Two0neOneTwo

excellent!

QUOTE (rushgoober @ Jun 23 2012, 09:15 PM) http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e85/rushgoober6/pantloadthread.jpg goobs! Thats funny as shit! lmao!

Good enough. No more mix/mastering talk from me. The music is strong! YEAY!

QUOTE (Terrapin @ Jun 23 2012, 08:33 PM) Apologies to everybody out there who are pretending to like this thing, but the songwriting, vocal melodies, song structures, arrangements are an example of a band that are completely devoid of any ideas as regards a musical future... The mastering is so bad that the individual instruments and vocals are difficult to hear. Quite obviously, to anybody with a pair of ears this album has been cut and pasted beyond belief and not particularly well No, it doesn't "Kick Ass" and no, it's not their best since... ? To be honest, I would prefer to read the novel than to have to listen to Pearts backing band trying to come up with some dodgy music in an effort to support his narrative. "In the fullness of time" this album will go down as sucking as much as the rest of the Rush catalogue since "Signals" I remember reading on this forum how great "Snakes and Arrows" was, only to be slagged of a few moths later, once the childish euphoria wore off.. CA is truly awful... you'll all agree with me in a few years - or through the "fullness" of time... I tell you what.....If anybody has been vocal about the mix/mastering its ME. I have good reasons for the way I feel about it because I've been in the studio before. I know what they did, and I know why they did it. Still, it is frustrating to know what it could have "been". However, I think your off your rocker if you think the music is bad. Your post is absurd. Individual taste aside, this is one monster album and I have to wonder if you've even given it a few listens yet. The mix/mastering is NOT that bad. Far from it. (Even if I'm on the side of "could be better") The music is fantastic and the judging from the Forums and reviews the consensus is the same. If your the lone little birdy who doesn't like it then, fly away. Ridiculous post. And no, i'm not pretending.

QUOTE (AndroidOnTheRun @ Jun 23 2012, 02:51 PM) QUOTE (Two0neOneTwo @ Jun 23 2012, 03:07 PM) QUOTE (Tick @ Jun 23 2012, 07:10 AM) Another thought to ponder.... Does anyone really think if Hold Your Fire was released now it would be hailed with the same love CA is getting? I think it would be getting ripped up personally. Not by all, but many. I also think if CA is released in 87 when Hold Your Fire was, it would have blown peoples minds. Yup, that's what me thinketh. Hey Tick, Yea your right but for the wrong reasons in my humble opinion. If HYF would have be released June 12 2012, the musicality of it would have never worked with the way mastering and mixing is done today. I think HYF would have torn up people ears. So yea, a failure for sure. If CA was released in 81 using Signals mastering/mixing techniques and equipment, it would have surpassed everything but Moving Pictures in my opinion. Yea, see? Thats what us whiners are saying. Tone the album down a bit so it isn't so hot/harsh. More sonic separation would be nice. Put MORE dynamic range in, that it currently has. I gotta say I would be curious to hear what HYF made today would sound like... one of my favorite albums. I know, I know, literally no one would agree with me. Whatever. TAI SHAN 2012 Nope, I agree. I happen to like Tai Shan. In my opinion, (hey Tick) SONICALLY any past album re-mixed/mastered to today's standards would destroy the album. Simple as that. I said before in another thread, it would be AMAZING if Rush would agree to an OPEN SOURCE album. Or...even just ONE Song. Release the master to those who have the EQ and skill and see who can take ONE album (or One Song) and make the "Best Rush" by a voting system based on Fan input. That would keep us forever busy.....lmao But hey, thats the kind of shit Rush fans love, the nerds we are. For example, We know Nick and Rich's take on Caravan, release the master to say 20-30 other's (who work for us) and see what we can do with it.

He still sucks at telling a story verbally. Patrick Stewart.....YES! Or Morgan Freeman. He's good too.

they should have had multiple hands pointing at every moment of the clock.

QUOTE (Jmo2112 @ Jun 23 2012, 03:00 PM) I figured. Could not find said threads. Anyone able to direct me to one? Sure, Heres a couple where we get into it a bit: My Webpage My Webpage

QUOTE (Tick @ Jun 23 2012, 02:26 PM)QUOTE (Two0neOneTwo @ Jun 23 2012, 03:07 PM) QUOTE (Tick @ Jun 23 2012, 07:10 AM) Another thought to ponder.... Does anyone really think if Hold Your Fire was released now it would be hailed with the same love CA is getting? I think it would be getting ripped up personally. Not by all, but many. I also think if CA is released in 87 when Hold Your Fire was, it would have blown peoples minds. Yup, that's what me thinketh. Hey Tick, Yea your right but for the wrong reasons in my humble opinion. If HYF would have be released June 12 2012, the musicality of it would have never worked with the way mastering and mixing is done today. I think HYF would have torn up people ears. So yea, a failure for sure. If CA was released in 81 using Signals mastering/mixing techniques and equipment, it would have surpassed everything but Moving Pictures in my opinion. Yea, see? Thats what us whiners are saying. Tone the album down a bit so it isn't so hot/harsh. More sonic separation would be nice. Put MORE dynamic range in, that it currently has. If you say sonic one more time I will find you and hurt you! Sonically? Audiocandy? Auditory? Sound waves? Audiosensoryorgasm? Any of those better?

QUOTE (Jmo2112 @ Jun 23 2012, 02:09 PM) Ok, I know some of you will think I'm just trying to stir the pot here but I ask this question simply because it has been on my mind a lot since I realized what a great album CA is. I currently rank it their best since Power Windows. I keep imagining these songs with the brilliant separation of sounds that Broon used to achieve. The production on those earlier albums really gave each member a lot of their own sonic space to work with. I then add in the character of the Rickenbacker, classic Gibsons, etc. and I wonder if CA could have been as amazing as MP or Hemispheres with Broon's magic touch. Jmo2112, While I wholeheartedly agree with you. There are a couple of threads already about this issue. Maybe you could jump in on those?

QUOTE (rushgoober @ Jun 22 2012, 11:06 PM) QUOTE (Two0neOneTwo @ Jun 22 2012, 04:36 PM) QUOTE (rushgoober @ Jun 22 2012, 02:52 PM) QUOTE (Tombstone Mountain @ Jun 22 2012, 07:11 AM) QUOTE (ucsteve667 @ Jun 22 2012, 08:30 AM) QUOTE (Tombstone Mountain @ Jun 22 2012, 08:02 AM) QUOTE (ucsteve667 @ Jun 20 2012, 04:41 PM) Thanks everyone, it was a lot of fun to do. there will def be more RUSHCASTS coming. Its so easy to talk about this band for over an hr. Hell, ive been doin it since I was 12. But its even harder to stop talking about this band. I cut out some, and could have talked for another hour no prob...Thanks again Goobs, Chris, and everyone fer listening My office listened to the entire show. everyone I work with knows that I'm a huge fan of the band who's been counting down the hours for this release. Now, we've all listened to the album multiple times together. The men and women I work with absolutely love this music--especially the harder edged rockers. The women's perspective was most interesting, especially when it came to your show. It was fun listening to your reactions to each other and to the music. The way you all explained your different appreciations for RUSH was at times (please take no offense) hilarious, annoying, insightful, and flabbergasting...which is why we liked it so much more upon further reflection. Enjoyed it! thank you very kindly. those were some nice words. I am curious...what flabberghatsed yas? the rest is completely understandable heh The whole sound thing. My favorite comment was: "boy, are those guys the wine and cheese crowd RUSH fans or what?" Obviously you guys are hearing things in the recording that bother you, and it's mostly a personal/production thing I suppose. We listen to this and hear so many nuances...we really just don't grasp what the fuss is about. We hear the instruments with great clarity, appreciate the wall of sound as a dynamic in this music, and find it not lacking for anything...in terms of sound. Anyway, relatively minor point but it caused a re-action on the female side I thought was amusing. THAT was the main point of contention! I thought it'd be more of a disagreement about the quality of different songs or our interpretations of them, etc. Anyway, like I said on the recording, the quality of the recording overall is a minor issue for me. "Anyway, like I said on the recording, the quality of the recording overall is a minor issue for me." Goober, I could see myself strangling you right now. My God Man! The Sound Quality is numero uno for a lot of us. I just don't understand how anyone could take such an important part of an album and say "meh" its a minor issue? No! no...no...no.... Come to the dark side goober........SQ is important! being completely honest, my stereo system is in storage (LONG story i won't go into here), so i've still never been able to hear it on really good equipment to know how it sounds optimally. the ways i have been able to hear it have made it sound decent, but not stellar, but at minimum it's acceptable. it was a far cry from the SQ of VT. what i'd really love is to see a waveform for this show where we talked about CA - i bet it's a heavily clipped brickwalled mess with no dynamic range whatsoever! Oh my. Dig it out. Its worth it.

QUOTE (bobkalka @ Jun 23 2012, 09:33 AM) A simple, unscientific observation - I'm a longtime (rock) musician who has a reasonably nice (German) car stereo that I've played 1000s of tunes through. As many of you probably do with yours, I've been able to find the 'sweet spot' of this stereo for what plays through it...in this case, Bass between 8-10 and Treble between 9-10 is that spot. There are two situations where those settings sound unmusicial - frankly horrible: * most of the recent (decade or so) King's X CDs - dUg stuffs his bass so loud and heavy in the mix that the stereo keels over in submission...have to pull it back to Bass 7 Treble 9. * Clockwork Angels. It is not musical until I dial it all the way back to Bass 5 Treble 7. Even at that level, at times when Ged's bass pedals kick it it still starts distorting. Don't get me wrong - I LOVE the tunes on CA, and I've seen the band about 20 times between the last four tours, so I'm a Rush apologist - they're my band. But (at least) the mastering is just simply BAD here. In fact, I had to laugh at that notice that Billy Corgan and Ged are going to do some interview where they talk about the' loudness wars' - wouldn't that be a trip to hear Ged say 'uh...the 'Big Bass' dude is example #1.' I also have a project recording studio, and when I heard CA through my iphone with good headphones - and after my musician son listened and commented how distorted it was - I was reminded of my amateur efforts with mastering plug-ins for the first year or two - it's really not hard to make music sound this harsh at 'normal' settings. I've seen the arguments that 'hey dude, just dial the EQ back and stop whining', but that doesn't do it for me - it's still less musical. Bring on the vinyl, I hear that mix is better! Peace... What we need is a technical breakdown of the Vinyl vs the cd. Seems to me, there shouldn't be that much of a difference since I don't "think" a separate master/mix was done. Like I said before, PLACEBO effect. I could be wrong.

QUOTE (Jmo2112 @ Jun 23 2012, 11:51 AM) Stunning album. I'm grateful everyday that my favorite band remains this vital. Yup, masterpiece of music. I have a feeling that once the novel is done and we can REALLY associate the songs with the story, its gonna become the best Album Rush has ever released. I can easily see a 12 or 13 part internet mini series happening. You never know, Sam Dunn, Scot McFadyen may have some ideas already brewing.

QUOTE (Tick @ Jun 23 2012, 07:10 AM) Another thought to ponder.... Does anyone really think if Hold Your Fire was released now it would be hailed with the same love CA is getting? I think it would be getting ripped up personally. Not by all, but many. I also think if CA is released in 87 when Hold Your Fire was, it would have blown peoples minds. Yup, that's what me thinketh. Hey Tick, Yea your right but for the wrong reasons in my humble opinion. If HYF would have be released June 12 2012, the musicality of it would have never worked with the way mastering and mixing is done today. I think HYF would have torn up people ears. So yea, a failure for sure. If CA was released in 81 using Signals mastering/mixing techniques and equipment, it would have surpassed everything but Moving Pictures in my opinion. Yea, see? Thats what us whiners are saying. Tone the album down a bit so it isn't so hot/harsh. More sonic separation would be nice. Put MORE dynamic range in, that it currently has.

Well, besides the already mentioned production values, I am REALLY falling in love with this Album. I find myself smiling more and more. After 50+ listen through's (with much fiddling) I am confident that at least for myself, I will continue to appreciate this album more and more as time goes on. Do i still wish for a more audiosensoryorgasm (edited for Tick) pleasing album? Yes. However, it is not "ruining" the music as bad as I feared it would. The music is just so strong.

QUOTE (micgtr71 @ Jun 22 2012, 07:17 PM) Ok, I am a vinyl fan. I purchased every album (except RTB through VT) in this format when they were released. The vinyl is much more dynamic and that may be due to the amplifier/speakers involved. First, I love the packaging. Heavy 180 gram discs are amazing. I love the clock showing 1 o'clock through 4 o'clock for the four sides. The gatefold brings me back to the glory days of vinyl. I almost wish the cover was a bit more ornate to use that medium a bit more. The sound is amazing. It is much more warm and dynamic. It doesn't feel like I am being hit in the face. Though it was almost 3 times the price of the cd opening week, I feel that it is worth it for the sound. This is Geddy's best bass sound in years. I just wanted to share this because it made me feel like I was a kid again. Anyone else get the vinyl and felt transported back to the days of your youth? Please share. Now I gotta get turn table.......dammit!

Any ugly plant can flower into a beautiful thing if one watches long enough. This album indeed, has great roots.

QUOTE (rushgoober @ Jun 22 2012, 02:52 PM) QUOTE (Tombstone Mountain @ Jun 22 2012, 07:11 AM) QUOTE (ucsteve667 @ Jun 22 2012, 08:30 AM) QUOTE (Tombstone Mountain @ Jun 22 2012, 08:02 AM) QUOTE (ucsteve667 @ Jun 20 2012, 04:41 PM) Thanks everyone, it was a lot of fun to do. there will def be more RUSHCASTS coming. Its so easy to talk about this band for over an hr. Hell, ive been doin it since I was 12. But its even harder to stop talking about this band. I cut out some, and could have talked for another hour no prob...Thanks again Goobs, Chris, and everyone fer listening My office listened to the entire show. everyone I work with knows that I'm a huge fan of the band who's been counting down the hours for this release. Now, we've all listened to the album multiple times together. The men and women I work with absolutely love this music--especially the harder edged rockers. The women's perspective was most interesting, especially when it came to your show. It was fun listening to your reactions to each other and to the music. The way you all explained your different appreciations for RUSH was at times (please take no offense) hilarious, annoying, insightful, and flabbergasting...which is why we liked it so much more upon further reflection. Enjoyed it! thank you very kindly. those were some nice words. I am curious...what flabberghatsed yas? the rest is completely understandable heh The whole sound thing. My favorite comment was: "boy, are those guys the wine and cheese crowd RUSH fans or what?" Obviously you guys are hearing things in the recording that bother you, and it's mostly a personal/production thing I suppose. We listen to this and hear so many nuances...we really just don't grasp what the fuss is about. We hear the instruments with great clarity, appreciate the wall of sound as a dynamic in this music, and find it not lacking for anything...in terms of sound. Anyway, relatively minor point but it caused a re-action on the female side I thought was amusing. THAT was the main point of contention! I thought it'd be more of a disagreement about the quality of different songs or our interpretations of them, etc. Anyway, like I said on the recording, the quality of the recording overall is a minor issue for me. "Anyway, like I said on the recording, the quality of the recording overall is a minor issue for me." Goober, I could see myself strangling you right now. My God Man! The Sound Quality is numero uno for a lot of us. I just don't understand how anyone could take such an important part of an album and say "meh" its a minor issue? No! no...no...no.... Come to the dark side goober........SQ is important!

I don't get it.....everyone knows Rush is evil. What a dumb pastor. He just gave Satan an A+. Gonna be hot soon for him.

QUOTE (Tick @ Jun 22 2012, 03:36 PM) QUOTE (Todem @ Jun 22 2012, 03:58 PM) I have them ranked right next to each other 9th(CA) and 10th(S&A) on my all time list. CA has the slight edge due to the flow and theme. I love the concept, and I love when Rush growl more than when they purr. Both albums though are very strong and they have not had a daily double like this since Power Windows and Hold Your Fire in my book. name 8 Rush albums better than CA? Better how? Musically or Sonically speaking? Musically: Hemispheres Power Windows Hold Your Fire Signals Permanent Waves Moving Pics Clockwork Angels Grace Under P Presto 2112 Counterparts Sonically; Everything up till Roll the bones is better sonically. Everything after gets progressively worse with VT being a horrific exception. VT is The worst even though it came before SnA, CA.

QUOTE (vespa2112 @ Jun 22 2012, 02:46 PM) QUOTE (CygnusX-1Bk2 @ Jun 22 2012, 02:39 PM) Her's an image from the Loudness Wars site depicting the dynamic ranges of various albums over the past 40 years. Green is good, red is bad obviously. And check out where CA appears on the DR chart. Note that vinyl version looks MUCH more promising. http://www.dr.loudness-war.info/index.php?search_artist=Rush stunning really........ No wonder why so many like the "original" sonic representation of Power Windows, Permanent Waves, Signals, ....etc... You can really see how it gets worse with each new mix/master. Unbelievable.

QUOTE (CygnusX-1Bk2 @ Jun 22 2012, 02:29 PM) I am sure they have a certain amount of control over the mix, as they are usually present for that, but that is rare as well. I know of many mix engineers who do not want the artist anywhere near a mix session because of the "more me" syndrome. The "we're gonna do what we're gonna do" applies more to the material and not so much the product that is the CD. I am sure that the record company was less than thrilled at the idea of a band in their late 50s making a concept album 30+ years after their last one. Other artists do not get this kind of consideration. Good point. But still..... blah.