diatribein

I haven't logged on this board in a few months, but I did today after hearing the news, just to say:

 

Rest In Peace my reluctant friend. I know that your relationship with instant fanatic friends was always something that you never wanted thrust upon you, but I always liked your words and thought that I could have brought a little joy to your life had we had the chance. It would have been the least I could do, since you have brought me so much joy that I could never repay. Thank you for having the courage to be your unique self under the weight of the demands of people who only ever got to know you through your art. These things, your things, will live for a very long time. Thank you for leaving them here for us to enjoy. My best wishes are with the family you leave behind.

My preference would be for another album, because I feel like Clockwork Angels is their weakest effort in over 30 years. So if there is never going to be another album, I would have preferred Snakes & Arrows be the conclusion to a fine career. To me that is their strongest album since the 80s and a true creative high to go out on.

In Canada we had/have Much Music and they played Rush's videos on a regular basis.

 

In fact, the FIRST EVER VIDEO on MuchMusic when it went live (not the demo loop) was The Body Electric. And that pre-live loop I mentioned... one of the (5???) videos on the loop was Distant Early Warning. It was a great time to be a preteen discovering music in Canada! I remember the Mystic Rhythms video being almost constantly on in early 1986.

Grace Under Pressure

Power Windows

Snakes & Arrows

 

Bonus: Geddy Lee - My Favourite Headache

They'll definitely continue through MP, and I would bet they'd also do one for Signals, but a 40th box for GuP...idk if they'll go down that path, it might lead to a 40th box for like, RTB, and I can't see that doing too well.

 

I would be ALL OVER a 40th Anniversary Roll The Bones Box!!!

Finally the battle of what I consider to be the best post 80s RUSH album against the one that sadly eliminated synthesizers entirely from RUSH music. It is no secret which one of these I like better, but I know the general sentiment on the board is the opposite. I put "Remixed" in parenthesis because for the purpose of this battle a song from Vapor Trails is from either release. Here we go:

 

 

One Little Victory < Far Cry

Ceiling Unlimited > Armor and Sword

Ghost Rider < Workin' Them Angels

Peaceable Kingdom < The Larger Bowl

The Stars Look Down > Spindrift

How It Is > The Main Monkey Business

Vapor Trail < The Way The Wind Blows

Secret Touch > Hope

Earthshine < Faithless

Sweet Miracle < Bravest Face

Nocturne > Good News First

Freeze (Part IV of "Fear") > Malignant Narcissism

Out Of The Cradle < We Hold On

 

 

Win for Snakes & Arrows, but closer than expected at 7-6. The closest battle for me was at #3 where my favourite song from Vapor Trails loses to one of my favourites from Snakes & Arrows. That really illustrates how this battle format doesn't show the complete picture. On the surface the two albums appear close, but my favourite song from Vapor Trails wouldn't beat my fifth favourite off of Snakes & Arrows. Only one battle was won by a song I dislike and that is at #12, where Fear defeats instrumental #3. I just find instrumentals boring, and that for me is the one weakness of Snakes & Arrows. Lastly, since this is a thread created by me, I would appreciate not reading any more Bravest Face bashing. It is one of my all time (not just from this album or era) favourite RUSH songs. Those who hate it have made their opinions abundantly clear over and over and over again, so how about if you dislike the song just vote for Sweet Miracle and leave it at that. Parish notes on battle #10 expounding hate are not required.

The answer you are looking for is SNAKES & ARROWS!!!

I was all set to do a Rush vs. Fly By Night battle because I wanted to get in some earlier albums, but then the 3-way was posted. So I think I'll keep that in the can for later once the 3-way isn't so fresh. The classic albums are a little more difficult due to the few number of tracks. With that in mind, I got a little creative with this Caress Of Steel vs. 2112 match-up. In this battle, every section of an epic is considered a song that can win/lose a battle! Here we go:

 

01. Bastille Day > 2112: I. Overture

02. I Think I'm Going Bald < 2112: II. The Temples Of Syrinx

03. Lakeside Park > 2112: III: Discovery

04. The Necromancer: I. Into The Darkness < 2112: IV: Presentation

05. The Necromancer: II. Under The Shadow < 2112: V. Oracle: The Dream

06. The Necromancer: III. Return Of The Prince < 2112: VI. Soliloquy

07. The Fountain of Lamneth: I. In The Valley < 2112: VII. Grand Finale

08. The Fountain of Lamneth: II. Didacts And Narpets < A Passage to Bangkok

09. The Fountain of Lamneth: III. No One At The Bridge < The Twilight Zone

10. The Fountain of Lamneth: IV. Panacea < Lessons

11. The Fountain of Lamneth: V. Bacchus Plateau < Tears

12. The Fountain of Lamneth: VI. The Fountain < Something For Nothing

 

10 - 2 for 2112. My results are really boring since I do not like anything on Caress Of Steel other than my two winners. One thing that lines up nicely though is that my favourite from Caress does battle with my least favourite part of 2112. I don't actually like The Twilight Zone, Lessons, or Tears, but almost anything trounces any part of The Fountain of Lamneth for me. Sorry Caress Of Steel lovers, this is not the kind of RUSH music I am into. The closest battle was #1 for me. I do like Overture despite it being an instrumental and Bastille Day isn't my favourite from Caress Of Steel, but in the end I still feel like it is a little better.

Way to steal my thunder, man! :tsk:

 

I was working up to doing some battles with these albums, but I wanted to space it out a little so we can enjoy the battles for a bit longer. Either way, I like this game so:

 

 

Finding My Way | Anthem < Subdivisions

Need Some Love | Best I Can < Analog Kid

Take a Friend < Beneath, Between, & Behind > Chemistry

Here Again < By-Tor & the Snow Dog ≥ Digital Man

What You’re Doing < Fly By Night < The Weapon

In The Mood | Making Memories < New World Man

Before and After | Rivendell < Losing It

Working Man > In the End | Countdown

 

 

It really is not a contest when any 70s RUSH album goes against anything from the 80s onward so this result was never in doubt. 1 for Rush, 2 for Fly By Night, and 5 for the win for Signals. It wasn't even that close, because Digital Man vs. By-Tor & The Snow Dog was a toss up for me. Convenient that the only song I really love from the first album goes up against one of the two I do not like on Signals so it doesn't go scoreless.

Apparently I missed this matchup. And a tough one it is. I like or love everything on these albums.

 

Distant Early Warning > The Big Money

Afterimage > Grand Designs

Red Sector A > Manhattan Project

The Enemy Within < Marathon

The Body Electric < Territories

Kid Gloves < Middletown Dreams

Red Lenses < Emotion Detector

Between The Wheels > Mystic Rhythms

 

Shut out in the first three matchups, PoW comes back with 4 in a row. GUP steals the final match to tie the game.

 

Final score...

Grace Under Pressure: 4

Power Windows: 4

 

I have the same score as you with the EXACT opposite choices!

I have to say, one of the elements of music I least pay attention to are the drums. I prefer music with drums, but have difficulty appreciating the nuances of different drummers or performances. One of the things I disliked about heavy metal as a genre of music, was the fact that concerts would often be stopped for some inane drum solo. It always feels like such a complete waste of time. We could get a whole other song if not for the damn drum solo. I feel the same way about live performance guitar & bass solos where the band vacates the stage so that a musician can twiddle for a while. Still, nothing was worse than a drum solo. If I had assigned seats, it was 100% guaranteed pee time!

 

All that said, I gave this question the respect it deserves and listened to many songs specifically for the drums. I took a lot of time to carefully pay attention to drumming I felt was unique or special and really brought something interesting to the song. The conclusion I came to may not be popular on the board. My favourite drum performance on any RUSH album is Red Lenses on Grace Under Pressure. The drumming on it is amazing and it includes a small drum solo that not only doesn't take away from the song, but adds to it. I feel like the drumming on that song is so full and interesting that you could strip it down to just vocals and drums and still have a song. Granted it wouldn't be as good, because the other elements work perfectly, but I feel like the drums are the driving force and heartbeat of that song. I know it is one of the ones that is largely hated here, but in my opinion the drumming on it is spectacular.

This thread has been a lot kinder than I expected. Thanks to everyone for being cool.

Still kind of annoys me they didn't reissue the 45 in this box.

 

1000% AGREE!

 

I did not bother to buy this thing, because I am not one for re-issues. I like the originals more. The only thing that would have gotten me to buy it is if it came with the Not Fade Away / You Can't Fight It single. I know the band want to disown those two tracks, but honestly plenty of fans have the songs anyway and all this is doing is making it so they have to have crappy youtube sourced rips from old 7" Singles. They aren't doing anything but hurting fans by making it impossible for them to purchase the music.

Time for the gluttons for punishment to get some pain in. Expect the haters to have their knives out and for a shitton "All Counterparts except Driven". Obviously, this is not the case for me. I consider Test For Echo to be significantly better than Counterparts, although it should be interesting to see by how much in a track by track battle.

 

Animate < Test For Echo

Stick It Out < Driven

Cut To The Chase < Half The World

Nobody's Hero ≤ The Color Of Right

Between Sun & Moon > Time And Motion

Alien Shore ≥ Totem

The Speed Of Love < Dog Years

Double Agent < Virtuality

Leave That Thing Alone < Resist

Cold Fire > Limbo

Everyday Glory < Carve Away The Stone

 

8 to 3 win for Test For Echo. This is no real surprise for me. There are very few songs on Test For Echo that I do not like. Interestingly one of the two songs I dislike on Test For Echo won its battle, Dog Years. I am not one to sit here insulting RUSH songs like others, but I have to say that was a real dog of a battle! The close ones were #4 and #6. I love Nobody's Hero & Totem, but both Alien Shore and The Color Of Right are always favourites of mine when they pop up on my playlists. I really identify with the lyrics of The Color Of Right. The song means a lot to me.

 

I also want to praise one of the songs that receives the most hate on this board. Virtuality is one of my favourite songs, not only from this era, but overall by the band. And it isn't just the awesome guitar riff that I love, I really like the lyrics. I know people constantly bitch about the "net boy, net girl, send your message around the world, put your message in a modem and throw it in the cyber sea..." line, but I think it is not only cute, but actually not so dated that it should be criticized. Yes, yes... more messages sent through the internet via cell phone towers today, but the line speaks to the constant changing of the ways we communicate, but that fundamental human contact remains the same. The methods of communication are always evolving even though the messages don't change significantly. I don't hear criticism for 867-5309/Jenny. I don't hear criticisms for the countless songs from the 60s written about writing letters to love interests. The message in the song is actually pretty timeless to me!

 

Anyway... let's get the hate started. I'm sure many of you are salivating at the opportunity to hurl insults at the 16th album by your alleged favourite band.

01. Test for Echo

02. Roll the Bones

03. Power Windows

04. Presto

05. Hemispheres

06. Moving Pictures

07. Fly by Night

08. Snakes & Arrows

09. A Farewell to Kings

10. Grace Under Pressure

11. Counterparts

12. Permanent Waves

13. Hold Your Fire (Opportunity lost here. I love the inner sleeve photo of the man juggling fireballs. Should have gone with that.)

14. Feedback

15. Vapor Trails

16. Signals

17. Clockwork Angels

18. 2112

19. Caress of Steel

20. RUSH

Of course I didn't say anything about Criss's involvement in writing or playing on Unmasked. A bit to the contrary - I said lack of interest which would suggest a lack of inolvement . But he was displayed in the artwork and as mentioned in the Shandi video when they were trying to pretend they were still a band. Of course this wasn't the point of the post was it? Wasn't Unmasked an album that no 2 members actually played on any given song? One of the things I admire about Rush is the absence of this bs. All bass on a Rush album - played by Ged, all guitars - Alex and all drums - Neil. Honesty and integrity - something Rush had in spades and KISS had virtually none. They were fun for a while though.

 

I think you'll find that goes waaaay further back than Unmasked. As I said, Peter didn't play on Dynasty except for Dirty Livin, Ace didn't play on Alive II Side 4, except for Rocket Ride, and obviously no one played or sang on Beth except for Peter Criss. Plenty of the songs from Dressed To Kill onward had the involvement of only 3 or fewer of the band members although all of them up until Alive II had most of them being involved in one way or another. I was in the studio with them when they were recording Revenge and one of the days I was in Bruce Kulick was laying down the Bass on one of Gene's signature tracks (Domino). I'm pretty sure the ONLY thing Gene did on that song was sing and write it, of course. I know for a fact that Paul didn't play on any of Gene's songs from at least Love Gun and I am not sure how much he played on his songs on Rock And Roll Over or even Destroyer beyond God Of Thunder which was his song. He occasionally sang background vocals obviously. All four of them were always more invested in their own songs than the ones written by the others, except for maybe Ace because he did do most of the solos up until Love Gun.

 

RUSH is obviously nothing like this. ALL 3 of them play on every song that has been recorded by the band. The only way they are similar is the voting block thing, which is probably a big reason why Neil is so distant and not as interested. Geddy & Alex are lifelong friends who tend to want more similar things than Neil. I'm sure they do a better job of including Neil than Paul & Gene did Ace (mostly because Gene Simmons is a horrible person), but it is pretty obvious that Neil sometimes feels like the odd man out.

Peter appeared in the video for Shandi. So he did participate in the promotion of Unmasked to a small degree.

 

Oh yeah! I forgot about that! You are right. That is the last appearance of Peter Criss. Very similar to Ace on the I Love It Loud video.

A 6 to 4 win for RtB over HYF. I really like Roll the Bones, so I'm not surprised at all. I like the reviled You Bet Your Life a lot, but I also like High Water- so that was close for me because they are good songs rather than because they are bad.

 

Prime Mover is my favorite across both albums, followed by Dreamline. The race was close, both albums have tracks I love and tracks I never bother to listen to. No surprises here and honestly if HYF had won that really wouldn't be a surprise either.

 

Force Ten < Dreamline

Time Stand Still > Bravado

Open Secrets < Roll The Bones

Second Nature < Face Up

Prime Mover > Where's My Thing?

Lock And Key > The Big Wheel

Mission < Heresy

Turn The Page > Ghost Of A Chance

Tai Shan < Neurotica

High Water < You Bet Your Life

 

Nice!

 

We are very, very close. Prime Mover is also my favourite of all here and I love most of the songs you like on Roll The Bones too. I think our only real disagreement is Heresy, because I also love Face Up and it was a difficult choice for me on that one.

I don't think there are any bad Rush albums because of one underlying fact - every time those guys went into the studio to create the next record, there was an honest effort to do a good record. To challenge themselves a bit and not retread conquered territory. Of course not every record was great or better than the last, but the bedrock of integrity meant there were no disasters. T4E and RTB are my least faves and I still really like half the material

 

That argument could be made for almost every album ever.

 

Naw - often there are contractual obligation records or bands with serious drug/alcohol problems or bands coming apart at the seems. Sure within that frame work someone is giving it their all but not everyone was pulling their weight or gave a crap. A couple of examples off the top of my head. KISS - Unmasked. The band was in tatters Peter and Ace were caring less and less, Gene had his mind on an acting career and the results show it. Deep Purple - House of Blue LIght, again the band was coming apart and the album doesn't have the feel of its' predecessor. Or the contractually obligated April Wine record "Walking Through Fire" Pee-ew. You get the idea.

 

My point was that Rush unlike so many of their contemporaries - were remarkably professional and consistent in their approach to creating their art and their catalogue reflects that by having no trash albums. As previously suggested, not every record was a masterpiece but all have something good to offer. JUst an opinion there are no facts to debate. You or others may think Unmasked is a great record or Zeppelin's In Through the Out Door is a classic

 

As a recovering KISS fan ( I was a huge fan for most of my youth) I have to just correct some inaccuracies in what you said. Peter Criss played NO PART of the writing, recording, promotion, or touring on Unmasked. He left the band entirely after the Dynasty tour. All of the drums on Unmasked (and Dynasty except Dirty Livin) were played by Anton Fig, who was friends with Ace Frehley and played on his solo album as well as Frehley's Comet. Upon completion of the album, KISS auditioned drummers and selected Eric Carr who would play a one off show with the band at the Palladium in NYC before heading off to Europe for a promotional and concert tour. The extent of Peter's involvement with the band was being depicted in the cartoon on the cover. This was mostly a contractual thing due to him still having a share of the band.

 

As far as Ace goes, Dynasty & Unmasked represent a time when he was MOST ENGAGED with the band. He wrote 3 songs for Unmasked (high water mark) and 2 for Dynasty, plus taking the lead singing duties and being entirely responsible for the band covering the Rolling Stones song 2000 Man. Arguably, Torpedo Girl, Talk To Me, and Two Sides of the Coin are amongst Frehleys best contributions to the band and in many ways was keeping them afloat at the time. Talk To Me was the second single in most territories and the biggest hit from the album in Australia and several European countries. The reason Unmasked failed in the United States (it was a hit in Europe & Australia) had a lot more to do with the fact that they were being viewed as an out of date kiddy band in part due to the merchandising overload and that most of the Dynasty tour shows had many a preteen in attendance! Simply put, it became very unfashionable to like KISS in 1980. It is possible that many people also disliked the music on Unmasked, but Ace, Paul, and even Gene were still very engaged with the music at that point.

 

That leads me to another inaccuracy: Gene Simmons' acting career did NOT start until the end of the Lick It Up tour. His first non-KISS related acting credit was Runaway which filmed and was released in 1984. The first album that really suffers due to Gene's disinterest and neglect is Animalize, where Gene's songs are a bunch of castoffs from the Wendy O. Williams album W.O.W.. Gene would be disinterested until Hot In The Shade, using reworked Paul songs (Love's A Deadly Weapon) and more W.O.W. cast offs like Thief In The Night. In fact, it was Gene who was the driving force behind the album that followed Unmasked. Recording the concept album (Music From) The Elder was pushed by Gene. The band had seen the drop off in sales in the US for the last two albums and Paul and Ace wanted to go in a more heavy rock direction (Don't Run by Ace and the Paul songs Nowhere To Run, Partners In Crime, Down On Your Knees, I'm A Legend Tonight, and Deadly Weapon), but Gene felt convinced that an arty concept album was the thing that would restore them to prominence. Personally I think their image was so tarnished at this time that nothing they would have released would have sold.

 

Either way, it was the ultimate direction of the music on (Music From) The Elder that left Ace disinterested and wanting to leave along with the fact that Eric Carr had no say in the band or the direction. Gene & Paul were best friends and even though they disagreed on the direction to take in 1981, Paul ultimately sided with Gene over Ace despite also wanting to take a more heavy direction. This left Ace feeling like there was no argument that he would ever win in the band as constituted at the time. He left after the very short promotional tour for The Elder. Paul and Gene still tried to court him back, but Ace was not interested and only appeared in the I Love It Loud video and album cover to fulfill contractual obligations. Even after leaving, both he and Peter still had 25% shares of the band and it was to Ace's advantage to have Creatures Of The Night succeed. Paul and Gene felt like that meant keeping the illusion of Ace still being in the band, so he played along.

 

All this to say that you may not like Unmasked along with a whole host of other people who count themselves as KISS fans, but the music written for the album has nothing to do with disinterest by the 3 members of the band or Gene's, still 4 years away, acting career. I also doubt anyone ever bought a Kiss album for Dirty Livin, Hooligan, or because of the drumming, so Peter being actually gone (without anyone knowing it) was not a factor either.

A battle of two of the most under-praised albums in their career. I suspect that the red one will win easily for most people here, considering it is the last album of an era that is still held in fairly high esteem on this board. Skipping albums again because these two line up well in terms of number of tracks and relative popularity (or lack there of) with regulars. Here are my choices:

 

Force Ten < Dreamline

Time Stand Still > Bravado

Open Secrets < Roll The Bones

Second Nature ≥ Face Up

Prime Mover > Where's My Thing? (Part IV, "Gangster Of Boats" Trilogy)

Lock And Key > The Big Wheel

Mission > Heresy

Turn The Page > Ghost Of A Chance

Tai Shan < Neurotica

High Water < You Bet Your Life

 

Very strange 6 - 4 win for Hold Your Fire for me ONLY because of the match-ups. Had Lock And Key & Mission gone up against 7 of the remaining 8 on Roll The Bones they would have lost, but instead they battle against two of the three songs I dislike on Roll The Bones. The closest battle on here is track 4 where Second Nature wins only due to the stellar lyrics. Along with Neurotica these are some of my all time favourite Neil Peart lyrics. The most lopsided battle of all the battles so far is track #5, where my favourite song from all 20 on offer destroys the song I like least out of these choices. Still, overall I do like Roll The Bones as an album better. If we were doing a straight up Top 10 from these 20, Roll The Bones wins 6 - 4.

I still dont listen to either as much as I listen to T4E. Yeah, Im that guy.

 

I'll do the battle for you soon, but expect really disheartening results!

 

RtB vs T4E? Lol

 

 

Na... I'll do Counterparts vs. Test For Echo, but I think you'll be pretty unhappy. They only like Driven here.

I still dont listen to either as much as I listen to T4E. Yeah, Im that guy.

 

I'll do the battle for you soon, but expect really disheartening results!

Mixing it up a bit by pitting two albums that aren't consecutive, but I did that for a reason. The documented hate for Roll The Bones & Test For Echo on this forum would make for a depressing and predictable result. The fact that Roll The Bones has 10 songs also makes it a little more challenging. I will pit it against another 10 song album soon, though. Anyway...

 

 

Show Don't Tell > Animate

Chain Lightning > Stick It Out

The Pass > Cut to the Chase

War Paint < Nobody's Hero

Scars < Between Sun & Moon

Presto > Alien Shore

Superconductor > The Speed of Love

Anagram (For Mongo) < Double Agent

Red Tide > Leave That Thing Alone

Hand Over Fist ≤ Cold Fire

Available Light < Everyday Glory

 

Win for Presto by the closest of margins, 6 - 5. Very close battle at #10. I really like Hand Over Fist, but in the end decided on Cold Fire. As much as I love Alien Shore (it's my 3rd favourite on Counterparts) nothing on either of these albums is beating out Presto (song) which is my favourite song out of all the ones on offer here.

2112 < A Farewell To Kings

A Passage To Bangkok > Xanadu

The Twilight Zone < Closer To The Heart

Lessons < Cinderella Man

Tears < Madrigal

Something For Nothing > Cygnus X-1

 

 

4 to 2 win for Kings over 2112. If it was just Overture & The Temples of Syrinx vs. A Farewell To Kings (song) it would have been a dead heat, but there is a reason why A Farewell To Kings is my favourite RUSH album released in the 1970s.

It's weird for me. In 1993 I was so disappointed by Counterparts after Roll The Bones (an album I loved then and still do now) that I didn't give it that many listens and very few beyond Side A (Alien Shore was track #1 on Side B of the original vinyl). It was only in the last couple of years, when I went back and did a reassessment of all the albums, that I discovered how much I really liked Alien Shore. I now count it as one of my 3 favourites on Counterparts along with Between Sun & Moon and Nobody's Hero.