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Kevin Moore vs Jordan Rudess


Mr. Not
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Moore vs Rudess  

12 members have voted

  1. 1. Who Has Offered More to DT?

    • Jordan Rudess
      9
    • Kevin Moore
      3


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In my opinion Jordan Rudess contributed more to the band and was instrumental in keeping DT an active writing, recording, and touring band. Personality wise, he fits in with the band and gets along with the band on a personal and creative level. I thought Jordan brought a new creative palette to the table when he joined in 1999 and to this day his creatively gels perfectly along with the rest of DT, and had he not join at that point, I would suffice to say that DT would've disbanded if SFAM wasn't creatively rewarding for the band and well received both critically and with their fan base.

 

Kevin Moore fit in with the sound and feel of the band for the first three albums, but I can't picture SFAM onward sounding the way they did and feeling the same impact as I have for those albums with anyone but Jordan. Kevin's approach was more moody sounding if not artsy and atmospheric, and while it might've sounded well with songs like Trial of Tears or Misunderstood, I don't think that approach would translate well with songs like The Root of All Evil or Fatal Tragedy. He left at the right time because musically he was straying further away from what the "DT sound" was at the time and you could hear it in Space Dye Vest, and even more so in his project Chroma Key (and to a lesser extent, his contributions to Fates Warning's A Pleasant Shade of Gray).

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Technically-speaking, I don't think anybody beats Jordan in any band.

 

I love JR's playing though he tended to rely on the "WOO WOO WOOO WEEEEEEEE!!!!!" note at the end of his solos a bit too much on SFAM lol.

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So far it's pretty unanimous. And yes, I excluded technical ability as a determination because Jordan completely blows Kevin out of the water there.

 

I asked this because on a video posting of the song "Voices" there were many comments saying Moore was better for DT. I made my response there, but I also decided to post this topic here mainly to check if I gave these thoughts too much credibility ;)

 

They also were saying Voices was Kevin's best work... Well, for the most part, all he's doing is rooting what Petrucci wrote. The exceptions are the keyboard solo (which is a kick ass keyboard solo) and the outro strings (which are okay).

 

As I said on the video, good keyboardist, not as masterful as Jordan and certainly not as good for DT as Jordan is.

Edited by Mr. IsNot
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Kevin Moore may have been the original.....but original ain't always best. I just love watching Jordon play. There should be an option on one of their DVD'S to just watch Jordan, lol Man is a wizard.

 

So i pick Jordan.

 

Mick

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Kevin Moore may have been the original.....but original ain't always best. I just love watching Jordon play. There should be an option on one of their DVD'S to just watch Jordan, lol Man is a wizard.

 

So i pick Jordan.

 

Mick

 

I agree. More than with any other band, I need individual cameras of each player.

Such a shame how underrepresented Myung was on their latest DVD.

 

They did something like (if not exactly) what you described for Live at Budokan, I believe.

 

 

 

 

Personally, I like watching the Myung camera for this one.

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Kevin Moore may have been the original.....but original ain't always best. I just love watching Jordon play. There should be an option on one of their DVD'S to just watch Jordan, lol Man is a wizard.

 

So i pick Jordan.

 

Mick

 

I agree. More than with any other band, I need individual cameras of each player.

Such a shame how underrepresented Myung was on their latest DVD.

 

They did something like (if not exactly) what you described for Live at Budokan, I believe.

 

 

http://youtu.be/WtkQMdiT_tk

 

 

Personally, I like watching the Myung camera for this one.

 

Cool I have every DVD except Budokan. Been lazy I really should get it.

 

Mick

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I swear to God, I don't know how anybody can listen to this crap.

 

I understand these guys are extraordinary musicians, and they play very well together but here's nothing you can tap your foot to, or nod your head to, or even any section of a song you could consider "jamming" that's more than 4 seconds. It's just "you do a solo, now you do a solo, now you do a solo" over and over and over again. Not to mention the complete sonic overload. I wonder if they don't have contests within the band to see who can play the most notes in one show. I've heard the current record holder is that Jordan Rudess guy with 47 million notes played in one night during a show in Toronto, but each of the other band members were each within 6 notes of that record. Except for the "Lead Singer"...you know...the guy with the part time job who is only on stage about a third as long as the other guys in the band. Think he gets a full cut of ticket and merch sales? I think on their next album he should be replaced with M-n-M, or Eminem, you know...Marshall Mathers, that guy 'cuz he is the only "vocalist" I know of who can cram as many words into one measure as the guys in DT do musical notes. I've also heard that DT's music has to be printed on special paper 'cuz there are so many notes per page that the paper runs the risk of actually exploding if one more note is added to any one page. So you guys be careful out there, 'cuz not only does the music suck, but it's actually dangerous to try to learn.

 

And yes, I have seen DT live back when they toured with Queensryche about 10 or 12 years ago. One of the worst shows I've ever seen. QR were completely lackluster and just sort of "slushed" through their performance and DT was like watching 4 guys (and the occasional 5th guy...wink wink) practicing scales for 2 hours.

 

Just my 2 cents....Which is 2 cents more than DT should be allowed to sell records and concert tickets for.

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I swear to God, I don't know how anybody can listen to this crap.

 

I understand these guys are extraordinary musicians, and they play very well together but here's nothing you can tap your foot to, or nod your head to, or even any section of a song you could consider "jamming" that's more than 4 seconds. It's just "you do a solo, now you do a solo, now you do a solo" over and over and over again. Not to mention the complete sonic overload. I wonder if they don't have contests within the band to see who can play the most notes in one show. I've heard the current record holder is that Jordan Rudess guy with 47 million notes played in one night during a show in Toronto, but each of the other band members were each within 6 notes of that record. Except for the "Lead Singer"...you know...the guy with the part time job who is only on stage about a third as long as the other guys in the band. Think he gets a full cut of ticket and merch sales? I think on their next album he should be replaced with M-n-M, or Eminem, you know...Marshall Mathers, that guy 'cuz he is the only "vocalist" I know of who can cram as many words into one measure as the guys in DT do musical notes. I've also heard that DT's music has to be printed on special paper 'cuz there are so many notes per page that the paper runs the risk of actually exploding if one more note is added to any one page. So you guys be careful out there, 'cuz not only does the music suck, but it's actually dangerous to try to learn.

 

And yes, I have seen DT live back when they toured with Queensryche about 10 or 12 years ago. One of the worst shows I've ever seen. QR were completely lackluster and just sort of "slushed" through their performance and DT was like watching 4 guys (and the occasional 5th guy...wink wink) practicing scales for 2 hours.

 

Just my 2 cents....Which is 2 cents more than DT should be allowed to sell records and concert tickets for.

 

It's posts like this that make me wish there was a "dislike this" option.

 

So, what albums have you heard from Dream Theater? I mean you've had to listen to them a little bit in order to have such a strong dislike for them, correct?

Edited by J2112YYZ
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here's nothing you can tap your foot to, or nod your head to, or even any section of a song you could consider "jamming" that's more than 4 seconds

 

Off the top of my head:

 

Foot tap: Intro for Solitary Shell

Nod your head to: This Dying Soul will make your head fall right the hell off lol

Jamming that's more than 4 seconds: I don't know what you mean here, they have jamming sections that are closer to 4 minutes *shrug*. Great examples are the breakdowns in Metropolis, Scarred, & Endless Sacrifice.

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I swear to God, I don't know how anybody can listen to this crap.

 

I understand these guys are extraordinary musicians, and they play very well together but here's nothing you can tap your foot to, or nod your head to, or even any section of a song you could consider "jamming" that's more than 4 seconds. It's just "you do a solo, now you do a solo, now you do a solo" over and over and over again. Not to mention the complete sonic overload. I wonder if they don't have contests within the band to see who can play the most notes in one show. I've heard the current record holder is that Jordan Rudess guy with 47 million notes played in one night during a show in Toronto, but each of the other band members were each within 6 notes of that record. Except for the "Lead Singer"...you know...the guy with the part time job who is only on stage about a third as long as the other guys in the band. Think he gets a full cut of ticket and merch sales? I think on their next album he should be replaced with M-n-M, or Eminem, you know...Marshall Mathers, that guy 'cuz he is the only "vocalist" I know of who can cram as many words into one measure as the guys in DT do musical notes. I've also heard that DT's music has to be printed on special paper 'cuz there are so many notes per page that the paper runs the risk of actually exploding if one more note is added to any one page. So you guys be careful out there, 'cuz not only does the music suck, but it's actually dangerous to try to learn.

 

And yes, I have seen DT live back when they toured with Queensryche about 10 or 12 years ago. One of the worst shows I've ever seen. QR were completely lackluster and just sort of "slushed" through their performance and DT was like watching 4 guys (and the occasional 5th guy...wink wink) practicing scales for 2 hours.

 

Just my 2 cents....Which is 2 cents more than DT should be allowed to sell records and concert tickets for.

 

It's posts like this that make me wish there was a "dislike this" option.

 

So, what albums have you heard from Dream Theater? I mean you've had to listen to them a little bit in order to have such a strong dislike for them, correct?

 

To each his own, he's not the 1st nor the last to dislike DT. When I first saw / heard them it was the Live at Budokan DVD and I'll be honest it was pretty overwhelming for me too (all the 'million note' jabs above). It almost made me want to quit playing altogether since I know I'll never get to that degree of technical prowess. But I gave them more time and now they're probably my 2nd favorite band tied with RUSH.

 

And it's not all about the million notes of course. Listen to something like The Silent Man, Hollow Years, Repentance.. I mean even something like The Mirror isn't a million notes and still kicks a lot of ass.

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I swear to God, I don't know how anybody can listen to this crap.

 

I understand these guys are extraordinary musicians, and they play very well together but here's nothing you can tap your foot to, or nod your head to, or even any section of a song you could consider "jamming" that's more than 4 seconds. It's just "you do a solo, now you do a solo, now you do a solo" over and over and over again. Not to mention the complete sonic overload. I wonder if they don't have contests within the band to see who can play the most notes in one show. I've heard the current record holder is that Jordan Rudess guy with 47 million notes played in one night during a show in Toronto, but each of the other band members were each within 6 notes of that record. Except for the "Lead Singer"...you know...the guy with the part time job who is only on stage about a third as long as the other guys in the band. Think he gets a full cut of ticket and merch sales? I think on their next album he should be replaced with M-n-M, or Eminem, you know...Marshall Mathers, that guy 'cuz he is the only "vocalist" I know of who can cram as many words into one measure as the guys in DT do musical notes. I've also heard that DT's music has to be printed on special paper 'cuz there are so many notes per page that the paper runs the risk of actually exploding if one more note is added to any one page. So you guys be careful out there, 'cuz not only does the music suck, but it's actually dangerous to try to learn.

 

And yes, I have seen DT live back when they toured with Queensryche about 10 or 12 years ago. One of the worst shows I've ever seen. QR were completely lackluster and just sort of "slushed" through their performance and DT was like watching 4 guys (and the occasional 5th guy...wink wink) practicing scales for 2 hours.

 

Just my 2 cents....Which is 2 cents more than DT should be allowed to sell records and concert tickets for.

 

So you don't like them? :LOL:

 

Mick

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I swear to God, I don't know how anybody can listen to this crap.

 

I understand these guys are extraordinary musicians, and they play very well together but here's nothing you can tap your foot to, or nod your head to, or even any section of a song you could consider "jamming" that's more than 4 seconds. It's just "you do a solo, now you do a solo, now you do a solo" over and over and over again. Not to mention the complete sonic overload. I wonder if they don't have contests within the band to see who can play the most notes in one show. I've heard the current record holder is that Jordan Rudess guy with 47 million notes played in one night during a show in Toronto, but each of the other band members were each within 6 notes of that record. Except for the "Lead Singer"...you know...the guy with the part time job who is only on stage about a third as long as the other guys in the band. Think he gets a full cut of ticket and merch sales? I think on their next album he should be replaced with M-n-M, or Eminem, you know...Marshall Mathers, that guy 'cuz he is the only "vocalist" I know of who can cram as many words into one measure as the guys in DT do musical notes. I've also heard that DT's music has to be printed on special paper 'cuz there are so many notes per page that the paper runs the risk of actually exploding if one more note is added to any one page. So you guys be careful out there, 'cuz not only does the music suck, but it's actually dangerous to try to learn.

 

And yes, I have seen DT live back when they toured with Queensryche about 10 or 12 years ago. One of the worst shows I've ever seen. QR were completely lackluster and just sort of "slushed" through their performance and DT was like watching 4 guys (and the occasional 5th guy...wink wink) practicing scales for 2 hours.

 

Just my 2 cents....Which is 2 cents more than DT should be allowed to sell records and concert tickets for.

 

So you don't like them? :LOL:

 

Mick

 

What tipped you off?

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I swear to God, I don't know how anybody can listen to this crap.

 

I understand these guys are extraordinary musicians, and they play very well together but here's nothing you can tap your foot to, or nod your head to, or even any section of a song you could consider "jamming" that's more than 4 seconds. It's just "you do a solo, now you do a solo, now you do a solo" over and over and over again. Not to mention the complete sonic overload. I wonder if they don't have contests within the band to see who can play the most notes in one show. I've heard the current record holder is that Jordan Rudess guy with 47 million notes played in one night during a show in Toronto, but each of the other band members were each within 6 notes of that record. Except for the "Lead Singer"...you know...the guy with the part time job who is only on stage about a third as long as the other guys in the band. Think he gets a full cut of ticket and merch sales? I think on their next album he should be replaced with M-n-M, or Eminem, you know...Marshall Mathers, that guy 'cuz he is the only "vocalist" I know of who can cram as many words into one measure as the guys in DT do musical notes. I've also heard that DT's music has to be printed on special paper 'cuz there are so many notes per page that the paper runs the risk of actually exploding if one more note is added to any one page. So you guys be careful out there, 'cuz not only does the music suck, but it's actually dangerous to try to learn.

 

And yes, I have seen DT live back when they toured with Queensryche about 10 or 12 years ago. One of the worst shows I've ever seen. QR were completely lackluster and just sort of "slushed" through their performance and DT was like watching 4 guys (and the occasional 5th guy...wink wink) practicing scales for 2 hours.

 

Just my 2 cents....Which is 2 cents more than DT should be allowed to sell records and concert tickets for.

 

So you don't like them? :LOL:

 

Mick

 

What tipped you off?

 

I put on their Score concert in your honor.....really missing out, lol

 

Mick

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In Dream Theater for the most part all the music is guitar driven and keyboards mostly just appear as a synth solo, a piano intro or adding colour or a halo around the guitars. So really it's not that important a question. Now if they'd had another guitar player instead of Petrucci at some point then we could have a discussion.
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I swear to God, I don't know how anybody can listen to this crap.

 

I understand these guys are extraordinary musicians, and they play very well together but here's nothing you can tap your foot to, or nod your head to, or even any section of a song you could consider "jamming" that's more than 4 seconds. It's just "you do a solo, now you do a solo, now you do a solo" over and over and over again. Not to mention the complete sonic overload. I wonder if they don't have contests within the band to see who can play the most notes in one show. I've heard the current record holder is that Jordan Rudess guy with 47 million notes played in one night during a show in Toronto, but each of the other band members were each within 6 notes of that record. Except for the "Lead Singer"...you know...the guy with the part time job who is only on stage about a third as long as the other guys in the band. Think he gets a full cut of ticket and merch sales? I think on their next album he should be replaced with M-n-M, or Eminem, you know...Marshall Mathers, that guy 'cuz he is the only "vocalist" I know of who can cram as many words into one measure as the guys in DT do musical notes. I've also heard that DT's music has to be printed on special paper 'cuz there are so many notes per page that the paper runs the risk of actually exploding if one more note is added to any one page. So you guys be careful out there, 'cuz not only does the music suck, but it's actually dangerous to try to learn.

 

And yes, I have seen DT live back when they toured with Queensryche about 10 or 12 years ago. One of the worst shows I've ever seen. QR were completely lackluster and just sort of "slushed" through their performance and DT was like watching 4 guys (and the occasional 5th guy...wink wink) practicing scales for 2 hours.

 

Just my 2 cents....Which is 2 cents more than DT should be allowed to sell records and concert tickets for.

 

It's posts like this that make me wish there was a "dislike this" option.

 

So, what albums have you heard from Dream Theater? I mean you've had to listen to them a little bit in order to have such a strong dislike for them, correct?

 

Unfortunately when I heard anything from them I wasn't prepared to write what I was listening to down...I realize I should have because I knew you would, one day, be asking me this question...I've really failed to be a good a DT student.

 

As I mentioned I saw them live in '03 (looked up the year just for you) so whatever they played on that tour I heard, and then other stuff I might have heard on Pandora or Sirius.

 

There was one song I can think of...maybe you can help me with the name...lemme see, the song goes. Ahhhh doodle-doodle-dooooo-tweedle deedle-doodle-baaaaah-baaaah-bang-boom-wha-wha-whaaaaaaam-twang-waaaaang-whaaaaaaaa-deedle-deeeeeeeee-chang-wang-whaaaaaoooooaaaaaahhhh-dun-dah-dah-duh.

 

I'm pretty sure that's how it goes, but I might have transcribed it wrong. Help me out with the title 'cuz that's the only song I can think of right off the top of my head.

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I swear to God, I don't know how anybody can listen to this crap.

 

I understand these guys are extraordinary musicians, and they play very well together but here's nothing you can tap your foot to, or nod your head to, or even any section of a song you could consider "jamming" that's more than 4 seconds. It's just "you do a solo, now you do a solo, now you do a solo" over and over and over again. Not to mention the complete sonic overload. I wonder if they don't have contests within the band to see who can play the most notes in one show. I've heard the current record holder is that Jordan Rudess guy with 47 million notes played in one night during a show in Toronto, but each of the other band members were each within 6 notes of that record. Except for the "Lead Singer"...you know...the guy with the part time job who is only on stage about a third as long as the other guys in the band. Think he gets a full cut of ticket and merch sales? I think on their next album he should be replaced with M-n-M, or Eminem, you know...Marshall Mathers, that guy 'cuz he is the only "vocalist" I know of who can cram as many words into one measure as the guys in DT do musical notes. I've also heard that DT's music has to be printed on special paper 'cuz there are so many notes per page that the paper runs the risk of actually exploding if one more note is added to any one page. So you guys be careful out there, 'cuz not only does the music suck, but it's actually dangerous to try to learn.

 

And yes, I have seen DT live back when they toured with Queensryche about 10 or 12 years ago. One of the worst shows I've ever seen. QR were completely lackluster and just sort of "slushed" through their performance and DT was like watching 4 guys (and the occasional 5th guy...wink wink) practicing scales for 2 hours.

 

Just my 2 cents....Which is 2 cents more than DT should be allowed to sell records and concert tickets for.

 

It's posts like this that make me wish there was a "dislike this" option.

 

So, what albums have you heard from Dream Theater? I mean you've had to listen to them a little bit in order to have such a strong dislike for them, correct?

 

Unfortunately when I heard anything from them I wasn't prepared to write what I was listening to down...I realize I should have because I knew you would, one day, be asking me this question...I've really failed to be a good a DT student.

 

As I mentioned I saw them live in '03 (looked up the year just for you) so whatever they played on that tour I heard, and then other stuff I might have heard on Pandora or Sirius.

 

There was one song I can think of...maybe you can help me with the name...lemme see, the song goes. Ahhhh doodle-doodle-dooooo-tweedle deedle-doodle-baaaaah-baaaah-bang-boom-wha-wha-whaaaaaaam-twang-waaaaang-whaaaaaaaa-deedle-deeeeeeeee-chang-wang-whaaaaaoooooaaaaaahhhh-dun-dah-dah-duh.

 

I'm pretty sure that's how it goes, but I might have transcribed it wrong. Help me out with the title 'cuz that's the only song I can think of right off the top of my head.

 

2003 the was the release of the Train of Thought album. If you their set mainly consisted of those songs then I can understand where you're coming from, that album is rather saddening coming from them, it was intended to be filled with "energetic fan/crowd pleasers"... It's my least favorite album of theirs.

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In Dream Theater for the most part all the music is guitar driven and keyboards mostly just appear as a synth solo, a piano intro or adding colour or a halo around the guitars. So really it's not that important a question. Now if they'd had another guitar player instead of Petrucci at some point then we could have a discussion.

 

Definitely the case for Moore, not so much the case with Rudess... He also writes around the vocal melodies! :LOL:

 

In seriousness, he does branch out more than Moore, even went ahead and created his own app to add tasteful environments to the songs: soundscaping, ambience, the merging of notes for certain solos (like a slide guitar does)

 

Songs I can think of off the top of my head where the keyboards act quite independently are: Outcry, Octavarium, and Bigger Picture. Not quite Wakeman, but certainly not Moore :LOL:

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Songs I can think of off the top of my head where the keyboards act quite independently are: Outcry, Octavarium, and Bigger Picture.

 

Blind Faith *cough cough*

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Train of Thought is indeed one of their worst.......can't stand it. Then came Octavarium......and i was OK, lol

 

Mick

 

Oh man, I listened to this on the way to work today. You're missing out I love this album!

 

Oh and I think I the song that guy transcribed is the chorus to In the Name of God :D

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Train of Thought is indeed one of their worst.......can't stand it. Then came Octavarium......and i was OK, lol

 

Mick

 

Oh man, I listened to this on the way to work today. You're missing out I love this album!

 

Oh and I think I the song that guy transcribed is the chorus to In the Name of God :D

I like that album, it's basically a metal album. People who don't like it don't like metal! :haz:

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