marblesmike

QUOTE (Storm Shadow @ Jun 13 2012, 03:14 PM) I read all of losingit2k's posts with that "double rainbow all the way" guy's voice in my head. Who's the double rainbow guy? That sounds funny.

QUOTE (Gompers @ Jun 13 2012, 03:03 PM) QUOTE (ShlappinDahBass @ Jun 13 2012, 03:01 PM) I am so confused on what is going on in the forum post anymore. lol. All I know is that people do not understand the definition between a troll and a person with an honest opinion. Agreed very much. I mean, if me saying that I like the album but not the sonics is being a troll, then jeez. I thought a troll is someone who purposely eggs other people on to get a rise out of them?

QUOTE (They Bow Defeated @ Jun 13 2012, 02:53 PM) QUOTE (Rush Cocky @ Jun 13 2012, 12:12 PM) I love it. A thread completely and 100% dedicated to mocking trolls. The very same people who mock others prove that they can dish it out but not take it. Great thread! It's pretty funny how the trolls come in here of their own volition, post their rants and insults, and then complain about being labeled as trolls. Example?

vinyl rip samples here: https://rapidshare.com/files/2261581141/rus...nyl-samples.zip Made by me. I think they sound a decent amount better than the cd, but not amazing. I believe these are 24-96.

QUOTE (Rush Cocky @ Jun 13 2012, 02:29 PM) QUOTE (marblesmike @ Jun 13 2012, 01:22 PM) QUOTE (Rush Cocky @ Jun 13 2012, 01:19 PM) QUOTE (Mr. Henry Gale @ Jun 13 2012, 01:15 PM) So why are we listening to a crappier version of what was actually recorded? How do you KNOW that this statement is true? Again, I cannot see how such a statement is not 100% conjecture. Many seem to be imagining this perfect mix exists, when it's entirely conceivable that it does not. And I agree 100% with the OP: this album is the best Rush album in at least 25 years, I don't give a damn what the trolls think. They put it all together (finally) in this offering. Soak it in people, this is greatness on display. So a troll is someone who doesn't think CA is a perfect 10 across the board in songwriting and sonics? Grow up. And there could very well have been a better mix unless the recording engineers are incompetent too, which I doubt. The existence of better sounding production tells me that it could have been possible with this record. Oh I'm sorry, I need to grow up? The album has been officially out not even 2 days, and rather than enjoying what we've been waiting for 5 years for, the audiophiles are ready to throw it in the trash because it doesn't "sound right" whatever the hell that means. I'm sorry my obervations and questions offend your sensiblities. Maybe if you and your ilk would focus on addressing the observations and answering the questions asked, you'd have better success. I still contend that there is no perfect mix out there. And the only way you're going to be able to experience perfection is to see them live. Unless you're in to criticizing thir amplifier selection, I don't know. But what do I know, I need to grow up. OR.....maybe the one who REALLY needs to grow up is the one who runs out debate material and resorts to telling other people to grow up. Food for thought. You said it, not me. I said "grow up" because it seemed from your post that those who disagree with the 100% greatness that is CA is simply a troll. I don't know why I need to keep saying this-- I love the album and it's lack of sonic quality isn't keeping me from enjoying it. I'm just saying I could enjoy it more. I'm not throwing it in the trash. And for the record, I bought it on vinyl on Saturday at an indie show so I've been listening to it multiple times every day since then. I think that's enough time to formulate an opinion on whether or not I like the mix. Again, it's possible to like the album and dislike the mix too. Although this is nowhere near the mess that is VT, I liked the songs on that too despite it's sound quality.

QUOTE (ShlappinDahBass @ Jun 13 2012, 01:49 PM) QUOTE (marblesmike @ Jun 13 2012, 12:39 PM) QUOTE (marblesmike @ Jun 13 2012, 01:30 PM) QUOTE (ShlappinDahBass @ Jun 13 2012, 01:27 PM) QUOTE (marblesmike @ Jun 13 2012, 12:22 PM) QUOTE (Rush Cocky @ Jun 13 2012, 01:19 PM) QUOTE (Mr. Henry Gale @ Jun 13 2012, 01:15 PM) So why are we listening to a crappier version of what was actually recorded? How do you KNOW that this statement is true? Again, I cannot see how such a statement is not 100% conjecture. Many seem to be imagining this perfect mix exists, when it's entirely conceivable that it does not. And I agree 100% with the OP: this album is the best Rush album in at least 25 years, I don't give a damn what the trolls think. They put it all together (finally) in this offering. Soak it in people, this is greatness on display. So a troll is someone who doesn't think CA is a perfect 10 across the board in songwriting and sonics? Grow up. And there could very well have been a better mix unless the recording engineers are incompetent too, which I doubt. The existence of better sounding production tells me that it could have been possible with this record. Like I said...Chill pill. Chill pill = bury your head in the sand I don't understand why I would need a chill pill? Because I want the best quality, especially when I know it is possible? Should I just strive for mediocrity instead? This is a music-based discussion. Nothing I say or think here affects me so much as to warrant the taking of any medications. See, that's what I mean. If it's just a little bit less than "perfect" quality, people tend to start complaining. I'm just saying, man. Don't let one/two little problems in a few songs take away from your experience and call it "mediocre". It's Rush...Take it as it is. Enjoy the music. Is it possible to love the album but wish it sounded better?

QUOTE (marblesmike @ Jun 13 2012, 01:30 PM) QUOTE (ShlappinDahBass @ Jun 13 2012, 01:27 PM) QUOTE (marblesmike @ Jun 13 2012, 12:22 PM) QUOTE (Rush Cocky @ Jun 13 2012, 01:19 PM) QUOTE (Mr. Henry Gale @ Jun 13 2012, 01:15 PM) So why are we listening to a crappier version of what was actually recorded? How do you KNOW that this statement is true? Again, I cannot see how such a statement is not 100% conjecture. Many seem to be imagining this perfect mix exists, when it's entirely conceivable that it does not. And I agree 100% with the OP: this album is the best Rush album in at least 25 years, I don't give a damn what the trolls think. They put it all together (finally) in this offering. Soak it in people, this is greatness on display. So a troll is someone who doesn't think CA is a perfect 10 across the board in songwriting and sonics? Grow up. And there could very well have been a better mix unless the recording engineers are incompetent too, which I doubt. The existence of better sounding production tells me that it could have been possible with this record. Like I said...Chill pill. Chill pill = bury your head in the sand I don't understand why I would need a chill pill? Because I want the best quality, especially when I know it is possible? Should I just strive for mediocrity instead? This is a music-based discussion. Nothing I say or think here affects me so much as to warrant the taking of any medications.

QUOTE (Rush Cocky @ Jun 13 2012, 01:24 PM) QUOTE (marblesmike @ Jun 13 2012, 01:10 PM) when I hear an album that is musically awesome and sonically awesome simultaneously it really hits my musical g-spot and gives me an eargasm.... That too may end up in a signature. I'm glad I posted something worthy of being a signature hahaha. That comment was only semi-serious.

QUOTE (ShlappinDahBass @ Jun 13 2012, 01:27 PM) QUOTE (marblesmike @ Jun 13 2012, 12:22 PM) QUOTE (Rush Cocky @ Jun 13 2012, 01:19 PM) QUOTE (Mr. Henry Gale @ Jun 13 2012, 01:15 PM) So why are we listening to a crappier version of what was actually recorded? How do you KNOW that this statement is true? Again, I cannot see how such a statement is not 100% conjecture. Many seem to be imagining this perfect mix exists, when it's entirely conceivable that it does not. And I agree 100% with the OP: this album is the best Rush album in at least 25 years, I don't give a damn what the trolls think. They put it all together (finally) in this offering. Soak it in people, this is greatness on display. So a troll is someone who doesn't think CA is a perfect 10 across the board in songwriting and sonics? Grow up. And there could very well have been a better mix unless the recording engineers are incompetent too, which I doubt. The existence of better sounding production tells me that it could have been possible with this record. Like I said...Chill pill. Chill pill = bury your head in the sand

QUOTE (Rush Cocky @ Jun 13 2012, 01:19 PM) QUOTE (Mr. Henry Gale @ Jun 13 2012, 01:15 PM) So why are we listening to a crappier version of what was actually recorded? How do you KNOW that this statement is true? Again, I cannot see how such a statement is not 100% conjecture. Many seem to be imagining this perfect mix exists, when it's entirely conceivable that it does not. And I agree 100% with the OP: this album is the best Rush album in at least 25 years, I don't give a damn what the trolls think. They put it all together (finally) in this offering. Soak it in people, this is greatness on display. So a troll is someone who doesn't think CA is a perfect 10 across the board in songwriting and sonics? Grow up. And there could very well have been a better mix unless the recording engineers are incompetent too, which I doubt. The existence of better sounding production tells me that it could have been possible with this record.

QUOTE (ShlappinDahBass @ Jun 13 2012, 01:16 PM) THANK YOOOU! Our modern day society is so caught up in HD and quality that it blinds us from the real purpose. I mean, it's always nice to have good quality on music but some people need to take a chill pill. Sorry, some of us strive and want the best possible quality since we know it is attainable. Rush music this good should sonically sound as good as their better material. Not to mention that in many ways contemporary audio quality has really sunk in the crapper compared to well-mixed and mastered stuff from 20+ years ago.

My thoughts are all over this board on this and other sonic issues, but I voted yes. I'm not "good with it." I think it is a travesty that such a strong band effort is covered in thick sonic mud at times. But it hasn't stopped me from enjoying the album, as I've listened to it over 10 times thanks to my trusty vinyl rip. I'm so glad I have the dynamics of the vinyl because if I was stuck listening to the cd I'd probably not enjoy it as much.

QUOTE (Rush Cocky @ Jun 13 2012, 01:05 PM) I think the mix sounds great. I actually feel bad for those of you who are distracted by these alleged imperfections. I feel bad for myself. It's a curse at times, I swear. But man, when I hear an album that is musically awesome and sonically awesome simultaneously it really hits my musical g-spot and gives me an eargasm.... ....(that's terrible imagery, I'm sorry)

What exactly are you talking about? Where/when it this said?

QUOTE (Rush Cocky @ Jun 13 2012, 12:49 PM) QUOTE (Terrapin @ Jun 12 2012, 08:12 PM) I'm sorry, but the mastering is appalling. I'm a massive Fanboy or "Fanboi" whatever... but this thing sounds like a carefully executed fart trying to escape from a well weaved, 3-ply piece of perfumed toilet paper... Songs are great, performances are great as well. Such a shame, it could have been immense! To all those complaining about this issue..... To say it should have been mastered better implies that you have a "better" to compare it with. Unfortunately, we only have what Rush gives us. So how can you logically say this, when you have no basis for comparison for these songs? Or....maybe some of you audiophiles would like to take a shot at cleaning it up, post the results for us to hear, and then we WILL have a basis for comparison, and we can praise your efforts. Unless of course your remix sucks, and then it's no soup for you. Listen to the way any Porcupine Tree album sounds (or anything mixed/mastered by Steven Wilson from the last few years). That's my gold standard for what sounds good sonically. And his music is lush too--keyboards, piano, flute, sax, drums, multiple guitar parts, vocal harmonies, etc. Or if you want to use Rush as an example: MP, Signals, GuP, PoW, etc. While you may not love the keyboards, synths, etc, you can hear all instruments clearly without distortion.

QUOTE (losingit2k @ Jun 13 2012, 12:47 PM) QUOTE (marblesmike @ Jun 13 2012, 11:25 AM) QUOTE (losingit2k @ Jun 13 2012, 12:23 PM) QUOTE (Mr. Henry Gale @ Jun 13 2012, 11:09 AM) My biggest gripe with this album - is just the bass. I really do feel it's a bit muddy/bloated in spots. Especially if you have a subwoofer and a really nice set up. Maybe it's not as noticeable if you are using a laptop, or driving in the car. But if you have a nice set up, the bass is really overpowering and annoying in parts - as it will bleed into the vocals in a couple spots. But outside of that boomy bass, I don't really have any issues with how this album sounds. Some have said the vocals sound too low in the mix, but I think everything else (instruments, vocals) all sound more than fine. I think Mr. Henry Gale has a better grasp on the Sound for this album than most of the so called experts! Why is "sound" capitalized? So you would have something to post! I was just messing with you, jeez man.

QUOTE (malnar @ Jun 13 2012, 12:44 PM) QUOTE (marblesmike @ Jun 13 2012, 11:39 AM) QUOTE (malnar @ Jun 13 2012, 12:35 PM) QUOTE (marblesmike @ Jun 13 2012, 11:30 AM) QUOTE (malnar @ Jun 13 2012, 12:29 PM) QUOTE (Mr. Henry Gale @ Jun 13 2012, 11:13 AM) QUOTE (marblesmike @ Jun 13 2012, 08:11 AM) QUOTE (Mr. Henry Gale @ Jun 13 2012, 12:09 PM) My biggest gripe with this album - is just the bass. I really do feel it's a bit muddy/bloated in spots. Especially if you have a subwoofer and a really nice set up. Maybe it's not as noticeable if you are using a laptop, or driving in the car. But if you have a nice set up, the bass is really overpowering and annoying in spots - as it will bleed into the vocals in a couple spots. But outside of that boomy bass, I don't really have any issues with how this album sound. Some have said the vocals sound too low in the mix, but I think everything else (instruments, vocals) all sound more than fine. True. It's hard to listen to in my car (even my vinyl rip) because of my sub. I have a feeling most people listening to this are just listening on basic stereo units. So they aren't hearing the full power of the music (I know that sounds cheesy). But seriously, if you have a sub and the proper set up, you start to notice how some albums are way too loud. I just had to turn my subwoofer to - 10 to even it out. What's really annoying is, not every song has this problem (and sometimes the boomy bass just comes in certain spots, so not through out the entire song). So you would have to keep adjusting your settings. Just too much hassle. I just basically turn off my subwoofer when listening to this album. The boomy bass you're hearing is the taurus pedals utilized sporadically throughout the album. I know what it is, but that doesn't mean that it isn't unnecessarily loud. I didn't say it wasn't unnecessarily loud. I was just identifying the 'boomy bass'. Wanna hear bass pedals utilized well? Listen to Back in NYC by Genesis. The last verse has some low end kick in that sounds absolutely powerful without blowing out your sub (unless you're listening to the recent remixes). I've heard bass pedals utilized well on prior Rush albums. Oh I agree for sure, I just was mentioning the first thing that came to mind.

QUOTE (Mr. Henry Gale @ Jun 13 2012, 12:40 PM) My thing is, I don't think Clockwork Angels sounds bad. Let me make that clear. In fact, I think most will not notice any issues, because they aren't playing this out of a system that has dedicated power for bass - or a system that is beyond just your standard stereo unit (ie. Laptop, or basic stereo set up). We were talking about this in another thread when discussing FLAC/LOSSLESS vs. MP3. FLAC/Lossless (or CD) is kind of a moot point for a lot of people, because most people don't have the systems to really tap into the full quality of these. So let's say you download a LOSSLESS copy of CA and are playing it through laptop speakers (or through basic headphones). You literally would not be able to tell the difference between the CD/LOSSLESS and V0 (or 320) mp3 rip. The same goes for those that put losssless on their iPod. So there is a certain level of human hearing that just can't tell the difference - especially when you don't have the power to fully juice up the lossless source. Conversely, if you are playing CA (CD) in a car stereo, or again a basic CD unit, you wouldn't be able to tell the difference if you plugged in your iPod or had a 320 (or V0) MP3 version playing through those systems. So the point I'm arriving at is - the average listener (the basic consumer) is not going to have these issues. But the reason I complain about this (and not because I'm a hardcore audiophile. I do care about sound, but I'm not THAT batshit crazy like those people can be) - is because I do not think just because the album sounds competent (and isn't awful like VT with clipping and distortion) - it means it was mixed great. I do not think this can be objectively true, if you look at past albums (from Rush or other bands) that sound infinitely better. So do I think CA is unlistenable? No. Of course not. Do I think it sounds good (what really matters is the music itself, and what they wrote) - yes. But I don't think we can say this is a great mix. Because it's not true. The bass really is too loud and bloated in spots. And there are some other little nitpicks I have, but won't get into. And my thing is - there is no reason for any of this. It's not like the older you get, the less capable you are of mixing/mastering something. It's not like playing an instrument, where you can slow down, because your technical playing is no longer at its peak. These are studio practices, and there is no excuse for why so many producers mix this stuff this loud. I honestly ask anyone to A/B CA to any Signals for instance, and tell me CA sounds great. It will sound bloated and loud - whereas Signals will sound much more crisp and clear (a clear separation and representation of the instruments and vocals). Awesome post. You put it more eloquently than I could have. Except, you can tell the difference between lossless vs mp3 in the car or on a portable device--you just need high end speakers or headphones to do so. I have Infinities in my car and I can tell the difference between mp3 and lossless, but before I got those speakers and in other people's cars the difference was less earth shattering. The reason so much contemporary music is mixed/mastered so poorly is because most people don't listen to it dedicated settings (IE hi-fi system vs on an ipod on a train, etc) and therefore can't tell the difference.

QUOTE (malnar @ Jun 13 2012, 12:35 PM) QUOTE (marblesmike @ Jun 13 2012, 11:30 AM) QUOTE (malnar @ Jun 13 2012, 12:29 PM) QUOTE (Mr. Henry Gale @ Jun 13 2012, 11:13 AM) QUOTE (marblesmike @ Jun 13 2012, 08:11 AM) QUOTE (Mr. Henry Gale @ Jun 13 2012, 12:09 PM) My biggest gripe with this album - is just the bass. I really do feel it's a bit muddy/bloated in spots. Especially if you have a subwoofer and a really nice set up. Maybe it's not as noticeable if you are using a laptop, or driving in the car. But if you have a nice set up, the bass is really overpowering and annoying in spots - as it will bleed into the vocals in a couple spots. But outside of that boomy bass, I don't really have any issues with how this album sound. Some have said the vocals sound too low in the mix, but I think everything else (instruments, vocals) all sound more than fine. True. It's hard to listen to in my car (even my vinyl rip) because of my sub. I have a feeling most people listening to this are just listening on basic stereo units. So they aren't hearing the full power of the music (I know that sounds cheesy). But seriously, if you have a sub and the proper set up, you start to notice how some albums are way too loud. I just had to turn my subwoofer to - 10 to even it out. What's really annoying is, not every song has this problem (and sometimes the boomy bass just comes in certain spots, so not through out the entire song). So you would have to keep adjusting your settings. Just too much hassle. I just basically turn off my subwoofer when listening to this album. The boomy bass you're hearing is the taurus pedals utilized sporadically throughout the album. I know what it is, but that doesn't mean that it isn't unnecessarily loud. I didn't say it wasn't unnecessarily loud. I was just identifying the 'boomy bass'. Wanna hear bass pedals utilized well? Listen to Back in NYC by Genesis. The last verse has some low end kick in that sounds absolutely powerful without blowing out your sub (unless you're listening to the recent remixes).

QUOTE (malnar @ Jun 13 2012, 12:29 PM) QUOTE (Mr. Henry Gale @ Jun 13 2012, 11:13 AM) QUOTE (marblesmike @ Jun 13 2012, 08:11 AM) QUOTE (Mr. Henry Gale @ Jun 13 2012, 12:09 PM) My biggest gripe with this album - is just the bass. I really do feel it's a bit muddy/bloated in spots. Especially if you have a subwoofer and a really nice set up. Maybe it's not as noticeable if you are using a laptop, or driving in the car. But if you have a nice set up, the bass is really overpowering and annoying in spots - as it will bleed into the vocals in a couple spots. But outside of that boomy bass, I don't really have any issues with how this album sound. Some have said the vocals sound too low in the mix, but I think everything else (instruments, vocals) all sound more than fine. True. It's hard to listen to in my car (even my vinyl rip) because of my sub. I have a feeling most people listening to this are just listening on basic stereo units. So they aren't hearing the full power of the music (I know that sounds cheesy). But seriously, if you have a sub and the proper set up, you start to notice how some albums are way too loud. I just had to turn my subwoofer to - 10 to even it out. What's really annoying is, not every song has this problem (and sometimes the boomy bass just comes in certain spots, so not through out the entire song). So you would have to keep adjusting your settings. Just too much hassle. I just basically turn off my subwoofer when listening to this album. The boomy bass you're hearing is the taurus pedals utilized sporadically throughout the album. I know what it is, but that doesn't mean that it isn't unnecessarily loud.

QUOTE (ReflectedLight @ Jun 13 2012, 12:28 PM) QUOTE (marblesmike @ Jun 13 2012, 11:25 AM) QUOTE (losingit2k @ Jun 13 2012, 12:23 PM) QUOTE (Mr. Henry Gale @ Jun 13 2012, 11:09 AM) My biggest gripe with this album - is just the bass. I really do feel it's a bit muddy/bloated in spots. Especially if you have a subwoofer and a really nice set up. Maybe it's not as noticeable if you are using a laptop, or driving in the car. But if you have a nice set up, the bass is really overpowering and annoying in parts - as it will bleed into the vocals in a couple spots. But outside of that boomy bass, I don't really have any issues with how this album sounds. Some have said the vocals sound too low in the mix, but I think everything else (instruments, vocals) all sound more than fine. I think Mr. Henry Gale has a better grasp on the Sound for this album than most of the so called experts! Why is "sound" capitalized? grammar police! What's more offensive, being grammar police or calling people an a$$hole for disagreeing with me?

QUOTE (losingit2k @ Jun 13 2012, 12:23 PM) QUOTE (Mr. Henry Gale @ Jun 13 2012, 11:09 AM) My biggest gripe with this album - is just the bass. I really do feel it's a bit muddy/bloated in spots. Especially if you have a subwoofer and a really nice set up. Maybe it's not as noticeable if you are using a laptop, or driving in the car. But if you have a nice set up, the bass is really overpowering and annoying in parts - as it will bleed into the vocals in a couple spots. But outside of that boomy bass, I don't really have any issues with how this album sounds. Some have said the vocals sound too low in the mix, but I think everything else (instruments, vocals) all sound more than fine. I think Mr. Henry Gale has a better grasp on the Sound for this album than most of the so called experts! Why is "sound" capitalized?

QUOTE (ReflectedLight @ Jun 13 2012, 12:21 PM) QUOTE (marblesmike @ Jun 13 2012, 11:18 AM) QUOTE (ReflectedLight @ Jun 13 2012, 12:16 PM) anyone else listening on a ihome mini reachargeable speaker? Yeah CA rocks so awesome out of those! jk

QUOTE (ReflectedLight @ Jun 13 2012, 12:16 PM) anyone else listening on a ihome mini reachargeable speaker? Yeah CA rocks so awesome out of those!