JohnnyBlaze's Definitive Method of Ranking Rush

[rushgoober]

QUOTE (Shreddy Lee @ Jul 16 2012, 03:02 PM)

QUOTE (rushgoober @ Jul 16 2012, 11:04 AM) One thing you share with my list that differs from JohnnyBlaze's is how low your rankings can go. For example, Johnny's lowest is 3.1. You have SEVEN albums rated lower than his lowest, and I have FOUR.  For him he seems to "not like something quite as much" where you and I seem to have no problem either "not liking it much at all" or outright "hating it." Interestingly, your highest is at 4.25, with #2 at 4 and #3 at 3.71.  Here we seriously differ as that seems shockingly low to me.  I guess you don't think Rush have any perfect albums, and only 1 that's even close to perfect.  Your numbers seem to show (and feel free to violently disagree with me) that you're more of a casual Rush fan than many of us.  Either that, or you're a lot harder to please.  I have a full ELEVEN albums rated higher than your highest rating.  Johnny has SEVEN.  I have 13 rated higher than your top 3, and Johnny has 14! I do have to disagree, I'm not a casual fan at all. I'm just as passionate about Rush as anyone else here. The fact that I took the time to rank the albums this way on a Rush forum should prove that.   I don't think I'd say it's that I'm harder to please, but rather that I'm just much more strict with calling something "perfect". He did put that word next to the 5, and I kept that in mind when rating. I only gave it to a handful of songs that I really, really love. If I had just considered it to be "great" or "the highest rating a song can get" then it would likely have turned out differently.   So I think my results are simply explained by the way this particular rating system works. I agree with you that when I looked back at all my averages, and saw how low they tended to be, I was surprised. It's not at all how it would have come out if I had just done it on my own, without this system. The album rankings were very close to my other list, but the numbers make it seem very different.   For example, I consider Hemispheres to be the best album. So if I was asked to rate it on a scale of 1-5, just in comparison to the other albums, it would get a 5. But on this scale, I gave Cygnus and La Villa both 5s, The Trees a 4, and Circumstances a 3. That drags the overall average down to 4.25. Similarly, my distaste for some of the late 80's and 90's stuff really dragged down my overall numbers, when I don't actually feel that strongly negative towards it. I don't hate it and think it's horrible music, it's just not for me. I did give a lot of 1s to the songs in that period that don't appeal to me at all, but perhaps that wasn't the right way to do it. Fair enough!

[JohnnyBlaze]

QUOTE (rushgoober @ Jul 17 2012, 12:04 AM)

QUOTE (Shreddy Lee @ Jul 15 2012, 03:40 AM) Good idea. My findings: 1. Hemispheres (Avg: 4.25) 2. Fly By Night (Avg: 4) 3. Moving Pictures (Avg: 3.71) 4. A Farewell to Kings (Avg: 3.5) (Tie) 5. Clockwork Angels (Avg: 3.5) (Tie) 6. Permanent Waves (Avg: 3.5) (Tie) 7. Vapor Trails (Avg: 3.46) 8. Caress of Steel (Avg: 3.4) 9. Rush (Avg: 3.375) 10. 2112 (Avg: 3.33) 11. Grace Under Pressure (Avg: 3.25) 12. Signals (Avg: 3.125) 13. Snakes & Arrows (Avg: 2.92) 14. Roll the Bones (Avg: 2.2) 15. Counterparts (Avg: 2) (Tie) 16. Hold Your Fire (Avg: 2) (Tie) 17. Test for Echo (Avg: 1.81) 18. Presto (Avg: 1.54) 19. Power Windows (Avg: 1.5) One thing you share with my list that differs from JohnnyBlaze's is how low your rankings can go.   For example, Johnny's lowest is 3.1. You have SEVEN albums rated lower than his lowest, and I have FOUR. For him he seems to "not like something quite as much" where you and I seem to have no problem either "not liking it much at all" or outright "hating it."   Interestingly, your highest is at 4.25, with #2 at 4 and #3 at 3.71. Here we seriously differ as that seems shockingly low to me. I guess you don't think Rush have any perfect albums, and only 1 that's even close to perfect. Your numbers seem to show (and feel free to violently disagree with me) that you're more of a casual Rush fan than many of us. Either that, or you're a lot harder to please. I have a full ELEVEN albums rated higher than your highest rating. Johnny has SEVEN. I have 13 rated higher than your top 3, and Johnny has 14! Why are my ratings so shocking? Yeah, the worst album imho is RTB. And, I've said this many times in the past,"It's still not that bad of an album despite having some shit on there." You on the other hand want to ram nuclear weapons up the band's sphincter for even thinking of Vapor Trails. So yeah, you have a lot more hate in you for some albums. So what?   There is no perfect scale. I only created this one because the other scales have been way to anal-retentive or just "Rate this album 1-10" simplistic.

[JohnnyBlaze]

QUOTE (Tommy Sawyer @ Jul 17 2012, 01:58 AM)

Albums don't work that way. This way give no weighting to how the album flows and how enjoyable it is to listen to the album all the way through. Besides, not all 5-star songs are equal.

Well then how do they work then big guy? What's your perfect scale oh great wise one of "weighting to how the album flows and how enjoyable it is to listen to the album all the way through"?

 

[rushgoober]

QUOTE (JohnnyBlaze @ Jul 17 2012, 04:52 AM)

QUOTE (rushgoober @ Jul 17 2012, 12:04 AM) QUOTE (Shreddy Lee @ Jul 15 2012, 03:40 AM) Good idea. My findings: 1. Hemispheres (Avg: 4.25) 2. Fly By Night (Avg: 4) 3. Moving Pictures (Avg: 3.71) 4. A Farewell to Kings (Avg: 3.5) (Tie) 5. Clockwork Angels (Avg: 3.5) (Tie) 6. Permanent Waves (Avg: 3.5) (Tie) 7. Vapor Trails (Avg: 3.46) 8. Caress of Steel (Avg: 3.4) 9. Rush (Avg: 3.375) 10. 2112 (Avg: 3.33) 11. Grace Under Pressure (Avg: 3.25) 12. Signals (Avg: 3.125) 13. Snakes & Arrows (Avg: 2.92) 14. Roll the Bones (Avg: 2.2) 15. Counterparts (Avg: 2) (Tie) 16. Hold Your Fire (Avg: 2) (Tie) 17. Test for Echo (Avg: 1.81) 18. Presto (Avg: 1.54) 19. Power Windows (Avg: 1.5) One thing you share with my list that differs from JohnnyBlaze's is how low your rankings can go.   For example, Johnny's lowest is 3.1. You have SEVEN albums rated lower than his lowest, and I have FOUR. For him he seems to "not like something quite as much" where you and I seem to have no problem either "not liking it much at all" or outright "hating it."   Interestingly, your highest is at 4.25, with #2 at 4 and #3 at 3.71. Here we seriously differ as that seems shockingly low to me. I guess you don't think Rush have any perfect albums, and only 1 that's even close to perfect. Your numbers seem to show (and feel free to violently disagree with me) that you're more of a casual Rush fan than many of us. Either that, or you're a lot harder to please. I have a full ELEVEN albums rated higher than your highest rating. Johnny has SEVEN. I have 13 rated higher than your top 3, and Johnny has 14! Why are my ratings so shocking? Yeah, the worst album imho is RTB. And, I've said this many times in the past,"It's still not that bad of an album despite having some shit on there." You on the other hand want to ram nuclear weapons up the band's sphincter for even thinking of Vapor Trails. So yeah, you have a lot more hate in you for some albums. So what?   There is no perfect scale. I only created this one because the other scales have been way to anal-retentive or just "Rate this album 1-10" simplistic. I didn't mean to sound judgmental or negative towards your ratings if you took it that way, just making some comparisons. Also, I used the word shockingly for Shreddy's numbers, not yours. Anyway, I wish my lowest rating was 3.1, but for me their weakest 4 albums are REALLY weak as opposed to being "not bad." I wish I felt that way.

Edited July 17, 2012 by rushgoober

[rushgoober]

QUOTE (Shreddy Lee @ Jul 16 2012, 03:02 PM)

I don't think I'd say it's that I'm harder to please, but rather that I'm just much more strict with calling something "perfect". He did put that word next to the 5, and I kept that in mind when rating. I only gave it to a handful of songs that I really, really love. If I had just considered it to be "great" or "the highest rating a song can get" then it would likely have turned out differently.

Well, the rating said a 5 was from great to perfect, as opposed to 4 which was from good to very good. If I was just giving 5 to absolutely PERFECT songs, I probably would have given far less 5's, but I also considered songs that were (merely!) great - basically, anything that was better than just very good got a 5, and that's a lot of songs!

[JohnnyBlaze]

QUOTE (rushgoober @ Jul 17 2012, 09:10 PM)

QUOTE (JohnnyBlaze @ Jul 17 2012, 04:52 AM) QUOTE (rushgoober @ Jul 17 2012, 12:04 AM) QUOTE (Shreddy Lee @ Jul 15 2012, 03:40 AM) Good idea. My findings: 1. Hemispheres (Avg: 4.25) 2. Fly By Night (Avg: 4) 3. Moving Pictures (Avg: 3.71) 4. A Farewell to Kings (Avg: 3.5) (Tie) 5. Clockwork Angels (Avg: 3.5) (Tie) 6. Permanent Waves (Avg: 3.5) (Tie) 7. Vapor Trails (Avg: 3.46) 8. Caress of Steel (Avg: 3.4) 9. Rush (Avg: 3.375) 10. 2112 (Avg: 3.33) 11. Grace Under Pressure (Avg: 3.25) 12. Signals (Avg: 3.125) 13. Snakes & Arrows (Avg: 2.92) 14. Roll the Bones (Avg: 2.2) 15. Counterparts (Avg: 2) (Tie) 16. Hold Your Fire (Avg: 2) (Tie) 17. Test for Echo (Avg: 1.81) 18. Presto (Avg: 1.54) 19. Power Windows (Avg: 1.5) One thing you share with my list that differs from JohnnyBlaze's is how low your rankings can go.   For example, Johnny's lowest is 3.1. You have SEVEN albums rated lower than his lowest, and I have FOUR. For him he seems to "not like something quite as much" where you and I seem to have no problem either "not liking it much at all" or outright "hating it."   Interestingly, your highest is at 4.25, with #2 at 4 and #3 at 3.71. Here we seriously differ as that seems shockingly low to me. I guess you don't think Rush have any perfect albums, and only 1 that's even close to perfect. Your numbers seem to show (and feel free to violently disagree with me) that you're more of a casual Rush fan than many of us. Either that, or you're a lot harder to please. I have a full ELEVEN albums rated higher than your highest rating. Johnny has SEVEN. I have 13 rated higher than your top 3, and Johnny has 14! Why are my ratings so shocking? Yeah, the worst album imho is RTB. And, I've said this many times in the past,"It's still not that bad of an album despite having some shit on there." You on the other hand want to ram nuclear weapons up the band's sphincter for even thinking of Vapor Trails. So yeah, you have a lot more hate in you for some albums. So what?   There is no perfect scale. I only created this one because the other scales have been way to anal-retentive or just "Rate this album 1-10" simplistic. I didn't mean to sound judgmental or negative towards your ratings if you took it that way, just making some comparisons. Also, I used the word shockingly for Shreddy's numbers, not yours. Anyway, I wish my lowest rating was 3.1, but for me their weakest 4 albums are REALLY weak as opposed to being "not bad." I wish I felt that way. Put it this way, RTB isn't a total piece of shit BUT this scale favored its points. As a straight-up question, I wouldn't have put it at 3.1 but I will likely put it at the bottom of all the Rush albums forever and ever amen. Obviously, this scale's only goal is to look at the albums song by song without being TOO microscopic (imho). I think some on here just aren't willing to do that. Oh well. It's just another method of judgement. S & A suffered in my ratings BECAUSE there are a few songs on there that got 2s. Too bad, but that's how it goes.

[rushgoober]

QUOTE (JohnnyBlaze @ Jul 17 2012, 05:37 AM)

QUOTE (rushgoober @ Jul 17 2012, 09:10 PM) QUOTE (JohnnyBlaze @ Jul 17 2012, 04:52 AM) QUOTE (rushgoober @ Jul 17 2012, 12:04 AM) QUOTE (Shreddy Lee @ Jul 15 2012, 03:40 AM) Good idea. My findings: 1. Hemispheres (Avg: 4.25) 2. Fly By Night (Avg: 4) 3. Moving Pictures (Avg: 3.71) 4. A Farewell to Kings (Avg: 3.5) (Tie) 5. Clockwork Angels (Avg: 3.5) (Tie) 6. Permanent Waves (Avg: 3.5) (Tie) 7. Vapor Trails (Avg: 3.46) 8. Caress of Steel (Avg: 3.4) 9. Rush (Avg: 3.375) 10. 2112 (Avg: 3.33) 11. Grace Under Pressure (Avg: 3.25) 12. Signals (Avg: 3.125) 13. Snakes & Arrows (Avg: 2.92) 14. Roll the Bones (Avg: 2.2) 15. Counterparts (Avg: 2) (Tie) 16. Hold Your Fire (Avg: 2) (Tie) 17. Test for Echo (Avg: 1.81) 18. Presto (Avg: 1.54) 19. Power Windows (Avg: 1.5) One thing you share with my list that differs from JohnnyBlaze's is how low your rankings can go.   For example, Johnny's lowest is 3.1. You have SEVEN albums rated lower than his lowest, and I have FOUR. For him he seems to "not like something quite as much" where you and I seem to have no problem either "not liking it much at all" or outright "hating it."   Interestingly, your highest is at 4.25, with #2 at 4 and #3 at 3.71. Here we seriously differ as that seems shockingly low to me. I guess you don't think Rush have any perfect albums, and only 1 that's even close to perfect. Your numbers seem to show (and feel free to violently disagree with me) that you're more of a casual Rush fan than many of us. Either that, or you're a lot harder to please. I have a full ELEVEN albums rated higher than your highest rating. Johnny has SEVEN. I have 13 rated higher than your top 3, and Johnny has 14! Why are my ratings so shocking? Yeah, the worst album imho is RTB. And, I've said this many times in the past,"It's still not that bad of an album despite having some shit on there." You on the other hand want to ram nuclear weapons up the band's sphincter for even thinking of Vapor Trails. So yeah, you have a lot more hate in you for some albums. So what?   There is no perfect scale. I only created this one because the other scales have been way to anal-retentive or just "Rate this album 1-10" simplistic. I didn't mean to sound judgmental or negative towards your ratings if you took it that way, just making some comparisons. Also, I used the word shockingly for Shreddy's numbers, not yours. Anyway, I wish my lowest rating was 3.1, but for me their weakest 4 albums are REALLY weak as opposed to being "not bad." I wish I felt that way. Put it this way, RTB isn't a total piece of shit BUT this scale favored its points. As a straight-up question, I wouldn't have put it at 3.1 but I will likely put it at the bottom of all the Rush albums forever and ever amen. Obviously, this scale's only goal is to look at the albums song by song without being TOO microscopic (imho). I think some on here just aren't willing to do that. Oh well. It's just another method of judgement. S & A suffered in my ratings BECAUSE there are a few songs on there that got 2s. Too bad, but that's how it goes. I think the thread is great, and I hope more people take on the challenge. I definitely enjoyed doing it.   And like I said previously, outside of a couple of albums that ended up a bit off from how I'd really rate them (2112 ended up too high and HYF ended up too low), for the most part this way of doing it was fairly dead-on in terms of how I would rate the Rush albums if I was doing it more generally just by how I feel about the albums.

[JohnnyBlaze]

QUOTE (rushgoober @ Jul 17 2012, 09:42 PM)

QUOTE (JohnnyBlaze @ Jul 17 2012, 05:37 AM) QUOTE (rushgoober @ Jul 17 2012, 09:10 PM) QUOTE (JohnnyBlaze @ Jul 17 2012, 04:52 AM) QUOTE (rushgoober @ Jul 17 2012, 12:04 AM) QUOTE (Shreddy Lee @ Jul 15 2012, 03:40 AM) Good idea. My findings: 1. Hemispheres (Avg: 4.25) 2. Fly By Night (Avg: 4) 3. Moving Pictures (Avg: 3.71) 4. A Farewell to Kings (Avg: 3.5) (Tie) 5. Clockwork Angels (Avg: 3.5) (Tie) 6. Permanent Waves (Avg: 3.5) (Tie) 7. Vapor Trails (Avg: 3.46) 8. Caress of Steel (Avg: 3.4) 9. Rush (Avg: 3.375) 10. 2112 (Avg: 3.33) 11. Grace Under Pressure (Avg: 3.25) 12. Signals (Avg: 3.125) 13. Snakes & Arrows (Avg: 2.92) 14. Roll the Bones (Avg: 2.2) 15. Counterparts (Avg: 2) (Tie) 16. Hold Your Fire (Avg: 2) (Tie) 17. Test for Echo (Avg: 1.81) 18. Presto (Avg: 1.54) 19. Power Windows (Avg: 1.5) One thing you share with my list that differs from JohnnyBlaze's is how low your rankings can go.   For example, Johnny's lowest is 3.1. You have SEVEN albums rated lower than his lowest, and I have FOUR. For him he seems to "not like something quite as much" where you and I seem to have no problem either "not liking it much at all" or outright "hating it."   Interestingly, your highest is at 4.25, with #2 at 4 and #3 at 3.71. Here we seriously differ as that seems shockingly low to me. I guess you don't think Rush have any perfect albums, and only 1 that's even close to perfect. Your numbers seem to show (and feel free to violently disagree with me) that you're more of a casual Rush fan than many of us. Either that, or you're a lot harder to please. I have a full ELEVEN albums rated higher than your highest rating. Johnny has SEVEN. I have 13 rated higher than your top 3, and Johnny has 14! Why are my ratings so shocking? Yeah, the worst album imho is RTB. And, I've said this many times in the past,"It's still not that bad of an album despite having some shit on there." You on the other hand want to ram nuclear weapons up the band's sphincter for even thinking of Vapor Trails. So yeah, you have a lot more hate in you for some albums. So what?   There is no perfect scale. I only created this one because the other scales have been way to anal-retentive or just "Rate this album 1-10" simplistic. I didn't mean to sound judgmental or negative towards your ratings if you took it that way, just making some comparisons. Also, I used the word shockingly for Shreddy's numbers, not yours. Anyway, I wish my lowest rating was 3.1, but for me their weakest 4 albums are REALLY weak as opposed to being "not bad." I wish I felt that way. Put it this way, RTB isn't a total piece of shit BUT this scale favored its points. As a straight-up question, I wouldn't have put it at 3.1 but I will likely put it at the bottom of all the Rush albums forever and ever amen. Obviously, this scale's only goal is to look at the albums song by song without being TOO microscopic (imho). I think some on here just aren't willing to do that. Oh well. It's just another method of judgement. S & A suffered in my ratings BECAUSE there are a few songs on there that got 2s. Too bad, but that's how it goes. I think the thread is great, and I hope more people take on the challenge. I definitely enjoyed doing it.   And like I said previously, outside of a couple of albums that ended up a bit off from how I'd really rate them (2112 ended up too high and HYF ended up too low), for the most part this way of doing it was fairly dead-on in terms of how I would rate the Rush albums if I was doing it more generally just by how I feel about the albums. Frankly, I think there are some folks that would skew their points so that their precious Hemispheres or Clockwork Angels doesn't get too bad of a ranking. . Really though.

[Gompers]

This method is somewhat flawed I think. Maybe a ranking out of 10 instead of 5 would be better. Some sub songs in TFoL are better than others and I didn't break them out.

 

Hemispheres 5

A Farewell to Kings 4.6

Permanent Waves 4.5

Grace Under Pressure 4.5

Snakes & Arrows 4.461538462

Moving Pictures 4.428571429

Power Windows 4.375

Counterparts 4.181818182

2112 4.166666667

Rush 4.125

Signals 4.125

Test For Echo 3.909090909

Fly By Night 3.875

Caress of Steel 3.8

Hold Your Fire 3.8

Clockwork Angels 3.75

Roll The Bones 3.5

Presto 3.363636364

Vapor Trails 3.153846154

 

[JohnnyBlaze]

QUOTE (Gompers @ Jul 17 2012, 10:10 PM)

This method is somewhat flawed I think. Maybe a ranking out of 10 instead of 5 would be better. Some sub songs in TFoL are better than others and I didn't break them out. Hemispheres 5 A Farewell to Kings 4.6 Permanent Waves 4.5 Grace Under Pressure 4.5 Snakes & Arrows 4.461538462 Moving Pictures 4.428571429 Power Windows 4.375 Counterparts 4.181818182 2112 4.166666667 Rush 4.125 Signals 4.125 Test For Echo 3.909090909 Fly By Night 3.875 Caress of Steel 3.8 Hold Your Fire 3.8 Clockwork Angels 3.75 Roll The Bones 3.5 Presto 3.363636364 Vapor Trails 3.153846154

I thought about a 1-10 scale for about 2 seconds. That 1-10 range is always used. I wanted something different. And I wanted the numbers/ratings to have more weight.

 

As for TFoL, it's still one song. Imho, it'd be like breaking up La Villa Strangiato...and I don't really think many Rush fans do that. Do they?

 

 

[rushgoober]

QUOTE (Gompers @ Jul 17 2012, 06:10 AM)

This method is somewhat flawed I think. Maybe a ranking out of 10 instead of 5 would be better. Some sub songs in TFoL are better than others and I didn't break them out. Hemispheres 5 A Farewell to Kings 4.6 Permanent Waves 4.5 Grace Under Pressure 4.5 Snakes & Arrows 4.461538462 Moving Pictures 4.428571429 Power Windows 4.375 Counterparts 4.181818182 2112 4.166666667 Rush 4.125 Signals 4.125 Test For Echo 3.909090909 Fly By Night 3.875 Caress of Steel 3.8 Hold Your Fire 3.8 Clockwork Angels 3.75 Roll The Bones 3.5 Presto 3.363636364 Vapor Trails 3.153846154

I don't know in what kind of strange universe you live in (clockwork or otherwise) where T4E rates higher than CA ( ), but otherwise cool list. Much like with Johnny, I have 4 albums that rate considerably lower than your lowest rating - you're far kinder to their weakest albums than I am...

[rushgoober]

QUOTE (ColdFireYYZ @ Jul 15 2012, 04:17 PM)

Signals - 4.875 Permanent Waves - 4.833 Hemispheres - 4.75 Moving Pictures - 4.714 A Farwell to Kings/Grace Under Pressure/Power Windows - 4.5 Clockwork Angels - 4.333 Counterparts - 4.272 2112 - 4.166 Fly By Night - 3.875 Hold Your Fire - 3.7 Vapor Trails - 3.692 Presto - 3.545 Snakes & Arrows - 3.461 Rush - 3.375 Roll The Bones - 3.3 Caress of Steel - 3.2 Test For Echo - 2.181

It's cool that you have Clockwork Angels so high on your list!

 

Interestingly, I have them as a higher numerical rating (4.5 compared to your 4.33), but you have them higher in order (6 for you compared to 9 for me).

[ColdFireYYZ]

QUOTE (Tommy Sawyer @ Jul 16 2012, 12:58 PM)

Albums don't work that way. This way give no weighting to how the album flows and how enjoyable it is to listen to the album all the way through. Besides, not all 5-star songs are equal.

I agree. An album can have 10 great songs but the flow could be terrible. However, I was pretty surprised that my list was pretty much in order. Signals and Permanent Waves are tied for first place for me, and they scored a 4.875 and 4.833.

Edited July 18, 2012 by ColdFireYYZ

[sitboaf]

Sorry to dig up such and old post (from page 3!), but I REALLY wanted to do these rankings when I got some time.

Actually, iTunes made it easy, since I have all my Rush songs already rated.

In order to use my existing database, I had to make some changes to the Johnny Blaze System. I think the results should come out about the same, though.

 

My alterations:

1. I use a 5-point scale for each song, but where 5 = Immortal (only 7 songs achieved this), 4 is fantastic, 3 is excellent/very good, 2 is good, and 1 is fair to poor. I have also assigned half-star rankings (Yes, you CAN do this in iTunes).

 

2. The multi-part epics are broken into individual songs, as that's how I imported them originally, and it's how I think of them. The band provided us with the names of the individual parts for a reason, right?

 

3. Songs under 2 minutes in length get half-weighted. Songs over 9 minutes get a weight-and-a-half. It's not perfect, but it keeps BU2B2 from weighing the same as side one of 2112 or Xanadu.

 

The Results:

1- 3.73 Moving Pictures

2- 3.31 Permanent Waves (tie)

2- 3.31 Signals (tie)

4- 3.29 Farewell to Kings

5- 2.96 Clockwork Angels

 

6- 2.94 Fly By Night

7- 2.90 Hold Your Fire

8- 2.88 Rush

9- 2.83 Hemispheres

10- 2.82 Counterparts (tie)

10- 2.82 Presto (tie)

10- 2.82 2112 (tie)

 

13- 2.81 Power Windows (tie)

13- 2.81 Snakes & Arrows (tie)

15- 2.75 Roll the Bones (tie)

15- 2.75 Grace Under Pressure (tie)

 

17- 2.73 Vapor Trails

18- 2.48 Caress of Steel

19- 2.14 Test for Echo

 

Wow. Moving Pictures just torched the field. After that, there are some very close rankings, especially #9 through #17. It's not surprising, really, since there are very few songs to which I gave 5 stars (7 total) or 1 star (5 of those). There are a huge number of 2.5 to 3.5 star songs (122 out of 185).

 

Having said that, though, I don't think my "emotional rankings" would be much different. CoS would do better, because I usually overlook "Bald" and heap love on most of Lamneth. The first two albums would rank lower, because I'm not in the mood to hear that period as much as the later periods.

 

But, yay for Clockwork Angels at number 5!

[SUBDIVISIONS]

Interesting, the system pays tribute to Hemispheres, which I think cygnus X1 book 2 is the most respectful, mature, creative, imaginative, awesome music rock operetta artwork ever made in history.

 

Also Signals rates High, maybe because Subdivisions is the Best Song Ever created in the Universe,

the highest pick among technology and creativity for human kind.

 

Moving seats to put down the worshipped Moving Pictures

[Babycat]

I don't understand a thing about numerical rating, except 10/10 - to me, all the albums are perfect. No bad songs.

 

 

That is all.

 

 

 

[nappy2112]

QUOTE (laughedatbytime @ Jul 15 2012, 08:49 PM)

QUOTE (1-0-0-1-0-0-1 @ Jul 15 2012, 01:54 PM) QUOTE (treeduck @ Jul 15 2012, 03:28 PM) I may have a go at this... Me too. I like Blaze's logic here. This system should be time weighted. Or at least the epics should be stripped down into parts.   Otherwise, for example, Tears and the Twilight Zone have twice as much weight as 2112. Yeah that's the problem I have with all these ranking threads , Hemispheres for example only has 4 songs and some others have 13.   Still kind of a neat idea though.

[sitboaf]

QUOTE

Otherwise, for example, Tears and the Twilight Zone have twice as much weight as 2112. Yeah that's the problem I have with all these ranking threads , Hemispheres for example only has 4 songs and some others have 13.

 

I think I solved it.

2112 (the song) is seven songs for me. X1: book 2-Hemispheres is 6 more. Well, 5 and a half songs, because I half-weighted part 6 for being under 2 minutes.

 

Xanadu, Camera Eye, Natural Science, Strangiato received 1.5 weights for being over 9 minutes.

It seemed to work, as my "math ranking" came very close to my "emotional ranking".

[JohnnyBlaze]

QUOTE (sitboaf @ Aug 10 2012, 03:20 PM)

Sorry to dig up such and old post (from page 3!), but I REALLY wanted to do these rankings when I got some time. Actually, iTunes made it easy, since I have all my Rush songs already rated. In order to use my existing database, I had to make some changes to the Johnny Blaze System. I think the results should come out about the same, though. My alterations: 1. I use a 5-point scale for each song, but where 5 = Immortal (only 7 songs achieved this), 4 is fantastic, 3 is excellent/very good, 2 is good, and 1 is fair to poor. I have also assigned half-star rankings (Yes, you CAN do this in iTunes). 2. The multi-part epics are broken into individual songs, as that's how I imported them originally, and it's how I think of them. The band provided us with the names of the individual parts for a reason, right? 3. Songs under 2 minutes in length get half-weighted. Songs over 9 minutes get a weight-and-a-half. It's not perfect, but it keeps BU2B2 from weighing the same as side one of 2112 or Xanadu. The Results: 1- 3.73 Moving Pictures 2- 3.31 Permanent Waves (tie) 2- 3.31 Signals (tie) 4- 3.29 Farewell to Kings 5- 2.96 Clockwork Angels 6- 2.94 Fly By Night 7- 2.90 Hold Your Fire 8- 2.88 Rush 9- 2.83 Hemispheres 10- 2.82 Counterparts (tie) 10- 2.82 Presto (tie) 10- 2.82 2112 (tie) 13- 2.81 Power Windows (tie) 13- 2.81 Snakes & Arrows (tie) 15- 2.75 Roll the Bones (tie) 15- 2.75 Grace Under Pressure (tie) 17- 2.73 Vapor Trails 18- 2.48 Caress of Steel 19- 2.14 Test for Echo Wow. Moving Pictures just torched the field. After that, there are some very close rankings, especially #9 through #17. It's not surprising, really, since there are very few songs to which I gave 5 stars (7 total) or 1 star (5 of those). There are a huge number of 2.5 to 3.5 star songs (122 out of 185). Having said that, though, I don't think my "emotional rankings" would be much different. CoS would do better, because I usually overlook "Bald" and heap love on most of Lamneth. The first two albums would rank lower, because I'm not in the mood to hear that period as much as the later periods. But, yay for Clockwork Angels at number 5!

You get 5 points simply for calling it The JohnnyBlaze System.

That's cool that you took the time to revise it actually. But, here are some of my issues with the Revised sitboaf-JohnnyBlaze System:

 

- I didn't want to dissect the concepts/epics simply because more complicated is NOT the way I wanted to go.

- Your 2 ranking doesn't make sense to me. 2 out of 5 is NOT "good" in my opinion. A 2 when it comes to ranking other things like films or hotels is GENERALLY "fair" or "okay". It's 40%. I don't see how 40%=good.

- The time dissection is another issue.

 

 

Someone noted that the system pays tribute to Hemispheres. I think not really. The system merely regards such tunes as ONE song. Hell, if I didn't like Hemispheres (the tune) then the album would've had a miserable ranking. It just so happened that I thought the entire Hemispheres album was perfection.

[LedRush]

I've used an alternative ranking system (5 is awesome, 4 excellent, 3 good, 2 ok, 1 is less than ok). If I didn't use this, everything would get the same score (little is immortal, and less is bad).

 

My Johnny Blaze (aka, standard iTunes) Results.

1. Hemispheres - 4.5

1. 2112 - 4.5

3. Caress of Steel - 4.4

4. Moving Pictures - 4.285

5. Clockwork Angels - 4.16 (this will move down a bit and settle in around 7-10 I think)

6. Fly By Night - 4.125

7. Roll The Bones - 4.1

8. A Farewell to Kings - 4

9. Test For Echo - 3.909

10. Signals - 3.875

11. Vapor Trails - 3.615

12. Grace Under Pressure - 3.5

12. Power Windows - 3.5

14. Snakes & Arrows - 3.4615

15. Permanent Waves - 3.4285 (I can't believe this result!)

16. Rush - 3.25 (too low!)

17. Hold Your Fire - 3.2

Feedback would go here, with 3.125

18. Presto - 3.09

19. Counterparts - 2.72

 

My recent rankings were:

1. Hemispheres

2. 2112

3. Caress of Steel

4. Moving Pictures

5. Fly By Night

6. Clockwork Angels

7. Farewell to Kings

8. Permanent Waves

9. Roll the Bones

10. Signals

11. Test for Echo

12. Vapor Trails

13. Rush

14. Grace Under Pressure

15. Snakes & Arrows

16. Power Windows

17. Hold Your Fire

18. Presto

19. Counterparts

 

My rankings are largely consistent with each other, with the biggest shock to me being how poorly Permanent Waves did. I love that album. It just must be one where the whole is greater than the sum of its parts.

 

Grace Under Pressure and Power Windows both benefited from this system, probably as both have only 8 songs, and only a couple of them aren't that strong. Also, I am an unabashed fan of RTB and T4E, but I was surprised they did this well under this system. Each have very few not good songs and powered through by not making the missteps that plagued HYF, Presto and CP (which was far lower than anything else Rush did). This is similar to Feedback - with no bad songs, it beats out Presto and Counterparts by just keeping everything good).

[sitboaf]

QUOTE

- I didn't want to dissect the concepts/epics simply because more complicated is NOT the way I wanted to go. - Your 2 ranking doesn't make sense to me. 2 out of 5 is NOT "good" in my opinion. A 2 when it comes to ranking other things like films or hotels is GENERALLY "fair" or "okay". It's 40%. I don't see how 40%=good.

 

Thanks for the thoughtful response, Johnny.

 

As for dissecting the epics, it didn't take me any extra time, as I had already imported them that way- -as separate tracks. Had I not done that, I would have come up with a different way to give extra weight to the side-long songs. But, since Rush had chosen to distinguish the parts of Lamneth and 2112, I did too.

 

As for my ranking system... It kinda bugs me when I read a song-by-song review where a person gives every other song a 5/5. Really? If you're giving the "Armor and Swords" of the world a perfect rank, how do you justify the same 5/5 for Subdivisions?

So I understand how a rating of 2 looks harsh, but I realized that my brain created 2 distinctions worse than "good" (fair and poor, or 1 and 0 - don't forget zero!), and 2 distinctions better than "good" (excellent and fantastic, or 3 and 4). By that logic, a "2" is the 3rd-lowest rank and could be considered 60%.

 

The extra 5th star is bestowed by the cosmos, for songs that become cultural icons/definers of the genre (Tom Sawyer, Working Man, Spirit of Radio).

[Geddyleegenes]

Decided to try it. First though, here's how I rated the albums without doing the numbers:

 

1. Moving Pictures

2. Permanent Waves

3. Counterparts

4. 2112

5. Clockwork Angels

6. Power Windows

7. Hemispheres

8. Rush

9. Caress of Steel

10. Roll The Bones

11. Vapor Trails

12. Fly By Night

13. Signals

14. A Farewell To Kings

15. Test For Echo

16. Grace Under Pressure

17. Snakes & Arrows

18. Hold Your Fire

19. Presto

 

Here's after I crunched the numbers:

 

1. Moving Pictures - Stayed at #1

2. 2112 - Moved up from #4

3. Permanent Waves - Dropped from #2

4. Hemispheres - Moved up from #7

5. Rush - Moved up from #8.

6. Clockwork Angels - Dropped from #5

7. Vapor Trails - Moved up from #11

8. Counterparts - Dropped from #3

9. Power Windows - Dropped from #6

10. Fly By Night - Moved up from #12

11. Roll The Bones - Dropped from #10

12. Caress of Steel - Dropped from #9

13. A Farewell To Kings - Moved up from #14

14. Grace Under Pressure - Moved up from #16

15. Signals - Dropped from #13

16. Test For Echo - Dropped from #15

17. Hold Your Fire - Moved up from #18

18. Snakes & Arrows - Dropped from #17

19. Presto - Stayed at #19

 

I definitely knew my most favorite Rush album and my least favorite.

 

Biggest surprise for me was "Counterparts" moving from #3 down to #8. My absolute favorite song, "Cut To The Chase" is on "CP" so obviously, it carried a whole lot of weight behind it.

 

"Mystic Rhythms" is my second most favorite Rush song, so it also had been supporting some weaker songs as "Power Windows" dropped from #6 to #9.

 

Also surprised that I like "Vapor Trails" more than I thought, up from #11 to #7, above "Counterparts". Even though the overall muddy sound of "VT" leaves me wanting, favorites on the album like "Ghost Rider", "Earthshine", "One Little Victory", "Vapor Trails" and "Nocturne" bring up other, weaker songs.

 

The other albums all stayed relatively close to my original thoughts, although everything from #2 to #18 did move around.

 

Great idea here, JohnnyBlaze. I don't know how I missed this when it was originally posted a month ago.

[sitboaf]

Your emotional rankings, like mine, were pretty darn close to those generated by the Johnny Blaze System. Only 2 of your albums moved more than 3 spots.

 

Your love of Cut To The Chase highlights one of the problems with using song rankings to determine album strength. Any songs that we really love or really hate will create a disproportionate influence on our opinion of the album as a whole.

 

What The Johnny Blaze System does best is measure consistency.

[JohnnyBlaze]

Dug this old thread up after reading fraroc's "Rediscover.." thread...which is kind of fun to read.

 

[Entre_Perpetuo]

I find this interesting, but just that and no more. If you enjoy ranking albums simply by their songs, then have a great go at it, but for me I feel there's something else involved more than an album being the sum of its parts. I think actually I might try this process at some point, but I would consider my personal, unmathematical, ranking more accurate than a the sum of parts rating, for me anyway.