mother of all machines Posted August 7, 2015 Share Posted August 7, 2015 http://media.giphy.com/media/5eM4x8fxZNzPO/giphy.gif "Cruising under your radar, watching from the sattelites."I was thinking the same. Reminds me the video a lot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyBlaze Posted August 7, 2015 Share Posted August 7, 2015 http://media.giphy.com/media/5eM4x8fxZNzPO/giphy.gif "Cruising under your radar, watching from the sattelites."I was thinking the same. Reminds me the video a lotIt IS taken directly from there. It's no coincidence Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyBlaze Posted August 7, 2015 Share Posted August 7, 2015 For those that don't know, I've lived in Japan for over a decade. And one thing in particular that has always disturbed me about Japanese is that many have no knowledge of WW2. Of course, they know of the bombs but MANY do NOT know about Japan's invasion/occupation of mainland Asia and some of the Pacific islands and all the blood that it entails. I've asked many of my J-friends how they don't know this and the answer is ALWAYS...ALWAYS: "We didn't study it in school." That's an extremely disturbing thing to me. Anyway, I don't want this to turn into a political discussion but I always think about this especially in the first week of August. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WorkingAllTheTime Posted August 7, 2015 Share Posted August 7, 2015 http://media.giphy.com/media/5eM4x8fxZNzPO/giphy.gif ^This. Great movie. A couple of years ago, I found a half dozen copies of it on DVD in a value bin (something like $2.50 a pop) at some store. I bought them all to have and give to like minded friends. Peter Sellers absolutely kills in it. So does George C. Scott. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
x1yyz Posted August 7, 2015 Share Posted August 7, 2015 For those that don't know, I've lived in Japan for over a decade. And one thing in particular that has always disturbed me about Japanese is that many have no knowledge of WW2. Of course, they know of the bombs but MANY do NOT know about Japan's invasion/occupation of mainland Asia and some of the Pacific islands and all the blood that it entails. I've asked many of my J-friends how they don't know this and the answer is ALWAYS...ALWAYS: "We didn't study it in school." That's an extremely disturbing thing to me. Anyway, I don't want this to turn into a political discussion but I always think about this especially in the first week of August. Here in the US we've been deceived about history in a similar way. When I was a kid we never learned about the Vietnam or Korean wars, and we learned that that Native Americans freely cooperated with the white "discoverers" of America. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyBlaze Posted August 7, 2015 Share Posted August 7, 2015 For those that don't know, I've lived in Japan for over a decade. And one thing in particular that has always disturbed me about Japanese is that many have no knowledge of WW2. Of course, they know of the bombs but MANY do NOT know about Japan's invasion/occupation of mainland Asia and some of the Pacific islands and all the blood that it entails. I've asked many of my J-friends how they don't know this and the answer is ALWAYS...ALWAYS: "We didn't study it in school." That's an extremely disturbing thing to me. Anyway, I don't want this to turn into a political discussion but I always think about this especially in the first week of August. Here in the US we've been deceived about history in a similar way. When I was a kid we never learned about the Vietnam or Korean wars, and we learned that that Native Americans freely cooperated with the white "discoverers" of America.I'm American. And you're right about those things. But sorry I believe this is different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
x1yyz Posted August 7, 2015 Share Posted August 7, 2015 For those that don't know, I've lived in Japan for over a decade. And one thing in particular that has always disturbed me about Japanese is that many have no knowledge of WW2. Of course, they know of the bombs but MANY do NOT know about Japan's invasion/occupation of mainland Asia and some of the Pacific islands and all the blood that it entails. I've asked many of my J-friends how they don't know this and the answer is ALWAYS...ALWAYS: "We didn't study it in school." That's an extremely disturbing thing to me. Anyway, I don't want this to turn into a political discussion but I always think about this especially in the first week of August. Here in the US we've been deceived about history in a similar way. When I was a kid we never learned about the Vietnam or Korean wars, and we learned that that Native Americans freely cooperated with the white "discoverers" of America.I'm American. And you're right about those things. But sorry I believe this is different. I'm curious, how is it different? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Principled Man Posted August 7, 2015 Share Posted August 7, 2015 For those that don't know, I've lived in Japan for over a decade. And one thing in particular that has always disturbed me about Japanese is that many have no knowledge of WW2. Of course, they know of the bombs but MANY do NOT know about Japan's invasion/occupation of mainland Asia and some of the Pacific islands and all the blood that it entails. I've asked many of my J-friends how they don't know this and the answer is ALWAYS...ALWAYS: "We didn't study it in school." That's an extremely disturbing thing to me. Anyway, I don't want this to turn into a political discussion but I always think about this especially in the first week of August. Here in the US we've been deceived about history in a similar way. When I was a kid we never learned about the Vietnam or Korean wars, and we learned that that Native Americans freely cooperated with the white "discoverers" of America. I'm American. And you're right about those things. But sorry I believe this is different. I'm curious, how is it different? I see little difference. Depending on who is in Power at the time, schools will teach a certain "interpretation" of national history and world history. This is true for every nation and country on Earth. It could be that Japan is just not ready to address its past crimes. Here in the USA, we're still struggling with our past crimes. We're still arguing over them, we're still debating what is still relevant and what we're truly "guilty" of doing. Nationalistic pride is often so strong that people simply won't admit to having committed any crimes - past or present. It definitely happens in this country. It can happen anywhere. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Barchetta Posted August 7, 2015 Share Posted August 7, 2015 Love Bomb------The Tubes UnderratedI actually never knew they had a song besides "She's a Beauty." Wow! Buddy! The Tubes are huge out here in the Bay Area! "Talk To Ya Later" is great! "Sushi Girl!" But the all time classics are "What Do You Want From Life?" and "WHITE PUNKS ON DOPE!"I wouldn't doubt it. I've loved "She's a Beauty" since the first time I heard it as a wee lad. That's just all I've ever heard. Perhaps I should do a little Youtube digging. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canadianice Posted August 7, 2015 Share Posted August 7, 2015 Love Bomb------The Tubes UnderratedI actually never knew they had a song besides "She's a Beauty." Wow! Buddy! The Tubes are huge out here in the Bay Area! "Talk To Ya Later" is great! "Sushi Girl!" But the all time classics are "What Do You Want From Life?" and "WHITE PUNKS ON DOPE!"I wouldn't doubt it. I've loved "She's a Beauty" since the first time I heard it as a wee lad. That's just all I've ever heard. Perhaps I should do a little Youtube digging. Or a baby,s arm holding an apple Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyBlaze Posted August 8, 2015 Share Posted August 8, 2015 For those that don't know, I've lived in Japan for over a decade. And one thing in particular that has always disturbed me about Japanese is that many have no knowledge of WW2. Of course, they know of the bombs but MANY do NOT know about Japan's invasion/occupation of mainland Asia and some of the Pacific islands and all the blood that it entails. I've asked many of my J-friends how they don't know this and the answer is ALWAYS...ALWAYS: "We didn't study it in school." That's an extremely disturbing thing to me. Anyway, I don't want this to turn into a political discussion but I always think about this especially in the first week of August. Here in the US we've been deceived about history in a similar way. When I was a kid we never learned about the Vietnam or Korean wars, and we learned that that Native Americans freely cooperated with the white "discoverers" of America. I'm American. And you're right about those things. But sorry I believe this is different. I'm curious, how is it different? I see little difference. Depending on who is in Power at the time, schools will teach a certain "interpretation" of national history and world history. This is true for every nation and country on Earth. It could be that Japan is just not ready to address its past crimes. Here in the USA, we're still struggling with our past crimes. We're still arguing over them, we're still debating what is still relevant and what we're truly "guilty" of doing. Nationalistic pride is often so strong that people simply won't admit to having committed any crimes - past or present. It definitely happens in this country. It can happen anywhere.Hard to explain. And I agree with everything you said...especially about "not ready to address its past crimes". I guess it's a "difference of degrees". But stateside I've never seen any vans driving around any major city blaring things on loudspeakers about national pride and how great the country would be without foreigners. Maybe that happens at a city rally but not on a usual basis and probably not driving around the city (like here in Osaka and other cities). I'd expect this in China actually but not Japan. And those vans I'm talking about are permanently painted a certain way with the old school rising sun J-flag. But whatever, free country and all that. Still, to be constantly reminded that I shouldn't be here (even though it's just coming from a minority far right wing faction) is...disturbing. The national pride in the U.S. doesn't reach these levels. It just doesn't. But like I said, this is just a matter of degrees. One point that's hard for us westerners to understand is the intensity of what "saving face" means in Asia ESPECIALLY Japan. Understandably, there's a lot of deep-rooted feelings of shame that many Japanese feel. As a result, it affects virtually everything including the education system. I don't expect anyone to completely understand what I'm saying. It's not exactly easy to describe another nation's understanding of itself. Think about this: MANY J-high schoolers (and I've worked at six different ones) can't even come close to guessing the WW2 years or which countries were involved besides Japan, the U.S., and Germany. While I've lived here, I've tried to steer away from this topic but when it's touched upon it's shocking what's not known. And yeah, I'm fully aware of my fellow Americans ignorance on historical topics too. "It can happen anywhere" is a phrase I hear often. But these intensity levels that I mentioned before make it a huge difference. "Hazukashii" is one of the first Japanese words I learned. No matter the topic, I hear it nearly every day even now. It means "embarassed/ashamed". 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boston_E Posted August 8, 2015 Share Posted August 8, 2015 I cannot fathom the weight on Truman's shoulders when he made his final decision. He, more than likely, saved millions of lives. That being said, his decision resulted in the deaths of hundreds of thousands of civilian lives. Unimaginable... I would imagine his thought process went something like this: If I don't do anything the total loss is unknown but likely half a millionIf we invade at least a half million dieIf I drop the bomb a hundred thousand or so die per bomb and it is likely they will surrender (unimaginable that they didn't immediately surrender after the first one). Hmm.. if I drop the bomb a couple of hundred thousand is better than a half a million. Better that they die than our guys. Drop it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perchance to Dream Posted August 8, 2015 Author Share Posted August 8, 2015 I cannot fathom the weight on Truman's shoulders when he made his final decision. He, more than likely, saved millions of lives. That being said, his decision resulted in the deaths of hundreds of thousands of civilian lives. Unimaginable... I would imagine his thought process went something like this: If I don't do anything the total loss is unknown but likely half a millionIf we invade at least a half million dieIf I drop the bomb a hundred thousand or so die per bomb and it is likely they will surrender (unimaginable that they didn't immediately surrender after the first one). Hmm.. if I drop the bomb a couple of hundred thousand is better than a half a million. Better that they die than our guys. Drop it.Possibly. At this point,I'll keep my opinion to myself. Wouldn't want to nuke my own thread, ya know? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Principled Man Posted August 8, 2015 Share Posted August 8, 2015 I cannot fathom the weight on Truman's shoulders when he made his final decision. He, more than likely, saved millions of lives. That being said, his decision resulted in the deaths of hundreds of thousands of civilian lives. Unimaginable... I would imagine his thought process went something like this: If I don't do anything the total loss is unknown but likely half a millionIf we invade at least a half million dieIf I drop the bomb a hundred thousand or so die per bomb and it is likely they will surrender (unimaginable that they didn't immediately surrender after the first one). Hmm.. if I drop the bomb a couple of hundred thousand is better than a half a million. Better that they die than our guys. Drop it. Imagination is not necessary. We can go by the historical facts. Every major Allied commander opposed dropping the Bomb on Japanese cities.By 1945, the USA and USSR were already waist deep in Cold War maneuvering and brinksmanship. The West was deathly afraid of Stalin invading Europe after the War was over. Secretary of State James Brynes was a fierce supporter of taking a strong hand with the Soviets. He directly advised Truman that dropping the Bomb on Japan would help dictate terms with Stalin after the War. Truman postponed the Trinity test from early 1945 to the day before the Potsdam Conference in the summer. Truman literally danced in joy the night before the conference, after learning of the successful detonation of the Bomb. He brought the news directly to Stalin, who was unmoved. The Soviets had already known about the USA's atomic program. Truman's bid to intimidate Stalin failed utterly. After the war ended, Truman, in explaining why he ordered the atomic bombings, would always cite FIRST the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor as well as atrocities committed by the Japanese military. He would then cite the widely-varying estimated numbers of casualties in a future invasion of Japan. Not once did he cite the real reason for dropping the Bombs - Cold War political posturing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perchance to Dream Posted August 8, 2015 Author Share Posted August 8, 2015 BOOM!!!! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Principled Man Posted August 8, 2015 Share Posted August 8, 2015 For those that don't know, I've lived in Japan for over a decade. And one thing in particular that has always disturbed me about Japanese is that many have no knowledge of WW2. Of course, they know of the bombs but MANY do NOT know about Japan's invasion/occupation of mainland Asia and some of the Pacific islands and all the blood that it entails. I've asked many of my J-friends how they don't know this and the answer is ALWAYS...ALWAYS: "We didn't study it in school." That's an extremely disturbing thing to me. Anyway, I don't want this to turn into a political discussion but I always think about this especially in the first week of August. Here in the US we've been deceived about history in a similar way. When I was a kid we never learned about the Vietnam or Korean wars, and we learned that that Native Americans freely cooperated with the white "discoverers" of America. I'm American. And you're right about those things. But sorry I believe this is different. I'm curious, how is it different? I see little difference. Depending on who is in Power at the time, schools will teach a certain "interpretation" of national history and world history. This is true for every nation and country on Earth. It could be that Japan is just not ready to address its past crimes. Here in the USA, we're still struggling with our past crimes. We're still arguing over them, we're still debating what is still relevant and what we're truly "guilty" of doing. Nationalistic pride is often so strong that people simply won't admit to having committed any crimes - past or present. It definitely happens in this country. It can happen anywhere.Hard to explain. And I agree with everything you said...especially about "not ready to address its past crimes". I guess it's a "difference of degrees". But stateside I've never seen any vans driving around any major city blaring things on loudspeakers about national pride and how great the country would be without foreigners. Maybe that happens at a city rally but not on a usual basis and probably not driving around the city (like here in Osaka and other cities). I'd expect this in China actually but not Japan. And those vans I'm talking about are permanently painted a certain way with the old school rising sun J-flag. But whatever, free country and all that. Still, to be constantly reminded that I shouldn't be here (even though it's just coming from a minority far right wing faction) is...disturbing. The national pride in the U.S. doesn't reach these levels. It just doesn't. But like I said, this is just a matter of degrees. One point that's hard for us westerners to understand is the intensity of what "saving face" means in Asia ESPECIALLY Japan. Understandably, there's a lot of deep-rooted feelings of shame that many Japanese feel. As a result, it affects virtually everything including the education system. I don't expect anyone to completely understand what I'm saying. It's not exactly easy to describe another nation's understanding of itself. Think about this: MANY J-high schoolers (and I've worked at six different ones) can't even come close to guessing the WW2 years or which countries were involved besides Japan, the U.S., and Germany. While I've lived here, I've tried to steer away from this topic but when it's touched upon it's shocking what's not known. And yeah, I'm fully aware of my fellow Americans ignorance on historical topics too. "It can happen anywhere" is a phrase I hear often. But these intensity levels that I mentioned before make it a huge difference. "Hazukashii" is one of the first Japanese words I learned. No matter the topic, I hear it nearly every day even now. It means "embarassed/ashamed". I totally believe your observations on the Japanese code of honor and shame. The Samurai took it to epic levels. Nationalistic extremists like Le Front National in France, the KKK and Aryan Nation in the USA, and neo-Nazis in Germany, still infect the West. They ain't going away anytime soon.... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyBlaze Posted August 8, 2015 Share Posted August 8, 2015 For those that don't know, I've lived in Japan for over a decade. And one thing in particular that has always disturbed me about Japanese is that many have no knowledge of WW2. Of course, they know of the bombs but MANY do NOT know about Japan's invasion/occupation of mainland Asia and some of the Pacific islands and all the blood that it entails. I've asked many of my J-friends how they don't know this and the answer is ALWAYS...ALWAYS: "We didn't study it in school." That's an extremely disturbing thing to me. Anyway, I don't want this to turn into a political discussion but I always think about this especially in the first week of August. Here in the US we've been deceived about history in a similar way. When I was a kid we never learned about the Vietnam or Korean wars, and we learned that that Native Americans freely cooperated with the white "discoverers" of America. I'm American. And you're right about those things. But sorry I believe this is different. I'm curious, how is it different? I see little difference. Depending on who is in Power at the time, schools will teach a certain "interpretation" of national history and world history. This is true for every nation and country on Earth. It could be that Japan is just not ready to address its past crimes. Here in the USA, we're still struggling with our past crimes. We're still arguing over them, we're still debating what is still relevant and what we're truly "guilty" of doing. Nationalistic pride is often so strong that people simply won't admit to having committed any crimes - past or present. It definitely happens in this country. It can happen anywhere.Hard to explain. And I agree with everything you said...especially about "not ready to address its past crimes". I guess it's a "difference of degrees". But stateside I've never seen any vans driving around any major city blaring things on loudspeakers about national pride and how great the country would be without foreigners. Maybe that happens at a city rally but not on a usual basis and probably not driving around the city (like here in Osaka and other cities). I'd expect this in China actually but not Japan. And those vans I'm talking about are permanently painted a certain way with the old school rising sun J-flag. But whatever, free country and all that. Still, to be constantly reminded that I shouldn't be here (even though it's just coming from a minority far right wing faction) is...disturbing. The national pride in the U.S. doesn't reach these levels. It just doesn't. But like I said, this is just a matter of degrees. One point that's hard for us westerners to understand is the intensity of what "saving face" means in Asia ESPECIALLY Japan. Understandably, there's a lot of deep-rooted feelings of shame that many Japanese feel. As a result, it affects virtually everything including the education system. I don't expect anyone to completely understand what I'm saying. It's not exactly easy to describe another nation's understanding of itself. Think about this: MANY J-high schoolers (and I've worked at six different ones) can't even come close to guessing the WW2 years or which countries were involved besides Japan, the U.S., and Germany. While I've lived here, I've tried to steer away from this topic but when it's touched upon it's shocking what's not known. And yeah, I'm fully aware of my fellow Americans ignorance on historical topics too. "It can happen anywhere" is a phrase I hear often. But these intensity levels that I mentioned before make it a huge difference. "Hazukashii" is one of the first Japanese words I learned. No matter the topic, I hear it nearly every day even now. It means "embarassed/ashamed". I totally believe your observations on the Japanese code of honor and shame. The Samurai took it to epic levels. Nationalistic extremists like Le Front National in France, the KKK and Aryan Nation in the USA, and neo-Nazis in Germany, still infect the West. They ain't going away anytime soon.... Yeah, that's pretty depressing when I think too long about the infections you just mentioned. Come to think of it, yesterday when I was walking in the city center I saw/heard one of those vans that I mentioned blaring (it's loud as hell) their nonsense. As I stood at the crosswalk standing next to an Aussie couple (tourists), I heard the woman say "I wonder what that's about." Didn't bother to tell them; I didn't want to ruin their vacation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goose Posted August 8, 2015 Share Posted August 8, 2015 http://media.giphy.com/media/5eM4x8fxZNzPO/giphy.gif ^This. Great movie. A couple of years ago, I found a half dozen copies of it on DVD in a value bin (something like $2.50 a pop) at some store. I bought them all to have and give to like minded friends. Peter Sellers absolutely kills in it. So does George C. Scott.One of the great films of all time. Just outstanding character acting! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tombstone Mountain Posted August 8, 2015 Share Posted August 8, 2015 http://media.giphy.com/media/5eM4x8fxZNzPO/giphy.gif ^This. Great movie. A couple of years ago, I found a half dozen copies of it on DVD in a value bin (something like $2.50 a pop) at some store. I bought them all to have and give to like minded friends. Peter Sellers absolutely kills in it. So does George C. Scott.One of the great films of all time. Just outstanding character acting!Gotta check this out guys. Awesome materialhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XfJTld0baG4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perchance to Dream Posted August 8, 2015 Author Share Posted August 8, 2015 I wasn't aware that the Japanese extreme "right" are still flying the flag (rising sun with rays) to this day. All symbols associated with the Nazi party were ruled to be illegal in Germany after their capitulation. Of course, even though politically incorrect, the Confederate battle flag is still legal to fly in the United States. You learn something new everyday... So, yeah. "Manhattan Project". Hellava song, yes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyBlaze Posted August 8, 2015 Share Posted August 8, 2015 I wasn't aware that the Japanese extreme "right" are still flying the flag (rising sun with rays) to this day. Look for their black vans with that flag on the side. There will be a large megaphone somewhere on the van too. Occasionally you might see one of those yahoos on some street corner talking his smack but the vans are more likely to be spotted. They were much more prevalent around 2001-2002 when I arrived. Then I rarely saw them between 2006-2012. But the last couple of years I've seen them much more but not as often as when I first arrived. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Digital Dad Posted August 8, 2015 Share Posted August 8, 2015 http://media.giphy.com/media/5eM4x8fxZNzPO/giphy.gif ^This. Great movie. A couple of years ago, I found a half dozen copies of it on DVD in a value bin (something like $2.50 a pop) at some store. I bought them all to have and give to like minded friends. Peter Sellers absolutely kills in it. So does George C. Scott.One of the great films of all time. Just outstanding character acting!Gotta check this out guys. Awesome materialhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XfJTld0baG4 You can't fight in here this is the War Room. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goose Posted August 8, 2015 Share Posted August 8, 2015 http://media.giphy.com/media/5eM4x8fxZNzPO/giphy.gif ^This. Great movie. A couple of years ago, I found a half dozen copies of it on DVD in a value bin (something like $2.50 a pop) at some store. I bought them all to have and give to like minded friends. Peter Sellers absolutely kills in it. So does George C. Scott.One of the great films of all time. Just outstanding character acting!Gotta check this out guys. Awesome materialhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XfJTld0baG4 You can't fight in here this is the War Room. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Partialgrace Posted August 8, 2015 Share Posted August 8, 2015 I want to quote but it's coming too long, so I quit.Quite interesting view and I think as one Japanese, you quite hit the point JohnnyBlaze.It's a shame most of us don't know what our elder generation had done to neighboring countries, esp China and Korea. Around this time of the year, many TV programs and Newspaper articles about the War, but I'm afraid "what we've done to the others" and "who had started at first" seems to be always left out. I kind of know but can't say I understand completely. The knowledge that I have comes from words of my parents and in-laws who knows the war in person. I fear the memories are going to die eventually as the old generations passing. Guide the future by the past. But to know the past exactly what was happend, not one-sided nor twisted. But sadly it's hard to get. Oh and the right-wing cars are truly annoying. They are extremely right-wing war-worshiping people,very vocal but extreme minority too. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyBlaze Posted August 8, 2015 Share Posted August 8, 2015 I want to quote but it's coming too long, so I quit.Quite interesting view and I think as one Japanese, you quite hit the point JohnnyBlaze.It's a shame most of us don't know what our elder generation had done to neighboring countries, esp China and Korea. Around this time of the year, many TV programs and Newspaper articles about the War, but I'm afraid "what we've done to the others" and "who had started at first" seems to be always left out. I kind of know but can't say I understand completely. The knowledge that I have comes from words of my parents and in-laws who knows the war in person. I fear the memories are going to die eventually as the old generations passing. Guide the future by the past. But to know the past exactly what was happend, not one-sided nor twisted. But sadly it's hard to get. Oh and the right-wing cars are truly annoying. They are extremely right-wing war-worshiping people,very vocal but extreme minority too.Very good to hear from you. And yes it's very important to note that those right wing vehicles are in the extreme minority as you stated. I've noticed them in some areas more than others probably due to similar reasons why there are more KKK in certain areas stateside. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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