lerxt1990 Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 QUOTE (Captain Avatar @ Apr 11 2012, 09:16 PM) QUOTE (presto123 @ Apr 11 2012, 07:59 PM) SnA was already pretty much written when he came on board so I will not judge him based on that record. This is my thinking too. In addition, the songs he worked on the most, or encouraged the band to pursue, such as Far Cry and Malignant Narcissism, are my favorites on that album. I'm heading into CA with great optimism. I hope I'm correct. I hope you are right too. Despite the lack of Rickenbacker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
presto123 Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReflectedLight Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lerxt1990 Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ak2112 Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 Its not going to matter who the producer is if they let Rich Chycki get his hands on the mixing and engineering side of things. They need to make an audiophile grade album WITH great songs. S&A had the latter but not the former. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilb1972 Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 I like Nick R -- being a fan can have its drawbacks but at the same time I think it's been helpful as well. It is a balance. I feel he is the best producer they have had, along with Terry Brown and Peter Collins. It's one reason I get so frustrated with S&A because sonically I really like it, but the songs leave a LOT to be desired (for me anyway); and it's why I am so pumped for CA -- seems that the songwriting is great and the sound is great, based on what he have thus far anyway. The synergy of good sound and good songwriting could be coming our way, and I'm excited! So yea, I am a Nick R fan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merely Space Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 I appreciate the sound of what Nick and Rich have achieved with Rush thus far. And I really like the enthusiasm he seems to evoke from the guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilb1972 Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 QUOTE And I really like the enthusiasm he seems to evoke from the guys. And this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gompers Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 QUOTE (danielmclark @ Apr 11 2012, 04:42 PM) I think he's probably the best producer they've had since Terry Brown, but I'll reserve final judgment until I hear all of CA. I think the "Who's a better musician" argument works here. It is a matter of taste. I mean how can some love the production of Presto and other despise it. VT suffers a similar criticism. Nick R. is not Terry Brown and brings something to the table that Broon couldn't do at this stage in Rush's career. I thought the S&A mix was incredibly good, and I think CA will be even better. I think Alex's guitar sounds and Neil's playing will be most impacted. I am a fan of Nick and I feel confident after hearing the little blurb of a teaser that CA will be a production victory for the band and producer. At this point, maybe only the song writing could be the detriment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gompers Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 QUOTE (lerxt1990 @ Apr 11 2012, 10:19 PM) QUOTE (Captain Avatar @ Apr 11 2012, 09:16 PM) QUOTE (presto123 @ Apr 11 2012, 07:59 PM) SnA was already pretty much written when he came on board so I will not judge him based on that record. This is my thinking too. In addition, the songs he worked on the most, or encouraged the band to pursue, such as Far Cry and Malignant Narcissism, are my favorites on that album. I'm heading into CA with great optimism. I hope I'm correct. I hope you are right too. Despite the lack of Rickenbacker. I was hoping for some Wal or Steinberger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Presto-digitation Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 (edited) I've yet to see production RUIN a Rush album. I realize VT is a brick-walled and muddy mess (and it's as close as any Rush album comes, don't mistake), but beyond that I still like the songs ...so it's still a good album to me regardless. Likewise I've never thought an album of really bad songs that sounded so good was worth a shit. No amount of production makes Dog Years something other than a turd, except that producer who says "Leave this one off the album". Some bands rely on producers more than others, clearly. Most times Rush comes in with a nearly finished product. You might sand the corners or help the boys select just the right finish or sealant or make a suggestion on cut length...but for the most part, the bones of the songs come from the band. No, I'd say 95% of the blame and the recognition should fall squarely at the feet of the band. They simply don't allow the producer to control that much. To Rush, a producer helps them a lot because God is in the details...and they're a details band, if there ever was one. So that recommendation of "a polished corner" is all the difference to someone like Neil Peart. But the reality is that the bulk of what we love or dislike about a tune comes directly from Geddy, Alex and Neil. Just don't gum up the mix and don't let the band be lazy. I think Nick R's got one album of success under his belt so far. Edited April 12, 2012 by Presto-digitation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gompers Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 QUOTE (Presto-digitation @ Apr 12 2012, 08:59 AM) I've yet to see production RUIN a Rush album. I realize VT is a brick-walled and muddy mess (and it's as close as any Rush album comes, don't mistake), but beyond that I still ike the songs ...so it's still a good album to me regardless. Likewise I've never thought an album of really bad songs that sounded so good was worth a shit. No amount of production makes Dog Years something other than a turd, except that producer who says "Leave this one off the album". Some bands rely on producers more than others, clearly. Most times Rush comes in with a nearly finished product. You might sand the corners or help the boys select just the right finish or sealant or make a suggestion on cut length...but for the most part, the bones of the songs come from the band. No, I'd say 95% of the blame and the recognition should fall squarely at the feet of the band. They simply don't allow the producer to control that much. To Rush, a producer helps them a lot because God is in the details...and they're a details band, if there ever was one. So that recommendation of "a polished corner" is all the difference. But the reality is that the bulk of what we love or dislike about a tune comes directly from Geddy, Alex and Neil. Just don't gum up the mix and don't let the band be lazy. I think Nick R's got one album of success under his belt so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg2112 Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 (edited) Anyone who can bring this band back to its hard rock/progressive roots is fine by me. Of course, that didnt happen with Snakes, but all signs point to this being the case with CA. Edited April 12, 2012 by greg2112 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Presto-digitation Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 QUOTE (greg2112 @ Apr 12 2012, 09:21 AM) Anyone who can bring this band back to its hard rock/progressive roots is fine by me. Of course, that didnt happen with Snakes, but all signs point to this being the case with CA. It's still only as successful as the band makes it, though. Nick R. can say, "Hey, go back to your roots!!" and it could get them jazzed...and then what that means to them and what that sounds like to US is a different thing. Whether writing another Bravado or re-inventing The Necromancer, it'll hinge entirely on the band. No producer is going to make the songs better in any appreciable way. I know people will disagree with me here, but it's often not Geddy and Alex and some producer sitting around writing the tune. If it were, fine...the producer has the chance to have a TON of influence. Some bands do this. Some producers have writing credits on albums for that very reason. I do think a producer can guide a band, but it's a bit like turning the Titanic...it takes a long time and a wide berth to affect very little, which to the band is probably a LOT...but may not actually be much when it comes down to it. Nick R. strikes me as a young man who's keeping them fired up. And the sound of his records are pretty clean, the instruments are separated, etc. You can't ask for much more from someone not asked to be involved in the writing. You can keep it clean and dry (K. Shirley) or you can bells-and-whistle it all up until it glows, but the root song is the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmotionDetector Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 QUOTE (ReRushed @ Apr 11 2012, 08:43 PM) Terry Brown is no big deal. He benefited more from Rush than Rush benefited from him. Is he really that good of a producer? Or did he have the luxury of working with Rush during their reputation defining era? I have always thought this. I'm not taking anything away from Terry, because the guy was behind the controls for brilliant albums. But let's face it...he was there during a time when the band could really do no wrong. They were on fire, year after year with every new album. Almost any producer could've made a name for themselves with a band playing like that. That's why I've always found it ridiculous when I see people calling for Terry to return to Rush in 2012. Who's to say that he would help them make material that mirrors anything from 1976-1981?? No-one...that's a ridiculous assumption in my mind...but that is what's happening. Let's face it...Terry Brown and Rush were the PERFECT marriage, but for THAT time. We are talking about 30 years now since they last worked together. There is no guarantee that their material would be any better than it is with Nick IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaminbenb Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 If anything...he's NOT trying to make them something they're NOT! After Broon, (and GuP, since they mostly had stuff worked out beforehand) The next few albums didn't sound like "them", and except for the odd track, they sounded like a different band entirely. (now some people might LIKE that, but to me they just missed the mark from PoW on, until Nick came in and returned them to their "signature sound"... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gompers Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 QUOTE (greg2112 @ Apr 12 2012, 10:21 AM) Anyone who can bring this band back to its hard rock/progressive roots is fine by me. Of course, that didnt happen with Snakes, but all signs point to this being the case with CA. That's totally what has defined Rush...regression. S&A is quite perfect the way it is and I am glad Rush wrote music the way they did for that release. Alex especially branched out and took a chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gompers Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 (edited) ... Edited April 12, 2012 by Gompers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Presto-digitation Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 The band willingly went along with all those changes, though. I think altering how Geddy approached his singing under Rupert was a GOOD thing. He's a better singer for it. He probably is singing today as a result of it, otherwise he might've ruined himself by now shrieking. They WANTED to adopt a contemporary Police-like sound in the early 80s. They adopted keyboards intentionally. Alex replaced his riffing for shimmering accents willfully at one time. I don't blame the band for getting bored and wanting to try new things. In the end that broad canvas is what I love, love, love about Rush. It's not all mid-70s prog. It's not all early 80s new wave influence. It's a full and colorful canvas, their sound scape. It's awesome how diverse they've been. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vprtrls Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 I'm a huge fan of Rush and anything Nick R does to fire them up is fine with me. I loved SnA, the songs, and the mix. I especially enjoy the way Geddy sings instead of squaking like in the 70's. I do enjoy the Geddy choir as well. I can't wait for CW. Old Rush great, new Rush better!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Avatar Posted April 12, 2012 Author Share Posted April 12, 2012 QUOTE (Presto-digitation @ Apr 12 2012, 11:31 AM) The band willingly went along with all those changes, though. I think altering how Geddy approached his singing under Rupert was a GOOD thing. He's a better singer for it. He probably is singing today as a result of it, otherwise he might've ruined himself by now shrieking. They WANTED to adopt a contemporary Police-like sound in the early 80s. They adopted keyboards intentionally. Alex replaced his riffing for shimmering accents willfully at one time. I don't blame the band for getting bored and wanting to try new things. In the end that broad canvas is what I love, love, love about Rush. It's not all mid-70s prog. It's not all early 80s new wave influence. It's a full and colorful canvas, their sound scape. It's awesome how diverse they've been. I agree to an extent. I actually love 80's Rush the most, so I agree about liking the diversity. But I have to say that in my opinion Rush lost some of their signature sound for a while...whether it was going contemporary pop (like Roll the Bones), pseudo-grunge (Counterparts) or all-out heavy layered riffing (a la Vapor Trails). I don't HATE any of their albums, although Vapor Trails is my least favorite, but I do think that their absolute best stuff was Hemispheres thru Signals, and I don't think I would love Rush nearly as much if they has only produced, say, Presto thru Vapor Trails. If...and it's a big if...Nick R. can get them to tap into the "classic Rush sound" that I love (instrument separation and clarity, MELODY, a-typical song structure, blazing instrumental prowess, drum fills, guitar solos, arpeggios, MELODY, etc.), without sacrificing innovation, then I, for one, will be ecstatic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metaldad Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 Nope . He has done 1 album that we have heard . If the new album is great and i hope it is, he has a long way to go to catch Terry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg2112 Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 QUOTE (Gompers @ Apr 12 2012, 11:09 AM) QUOTE (greg2112 @ Apr 12 2012, 10:21 AM) Anyone who can bring this band back to its hard rock/progressive roots is fine by me. Of course, that didnt happen with Snakes, but all signs point to this being the case with CA. That's totally what has defined Rush...regression. S&A is quite perfect the way it is and I am glad Rush wrote music the way they did for that release. Alex especially branched out and took a chance. To each his/her own. Not my cup of tea overall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metaldad Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 QUOTE (Gompers @ Apr 12 2012, 11:09 AM) S&A is quite perfect the way it is Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
presto123 Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 QUOTE (greg2112 @ Apr 12 2012, 02:30 PM) QUOTE (Gompers @ Apr 12 2012, 11:09 AM) QUOTE (greg2112 @ Apr 12 2012, 10:21 AM) Anyone who can bring this band back to its hard rock/progressive roots is fine by me. Of course, that didnt happen with Snakes, but all signs point to this being the case with CA. That's totally what has defined Rush...regression. S&A is quite perfect the way it is and I am glad Rush wrote music the way they did for that release. Alex especially branched out and took a chance. To each his/her own. Not my cup of tea overall. I agree. It has its moments but overall that taking a chance didn't pan out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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