think most people who are less than happy with the sonics of CA have said they love the material. So I don't know why some people are getting their thongs all up in a bunch. Clockwork Angels sounds spectacular and I would compare my hearing to yours any day of the week! I don't need any algorithms to know that this is RUSH finest effort since the early 80's! Being musically great and sonically great are two separate things. So you think CA SOUNDS better than CP, or HYF, or PoW? Out of those three the only one that you can really compare it too is CP. The other two album HYF and PW. have way to many keyboards which alters the sound, so I'm not comparing it to those. Apples and Apples and Oranges and Oranges. Now that said the production of CP is cleaner because its not as busy as CA. There much more in CA musically and sonically than in CP. CP was more stripped down musically so there much more room for spacing between the instruments. Regardles, I usually compare it to what just came before and in my opinion it sounds as good if not better than S & A! Thats enough for me. When it comes to sound, as long as it's not Vapor Trails its fine. If you want to Nick-pick and use algorithms And Piu36 explosive modulators to determine how an album sounds go right ahead. I'll stay hear enjoying the wonder and amazement that is Clockwork Angels. There's no reasoning with you. I'm talking about the production, mixing, engineering; I'm not talking about whether the album has more keyboard-oriented songwriting. Regardless, if you think CA sonically sounds better than any of those aforementioned albums then I salute you and your ears. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmotionDetector Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 QUOTE (Storm Shadow @ Jun 13 2012, 12:01 PM) The album is a bit muddy, but I can't pretend I'm a person who knows if it's due to the mastering or the production and mix. Something like Mastodon's "The Hunter" seems to be mastered louder to me, but the sound is crisper and more clear than CA. CA sounds good enough to me though. Especially since I listen to a lot of old punk and metal that sounds like it was recorded in someone's ass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tangy Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 read the liner notes, grundman did not do the mastering although it was done at his studio....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Henry Gale Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 (edited) My biggest gripe with this album - is just the bass. I really do feel it's a bit muddy/bloated in spots. Especially if you have a subwoofer and a really nice set up. Maybe it's not as noticeable if you are using a laptop, or driving in the car. But if you have a nice set up, the bass is really overpowering and annoying in parts - as it will bleed into the vocals in a couple spots. But outside of that boomy bass, I don't really have any issues with how this album sounds. Some have said the vocals sound too low in the mix, but I think everything else (instruments, vocals) all sound more than fine. Edited June 13, 2012 by Mr. Henry Gale Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReflectedLight Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 QUOTE (tangy @ Jun 13 2012, 11:08 AM) read the liner notes, grundman did not do the mastering although it was done at his studio....... so basically grundman is off the hook and this thread means nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Godeater2112 Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 All I know is that this album sounds amazing to me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Henry Gale Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 QUOTE (ReflectedLight @ Jun 13 2012, 08:10 AM) QUOTE (tangy @ Jun 13 2012, 11:08 AM) read the liner notes, grundman did not do the mastering although it was done at his studio....... so basically grundman is off the hook and this thread means nothing. OP could change it to - whoever did the mastering. Because, while he's off the hook, doesn't change the fact that this could have been mastered better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marblesmike Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 QUOTE (Mr. Henry Gale @ Jun 13 2012, 12:09 PM) My biggest gripe with this album - is just the bass. I really do feel it's a bit muddy/bloated in spots. Especially if you have a subwoofer and a really nice set up. Maybe it's not as noticeable if you are using a laptop, or driving in the car. But if you have a nice set up, the bass is really overpowering and annoying in spots - as it will bleed into the vocals in a couple spots. But outside of that boomy bass, I don't really have any issues with how this album sound. Some have said the vocals sound too low in the mix, but I think everything else (instruments, vocals) all sound more than fine. True. It's hard to listen to in my car (even my vinyl rip) because of my sub. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marblesmike Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 QUOTE (ReflectedLight @ Jun 13 2012, 12:10 PM) QUOTE (tangy @ Jun 13 2012, 11:08 AM) read the liner notes, grundman did not do the mastering although it was done at his studio....... so basically grundman is off the hook and this thread means nothing. As I've said multiple times in this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReflectedLight Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 QUOTE (Godeater2112 @ Jun 13 2012, 11:10 AM) All I know is that this album sounds amazing to me! vapor trails sounded fine to me so i don't know what the hell you guys are talking about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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