LedRush Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Funny, this debate has been quasi political, but everyone has been more civil than if it were in SOCN. I just took kicked it up a notch. The problem is the Narpski is too nice, and I like him too much, for it to escalate. Which makes me think that he is a selfish dickhead for not being meaner than he is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LedRush Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Pull the adds. I will sleep well either way..... Of course, because you don't make your money from the NFL. Goodell, however, might not be sleeping as well as you.Tiger survived the big bail. If the product continues to be great they will too....This is a good point. As long as the fan support doesn't wane (and it won't), companies will be lining up to associate with the league.I hope the holier than thou businesses bail and lose some coin. I just can't stand when folks lick their finger and stick it in the air to check the wind direction. Just my opinion of course....I'm not being critical of A-B...just talking economics.I am not ashamed to admit I suck at economics...... Nah, you know plenty. And this one's pretty simple, IMO. There is going to be no shortage of companies who will do business with the NFL. You could actually argue that if a company pulls their ads that they're not fulfilling their fiduciary responsibility to their stockholder to maximize (legally) their profits. Except that choosing not to business with the NFL over an issue like this is likely to earn you more free publicity into fresh ocean markets than doing business with the NFL possibly could. Shit, even thinking about not doing business with the NFL is starting to do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inthend Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Maybe "doing nothing" isn't the wisest policy. http://www.usatoday....erson/15728397/Yeah their product doesn't contribute to any social ills. What hypocrites. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aikenrooster Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Funny, this debate has been quasi political, but everyone has been more civil than if it were in SOCN. I just took kicked it up a notch. The problem is the Narpski is too nice, and I like him too much, for it to escalate. Which makes me think that he is a selfish dickhead for not being meaner than he is.Yeah, I've been scratching my head about him.He did an excellent job raising his kids without speaking them, yet he defends bad parents who spank their kids because they aren't parenting properly.Narpski proved that it could be done. He should be bragging about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Narps Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 I kind of enjoy when folks/companies bite off their nose to spite their faces and end up with olfactory issues.... It must be sad to go through life wishing and thinking the worst about people just so you can defend racists, wife beaters and child abusers.Sounds awful. I knew I should have stayed out if this one. Attempting to at least make sense of some things I would never do, have done or associate with..... Kind of my first personal attack in a way though. This and the post that follows. Breaking some new ground. Oops never mind forgot. Xanadoood beat you to it months ago calling me names directly amongst other things. BTW, I am only trying to defend people's freedoms and the right to do right and to f**k up also and some gray area in between. I' m just not doing it very well sadly..... :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aikenrooster Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Under the logic of this thread a fat bastard should thank his parents because he never got a teenage girl pregnant. Also, an illiterate person should thank his parents for not making sure he was educated, because he never plagerized another author. Maybe soldiers who get their arms and legs blown off in war should thank their parents because they'll never get hurt playing professional sports. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aikenrooster Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 I kind of enjoy when folks/companies bite off their nose to spite their faces and end up with olfactory issues.... It must be sad to go through life wishing and thinking the worst about people just so you can defend racists, wife beaters and child abusers.Sounds awful. I knew I should have stayed out if this one. Attempting to at least make sense of some things I would never do, have done or associate with..... Kind of my first personal attack in a way though. This and the post that follows. Breaking some new ground. Oops never mind forgot. Xanadoood beat you to it months ago calling me names directly amongst other things. BTW, I am only trying to defend people's freedoms and the right to do right and to f**k up also and some gray area in between. I' m just not doing it very well sadly..... :(I don't think you should stay out of the debates. But, previously, you asked me if the opinion of one who actually raised kids should count more? In this debate, you, and other good parents, broke the cycle of abuae, and successfully raised kids into adulthood without hitting them. Don't shy away from the shining example you set for mankind. You changed the world. What you did put humanity on a different course, for the better. What a monumental achievement! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Narps Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 I thank my parents still to this day for all they have taught and done for me. They molded who I am in many ways and thankfully my children caught some of that residue as well.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LedRush Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 I kind of enjoy when folks/companies bite off their nose to spite their faces and end up with olfactory issues.... It must be sad to go through life wishing and thinking the worst about people just so you can defend racists, wife beaters and child abusers.Sounds awful. I knew I should have stayed out if this one. Attempting to at least make sense of some things I would never do, have done or associate with..... Kind of my first personal attack in a way though. This and the post that follows. Breaking some new ground. Oops never mind forgot. Xanadoood beat you to it months ago calling me names directly amongst other things. BTW, I am only trying to defend people's freedoms and the right to do right and to f**k up also and some gray area in between. I' m just not doing it very well sadly..... :( I intended the post after this to be an obvious joke, and thus take away any potential sting of this post. Obviously I failed. I apologize for the wording, but not for the sentiment. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LedRush Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Peterson is losing sponsorships, his charities are losing money, and 4 different NFL advertisers have questioned their sponsorship of the NFL. Minnesota's governor is calling out the Vikings for not suspending Peterson. I don't understand the arguments that this publicity isn't harming the interests of stakeholders in the NFL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Narps Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 I kind of enjoy when folks/companies bite off their nose to spite their faces and end up with olfactory issues.... It must be sad to go through life wishing and thinking the worst about people just so you can defend racists, wife beaters and child abusers.Sounds awful. I knew I should have stayed out if this one. Attempting to at least make sense of some things I would never do, have done or associate with..... Kind of my first personal attack in a way though. This and the post that follows. Breaking some new ground. Oops never mind forgot. Xanadoood beat you to it months ago calling me names directly amongst other things. BTW, I am only trying to defend people's freedoms and the right to do right and to f**k up also and some gray area in between. I' m just not doing it very well sadly..... :(I don't think you should stay out of the debates. But, previously, you asked me if the opinion of one who actually raised kids should count more? In this debate, you, and other good parents, broke the cycle of abuae, and successfully raised kids into adulthood without hitting them. Don't shy away from the shining example you set for mankind. You changed the world. What you did put humanity on a different course, for the better. What a monumental achievement!Thanks for the kind words. I just suck at trying to defend folks personal freedoms, liberty and privacy. I am not the type that just because I don't smoke I wish to tar and feather those who choose too and remove their freedom to do so. If that analogy makes any sense at all.... LedRush is still my bro also, no matter..... :cheers: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Narps Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 A master debater I will sadly never be..... :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Narps Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 For now I gots to get some sleep. No hard feelings. Maybe I will feel differently in the morning.... ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LedRush Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 I kind of enjoy when folks/companies bite off their nose to spite their faces and end up with olfactory issues.... It must be sad to go through life wishing and thinking the worst about people just so you can defend racists, wife beaters and child abusers.Sounds awful. I knew I should have stayed out if this one. Attempting to at least make sense of some things I would never do, have done or associate with..... Kind of my first personal attack in a way though. This and the post that follows. Breaking some new ground. Oops never mind forgot. Xanadoood beat you to it months ago calling me names directly amongst other things. BTW, I am only trying to defend people's freedoms and the right to do right and to f**k up also and some gray area in between. I' m just not doing it very well sadly..... :(I don't think you should stay out of the debates. But, previously, you asked me if the opinion of one who actually raised kids should count more? In this debate, you, and other good parents, broke the cycle of abuae, and successfully raised kids into adulthood without hitting them. Don't shy away from the shining example you set for mankind. You changed the world. What you did put humanity on a different course, for the better. What a monumental achievement!Thanks for the kind words. I just suck at trying to defend folks personal freedoms, liberty and privacy. I am not the type that just because I don't smoke I wish to tar and feather those who choose too and remove their freedom to do so. If that analogy makes any sense at all.... LedRush is still my bro also, no matter..... :cheers: Thanks for the beer (I friggin' need it now). However, you are not arguing for personal freedom, but for the lack thereof. And there are very good reasons that criminal indictments are not kept private. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenJennings Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 (edited) If Adrian Peterson is found guilty of a crime, then, and only then, we can talk about the appropriate suspension. Where in the hell do you get this, Ken? His contract and his collective bargaining agreement are the documents that govern whether of not he can be suspended. A criminal finding may not be required. It's all in the legal agreements under which he is employed. No more privately contracted legal agreements for Ken. Now the government is in charge of my decisions on whether to hire, fire, or take disciplinary actions regarding my employees. Hold the phone a second. If you accuse me of violating contract, and I didn't violate contract; who gets to decide which one of us is in breach of that agreement? Now, we've got an investigation ongoing that is determining what Adrian Peterson did. Is it not the prudent action to wait and see what the results of that investigation are, before you act on his contract and potentially breach the terms of that agreement yourself? Edited September 17, 2014 by KenJennings Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenJennings Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 And if the NFL does take any action against Peterson, I think he'd have every right to move for an injunction against their decision, in order to allow time for a legal ruling on whether or not he did violate the terms of his contract. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LedRush Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 If Adrian Peterson is found guilty of a crime, then, and only then, we can talk about the appropriate suspension. Where in the hell do you get this, Ken? His contract and his collective bargaining agreement are the documents that govern whether of not he can be suspended. A criminal finding may not be required. It's all in the legal agreements under which he is employed. No more privately contracted legal agreements for Ken. Now the government is in charge of my decisions on whether to hire, fire, or take disciplinary actions regarding my employees. Hold the phone a second. If you accuse me of violating contract, and I didn't violate contract; who gets to decide which one of us is in breach of that agreement? Now, we've got an investigation ongoing that is determining what Adrian Peterson did. Is it not the prudent action to wait and see what the results of that investigation are, before you act on his contract and potentially breach the terms of that agreement yourself? It depends on what the contract states. For every code of conduct I've seen, it is the company that gets to make the determination, sometimes with input from other parties and with a planned arbitration policy. Regardless, the answer is almost never the US government. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LedRush Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 (edited) And if the NFL does take any action against Peterson, I think he'd have every right to move for an injunction against their decision, in order to allow time for a legal ruling on whether or not he did violate the terms of his contract. He'd lose. Quickly. Edited September 17, 2014 by LedRush Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aikenrooster Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 If Adrian Peterson is found guilty of a crime, then, and only then, we can talk about the appropriate suspension. Where in the hell do you get this, Ken? His contract and his collective bargaining agreement are the documents that govern whether of not he can be suspended. A criminal finding may not be required. It's all in the legal agreements under which he is employed. No more privately contracted legal agreements for Ken. Now the government is in charge of my decisions on whether to hire, fire, or take disciplinary actions regarding my employees. Hold the phone a second. If you accuse me of violating contract, and I didn't violate contract; who gets to decide which one of us is in breach of that agreement? Now, we've got an investigation ongoing that is determining what Adrian Peterson did. Is it not the prudent action to wait and see what the results of that investigation are, before you act on his contract and potentially breach the terms of that agreement yourself?Who decides in international contracts.? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LedRush Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 If Adrian Peterson is found guilty of a crime, then, and only then, we can talk about the appropriate suspension. Where in the hell do you get this, Ken? His contract and his collective bargaining agreement are the documents that govern whether of not he can be suspended. A criminal finding may not be required. It's all in the legal agreements under which he is employed. No more privately contracted legal agreements for Ken. Now the government is in charge of my decisions on whether to hire, fire, or take disciplinary actions regarding my employees. Hold the phone a second. If you accuse me of violating contract, and I didn't violate contract; who gets to decide which one of us is in breach of that agreement? Now, we've got an investigation ongoing that is determining what Adrian Peterson did. Is it not the prudent action to wait and see what the results of that investigation are, before you act on his contract and potentially breach the terms of that agreement yourself?Who decides in international contracts.? There are usually choice of law provisions which explicitly state what international arbitration committee or which court of law would make the determination. In employment contracts, though, that is rarely an issue. For a code of conduct violation the company virtually always can make the determination themselves, though an arbitration system is sometimes established. But all of this is a sideshow. A company can make it's determination based on the facts it has at hand, and so can the arbitration vehicle. The idea that you'd need to wait for a court of law to weigh in is patently absurd. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aikenrooster Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 If Adrian Peterson is found guilty of a crime, then, and only then, we can talk about the appropriate suspension. Where in the hell do you get this, Ken? His contract and his collective bargaining agreement are the documents that govern whether of not he can be suspended. A criminal finding may not be required. It's all in the legal agreements under which he is employed. No more privately contracted legal agreements for Ken. Now the government is in charge of my decisions on whether to hire, fire, or take disciplinary actions regarding my employees. Hold the phone a second. If you accuse me of violating contract, and I didn't violate contract; who gets to decide which one of us is in breach of that agreement? Now, we've got an investigation ongoing that is determining what Adrian Peterson did. Is it not the prudent action to wait and see what the results of that investigation are, before you act on his contract and potentially breach the terms of that agreement yourself?Who decides in international contracts.? There are usually choice of law provisions which explicitly state what international arbitration committee or which court of law would make the determination. In employment contracts, though, that is rarely an issue. For a code of conduct violation the company virtually always can make the determination themselves, though an arbitration system is sometimes established. But all of this is a sideshow. A company can make it's determination based on the facts it has at hand, and so can the arbitration vehicle. The idea that you'd need to wait for a court of law to weigh in is patently absurd.Correct. Rules agreed to BEFOREHAND. Arbitration agreed to BEFOREHAND. No government needed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenJennings Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 And if the NFL does take any action against Peterson, I think he'd have every right to move for an injunction against their decision, in order to allow time for a legal ruling on whether or not he did violate the terms of his contract. He'd lose. Quickly. There is precedent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finding IT Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 If Adrian Peterson is found guilty of a crime, then, and only then, we can talk about the appropriate suspension. Where in the hell do you get this, Ken? His contract and his collective bargaining agreement are the documents that govern whether of not he can be suspended. A criminal finding may not be required. It's all in the legal agreements under which he is employed. No more privately contracted legal agreements for Ken. Now the government is in charge of my decisions on whether to hire, fire, or take disciplinary actions regarding my employees. Hold the phone a second. If you accuse me of violating contract, and I didn't violate contract; who gets to decide which one of us is in breach of that agreement? Now, we've got an investigation ongoing that is determining what Adrian Peterson did. Is it not the prudent action to wait and see what the results of that investigation are, before you act on his contract and potentially breach the terms of that agreement yourself? If you didn't violate the contract. My point is that a legal finding is not necessarily required to take action (based on whatever is in the contract and allowed under the collective bargaining agreement). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenJennings Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 (edited) If Adrian Peterson is found guilty of a crime, then, and only then, we can talk about the appropriate suspension. Where in the hell do you get this, Ken? His contract and his collective bargaining agreement are the documents that govern whether of not he can be suspended. A criminal finding may not be required. It's all in the legal agreements under which he is employed. No more privately contracted legal agreements for Ken. Now the government is in charge of my decisions on whether to hire, fire, or take disciplinary actions regarding my employees. Hold the phone a second. If you accuse me of violating contract, and I didn't violate contract; who gets to decide which one of us is in breach of that agreement? Now, we've got an investigation ongoing that is determining what Adrian Peterson did. Is it not the prudent action to wait and see what the results of that investigation are, before you act on his contract and potentially breach the terms of that agreement yourself? If you didn't violate the contract. My point is that a legal finding is not necessarily required to take action (based on whatever is in the contract and allowed under the collective bargaining agreement). I never meant to claim that it was. But I do think it's prudent to wait for legal finding, since the proceedings are already initiated anyways, and that essentially kills two birds with one stone. If he's found guilty, you have no question in acting within the bounds of the contract, and you can punish him as you deem appropriate. If he's found not guilty, you have no liability by having potentially acting wrongfully against an innocent party. Edited September 17, 2014 by KenJennings Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KenJennings Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Well... looks like the Vikings organization removed the spine they'd seemed to have developed, and proceeded to paint their bellies yella... AP's sitting out until he's exonerated. Great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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