Neil's drumming...what gives?

[coventry]

I was listening to Clockwork Angels the other day, and while his drumming in it is certainly busier than Snakes & Arrows, there´s hardly a moment in the whole album where I think "wow, that fill really belw me away!", or "what a crazy time signature!". It may be the case where they´re getting rid of all the excess from their early years and adopting the less is more approach, but Neil´s excess was a huge part of why I came to love Rush. He´s changed from the odd time signature mastermind to a slightly improved version of Keith Moon in the latest albums.

 

Which is exactly what I'm talking about, only Neil doesn't seem to agree with you. When he talks about the album, he discusses how difficult and daring the drum parts are. He talks about one song (I believe it's Headlong Flight) being so difficult that he actually had to have the music on a stand so he could play it, and how he never had to do that before. He's sort of like the athlete who swears he's in the best playing shape of his life but who everyone else can clearly see has lost a lot of what made him so great before.

 

Neil's excess is a huge part of what made me a Rush fan too...and it's what I think most defines the band for music fans in general. Mention the name "Rush," and just about everyone says something to the effect of, "Awesome drummer." I don't think that would be the case of Neil played the way he's playing now on their first ten albums.

 

I was listening to Presto today and thinking of this thread insofar as how intricate the compositions are - production quality aside. And while his snare sounds like as anemic and empty as a Kardashian, his drumming structure, fill selection, composition, and rhythmic variety on that album is some of the best in the Rush catalog. In many ways, the drums are the main instrument on that album; they dive and soar and skim and pound analogous to his work on Power Windows and almost always lead the other instruments.

 

It's definitely something he never would have done in '78 or '82. He just wasn't as confident a composer back then. Does it have the incredibly deleterious fills and time-sig jumps of his earlier work? No. But I think he'd moved past that by then. One thing Neil has said repeatedly is that he always has to feel he's growing and changing as an artist.

 

To write that Neil is simply fooling himself by saying that his parts on CA are some of the most demanding he can remember is simply clueless, especially if written by a non-drummer. He's not saying he's "in the best shape of his life." He's saying he's written parts that are challenging in ways we're not used to.

It's like that video of the 7-year old playing "YYZ" - could Neil have played that when he was 7? No. But the 7 year old didn't write it in the first place. Shit - we can all imitate given enough practice and aptitude, but to create initially takes a different level of talent.

[upstateNYfan]

Very well said. (And yes, I think CA is some of his best work.)

[CygnusX-1Bk2]

He's trying to use the bands (imaginary) reasons for not playing songs to validate (and I guess influence) his opinions. Kind of like LedRush does with his perceived audience reactions. And this guys 47 so I can't blame it on him being a kid...

 

Eh...why doesn't anyone have enough confidence in their own subjective tastes? Why do you they need external validation?

In a lot of cases it's not imaginary when they have made statements about their own material. I make interpretations of what they play in shows and what they've said in interviews about certain songs and albums as well as what I've gathered from talking to some crew members. I know a stinker when I hear it and they know it when they've written one, though usually years later. People need to stop sucking their dicks and be real.

 

My opinion matters to only me. Who cares what you, me or anyone else thinks? Seriously. You can like garbage if you want but I tend to be more discerning and I don't care much what anybody thinks about it. If others can state their opinions then so can I. Get your panties in a wad if you want to. That doesn't mean you can be an ass by posting incessantly because you disagree. You are what is referred to as a foamer. :)

[savagegrace26]

He's trying to use the bands (imaginary) reasons for not playing songs to validate (and I guess influence) his opinions. Kind of like LedRush does with his perceived audience reactions. And this guys 47 so I can't blame it on him being a kid...

 

Eh...why doesn't anyone have enough confidence in their own subjective tastes? Why do you they need external validation?

In a lot of cases it's not imaginary when they have made statements about their own material. I make interpretations of what they play in shows and what they've said in interviews about certain songs and albums as well as what I've gathered from talking to some crew members.

 

Yes, you are making your own interpretations based on what you think the band may think about their songs and your results are fairly innacurate. That's the problem here.

 

And the band's opinions on their own work is pretty irrelevant and doesn't affirm or validate your own opinions in any way to make them more meaningful or objective.

 

It really doesn't matter what the band thinks.

 

Neil likes The Speed of Love.

Edited December 6, 2014 by savagegrace26

[savagegrace26]

He's trying to use the bands (imaginary) reasons for not playing songs to validate (and I guess influence) his opinions. Kind of like LedRush does with his perceived audience reactions. And this guys 47 so I can't blame it on him being a kid...

 

Eh...why doesn't anyone have enough confidence in their own subjective tastes? Why do you they need external validation?

That doesn't mean you can be an ass by posting incessantly because you disagree.

 

I can do whatever I please and that includes calling out bs when I see it.

[Lorraine]

Neil likes The Speed of Love.

 

So do I!

Edited December 6, 2014 by Lorraine

[savagegrace26]

"I know a stinker when I hear it and they know it when they've written one"

Yes, and so do I. And I know when they've written a gem like Available Light.

 

"People need to stop sucking their dicks and be real."

I'm critical of the band when I need to be. I'm not interested in their dicks.

 

"You can like garbage if you want but I tend to be more discerning"

I have excellent taste and everything I like is awesome. Your discernment is very very off. You don't know what you're talking about.

 

I rate your critical discernment skills 0/10

[savagegrace26]

"Who cares what you, me or anyone else thinks? Seriously."

 

You apparently care what Rush thinks.

[ThatLightInYourEyes]

"I know a stinker when I hear it and they know it when they've written one"

Yes, and so do I. And I know when they've written a gem like Available Light.

 

"People need to stop sucking their dicks and be real."

I'm critical of the band when I need to be. I'm not interested in their dicks.

 

"You can like garbage if you want but I tend to be more discerning"

I have excellent taste and everything I like is awesome. Your discernment is very very off. You don't know what you're talking about.

 

I rate your critical discernment skills 0/10

 

[savagegrace26]

"I know a stinker when I hear it and they know it when they've written one"

Yes, and so do I. And I know when they've written a gem like Available Light.

 

"People need to stop sucking their dicks and be real."

I'm critical of the band when I need to be. I'm not interested in their dicks.

 

"You can like garbage if you want but I tend to be more discerning"

I have excellent taste and everything I like is awesome. Your discernment is very very off. You don't know what you're talking about.

 

I rate your critical discernment skills 0/10

 

 

Are you going to share your popcorn?

[ThatLightInYourEyes]

"I know a stinker when I hear it and they know it when they've written one"

Yes, and so do I. And I know when they've written a gem like Available Light.

 

"People need to stop sucking their dicks and be real."

I'm critical of the band when I need to be. I'm not interested in their dicks.

 

"You can like garbage if you want but I tend to be more discerning"

I have excellent taste and everything I like is awesome. Your discernment is very very off. You don't know what you're talking about.

 

I rate your critical discernment skills 0/10

 

 

Are you going to share your popcorn?

 

Here, this should cover at least half of a thread about "Vapor Trails":

 

http://www.cinemashop.com/images/pa/tpgroup_cart_large.jpg

[antiquark]

So if YYZ and Tom Sawyer are so much more difficult than Headlong Flight, why is it that precious little children can effortlessly play YYZ and TS? Huh, Huh??? :codger:

[savagegrace26]

I just don't like that "holier than thou" attitude of thinking one's views on songs is objective or right. Especially when one tries to use some arbitrary opinion to somehow validate your own (like what the band may or may not like). It comes off as condescending and shitty, not to mention immature.. Just because one doesn't see the value or artistry of a song like Red Tide or Available Light doesn't mean you're right or that you have a "better" or some special esoteric point-of-view regarding music.

 

Just like I don't see the "greatness" in The Speed of Love like a (very) few do. I have never once called The Speed of Love "garbage" and never will. I think the song is hokey and cheesy and one of the band's weakest songs (if not the flat out worst) but I'm not going to excessively put it down and act like my opinion is superior than anyone else's. I wish I could appreciate what Lorraine hears in that song, but I don't. Although I do love how much she appreciates the brilliance of The Weapon. So she does have some taste ;)

 

Seriously, this arrogance that you have a better view of what constutes good and bad music is f*cking bullshit.

Edited December 6, 2014 by savagegrace26

[MMCXII]

The Gruber lessons made him a better drummer but less of a "Neil Peart". He seems to have lost that angular mathematical madness he had in the 70's.

Becoming a better drummer made him a more normal drummer. He still tries but I think he's too worried about trying to make everything flow between the hits or whatever..

[Lorraine]

I just don't like that "holier than thou" attitude of thinking one's views on songs is objective or right. Especially when one tries to use some arbitrary opinion to somehow validate your own (like what the band may or may not like). It comes off as condescending and shitty, not to mention immature.. Just because one doesn't see the value or artistry of a song like Red Tide or Available Light doesn't mean you're right or that you have a "better" or some special esoteric point-of-view regarding music.

 

Just like I don't see the "greatness" in The Speed of Love like a (very) few do. I have never once called The Speed of Love "garbage" and never will. I think the song is hokey and cheesy and one of the band's weakest songs (if not the flat out worst) but I'm not going to excessively put it down and act like my opinion is superior than anyone else's. I wish I could appreciate what Lorraine hears in that song, but I don't. Although I do love how much she appreciates the brilliance of The Weapon. So she does have some taste ;)

 

Seriously, this arrogance that you have a better view of what constutes good and bad music is f*cking bullshit.

 

I am going to read this over again a few more times as I suspect there is a well hidden compliment in it. Somewhere.

[Narps]

I just don't like that "holier than thou" attitude of thinking one's views on songs is objective or right. Especially when one tries to use some arbitrary opinion to somehow validate your own (like what the band may or may not like). It comes off as condescending and shitty, not to mention immature.. Just because one doesn't see the value or artistry of a song like Red Tide or Available Light doesn't mean you're right or that you have a "better" or some special esoteric point-of-view regarding music.

 

Just like I don't see the "greatness" in The Speed of Love like a (very) few do. I have never once called The Speed of Love "garbage" and never will. I think the song is hokey and cheesy and one of the band's weakest songs (if not the flat out worst) but I'm not going to excessively put it down and act like my opinion is superior than anyone else's. I wish I could appreciate what Lorraine hears in that song, but I don't. Although I do love how much she appreciates the brilliance of The Weapon. So she does have some taste ;)

 

Seriously, this arrogance that you have a better view of what constutes good and bad music is f*cking bullshit.

 

I am going to read this over again a few more times as I suspect there is a well hidden compliment in it. Somewhere.

"some" is better than none....

[Lorraine]

"I know a stinker when I hear it and they know it when they've written one"

Yes, and so do I. And I know when they've written a gem like Available Light.

 

"People need to stop sucking their dicks and be real."

I'm critical of the band when I need to be. I'm not interested in their dicks.

 

"You can like garbage if you want but I tend to be more discerning"

I have excellent taste and everything I like is awesome. Your discernment is very very off. You don't know what you're talking about.

 

I rate your critical discernment skills 0/10

 

TLIYE, did you notice how he snuck a rating in? :)

[YYZ Working Man]

To the upset posters above....I believe his credentials below speak for themselves which cover a few decades of material. A resume doesn't get much better than that.Personally the 7 albums recorded at LeStudio may have been some of his best work on the drums

 

Awards and honours:

 

Peart has received the following awards in Modern Drummer magazine

• Hall of Fame: 1983
  
• Best Rock Drummer*: 1980, 1981, 1982, 1983, 1984, 1985, 1986, 2006, 2008
  
• Best Multi-Percussionist*: 1983, 1984, 1985, 1986
  
• Best Percussion Instrumentalist: 1982
  
• Most Promising New Drummer: 1980
  
• Best All Around: 1986
  
• 1986 Honor Roll: Rock Drummer, Multi-Percussion
  

(* – As a member of the Honor Roll in these categories, he is no longer eligible for votes in the above categories.)

• Best Instructional Video: 2006, for Anatomy of A Drum Solo
  
• Best Drum Recording of the 1980s, 2007, for "YYZ" from Exit...Stage Left
  

• Best Recorded Performance:
  
  • 1980: Permanent Waves
    
  • 1981: Moving Pictures
    
  • 1982: Exit...Stage Left
    
  • 1983: Signals
    
  • 1985: Grace Under Pressure
    
  • 1986: Power Windows
    
  • 1988: Hold Your Fire
    
  • 1989: A Show of Hands
    
  • 1990: Presto
    
  • 1992: Roll the Bones
    
  • 1993: Counterparts
    
  • 1997: Test for Echo
    
  • 1999: Different Stages
    
  • 2002: Vapor Trails
    
  • 2004: R30
    
  • 2007: Snakes & Arrows
    
  • 2011: Time Machine
    
  • 2012: Clockwork Angels
    

Peart has received the following awards from DRUM! magazine for 2007:

• Drummer of the Year
  
• Best Progressive Rock Drummer
  
• Best Live Performer
  
• Best DVD (Anatomy Of A Drum Solo)
  
• Best Drumming Album (Snakes & Arrows)
  

Peart received the following awards from DRUM! magazine for 2008:

• Drummer of the Year
  
• Best Progressive Rock Drummer (Runner-Up)
  
• Best Mainstream Pop Drummer (Runner-Up)
  
• Best Live Drumming Performer
  

Peart received the following awards from DRUM! magazine for 2009:

• Drummer Of The Year
  
• Best Progressive Rock Drummer
  

Peart received the following awards from DRUM! magazine for 2010:

• Drummer of the Year
  
• Best Live Performer (Runner-Up)
  
• Best Progressive Rock Drummer (Runner-Up)
  

Along with his bandmates Lee and Lifeson, Peart was made an Officer of the Order of Canada on May 9, 1996. The trio was the first rock band to be so honoured, as a group.Peart was inducted into the Canadian Songwriter Hall of Fame along with bandmates Lifeson and Lee. On April 18, 2013, Rush was inducted into the Rock And Roll Hall Of Fame.

[savagegrace26]

Best Promising New Drummer in 1980?

[Lorraine]

Best Promising New Drummer in 1980?

Who knew?

[Lorraine]

I just don't like that "holier than thou" attitude of thinking one's views on songs is objective or right. Especially when one tries to use some arbitrary opinion to somehow validate your own (like what the band may or may not like). It comes off as condescending and shitty, not to mention immature.. Just because one doesn't see the value or artistry of a song like Red Tide or Available Light doesn't mean you're right or that you have a "better" or some special esoteric point-of-view regarding music.

 

Just like I don't see the "greatness" in The Speed of Love like a (very) few do. I have never once called The Speed of Love "garbage" and never will. I think the song is hokey and cheesy and one of the band's weakest songs (if not the flat out worst) but I'm not going to excessively put it down and act like my opinion is superior than anyone else's. I wish I could appreciate what Lorraine hears in that song, but I don't. Although I do love how much she appreciates the brilliance of The Weapon. So she does have some taste ;)

 

Seriously, this arrogance that you have a better view of what constutes good and bad music is f*cking bullshit.

 

I am going to read this over again a few more times as I suspect there is a well hidden compliment in it. Somewhere.

"some" is better than none....

Maybe I ought to resurrect the thread he started on The Speed of Love bashing it to bits. You know. The one where I got together the modest list of resident Speed of Love lovers? Or perhaps it would just be best to just drop the whole thing and look for the hidden compliment instead?

[EagleMoon]

I just don't like that "holier than thou" attitude of thinking one's views on songs is objective or right. Especially when one tries to use some arbitrary opinion to somehow validate your own (like what the band may or may not like). It comes off as condescending and shitty, not to mention immature.. Just because one doesn't see the value or artistry of a song like Red Tide or Available Light doesn't mean you're right or that you have a "better" or some special esoteric point-of-view regarding music.

 

Just like I don't see the "greatness" in The Speed of Love like a (very) few do. I have never once called The Speed of Love "garbage" and never will. I think the song is hokey and cheesy and one of the band's weakest songs (if not the flat out worst) but I'm not going to excessively put it down and act like my opinion is superior than anyone else's. I wish I could appreciate what Lorraine hears in that song, but I don't. Although I do love how much she appreciates the brilliance of The Weapon. So she does have some taste ;)

 

Seriously, this arrogance that you have a better view of what constutes good and bad music is f*cking bullshit.

 

I am going to read this over again a few more times as I suspect there is a well hidden compliment in it. Somewhere.

 

Good luck with that.

[savagegrace26]

I just don't like that "holier than thou" attitude of thinking one's views on songs is objective or right. Especially when one tries to use some arbitrary opinion to somehow validate your own (like what the band may or may not like). It comes off as condescending and shitty, not to mention immature.. Just because one doesn't see the value or artistry of a song like Red Tide or Available Light doesn't mean you're right or that you have a "better" or some special esoteric point-of-view regarding music.

 

Just like I don't see the "greatness" in The Speed of Love like a (very) few do. I have never once called The Speed of Love "garbage" and never will. I think the song is hokey and cheesy and one of the band's weakest songs (if not the flat out worst) but I'm not going to excessively put it down and act like my opinion is superior than anyone else's. I wish I could appreciate what Lorraine hears in that song, but I don't. Although I do love how much she appreciates the brilliance of The Weapon. So she does have some taste ;)

 

Seriously, this arrogance that you have a better view of what constutes good and bad music is f*cking bullshit.

 

I am going to read this over again a few more times as I suspect there is a well hidden compliment in it. Somewhere.

 

Good luck with that.

 

There is very much a compliment (or two) in there. Lorraine is cool. She deserves them.

[Lorraine]

I just don't like that "holier than thou" attitude of thinking one's views on songs is objective or right. Especially when one tries to use some arbitrary opinion to somehow validate your own (like what the band may or may not like). It comes off as condescending and shitty, not to mention immature.. Just because one doesn't see the value or artistry of a song like Red Tide or Available Light doesn't mean you're right or that you have a "better" or some special esoteric point-of-view regarding music.

 

Just like I don't see the "greatness" in The Speed of Love like a (very) few do. I have never once called The Speed of Love "garbage" and never will. I think the song is hokey and cheesy and one of the band's weakest songs (if not the flat out worst) but I'm not going to excessively put it down and act like my opinion is superior than anyone else's. I wish I could appreciate what Lorraine hears in that song, but I don't. Although I do love how much she appreciates the brilliance of The Weapon. So she does have some taste ;)

 

Seriously, this arrogance that you have a better view of what constutes good and bad music is f*cking bullshit.

 

I am going to read this over again a few more times as I suspect there is a well hidden compliment in it. Somewhere.

"some" is better than none....

Maybe I ought to resurrect the thread he started on The Speed of Love bashing it to bits. You know. The one where I got together the modest list of resident Speed of Love lovers? Or perhaps it would just be best to just drop the whole thing and look for the hidden compliment instead?

A little search revealed to me that it was actually Len who started the Speed of Love bashing thread.

 

My apologies for falsely accusing you, Savage.

[EagleMoon]

I just don't like that "holier than thou" attitude of thinking one's views on songs is objective or right. Especially when one tries to use some arbitrary opinion to somehow validate your own (like what the band may or may not like). It comes off as condescending and shitty, not to mention immature.. Just because one doesn't see the value or artistry of a song like Red Tide or Available Light doesn't mean you're right or that you have a "better" or some special esoteric point-of-view regarding music.

 

Just like I don't see the "greatness" in The Speed of Love like a (very) few do. I have never once called The Speed of Love "garbage" and never will. I think the song is hokey and cheesy and one of the band's weakest songs (if not the flat out worst) but I'm not going to excessively put it down and act like my opinion is superior than anyone else's. I wish I could appreciate what Lorraine hears in that song, but I don't. Although I do love how much she appreciates the brilliance of The Weapon. So she does have some taste ;)

 

Seriously, this arrogance that you have a better view of what constutes good and bad music is f*cking bullshit.

 

I am going to read this over again a few more times as I suspect there is a well hidden compliment in it. Somewhere.

 

Good luck with that.

 

There is very much a compliment (or two) in there. Lorraine is cool. She deserves them.

 

How about instead of making them so hard to find, you might actually "gasp" come right out and say them?