Why Test for Echo failed so miserably

[LeaveMyThingAlone]

So, as we all know, Test for Echo is one of Rush's worst efforts if not their worst, particularly the lyrics, which everyone here agrees is Neil's worst effort.

 

The question has always been why, particularly coming on the heels of Counterparts, which, obviously, is Rush's best album since Moving Pictures

 

After watching Beyond the Lighted stage for the 1,000 th time it has finally hit me why...Test For Echo is the album where Neil re-learned to play the drums under Freddie Gruber! Of course, drumming took priority and Neil probably put lyrics on the back burner....

 

Like me, many of you have always wondered why Neil's lyrics are so wrong.....and I think I have discovered one possible reason.

 

So the next time you're listening to Virtuality, Half the World, Dog Years, of The Color of Right and are thinking to youself blame the late great Freddie Gruber

[Analog_Bro]

That and some songs (Dog Years, Totem, etc.) are really boring (my opinion of course)

 

Limbo is really good because there are no lyrics

 

Virtuality is great musically - probably my favorite off the album if it weren't for the lyrics

 

Test For Echo and Driven are my two favorite now because the lyrics aren't bad and they are pretty rockin musically

Edited November 24, 2011 by Analog_Bro

[Tommy Sawyer]

QUOTE (LeaveMyThingAlone @ Nov 23 2011, 10:26 PM)

So, as we all know, Test for Echo is one of Rush's worst efforts if not their worst, particularly the lyrics, which everyone here agrees is Neil's worst effort.

Argument invalid. TFE's 'failure' is only an opinion that a large percentage of people share. However, there are many of us that view TFE as a great album, including me.

 

But to say that is is objectively better?

 

[MMCXII]

its mainly the lyrics to Dog years people complain about because they're kinda cheesy. Resist on the other hand I see quoted in signatures often on here.. Driven is one of my favorite songs too!

 

and the lyrics to Limbo aren't too bad...

[GUP1771]

QUOTE (Tommy Sawyer @ Nov 23 2011, 10:32 PM)

QUOTE (LeaveMyThingAlone @ Nov 23 2011, 10:26 PM) So, as we all know, Test for Echo is one of Rush's worst efforts if not their worst, particularly the lyrics, which everyone here agrees is Neil's worst effort. Argument invalid. TFE's 'failure' is only an opinion that a large percentage of people share. However, there are many of us that view TFE as a great album, including me.   But to say that is is objectively better?   I agree.   Seriously OP, you can't make a statement that "...everyone here agrees [Test for Echo] is Neil's worst effort." Like Tommy said, there are some who happen to like the album. While I believe it's not his best effort, I do find some of his lyrics to be great, but that's just my opinion. I also love some of the songs musically. I for one find Half the World, Resist, and Driven to have great lyrics. I also happen to like Test for Echo, although I pay attention to the instruments than the lyrics.

[danielmclark]

QUOTE (LeaveMyThingAlone @ Nov 23 2011, 09:26 PM)

So, as we all know, Test for Echo is one of Rush's worst efforts if not their worst, particularly the lyrics, which everyone here agrees is Neil's worst effort. The question has always been why, particularly coming on the heels of Counterparts, which, obviously, is Rush's best album since Moving Pictures

Wrong aaaaaand... yep, wrong. Wow, wrong on both counts. Not a very solid foundation for your thread.

[goose]

I thonk Time and Motion has some of Neil's best lyrics. I also seem to be one of the few that get the jokes woven into Dog Years.

 

That said, there are plenty of weak lyrics on T4E. Music too, for that matter. But it did spawn perhaps their greatest tour ever. Amazing show!

[ucsteve667]

Im a big fan of this record. and as far as dog years goes, Neil and Ged like to be corny and geeky with tongue in cheek so that shouldnt be any big surprise to anyone

[HowItIs]

QUOTE (danielmclark @ Nov 23 2011, 09:51 PM)

QUOTE (LeaveMyThingAlone @ Nov 23 2011, 09:26 PM) So, as we all know, Test for Echo is one of Rush's worst efforts if not their worst, particularly the lyrics, which everyone here agrees is Neil's worst effort. The question has always been why, particularly coming on the heels of Counterparts, which, obviously, is Rush's best album since Moving Pictures Wrong aaaaaand... yep, wrong. Wow, wrong on both counts. Not a very solid foundation for your thread. http://i224.photobucket.com/albums/dd103/laserspray/internet%20stuff/smilies/plusone2.gif     Honestly, it's fine to have your own opinion but don't try to speak for EVERY Rush fan. Capice'?     Thanks for playing.

[HowItIs]

QUOTE (danielmclark @ Nov 23 2011, 09:51 PM)

QUOTE (LeaveMyThingAlone @ Nov 23 2011, 09:26 PM) So, as we all know, Test for Echo is one of Rush's worst efforts if not their worst, particularly the lyrics, which everyone here agrees is Neil's worst effort. The question has always been why, particularly coming on the heels of Counterparts, which, obviously, is Rush's best album since Moving Pictures Wrong aaaaaand... yep, wrong. Wow, wrong on both counts. Not a very solid foundation for your thread. http://i224.photobucket.com/albums/dd103/laserspray/internet%20stuff/smilies/plusone2.gif     Honestly, it's fine to have your own opinion but don't try to speak for EVERY Rush fan. Capice'?     Thanks for playing.

[Silas Lang]

I think TFE is at least as good as Counterparts, perhaps better (or musically more adventurous and intricate). There's only a couple of songs in which there are some questionable lyrics (not Dog Years or Virtuality), so in comparison to other albums I guess you could say it's slightly inferior in that sense. It doesn't really bother me that much. Very good album.

[rushgoober]

The only place where I seriously disagree with the OP is that Counterparts is their best album since MP. For me, Counterparts is their best album since HYF, and by a wide margin. It was a great comeback album for them.

 

I do agree, however, that when albums of theirs have failed, like T4E, it's because of the lyrics. Absolutely, 100% that's where the blame lies. The only album where this is an exception is VT where it's the lyrics, and the repetition, and the Geddy choir, and the music (guitar solos anyone???) and the production, and pretty much ALL of that failed, but for their other albums that didn't make it; Presto, RTB & T4E, it's because of the lyrics.

 

 

[Scars]

It's amazing how in any other context other than a "TFE-bashing" thread that everyone seemingly bashes TFE. From my time here, taking a stab at Dog Years, Virtuality and TFE as a whole has become sort of the Godwin's Law of Rush. Now that it's time to actually discuss the drawbacks of the album, suddenly everyone's a fan and LeaveMyThingAlone is left to fend for themselves.

 

To be honest, the album is nowhere near as consistent as Counterparts. TFE feels like a mishmash of material and lyrics put together randomly by the guys. Sure, at times the music can be great, and at times the lyrics can be great (and sometimes both), but I always get the feeling like the guys never had their heart into the album (or stepped-back to see the album as a whole). To me, it's kind of just "the album that happened."

 

The songs that I like, I love and the songs that I dislike, I hate. I am on auto-skip with Driven, Half the World (especially), Totem, and Time and Motion (which is probably the least worst out of this list). Dog Years could use a new subject matter, Virtuality could use a better chorus lyrically, CATS and TCoR could have been a little more fleshed out and less cookie-cutter, but they're all listenable (and likable) in my mind.

 

In the end TFE may not be their worst album (just give them 11 years), but it's also not a masterpiece. Just because someone says the album is crap doesn't mean we have to retaliate by claiming it's better than it actually is. The album has some definite highs and some definite lows.

[MMCXII]

QUOTE (goose @ Nov 23 2011, 11:28 PM)

I thonk Time and Motion has some of Neil's best lyrics. I also seem to be one of the few that get the jokes woven into Dog Years. That said, there are plenty of weak lyrics on T4E. Music too, for that matter. But it did spawn perhaps their greatest tour ever. Amazing show!

Good call on Time and motion! Used to be my favorite song for quite a while and lyrically still one of my favs

[goose]

QUOTE (MMCXII @ Nov 24 2011, 06:40 AM)

QUOTE (goose @ Nov 23 2011, 11:28 PM) I thonk Time and Motion has some of Neil's best lyrics.  I also seem to be one of the few that get the jokes woven into Dog Years. That said, there are plenty of weak lyrics on T4E.  Music too, for that matter.  But it did spawn perhaps their greatest tour ever.  Amazing show! Good call on Time and motion! Used to be my favorite song for quite a while and lyrically still one of my favs

[Thorne]

QUOTE (MMCXII @ Nov 24 2011, 11:40 AM)

Good call on Time and motion! Used to be my favorite song for quite a while and lyrically still one of my favs

 

Absolutely love that track, aside from the fact that I can't help mishearing Ged and thinking he's singing about snails. "Fill them up with fresh escargot.."

 

I was a bit disappointed with the album when it came out, but I've since learned to like it a lot. I even rather like 'Dog Years'!

 

Only thing I really still can't stand is the chorus to 'Virtuality', I physically cringe when I hear the lyrics. Great music though.

[GrandDesigner]

I think I like this album a lot because I first heard it via the Work In Progress VHS. It wasn't until months later I bought the actual album. I'd watch AWiP over and over (not even for the drumming parts, which I always found quite easy, but mainly for the interview/speaking footage).

 

Hearing Neil explain the songs, and getting caught up in his enthusiasm made the album more enjoyable for me I guess. It's hard to see the album in a negative light after the artist has personally broken it down and shown his commitment and love for it.

 

Plus, I LOVE Virtuality and Dog Years! Seriously. The music on both is some of the most exciting stuff they did in the 90's. To the point where the lyrics don't even detract. And I don't find the lyrics to DY to be bad at all. Virtuality is just naive lyrically, not poorly written.

[goose]

QUOTE (GrandDesigner @ Nov 24 2011, 08:08 AM)

I think I like this album a lot because I first heard it via the Work In Progress VHS. It wasn't until months later I bought the actual album. I'd watch AWiP over and over (not even for the drumming parts, which I always found quite easy, but mainly for the interview/speaking footage). Hearing Neil explain the songs, and getting caught up in his enthusiasm made the album more enjoyable for me I guess. It's hard to see the album in a negative light after the artist has personally broken it down and shown his commitment and love for it. Plus, I LOVE Virtuality and Dog Years! Seriously. The music on both is some of the most exciting stuff they did in the 90's. To the point where the lyrics don't even detract. And I don't find the lyrics to DY to be bad at all. Virtuality is just naive lyrically, not poorly written.

I really liked T4E when it came out, for the same reasons you mention. The whole Neil re-inventing himself was intriguing, and the instructional vid really supported each song.

 

These days when I put the CD on, most of it seems pretty bleh. But I'll actually forward to Dog Years - which I love! So, I guess you can pretty much discount anything I have to say.

[circumstantial tree]

Test for Echo is the most sterile album in their discography.

[TullSkull]

QUOTE (GUP1771 @ Nov 23 2011, 09:35 PM)

QUOTE (Tommy Sawyer @ Nov 23 2011, 10:32 PM) QUOTE (LeaveMyThingAlone @ Nov 23 2011, 10:26 PM) So, as we all know, Test for Echo is one of Rush's worst efforts if not their worst, particularly the lyrics, which everyone here agrees is Neil's worst effort. Argument invalid. TFE's 'failure' is only an opinion that a large percentage of people share. However, there are many of us that view TFE as a great album, including me.   But to say that is is objectively better?   I agree.   Seriously OP, you can't make a statement that "...everyone here agrees [Test for Echo] is Neil's worst effort." Like Tommy said, there are some who happen to like the album. While I believe it's not his best effort, I do find some of his lyrics to be great, but that's just my opinion. I also love some of the songs musically. I for one find Half the World, Resist, and Driven to have great lyrics. I also happen to like Test for Echo, although I pay attention to the instruments than the lyrics.   TFE has one of my all time fav tunes, Resist. Then there is 1/2 the World, Time And Motion and Driven all wonderful tunes..

[danielmclark]

QUOTE (Scars @ Nov 24 2011, 02:42 AM)

It's amazing how in any other context other than a "TFE-bashing" thread that everyone seemingly bashes TFE. From my time here, taking a stab at Dog Years, Virtuality and TFE as a whole has become sort of the Godwin's Law of Rush. Now that it's time to actually discuss the drawbacks of the album, suddenly everyone's a fan and LeaveMyThingAlone is left to fend for themselves.

I don't bash the album, ever. I like it with the exception of Dog Years and Virtuality, which I despise. Aside from those two, it's a strong album.

 

Where I take exception is the OP's statement that "we all agree" that TFE's lyrics are Neil's worst and that Counterparts is "obviously" their best album since Moving Pictures.

 

No, we don't all agree.

 

And no, it's not their best since Moving Pictures, which is a flawed statement to begin with because it insinuates that MP was the pinnacle of their career - a statement held my most, but not all. In fact, for me, MP barely cracks the Top 5 behind Power Windows, Permanent Waves, and Presto.

 

Counterparts was a good album, but to say it was the best since MP eliminates Signals and Power Windows at the very least, and there are many here who love HYF, Presto and the others.

[jnoble]

TFE isn't horrible per se....that would be VT if for anything else, the horrid 'put a pot on your head and bang on the side of it with a spoon' production...I liked it when it first came out and remember Neil gushing in pre-release interviews about how they felt the songs were the 'best they'd ever written' (Doesn't he say that about EVERY new album?) But it hasn't aged well with me, that's for sure. It's dated sounding and I always thought it wasn't nearly as good sounding as CP...too distorted and fuzzy sounding.

 

TFE also laid the grounds for the bad habits that would plague future Rush albums.....shoehorned lyrics awkwardly forced into music, Geddy choir, too many layers of guitars and bass for a 'wall of noise' soundscape

 

'Color of Right' in particular was the first Rush song that made me wonder if Geddy was inventing the melody on the spot. It's so bland and I'm still not sure what the hell the songs even about.

 

'Time and Motion' is OK but hugely disjointed sounding. Especially the keyboard sample riff that plays on and off between the verses.

 

'Limbo' starts off alright, but gets downright ponderous and goes on too long in a mess of distortion. Easily their worst and most forgettable instrumental.

 

That all being said, I've always liked Half the World even if it wasn't the hit song the band seemed to think it should've been.

Edited November 24, 2011 by jnoble

[ReRushed]

Failed so miserably? No way. It's not a stellar Rush album, by any stretch of the imagination, but it's still an okay album. It's got some very good tunes on it and the production sounds great to my ears.

[MalNarpet]

Several good points made on this page so far.

 

I blame Andy Wallace, myself.

[kbomb106]

I wouldn't say everyone would agree. TFE peaked on the (US) charts at #5. Compare that to Signals, which only hit 10, Moving Pictures, which hit 3, PeW, which hit 4, and 2112, which only hit 61. While you may not have liked it, apparently some people did.