The Garden = The Garden of Eden?

[Running Rebel]

QUOTE (HowItIs @ Jul 11 2012, 02:28 AM)

Oh, Goob I didn't mean to brush you off. And it IS mentioned in Candide. It's an interesting thread and has engendered some good discussion you!

I was going to make the same point. Originally I scorned the idea until you showed it to us in writing. I was unaware that Adam and Eve were supposed to "work" the garden. That's confusing in and of itself.

 

I guess the point is whether you beleve God put us here or not, no matter what twisis of fate brought you to this point, we still are wise to "tend the garden".

 

I also can't help but think of Peter Sellers in Being There.

[HowItIs]

QUOTE (Running Rebel @ Jul 13 2012, 05:05 PM)

QUOTE (HowItIs @ Jul 11 2012, 02:28 AM) Oh, Goob I didn't mean to brush you off. And it IS mentioned in Candide. It's an interesting thread and has engendered some good discussion  you! I was going to make the same point. Originally I scorned the idea until you showed it to us in writing. I was unaware that Adam and Eve were supposed to "work" the garden. That's confusing in and of itself.   I guess the point is whether you beleve God put us here or not, no matter what twisis of fate brought you to this point, we still are wise to "tend the garden".   I also can't help but think of Peter Sellers in Being There.   I hadn't thought of that! Interesting..... http://i224.photobucket.com/albums/dd103/laserspray/internet%20stuff/smilies/diapo1850f8b72528112838e9ae02a3a3ed.gif

[CygnusGal]

[USB Connector]

EDIT: never mind, findingIT posted a much better explanation of Candide. Refer to what he posted. Edited July 14, 2012 by USB Connector

[OGr8imL84AD8inF8sBlackSedan]

Yep....Garden of Eden.

 

http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e259/teeth_rock/olive_garden.jpg

[ReflectedLight]

QUOTE (OGr8imL84AD8inF8sBlackSedan @ Jul 14 2012, 04:59 PM)

Yep....Garden of Eden. http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e259/teeth_rock/olive_garden.jpg

the only problem i have with that picture is that the olive garden sucks.

[Bastille Night]

I just read Candide for the first time just because of the reference from this album (yay Neil, you made me read something I otherwise would only have just thought about reading). Yep, Goob's analysis seems to fit. I was actually quite surprised that there was some backlash against the concept. There are many angry people here!

 

There were a bunch of other cool quotes in the Candide text that I need to fish out. Such a cool book. It's funny to realize that people back in 1700s were thinking the same shit as we're thinking now, and maybe we haven't really progessed that much? I wonder how Voltaire would have approached message boards?

[HowItIs]

QUOTE (Bastille Night @ Jul 15 2012, 06:02 PM)

I just read Candide for the first time just because of the reference from this album (yay Neil, you made me read something I otherwise would only have just thought about reading). Yep, Goob's analysis seems to fit. I was actually quite surprised that there was some backlash against the concept. There are many angry people here! There were a bunch of other cool quotes in the Candide text that I need to fish out. Such a cool book. It's funny to realize that people back in 1700s were thinking the same shit as we're thinking now, and maybe we haven't really progessed that much? I wonder how Voltaire would have approached message boards?

With a rapier wit, I'll warrant!

[Weakly Criminal]

QUOTE (HowItIs @ Jul 16 2012, 01:41 AM)

QUOTE (Bastille Night @ Jul 15 2012, 06:02 PM) I just read Candide for the first time just because of the reference from this album (yay Neil, you made me read something I otherwise would only have just thought about reading). Yep, Goob's analysis seems to fit. I was actually quite surprised that there was some backlash against the concept. There are many angry people here! There were a bunch of other cool quotes in the Candide text that I need to fish out. Such a cool book. It's funny to realize that people back in 1700s were thinking the same shit as we're thinking now, and maybe we haven't really progessed that much? I wonder how Voltaire would have approached message boards? With a rapier wit, I'll warrant! And much despair.

[troutman]

Well,

 

Regardless of the true meaning of the tune. I love it! But at certain moments and depending on my mood I have to play it if it's one of those times. Not sure if this has been posted. A cool video. Makes a person realize how special life is.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cMBqcOF8Svw

[losingit2k]

QUOTE (rushgoober @ Jul 10 2012, 09:29 AM)

Please do not turn this into a religious debate, as that's not the intention here. The subject does seem worthy of discussion, however, in the context of the album and the possible literary correlations. Neil says in the liner notes: QUOTE There is a metaphorical garden in the acts and attitudes of a person's life, and the treasures of that garden are love and respect. I have come to realize that the gathering of love and respect - from others and for myself - has been the real quest of my life. "Now we must tend our garden."   Neil is an intelligent and well-read individual. There's no way he could have not at least thought of "The Garden of Eden" when calling a song "The Garden." I'm not saying he's making any kind of religious statement here, but it seems worth mentioning as the song DOES seem to reflect Neil's philosophy, which could be equated to his version of religion or spirituality in some way. He has often talked in his lyrics about hope, love, respect, free will and a philosophical ideal.   Perhaps he's equating The Garden in the story to certain aspects of The Garden of Eden - that of a time of innocence, love, purity, peace, reflection, of being more connected to who we are and our true natures - of a time before the fall from grace, as opposed to being caught up in the illusions, distractions and difficulties of the world.   The theme of Clockwork Angels begins in Caravan with a time of innocence, hope and dreams:   QUOTE For a boy, life on the farm was idyllic, but for the young man I became, that very peace and predictability were stifling, unbearable. I had big dreams, and needed a big place to explore them: the whole wide world.   On the journey, he hits the realities of the world and has experiences that are familiar to us; that of having belief, structure and will forced upon us (BU2B, Clockwork Angels), working to break free to decide our own path (The Anarchist), searching the world for treasure both literal and metaphorical (Carnies, Seven Cities of Gold), falling in love (Halo Effect), being hurt and enduring tragedy (The Wreckers), having doubt (BU2B2), and then finally getting perspective on the positive aspects of life (Headlong Flight), walking away from those who would hurt us (Wish Them Well) and moving towards the light, the good, towards what we have learned and gained, back full circle towards a time of innocence, but with the perspective gained by wisdom and experience (The Garden).   The character's story reflects a fall from grace and an eventual return, which could easily be equated metaphorically to "The Garden of Eden," and a desire to return to that more pure state. This is a sacred place, even if it is merely metaphorical, that needs to be protected.   QUOTE The measure of a life is a measure of love and respect So hard to earn, so easily burned In the fullness of time A garden to nurture and protect Good point, However I saw it more of a Reap what we've sown and protect what we still have in our lives.

[Mr. Not]

QUOTE (rushgoober @ Jul 10 2012, 07:34 PM)

I guess it's not the first time I had a theory I thought was well-thought out and thought provoking only to have it completely shut down without almost any openness to it having any validity at all. Oh, well...

http://sflchronicle.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/pwned-DH.jpg

 

 

 

And, I've seen you do the same thing to a lot of threads, so you can't really expect much.

[rushgoober]

QUOTE (losingit2k @ Jul 28 2012, 08:11 PM)

QUOTE (rushgoober @ Jul 10 2012, 09:29 AM) Please do not turn this into a religious debate, as that's not the intention here.  The subject does seem worthy of discussion, however, in the context of the album and the possible literary correlations. Neil says in the liner notes: QUOTE There is a metaphorical garden in the acts and attitudes of a person's life, and the treasures of that garden are love and respect. I have come to realize that the gathering of love and respect - from others and for myself - has been the real quest of my life. "Now we must tend our garden."   Neil is an intelligent and well-read individual. There's no way he could have not at least thought of "The Garden of Eden" when calling a song "The Garden." I'm not saying he's making any kind of religious statement here, but it seems worth mentioning as the song DOES seem to reflect Neil's philosophy, which could be equated to his version of religion or spirituality in some way. He has often talked in his lyrics about hope, love, respect, free will and a philosophical ideal.   Perhaps he's equating The Garden in the story to certain aspects of The Garden of Eden - that of a time of innocence, love, purity, peace, reflection, of being more connected to who we are and our true natures - of a time before the fall from grace, as opposed to being caught up in the illusions, distractions and difficulties of the world.   The theme of Clockwork Angels begins in Caravan with a time of innocence, hope and dreams:   QUOTE For a boy, life on the farm was idyllic, but for the young man I became, that very peace and predictability were stifling, unbearable. I had big dreams, and needed a big place to explore them: the whole wide world.   On the journey, he hits the realities of the world and has experiences that are familiar to us; that of having belief, structure and will forced upon us (BU2B, Clockwork Angels), working to break free to decide our own path (The Anarchist), searching the world for treasure both literal and metaphorical (Carnies, Seven Cities of Gold), falling in love (Halo Effect), being hurt and enduring tragedy (The Wreckers), having doubt (BU2B2), and then finally getting perspective on the positive aspects of life (Headlong Flight), walking away from those who would hurt us (Wish Them Well) and moving towards the light, the good, towards what we have learned and gained, back full circle towards a time of innocence, but with the perspective gained by wisdom and experience (The Garden).   The character's story reflects a fall from grace and an eventual return, which could easily be equated metaphorically to "The Garden of Eden," and a desire to return to that more pure state. This is a sacred place, even if it is merely metaphorical, that needs to be protected.   QUOTE The measure of a life is a measure of love and respect So hard to earn, so easily burned In the fullness of time A garden to nurture and protect Good point, However I saw it more of a Reap what we've sown and protect what we still have in our lives.   I see that too.