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R40 Leg 2


losingit2k
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As a fan, it's hard to accept and understand Neil's behavior, if true.

 

It's not the desire to retire or to spend time with his family.

 

It's the apparent fact that he knew he would be done but then was passive aggressive and arguably unprofessional. It would have been fine to say, "guys, we have x more shows, and I am DONE. For good." Not think it to HIMSELF and then not say anything clear.

 

Of course, from a marketing perspective, they're leaving tons of money and markets on the table.

 

Hope he gets restless next spring and changes his mind. Maybe fly with the guys and forget the arduous way he travels...

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As a fan, it's hard to accept and understand Neil's behavior, if true.

 

It's not the desire to retire or to spend time with his family.

 

It's the apparent fact that he knew he would be done but then was passive aggressive and arguably unprofessional. It would have been fine to say, "guys, we have x more shows, and I am DONE. For good." Not think it to HIMSELF and then not say anything clear.

 

Of course, from a marketing perspective, they're leaving tons of money and markets on the table.

 

Hope he gets restless next spring and changes his mind. Maybe fly with the guys and forget the arduous way he travels...

 

But how does anyone know what Neil was saying or doing behind the scenes? Are there spy reports?

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I've said this before and I will say it again. You are projecting.

I'm not sure in what context you mean. If you mean that I'm projecting feelings that were not only visually obvious, but were also verbally spoken to me then yes, I'm projecting...

 

FOH, you said geddy/alex were frustrated, there was animosity… was this like evident with them during the tour? I know you said they won't say anything bad about each other publicly, and I know alex saying something about how he didn't mind the whole situation with neil not wanting to tour in an interview. But you are saying really backstage both guys are pretty pissed at him?

To think that G&A are not miffed by the situation would be naive. The inner circle, including Neil, are well aware of how they feel. There was a picture I posted a while back (someone else did too) that showed one of their last walks to the stage and it's very telling, IMO. Taken from behind, it shows Neil leading, followed by G&A walking next to each other. Neil appears as happy as a pig in shite, while G&A, not so much. Towards the end of the tour, Neil had a few shirts made - a picture taken of him from behind, riding his bike with his arms raised in the air (in victorious fashion) and a big red circle with a line through it covering the whole thing. The caption was something like, "the end of the road". He presented them to G&A and Alex promptly threw his in the nearest trash can. Of course, they have/would never let their feelings be known publicly, but this was not a fairy tale ending. There was no celebration together - no final night out together, as one might expect. Even at the end of tour bash, there was no touching moment where they all hugged, thanked each other for the amazing ride, and no heartfelt goodbyes. It just ended, with a LOT of mixed emotions.

 

IDK, maybe I'm biased, but for those who say that Neil deserves to be left alone and be with his family, you should take into consideration how HE orchestrated their swan song. IMO, it was a final FU to not only the whole organization, but also to the fans. Neil is a professional, and could have easily toughed it out for another 3 months to give his band mates, and especially the fans (who really deserved it), a proper last tour. It could have been handled differently, with a little more compassion, and a LOT more class. So I ask you to dig deep and wonder for a minute, did his actions seem like those of a team player who took everyone's wants & desires into consideration, or were they selfish and based only on what was best for Neil?

 

This blows my mind (not that you are wrong). In a weird way, this seems to make sense. I am not an insider so I will not say that I know exactly what was/is going on. I do believe that there may be a bunch of stuff that has happened we have no clue about (but I chalk this up to the nature of bands).

 

Like I said in my Denver torrent on DIME, if Denver is the last time I see them (and I assume it is until more dates announced, which I do not assume will happen), then I saw a good show. If there was animosity happening behind the scenes then, maybe that helped make the performances rock more.

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FOH, interesting post and thanks for some of that behind the scenes info, fascinating to say the least. Alex throwing the shirt away? Did he do that right in front of neil too? lol.

 

So another thing I am curious about….ok ideally they would have like another couple more months (G&A) to do the proper farewell. But if it were up to them how many more years could they have seen rush going on for? They are in their early 60s I mean if this comes down to just 3 more months of touring I guess I don't really see too much of a big deal. But if you tell me G&A would be willing to continue this into their late 60s thats another thing.

Edited by mrfriendly
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There's no reason that Geddy or Alex couldn't do more solo albums or even work together on an album. Let Neil do what he wants.
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I expect the announcement for the R40 Live Tour Second leg around January 2016 Or after Christmas 2015.

 

I expect it around April 1, 2016. ;)

 

Geddy just said there's no plans for any more touring.

 

Not that I have any doubt that it's true, but where exactly did he just say this?

I think the fact that Neil recently had ALL of his equipment that was in the bands storage facility shipped to him in CA is a pretty good indicator that it's over. In 40+ years, he has NEVER done that.

 

As it turns out, Geddy, Alex, & management were hoping that once the Emperor got out on this tour, he'd have a change of heart about extending the tour and even going overseas. Which, is something they desperately wanted to do, considering it was the last tour. However, we know how this story ended. As predicted, Neil's selfishness is solely responsible for the death of Rush.

Neil's selfishness? I doubt his family feels this way. As a fan I could feel this way, but I don't. The last 15 years have been a bit of a bonus, if you look at it one way.

 

Listening to Neil rave about how awesome touring is on the ESL film, it's almost ironic he is adamant about retiring now.

 

He is at that point in life, if this is what he wants, so be it. Its a shame the fans only got three months notice of the end before the short tour began. But at least we got that and it was special.

 

Fans should not fret, if Ged and Al, or just Ged, want to continue, that would be a way for their music to live on. LEEFSON!!

 

Seeing Roger Waters doing The Wall and Dark Side was awesome. And The Dead/Further/The Other Ones sold out arenas and they had an even tougher job replacing Neil, yet put on a great show for the fans.

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There's no reason that Geddy or Alex couldn't do more solo albums or even work together on an album. Let Neil do what he wants.

 

Yes, and I would welcome hearing new Geddy/new Alex music without Neil. They have every right to continue if they want. They're not married to Neil. Just don't call it Rush (which they wouldn't anyway). ;)

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Thank god Bard isn't here anymore, or lord knows how this thread would have become after FOH's comments! :P

 

But seriously, it's very hard to read those words about Neil and the various grumblings behind the scenes and not feel slightly disappointed by his behaviour. At the same time, it's very difficult TO feel that way about Neil after the man has endured some of the worst things a human being can endure in his lifetime. I guess, as FOH said, I just wish he would have soldiered on for another 3 months or so and given the fans in Europe the conclusion they deserve (because they do deserve it, and Geddy and Alex know this---they'd be in Europe in the blink of an eye if it were up to them) rather than, apparently, rub the whole 'end of the road' thing in everyone's faces. They could have had a brilliant ending to a touring career and ensured that everyone had their slice of the glorious R40 pie, rather than things come to the end the line with so much frustration shared among 2/3 of the band members (not to mention many of the fans, too).

 

I admit I'm naive sometimes, so I really do hope that somehow, somewhere along the line, Neil will have a change of heart and see R40 out with some European shows.

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I expect the announcement for the R40 Live Tour Second leg around January 2016 Or after Christmas 2015.

 

I expect it around April 1, 2016. ;)

 

Geddy just said there's no plans for any more touring.

 

Not that I have any doubt that it's true, but where exactly did he just say this?

I think the fact that Neil recently had ALL of his equipment that was in the bands storage facility shipped to him in CA is a pretty good indicator that it's over. In 40+ years, he has NEVER done that.

 

As it turns out, Geddy, Alex, & management were hoping that once the Emperor got out on this tour, he'd have a change of heart about extending the tour and even going overseas. Which, is something they desperately wanted to do, considering it was the last tour. However, we know how this story ended. As predicted, Neil's selfishness is solely responsible for the death of Rush.

Neil's selfishness? I doubt his family feels this way. As a fan I could feel this way, but I don't. The last 15 years have been a bit of a bonus, if you look at it one way.

 

Listening to Neil rave about how awesome touring is on the ESL film, it's almost ironic he is adamant about retiring now.

 

He is at that point in life, if this is what he wants, so be it. Its a shame the fans only got three months notice of the end before the short tour began. But at least we got that and it was special.

 

Fans should not fret, if Ged and Al, or just Ged, want to continue, that would be a way for their music to live on. LEEFSON!!

 

Seeing Roger Waters doing The Wall and Dark Side was awesome. And The Dead/Further/The Other Ones sold out arenas and they had an even tougher job replacing Neil, yet put on a great show for the fans.

 

I realize this may be nitpicking, but IIRC he said he liked "playing live a lot". I can see how this is not saying he likes touring.

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I expect the announcement for the R40 Live Tour Second leg around January 2016 Or after Christmas 2015.

 

I expect it around April 1, 2016. ;)

 

Geddy just said there's no plans for any more touring.

 

Not that I have any doubt that it's true, but where exactly did he just say this?

I think the fact that Neil recently had ALL of his equipment that was in the bands storage facility shipped to him in CA is a pretty good indicator that it's over. In 40+ years, he has NEVER done that.

 

As it turns out, Geddy, Alex, & management were hoping that once the Emperor got out on this tour, he'd have a change of heart about extending the tour and even going overseas. Which, is something they desperately wanted to do, considering it was the last tour. However, we know how this story ended. As predicted, Neil's selfishness is solely responsible for the death of Rush.

Neil's selfishness? I doubt his family feels this way. As a fan I could feel this way, but I don't. The last 15 years have been a bit of a bonus, if you look at it one way.

 

Listening to Neil rave about how awesome touring is on the ESL film, it's almost ironic he is adamant about retiring now.

 

He is at that point in life, if this is what he wants, so be it. Its a shame the fans only got three months notice of the end before the short tour began. But at least we got that and it was special.

 

Fans should not fret, if Ged and Al, or just Ged, want to continue, that would be a way for their music to live on. LEEFSON!!

 

Seeing Roger Waters doing The Wall and Dark Side was awesome. And The Dead/Further/The Other Ones sold out arenas and they had an even tougher job replacing Neil, yet put on a great show for the fans.

 

I realize this may be nitpicking, but IIRC he said he liked "playing live a lot". I can see how this is not saying he likes touring.

 

That was in 1981! A lifetime ago.

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Did I miss something about FOH? How do we know he's telling the truth? Sorry but I've never seen any confirmation that he actually has any backstage knowledge vs just making it up? I'm very sorry if I'm wrong and missed something. The story is very believable but I've always been told to check for sources
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Just a couple of random comments… In a recent interview on a MLB talkshow, it was very evident that Geddy has not given up on the prospects of more touring in the relatively near future. I remember him saying something like "We have nothing planned right now". And "we're still discussing". But he also said "we all three have very different views on what our future should be as far as touring goes." Please note that I am paraphrasing these comments off the top of my head, so I may not have the exact wording correct, but I am accurate as to the sentiments Geddy expressed.

 

On a possibly somewhat related note, I also remember Geddy making a comment at the Bristow show along the lines of "It's funny how sometimes you just ask someone to do something for you, and they do it", as he turned his body slightly to make eye contact with Neil. We can only speculate on the intended context of that comment, but it seems reasonably possible it may have had something to do with discussions on extended tour dates.

 

So what I take from all of this is that Neil has said he is done with touring, but Geddy (and probably Alex) have not given up on trying to persuade him otherwise. I seriously doubt that there is or ever was any animosity though. Disappointment yes, but animosity between these three seems way out of character and extremely unlikely. I was at 12 shows, and both Alex and Geddy were goofing around quite a bit with Neil (and each other), and all three of them were more visibly jovial in general than I've ever seen them act on stage. Sorry, but I just don't believe that they would act that way on stage and then be at odds with each other behind the scenes.

Edited by Empty Mindless Spectre
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I expect the announcement for the R40 Live Tour Second leg around January 2016 Or after Christmas 2015.

 

I expect it around April 1, 2016. ;)

 

Geddy just said there's no plans for any more touring.

 

Not that I have any doubt that it's true, but where exactly did he just say this?

I think the fact that Neil recently had ALL of his equipment that was in the bands storage facility shipped to him in CA is a pretty good indicator that it's over. In 40+ years, he has NEVER done that.

 

As it turns out, Geddy, Alex, & management were hoping that once the Emperor got out on this tour, he'd have a change of heart about extending the tour and even going overseas. Which, is something they desperately wanted to do, considering it was the last tour. However, we know how this story ended. As predicted, Neil's selfishness is solely responsible for the death of Rush.

Neil's selfishness? I doubt his family feels this way. As a fan I could feel this way, but I don't. The last 15 years have been a bit of a bonus, if you look at it one way.

 

Listening to Neil rave about how awesome touring is on the ESL film, it's almost ironic he is adamant about retiring now.

 

He is at that point in life, if this is what he wants, so be it. Its a shame the fans only got three months notice of the end before the short tour began. But at least we got that and it was special.

 

Fans should not fret, if Ged and Al, or just Ged, want to continue, that would be a way for their music to live on. LEEFSON!!

 

Seeing Roger Waters doing The Wall and Dark Side was awesome. And The Dead/Further/The Other Ones sold out arenas and they had an even tougher job replacing Neil, yet put on a great show for the fans.

 

I realize this may be nitpicking, but IIRC he said he liked "playing live a lot". I can see how this is not saying he likes touring.

 

That was in 1981! A lifetime ago.

 

 

Without rewatching the film, let's agree on the distinction between touring and live shows, and also agree, Rush is done touring,but in no way done performing live shows ;)

 

As far as 1981 being so long ago, my point was he owes almost everything, with respect to fame and wealth, to the tour model of live performing and artist revenues. In other words, touring has been beyond generous to his betterment. He knew that in 1981. And he kind of shats on that in the end.

 

.

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Rant On!! I'm sure that I'm gonna get flamed for this, but I'm not known for shutting up when incensed!! Since Neil has apparently packed it in, and not cared how the tour ended since only his demands/needs were met, how about thinking of a "new drummer" idea? Unless, someone can prove me wrong, I think his exit was tasteless and severely lacking! If this was indeed a "final" tour from him/Rush, than the collective fanbase had a right to know this upfront without having to hear of things coming out now. Okay, Rant Over!! Edited by rushfanforever!
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Rant On!! I'm sure that I'm gonna get flamed for this, but I'm not known for shutting up when incensed!! Since Neil has apparently packed it in, and not cared how the tour ended since only his demands/needs were met, how about thinking of a "new drummer" idea? Unless, someone can prove me wrong, I think his exit was tasteless and severely lacking! If this was indeed a "final" tour from him/Rush, than the collective fanbase had a right to know this upfront without having to hear of things coming out now. Okay, Rant Over!!

 

New drummer is fine and would be a lot of fun to see G & A live again, but I think we all agree the Rush name would need to be retired.

 

" LEEFSON...An evening of solo / new music, and RUSH classics"... would be AOK

Edited by Gabrielgil513
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