melodic777

just think of Xanadu, and Hemispheres (a lot of them in that song during the main theme of Prelude), Red Barchetta when the guitar solo ends and he does a fill with the drums going into the last verse. Man there's a lot of examples. I love his playing though because even though it is scaler most of the time, he throws in dotted notes and rests to take away the same of 16th note "one e and a" fills as well as the quarter note ascends and descends.

fair enough.

its a message board, I'm glad you had fun, because its not much of a thing to me. WIth the other days' drama, of course, I'm getting snide shit my way......so I'll treat it as such. I don't lose my temper here in my house so if you think you've pulled my chain, you wouldn't know as I have a large thresh hold for bullshit But then again, if you were just messin with me and I am not your friend, then that means you are being a troll, something your people here don't like, so I guess a double standard eh?

QUOTE (Mandalorian Hunter @ Oct 21 2006, 06:01 PM) Hmmm. I can see that Ged's tone is muddy, but if he goes back to the Presto era bass, means Alex has to go there with his guitar sound, and that would just be crap. If a concert is all seated, i can understand people sitting and appreciating, i did for Tull, but standing, it's hard to just stand there for ages without being retarded. I'd like if we would be able to hear what the Presto bass sounded like if we were sitting in the control room of that studio while Geddy was recording because whoever engineered that one really f*cked it up. His tone was great but for that album and RTB, they rolled off everything under 400mhz it seems. Bass would've been brilliant had it had that God damn low pass filter off (I don't know if that was the case, but it sure did seem like it......and this goes for the drums as well) The entire album had the low end rolled off. Give Geddy that tone with some phatness but clean phatness, not garbled up bullshit, and use Alex's tone from say Limelight on R30 and then let them jam. No more of this crap sound he has. As I said and at this point I would give anything to work for free, not to meet Geddy so much, but so that I could hear his tone the way it should be, nice and clean, one last time before he retires at some point I'm guessing in the near few years. I actually didn't mind his tone on "My Favorite Headache" although I didn't really dig the album but the tone was good.

no, I did'nt change anything, I only further elaborated as we all well know the clapping etc was accompanied by screaming.

cool

QUOTE (Grace2Grace @ Oct 16 2006, 09:49 PM) I like that crazy form RHCP... come again?

QUOTE (melodic777 @ Oct 16 2006, 09:41 PM) See, I think his studio sound minus Moving Pictures when there was no bass on YYZ cause it sounded like a guitar with have distortion on......sounds good. But you don't take the engineer on the road with you so having your sound clean in the studio versus on the road can be two separate things. Geddy just hears what he hears. Everyone hears what they want. That guy in Korn thinks he has a good tone. I'd rather pound pencils into my eardrums and then chop my arms off and then feed myself to a pool of hungry alligators than play a bass like that guy with no technique, no tone, no purpose, and look like a total douche. But Geddy has some clean sounds. What I would have given to have heard a beefed up and more present, not thin, Wal sound like Presto but not pussed out like it was mixed in Presto on the Moving Pictures cd. and that is the producer and engineers fault. BUt again, Geddy has a say in his tone. Roll the Bones was the least present bass I've ever heard and that goes for bass drum as well. The whole spectrum was between 400hz and 10khz There was no bottom end, terrible sound and what a great album

See, I think his studio sound minus Moving Pictures when there was no bass on YYZ cause it sounded like a guitar with have distortion on......sounds good. But you don't take the engineer on the road with you so having your sound clean in the studio versus on the road can be two separate things. Geddy just hears what he hears. Everyone hears what they want. That guy in Korn thinks he has a good tone. I'd rather pound pencils into my eardrums and then chop my arms off and then feed myself to a pool of hungry alligators than play a bass like that guy with no technique, no tone, no purpose, and look like a total douche. But Geddy has some clean sounds. What I would have given to have heard a beefed up and more present, not thin, Wal sound like Presto but not pussed out like it was mixed in Presto on the Moving Pictures cd.

QUOTE (Necromancer @ Oct 16 2006, 08:28 PM) On dvd's. The point of the dvd isn't to JUST show play their tunes. The producers and other people that are part of the artistic creation of the DVD are trying to capture a moment in time and a FEEL. Most of us here have heard live and know what we like and which show may have sounded better than another. THAT particular night, in Rio, THE CROWD was a major part of THAT MOMENT IN TIME. It wasn't like every other show they play. So the band and producers, i'm sure, felt it wouldn't do the DVD justice to just have ANOTHER live recording of the band from stage view and crowd mixed out. If the point was just to do that, then it might as well be a lip synched, no crowd show. Know what I mean? I look at DVD concerts as almost a movie. The Rio dvd and R30 have two distinctly different feels and are shot completely different. DVD's are NOT all about the sound, but more the feeling of that particular moment in time. IMO actually, you watch a music dvd to hear and watch the music from the albums be performed, not to watch 60,000 people jump up and down like they're on crack. No, its not their fault for having that energy, they kicked ass and I wish I was Rush to experience that......however, That is for them to experience, I don't like that, I purchase music to listen to IT, not the crowd. If they SLIGHTLY, NOT COMPLETELY cut out the crowd a bit more.....the mix coulda been perfect and we would have had an excellent DVD that gave you that warm feeling as if you were there, yet, a feeling that, this is great, I can still hear the band playing unimpeded by loud people. Fridge, I agree to an extent. I don't find it egotistical to take credit for hard work. I walk the walk. Talk is cheap. If I go into an audition no matter what the format, I walk in there to get the job, and you know what? 9 outta 10 times that job is mine as soon as I plug in because I do possess the chops to hang with anyone on the planet, but I also have instilled in me by a great mentor, teacher, and friend (that will tell me my shit still stinks if need be), the wisdom to know when its not in context and to lay off. You are only as good as the band you play in and if you try to outshine, then its too much, whereas your job in a team should be to do your best to make others look good first and foremost. I'm a chopsmonster, however, I get misinterpreted from my conversations as someone who thinks chops only applies. That's not the case. Just like when I mention Dream Theater, automatically people who don't know much except for maybe "Pull Me Under" jump right on the bandwagon of ignorance and call Petrucci a shredder only, and the bassist overplays and the drummer is an egotistical asshole, and the singer doesn't know how to sing....... If those same people took the time to buy or download each song ever written post '92, they would be enlightened to see that their music has been ecclectic and not all shred, not feelingless and uninspiring..... Same with my playing. I have worked in a ton of bands and in different stylings, I go with the flow but I always make the music my own with my phrasing or fills that I seem to love to work in. Geddy's melodies made me fall in love with his bass playing and I am forever indebted to his influence, as it is one of the reasons I am so good at what I do. He opened doors to my perception in my approach to playing bass guitar. I don't care if I ever make a living off of music, my dream would be to have touched people the way he has and knowing I had part of shaping someone elses passion. That's a very powerful and priceless thing especially between strangers that will never meet. I had a kid approach me that I didn't even know when I was 22 who saw me gigging when I was 18 and I didn't know him from Jack and he said, "you're the reason I started playing bass after seeing what you did on bass that night" That's awesome. I was only an extension of what Geddy and so many other greats have given me. What a gift!

its sad if you're there to hear clapping, yelling, and hollering...... I go to concerts however, to enjoy the music and cheer between songs

QUOTE (GeddyRulz @ Oct 16 2006, 04:50 PM) As a bass player who was inspired to take up the instrument because of the Ged Man, I'll say the only bass tone of his that I dislike is the Steinberger sound on Grace Under Pressure. Geddy's other choices in instruments all seemed to cut through the mix in a way that could be heard, apart from the other instruments. (Particularly the Rickenbacker, which has such a unique and grungy tone that it should be considered an instrument of its own, and not a "bass" exactly. You can easily make out the individual bass part on most Rush songs, but not so much with the Steinberger. I can take or leave the red Wal and the Fender Jazz, but to me the best tone of Geddy's can be found with the black Wal and the Ric. And in concert, I wish Geddy would move back to amplifiers; his basslines don't cut through very well in live settings anymore, and I blame the house P.A. systems. Its not that, because you use amps on stage for stage sound when you don't use in ear systems (lest you are a guitarist and utilize feedback so you have the amps on stage for when you need that feedback). When you have amps on stage for stage sound, you aren't supposed to "come out of the PA" otherwise known as being louder than the PA. So it would defeat the PA's purpose if GEddy was playing his cabs louder than the PA. I think part of it is the rig he uses, the bass electronics, and how it is processed. The other half is the sound guy not brining him up enough in the mix because they are a trio so he should be just as strong as the guitar to fill up the space. The mud is the bass choice and a shitty rig with bad volume levels essentially. I would be willing to bet on it! Adding more stage sound would only make the stage and the front few rows even muddier

Rio, horrible DVD because the stupid crowd can't shut up and listen to the music. Part of the blame goes to Rush for not mixing the crowd out of it a lot more. When I listen to YYZ, I'm sorry,a crowd that thinks they have to be annoyingly obnoxious to show respect. I'm so psyched for Brazilians who got to see Rush but it is almost as irritating as when you go to see a band play a show and a soft song comes on and some moron starts clapping to the beat, and gets his follower morons to start clapping.......all of the sudden, you don't hear music, you hear clapping and not just that, sometimes the pace of the song is supposed to cross the bar line and not be right on beat, but if they are loud enough, then it can be heard through in ear monitors and possibly drag the band right onto the click of the tempo, ruining the feeling of the part(s). Sucks. Rio was terrible, they shoulda just mixed the band out, and we coulda just watched the crowd instead, because in watching, I thought Rush was just a halftime show at a soccer game.

QUOTE (Necromancer @ Oct 15 2006, 11:13 PM) QUOTE (Necromancer @ Oct 15 2006, 11:02 PM) QUOTE (melodic777 @ Oct 15 2006, 10:53 PM) QUOTE (Necromancer @ Oct 15 2006, 10:30 PM) QUOTE (Geds @ Oct 15 2006, 10:08 PM) Honest question, Random..... If you are SO bent over about TONE, and you don't think 4 strings is enough for a bass...... Why the hell aren't you a guitar player? I know this isn't for me, but I played bass because I had big hands and i really sucked at chording a little six string. Bass just suited my size more. But once I began to love bass, then I personally felt that too much bass could be a bad thing. I really don't care for the Steve Harris way of playing or even the guy from DT. I think it's too much and hurts the song. It's basically showing off and who needs it. I think most rockers realize that rock is guitar driven and we don't need excessive chording or soloing from Steve Harris or DeMaio from ManoWar. It winds up being bad. THAT i feel I know enough to comment on. Funny thing is that Myung only leaves the lower register when he has to jump up to add a voicing that accompanies the guitar or keys, sometimes to do unison work. Nothing personal but if you knew more about how bass works in an ensemble, then you would know that Myung's use in the context of Dream Theater is right on. He is never too much and always is doing what the song needs, just like Geddy does for Rush. I have yet to hear Myung do too much actually, I am always hoping he'll do more but he's got perfect balance in that project. Guess you know more than Tom Kennedy of the Dave Weckl band too where he plays 4s and 5 string basses and is all over them. But then you also know more than Stanley Clarke and Jaco Pastorious, Vic Wooten, Jeff Berlin, Chris Squire and others. I have been taught by my teacher that everything is in relation to the context of that given piece of music. An example of an excellent player in many different contexts. Just listen to his different tracks and one includes Derek Sherinian's Moonbabies. Berlin Rufus Philpot I don't feel that I know more than anyone, i'm just stating who and what I like. My buddy Tick on here has been trying to get me into DT and I've honestly tried, but I think they are all too big on the showing off stuff and not about the songs. When I played, I listened to anyone i could and i was blown away by Stanley Clarke, but just didn't get personally into that music or style of play. I like bass riffs and runs and holding together a good beat with the drums. I personally don't need the soloing and showing off. As much as I love bass, I find it better to listen to guitars show off than bass during a song. Now an occassional solo, that's different. I checked out all the links you posted and thought all were amazing. I've heard some of this stuff before, it's just not my cup of tea. In my days as a player, i admit I prolly couldn't even attempt this stuff, but also I never wanted to. Just not the type of bass playing i'm into. While Geddy is my all-time fave, he and are not my fave kind of music. Heavy metal is, so I played more in a thrash vein and really got into players like Cliff and Tom Araya actually. These days I love the playing of Justin Chancellor of Tool and one of my all time faves just cuz his sound is so distorted and cool is Pete Steele of Type O Negative. While I can listen to the stuff you linked for hours on end... i couldn't do it consistantly. It just bores me somehow after awhile. Nice Bassline and while some may call it showing off, it is a properly, in context piece of art. Oh, and don't think because people write intricate music that it means that is is "showing off". They just write music that way, they don't care about approval. Music is art, so who is anyone to judge and insert their own implication of what people are doing and why? I look at it this way, was ALex showing off in La Villa? No, he was playing what was necessary.

QUOTE (Necromancer @ Oct 15 2006, 10:30 PM) QUOTE (Geds @ Oct 15 2006, 10:08 PM) Honest question, Random..... If you are SO bent over about TONE, and you don't think 4 strings is enough for a bass...... Why the hell aren't you a guitar player? I know this isn't for me, but I played bass because I had big hands and i really sucked at chording a little six string. Bass just suited my size more. But once I began to love bass, then I personally felt that too much bass could be a bad thing. I really don't care for the Steve Harris way of playing or even the guy from DT. I think it's too much and hurts the song. It's basically showing off and who needs it. I think most rockers realize that rock is guitar driven and we don't need excessive chording or soloing from Steve Harris or DeMaio from ManoWar. It winds up being bad. THAT i feel I know enough to comment on. Funny thing is that Myung only leaves the lower register when he has to jump up to add a voicing that accompanies the guitar or keys, sometimes to do unison work. Nothing personal but if you knew more about how bass works in an ensemble, then you would know that Myung's use in the context of Dream Theater is right on. He is never too much and always is doing what the song needs, just like Geddy does for Rush. I have yet to hear Myung do too much actually, I am always hoping he'll do more but he's got perfect balance in that project. Guess you know more than Tom Kennedy of the Dave Weckl band too where he plays 4s and 5 string basses and is all over them. But then you also know more than Stanley Clarke and Jaco Pastorious, Vic Wooten, Jeff Berlin, Chris Squire and others. I have been taught by my teacher that everything is in relation to the context of that given piece of music. An example of an excellent player in many different contexts. Just listen to his different tracks and one includes Derek Sherinian's Moonbabies. Berlin Rufus Philpot

so I guess given your theory, Victor Wooten shouldn't be allowed on his 5 string and Bill Buddha Dickens shouldn't play his 7 or 9 strings, Tommy Kennedy shouldn't be allowed his 5 string? I am bent on tone because iwhen it sucks ts like talking to a hot chick and she opens up her mouth and has horrible breath and the worst hoarse voice when I know the chords but I am not a guitarist, I just know how to connect the dots and play the tensions to make the music sound cool. And given your attempt at antagonizing me, I guess you contradict yourself because you are saying basically with more strings, why am I a melodic player when that is a guitarists job........well, why don't you write fan mail to Geddy and ask him what the hell he is thinking on YYZ or anything else where he steps up in the register. See, I have more strings than 4 because I do more than just play Rush songs. I double chords up top, solo across the range, as well as play low end grooves. Everyone can do what they want, there is no right or wrong way, but that's my way and that's the only way that I care about!

I'd comment but too many here don't have the ability to be objective with their thoughts. Marcus Miller does have a nice tone, I'd say it could have to do with his EQ'ing and maybe whether or not he is playing active or passive electronics. Bass tone like guitar tone is important. But even if you have a great tone, you can be muddy depending on your technique and how clean you actually play your instrument. People like Necro unfortunately mistake objective opinions like, "I don't like Geddy's tone" as an insult to his master. Its not personal, he's one of my idols as well, but I'm at a point in my playing where I can comment on something as "subtle" as tone and you'd be surprised who something so subtle can have such a profound impact on the dynamics the bass can have in a song. If it all sounds muddy, it all sounds muddy, and I'd love to see Geddy's rig and settings to understand what is going wrong behind those curtains when I feel like everything I have ever loved him for: Show don't Tell solo Time Stand Still fills Mission unison with the Mallet Kat Turn the Page Big Money Where's my Thing Leave the Thing Alone Signals etc what a mess his tone makes of those tunes

QUOTE (Necromancer @ Aug 26 2006, 06:31 PM) QUOTE (tick @ Aug 25 2006, 10:31 PM) IF YOU WATCHED TONIGHTS DREAM THEATER CONCERT EXCERPTS AND DID'NT LIKE IT THEN YOU DONT LIKE DREAM THEATER ! I AGREE TANG, THOSE WERE THE TWO BEST. I CANT WAIT TILL MY COPY ARRIVES ! ! ! Stop shouting already. I watched it. I can dig some songs, but mostly I think they do too much at the expense of losing the song in favor of showing off. Too many virtuosoes in one band maybe? While there was a lot of HOLY f**k moments... the show for me... was boring. I fell asleep. This doesn't prevent me from trying to "get" their appeal. I'm still listening. The last album is growing on me. it isn't showing off......its called writing and performing music.

QUOTE (OneHalf-D @ Sep 12 2006, 06:27 PM) ...Agree to the above post. Score makes up for the poor performance on the Budokon disc and highlights DT on a very good night. J.LaBrie sounds better than he has in a very long time. Rush could learn a little something about producing a quality DVD from DT. To the person looking for more DT to buy, Scenes From A Memory is a must have. lol Are you serious? Poor performance? As a trained musician, I haven't really seen anything on that Budokan performance that would lead me to see anything less than about 99% perfect. I was at the NY show 2 weeks before the shoot in Japan and LaBrie was amazing both times as was the entire cast. I was at the Radio City show and it was great to see that although many people will say, "He couldn't have sung that good, there has to be overdubs", you can hear him like a 1/4 tone flat here or there (like 3 times the entire show) and the rest of the time LaBrie really was that sick, as was the rest of the guys. I can say this because like any Rush or DT fan and maybe moreso being a musician, I am highly analytical of performances. Plus I don't drink or do drugs so I know what I saw those nights. Poor Performance.......if you don't mind me asking, please, could you enlighten what the poor performance remark was based on? Is it because they didn't play enough old tunes? What they did play, they nailed. People aren't happy with the RCMH show because of the orchestra and what not - setlist. I didn't care much for the orchestra but moreso about sitting through 6 degrees when I've seen that all before and that's a big block of time that would have been nicely utilized on other tunes......however, I was only a part of that night. That night was their dream come true and they deserved to do what they thought was fitting for them. I was very pleased and after watching and listening to the Score stuff, I really have come to like the orchestrations added where they weren't before. Poor performance? lol some people, lol

QUOTE (Dreamline @ Dec 8 2005, 12:57 PM) I'm not a Portnoy fan - Neil would wipe the floor with him every time - Portnoy is just a Peart-wannabe Petrucci v. Lerxt? Too different to compare. I'd venture to suggest that Petrucci is a better soloist - but Alex has his strengths too so I won't judge on that one. Myung v. Ged? hard to separate technically. Ged wins by a mile in personality and stage presence though. Singers? Not a fan of La Brie myself - but then many people are put off by Ged's singing too (not me) .. .so hard to judge that one too. Where DT do come out on top is Jordan Rudess. That guy is a genius - but as he has no counterpart (pun intended) in Rush, againi its not a calid comparison. Can't compare apples and oranges. Also, you can't say that any member of Rush would wipe the floor with any member from DT. Technique and musical knowledge, DT is superior. peart could probably "wipe" the floor with Mike when it comes to Midi, triggering, xylophone and percussion. I would rethink that statement though if kept to acoustic drums. The Professor pioneered, but is definitely not the king anymore. That's alright, he has made HUGE contributions that without which, we wouldn't have the greats today inspired by the Professor. Geddy may have the personality, but Myung is a vastly different player and Geddy has terrible technique, but he has chops and gets the job done. He is also the front man, something Myung is not, so this is an irrelevant comparison. It wouldnt' matter if you had a "counterpart" in Rush that played keys. Jordan has no counterpart. whether you like him or not, He's a genius and there aren't any equaling that brilliance out now, and doubtfully for a long time to come. You can't train people to be prodigious