What is Rush's most technically challenging song?

[Lorraine]

That should read "I don't know anything...". It won't let me edit, for whatever reason.

[The Lofty Oaks]

I have to go with La Villa as well.

 

I can play many Rush songs but I never had so much trouble getting things to sound "right". I spent well over 2 months trying to get a reasonably passable version. Still not sure I succeeded. I did not even attempt to copy the Lifeson solos note for note so I went in my own direction there. The song has many challenging guitar parts but the timing was the hardest aspect to nail down.

 

 

https://soundcloud.com/theloftyoaks/la-villa-strangiato

[Xanadoood]

Big Money sounds like a real bitch to play.

[Nate1647]

The Big Money actually isn't as hard as people would think (the bass part). Geddy has this amazing ability to write complex sounding parts that move real fast, but all kind of flow off the fingers once you know the notes and rhythms. A lot of Hold Your Fire is like that too.

[rushfanNlv]

I have been thinking about how to answer this question on and off for a few days now and I have come to the conclusion that it is almost impossible to answer without breaking it down album by album or at least by period of the band (i.e. Rush thru 2112/AFTK thru MP etc). I would even go further as to break it down by band member. To hard of a question to answer on a standard lunch break. :D

 

There are just so many moments or parts from an individual player in certain songs that I consider to be "technically challenging" to narrow this down. Example - from .26 seconds into Subdivisions to .37 seconds, Neil is playing what I consider to be a technically challenging drum part where he is using a combination of hi-hat and ride with this off snare timing - it's just crazy complicated to me (I've tried to play it) but the rest of the song is not as complicated in relative terms. The guitar part is fairly simple to play as are the bass and Keyboard parts. So, I can't say that Subdivisions is a "technically challenging" song but that 11 seconds of the song certainly are.

 

I'm over-analyzing...I know.

[Tombstone Mountain]

The Big Money actually isn't as hard as people would think (the bass part). Geddy has this amazing ability to write complex sounding parts that move real fast, but all kind of flow off the fingers once you know the notes and rhythms. A lot of Hold Your Fire is like that too.

Yeah...piece of cake. It's as easy as smoke on the water

[Powderfinger]

the band were asked this exact question once and their answer was Natural Science..

 

Hahahaha Knew it! I don't anything about playing an instrument, but I knew that had to be one hard song to do. It is one of my favorites too. Sometime it stays in my brain for weeks and I can't get it out.

 

Not surprised that the band cites Natural Science. Watch Geddy closely when they perform it on the Snakes and Arrows Live DVD. It's absolutely astonishing.

Edited March 22, 2013 by Powderfinger

[GrandDesigner]

I'm a drummer and I've never found any of Neil's parts to be "too hard" to play. He's obviously skilled, but there's nothing he's done on a drumset that cannot easily be replicated with a bit of rehearsing. Natural Science is simple, there's absolutely nothing of difficulty in that song drum-wise. I'd say his most challenging would be La Villa Strangiato as there are a lot of shifting feels that need to be smoothly executed, or something off of PoW or HYF where he is utilizing percussion within beats. The chorus of Mystic Rhythms can be hard to replicate without proper foot-triggers, but even that's easily done with a bit of practice.

 

La Villa is the hardest, no doubt.

[ShlappinDahBass]

I'm a drummer and I've never found any of Neil's parts to be "too hard" to play. He's obviously skilled, but there's nothing he's done on a drumset that cannot easily be replicated with a bit of rehearsing. Natural Science is simple, there's absolutely nothing of difficulty in that song drum-wise. I'd say his most challenging would be La Villa Strangiato as there are a lot of shifting feels that need to be smoothly executed, or something off of PoW or HYF where he is utilizing percussion within beats. The chorus of Mystic Rhythms can be hard to replicate without proper foot-triggers, but even that's easily done with a bit of practice.

 

La Villa is the hardest, no doubt.

 

Really? You don't think the whole of Hemispheres, Snakes and Arrows, Test for Echo, and Permenant Waves are "too hard"? You have to dig deeper into his playing. Take a look at his "Taking Center Stage" DVD. You will notice things he does you would not even believe are possible. Leave that Thing Alone and Main Monkey Business come to mind. His techniques are pretty hard to master, especially keeping a rhythm. I know a lot of drummers who think they're hotshots but can't even keep a simple Beatles song the same tempo by the end.

 

Now, don't take this the wrong way as saying you don't have enough experience to replicate his playing but it's pretty much a job to keep up with his current playing level. I haven't seen one person keep their left foot going on the highhat and using it as a metronome like he does. The man is a machine. All four of his limbs are constantly doing stuff now it just makes you want to throw up that he's actually a human being. I'm surprised he doesn't even use his head as a limb to play.

 

Even my dad is a drummer (38 years of experience and Neil has been his idol since he first started drumming) and he is still floored by Neil's playing.

 

I would say all-together...Cygnus X-II, La Villa, Test for Echo, Gangster of Boats Series, Headlong Flight and Natural Science are the craziest and complicated RUSH songs.

[GrandDesigner]

I'm a drummer and I've never found any of Neil's parts to be "too hard" to play. He's obviously skilled, but there's nothing he's done on a drumset that cannot easily be replicated with a bit of rehearsing. Natural Science is simple, there's absolutely nothing of difficulty in that song drum-wise. I'd say his most challenging would be La Villa Strangiato as there are a lot of shifting feels that need to be smoothly executed, or something off of PoW or HYF where he is utilizing percussion within beats. The chorus of Mystic Rhythms can be hard to replicate without proper foot-triggers, but even that's easily done with a bit of practice.

 

La Villa is the hardest, no doubt.

 

Really? You don't think the whole of Hemispheres, Snakes and Arrows, Test for Echo, and Permenant Waves are "too hard"? You have to dig deeper into his playing. Take a look at his "Taking Center Stage" DVD. You will notice things he does you would not even believe are possible. Leave that Thing Alone and Main Monkey Business come to mind. His techniques are pretty hard to master, especially keeping a rhythm. I know a lot of drummers who think they're hotshots but can't even keep a simple Beatles song the same tempo by the end.

 

Now, don't take this the wrong way as saying you don't have enough experience to replicate his playing but it's pretty much a job to keep up with his current playing level. I haven't seen one person keep their left foot going on the highhat and using it as a metronome like he does. The man is a machine. All four of his limbs are constantly doing stuff now it just makes you want to throw up that he's actually a human being. I'm surprised he doesn't even use his head as a limb to play.

 

Even my dad is a drummer (38 years of experience and Neil has been his idol since he first started drumming) and he is still floored by Neil's playing.

 

I would say all-together...Cygnus X-II, La Villa, Test for Echo, Gangster of Boats Series, Headlong Flight and Natural Science are the craziest and complicated RUSH songs.

 

But it's not a job to keep up with his playing. Natural Science has NOTHING difficult in it. Hemispheres the song is basic patterns and disco beats on the hi-hat. La Villa is legitimitely challenging, but that's mainly due to the abrupt switches in feels/parts that need to be smoothly transitioned. Keeping a hi-hat going through a beat is really easy for anyone who's gained any sort of limb independence from playing drums for a few years,

 

I'm not knocking Neil at all. His parts are GREAT. But they are nowhere near difficult or as difficult as people make them out to be.

Edited March 22, 2013 by GrandDesigner

[Powderfinger]

I'm a drummer and I've never found any of Neil's parts to be "too hard" to play. He's obviously skilled, but there's nothing he's done on a drumset that cannot easily be replicated with a bit of rehearsing. Natural Science is simple, there's absolutely nothing of difficulty in that song drum-wise. I'd say his most challenging would be La Villa Strangiato as there are a lot of shifting feels that need to be smoothly executed, or something off of PoW or HYF where he is utilizing percussion within beats. The chorus of Mystic Rhythms can be hard to replicate without proper foot-triggers, but even that's easily done with a bit of practice.

 

La Villa is the hardest, no doubt.

 

Really? You don't think the whole of Hemispheres, Snakes and Arrows, Test for Echo, and Permenant Waves are "too hard"? You have to dig deeper into his playing. Take a look at his "Taking Center Stage" DVD. You will notice things he does you would not even believe are possible. Leave that Thing Alone and Main Monkey Business come to mind. His techniques are pretty hard to master, especially keeping a rhythm. I know a lot of drummers who think they're hotshots but can't even keep a simple Beatles song the same tempo by the end.

 

Now, don't take this the wrong way as saying you don't have enough experience to replicate his playing but it's pretty much a job to keep up with his current playing level. I haven't seen one person keep their left foot going on the highhat and using it as a metronome like he does. The man is a machine. All four of his limbs are constantly doing stuff now it just makes you want to throw up that he's actually a human being. I'm surprised he doesn't even use his head as a limb to play.

 

Even my dad is a drummer (38 years of experience and Neil has been his idol since he first started drumming) and he is still floored by Neil's playing.

 

I would say all-together...Cygnus X-II, La Villa, Test for Echo, Gangster of Boats Series, Headlong Flight and Natural Science are the craziest and complicated RUSH songs.

 

But it's not a job to keep up with his playing. Natural Science has NOTHING difficult in it. Hemispheres the song is basic patterns and disco beats on the hi-hat. La Villa is legitimitely challenging, but that's mainly due to the abrupt switches in feels/parts that need to be smoothly transitioned. Keeping a hi-hat going through a beat is really easy for anyone who's gained any sort of limb independence from playing drums for a few years,

 

I'm not knocking Neil at all. His parts are GREAT. But they are nowhere near difficult or as difficult as people make them out to be.

 

I'm sure you're a great drummer, and I mean this playfully—not personally, but give me a break. You are overstating your point. If in your opinion Natural Science has "nothing difficult in it," then I trust you are drumming for a successful rock group...

[ShlappinDahBass]

I'm a drummer and I've never found any of Neil's parts to be "too hard" to play. He's obviously skilled, but there's nothing he's done on a drumset that cannot easily be replicated with a bit of rehearsing. Natural Science is simple, there's absolutely nothing of difficulty in that song drum-wise. I'd say his most challenging would be La Villa Strangiato as there are a lot of shifting feels that need to be smoothly executed, or something off of PoW or HYF where he is utilizing percussion within beats. The chorus of Mystic Rhythms can be hard to replicate without proper foot-triggers, but even that's easily done with a bit of practice.

 

La Villa is the hardest, no doubt.

 

Really? You don't think the whole of Hemispheres, Snakes and Arrows, Test for Echo, and Permenant Waves are "too hard"? You have to dig deeper into his playing. Take a look at his "Taking Center Stage" DVD. You will notice things he does you would not even believe are possible. Leave that Thing Alone and Main Monkey Business come to mind. His techniques are pretty hard to master, especially keeping a rhythm. I know a lot of drummers who think they're hotshots but can't even keep a simple Beatles song the same tempo by the end.

 

Now, don't take this the wrong way as saying you don't have enough experience to replicate his playing but it's pretty much a job to keep up with his current playing level. I haven't seen one person keep their left foot going on the highhat and using it as a metronome like he does. The man is a machine. All four of his limbs are constantly doing stuff now it just makes you want to throw up that he's actually a human being. I'm surprised he doesn't even use his head as a limb to play.

 

Even my dad is a drummer (38 years of experience and Neil has been his idol since he first started drumming) and he is still floored by Neil's playing.

 

I would say all-together...Cygnus X-II, La Villa, Test for Echo, Gangster of Boats Series, Headlong Flight and Natural Science are the craziest and complicated RUSH songs.

 

But it's not a job to keep up with his playing. Natural Science has NOTHING difficult in it. Hemispheres the song is basic patterns and disco beats on the hi-hat. La Villa is legitimitely challenging, but that's mainly due to the abrupt switches in feels/parts that need to be smoothly transitioned. Keeping a hi-hat going through a beat is really easy for anyone who's gained any sort of limb independence from playing drums for a few years,

 

I'm not knocking Neil at all. His parts are GREAT. But they are nowhere near difficult or as difficult as people make them out to be.

 

I'm sure you're a great drummer, and I mean this playfully—not personally, but give me a break. You are overstating your point. If in your opinion Natural Science has "nothing difficult in it," then I trust you are drumming for a successful rock group...

 

 

Soo much going on. I love this song. :dweez:

[calirush]

I've seen this before but thought it would be good for this thread.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Ovp2MmdhD_M

[peter_heijnen]

Neils parts are are great but indeed 'doable' for any nowadays drummer that want's to work out all the parts.

 

However, the way neil plays his parts -especially in the old days- is what makes all the difference. Try playing those parts with that incredible power! ;)

[Tombstone Mountain]

I'm a drummer and I've never found any of Neil's parts to be "too hard" to play. He's obviously skilled, but there's nothing he's done on a drumset that cannot easily be replicated with a bit of rehearsing. Natural Science is simple, there's absolutely nothing of difficulty in that song drum-wise. I'd say his most challenging would be La Villa Strangiato as there are a lot of shifting feels that need to be smoothly executed, or something off of PoW or HYF where he is utilizing percussion within beats. The chorus of Mystic Rhythms can be hard to replicate without proper foot-triggers, but even that's easily done with a bit of practice.

 

La Villa is the hardest, no doubt.

 

Really? You don't think the whole of Hemispheres, Snakes and Arrows, Test for Echo, and Permenant Waves are "too hard"? You have to dig deeper into his playing. Take a look at his "Taking Center Stage" DVD. You will notice things he does you would not even believe are possible. Leave that Thing Alone and Main Monkey Business come to mind. His techniques are pretty hard to master, especially keeping a rhythm. I know a lot of drummers who think they're hotshots but can't even keep a simple Beatles song the same tempo by the end.

 

Now, don't take this the wrong way as saying you don't have enough experience to replicate his playing but it's pretty much a job to keep up with his current playing level. I haven't seen one person keep their left foot going on the highhat and using it as a metronome like he does. The man is a machine. All four of his limbs are constantly doing stuff now it just makes you want to throw up that he's actually a human being. I'm surprised he doesn't even use his head as a limb to play.

 

Even my dad is a drummer (38 years of experience and Neil has been his idol since he first started drumming) and he is still floored by Neil's playing.

 

I would say all-together...Cygnus X-II, La Villa, Test for Echo, Gangster of Boats Series, Headlong Flight and Natural Science are the craziest and complicated RUSH songs.

 

But it's not a job to keep up with his playing. Natural Science has NOTHING difficult in it. Hemispheres the song is basic patterns and disco beats on the hi-hat. La Villa is legitimitely challenging, but that's mainly due to the abrupt switches in feels/parts that need to be smoothly transitioned. Keeping a hi-hat going through a beat is really easy for anyone who's gained any sort of limb independence from playing drums for a few years,

 

I'm not knocking Neil at all. His parts are GREAT. But they are nowhere near difficult or as difficult as people make them out to be.

Funny...Gotta laugh :Neil: Neil once described playing an entire Rush show in these exact terms: it's like "running a marathon while solving equations".

[RushBoingo]

Off the top of my head, and guessing

 

For Alex, any song where he has to put his pick in his mouth and play the keys could be hard if the transfer has to quick, think Time Stand Still, otherwise, TSOR must be tiring, and the live working man solos sound taxing

 

For Geddy, I know for a fact that it's a pain to play the chords in Force ten, I don't know how he does it. Alot of the Power Windows album has a good chunk of bass and keyboard triggers to manage. Singing wise Cygnus X-1 takes the cake for the C Sharp 5 note at the end. If Geddy played every key note hands down the difficulty would go to the middle section of Grand Designs

 

For Neil, Certainly Xanadu had him dancing around his kit to hit all the extra percussion, and the weapon has a very mentaly grading opening line for electronic stuff. Otherwise I don't know, I don't know the difficulty for drums as much.

[kooma]

La Villa, I think... :sigh:

[CygnusGal]

I've seen this before but thought it would be good for this thread.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Ovp2MmdhD_M

^^^ this was my first thought too. I am not a drummer but Neil says it is difficult. Who are we to argue? I remember hearing them say (Geddy, iirc) that it was the toughest track to get to sound correctly when it was created in the studio too.

 

I find Geddy's newer stuff to be more challenging to play than a lot of his older lines. To me, his playing today has faster passages, more subtle grace notes and his phrasing is more fluid. He plays with more emotion and has more command of the instrument than he did 30 years ago. MalNar is a great example and its done on a fretless bass, too - what intonation! :o CA song is very challenging with vocals that runs counter to the bass (a first for Rush!)

 

I am not a guitarist, so I don't know the answer for guitar. But, I've known more than a few guitarists who've been frustrated by many of the Lifeson chords. "That's crazy" was a common utterance I would overhear from the guitarist I've known who could play Rush.

 

JMO.

[John V]

Jacobs Ladder has a very unusual beat to it. Is this what Peart was talking about when he told the story on "Lighted Stage" about learning to play a new way?

It seems Jacobs Ladder is an example of this new found style?

[Tombstone Mountain]

I've seen this before but thought it would be good for this thread.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Ovp2MmdhD_M

^^^ this was my first thought too. I am not a drummer but Neil says it is difficult. Who are we to argue? I remember hearing them say (Geddy, iirc) that it was the toughest track to get to sound correctly when it was created in the studio too.

 

I find Geddy's newer stuff to be more challenging to play than a lot of his older lines. To me, his playing today has faster passages, more subtle grace notes and his phrasing is more fluid. He plays with more emotion and has more command of the instrument than he did 30 years ago. MalNar is a great example and its done on a fretless bass, too - what intonation! :o CA song is very challenging with vocals that runs counter to the bass (a first for Rush!)

 

I am not a guitarist, so I don't know the answer for guitar. But, I've known more than a few guitarists who've been frustrated by many of the Lifeson chords. "That's crazy" was a common utterance I would overhear from the guitarist I've known who could play Rush.

 

JMO.

In the pocket BassGurl!

[Blue J]

from .26 seconds into Subdivisions to .37 seconds, Neil is playing what I consider to be a technically challenging drum part where he is using a combination of hi-hat and ride with this off snare timing - it's just crazy complicated to me (I've tried to play it) but the rest of the song is not as complicated in relative terms.

 

Exactly right! I've always been awed by that particular passage. I've spent 28 years playing the drums, and there are a lot of things I've never been able to do, that Neil seems to be able to toss off in his sleep.

 

And now that I've started on guitar, I'm finding that Geddy and Alex's approach to songwriting (not just the time signatures, but the chord progressions) is from somewhere way out in the cosmos. Great, great stuff.

 

I can't pick a 'most technically challenging' piece of Rush music...there are too many.

[DBJetsman]

La Villa Strangiato, YYZ, Natural Science, The Analog Kid

[drbirdsong]

The only thing I can play without instruction is the final chord of 'A Day In The Life' on piano. (Tone deaf and musically un-inclined)

 

Freewill always seemed like it would be a hard one to play. Sure enough, I saw a video of Alex talking about that song (don't ask me where) and he said that he is very proud of that one because they are all soloing in the middle and he really has to concentrate on what he is doing. It is always easy to think of Neil and Geddy doing amazing things, but Alex makes it look simple.

 

I also heard Geddy saying that The Anarchist was challenging. It looks likes magic to me.

[EagleMoon]

I would have to say Hemispheres as a whole. I still struggle with parts of it to this day. Not sure I ever learned the bass parts note for note, but pretty close.

[dilbertyard]

La villa strangiato and Freewill as a whole for all the instruments. Many people say yyz but in my opinion is a fairly simple song (relatively speaking) but just at a fast pace.