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QUOTE (1-0-0-1-0-0-1 @ Jul 22 2011, 09:53 PM)
QUOTE (Earthshine @ Jul 22 2011, 10:07 AM)
Neil is not washed up. He just can't improvise nor play jazz or classical.

Classical? Can you give an example of a classical drummer?

Carl Palmer

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QUOTE (Earthshine @ Jul 23 2011, 03:48 PM)
QUOTE (1-0-0-1-0-0-1 @ Jul 22 2011, 09:53 PM)
QUOTE (Earthshine @ Jul 22 2011, 10:07 AM)
Neil is not washed up. He just can't improvise nor play jazz or classical.

Classical? Can you give an example of a classical drummer?

Carl Palmer

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*In sarcastic tone* Man Neil just sounds awful, he looks so uncomfortable and out of place. He needs to learn to loosen up and have fun instead of being precise and planned out. He has really gone downhill with his drumming.

 

Ok raise your hand if you don't have some beef with Neil just because you don't like his personality and allow that beef to carry over into anything on this forum related to Neil . . . . . ooooooh looks like three other people and I raised our hands.

 

To everyone else who didn't raise their hand, and you know who you are, how about turning off the hate once and awhile. Not only is it annoying and childish, it really makes it unenjoyable for the rest of the people on this site who read through these threads.

 

Relax, curb your anger and judgement, and move on.

 

trink39.gif

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QUOTE (Dobner has assumed control @ Jul 23 2011, 08:38 PM)
*In sarcastic tone* Man Neil just sounds awful, he looks so uncomfortable and out of place. He needs to learn to loosen up and have fun instead of being precise and planned out. He has really gone downhill with his drumming.

Ok raise your hand if you don't have some beef with Neil just because you don't like his personality and allow that beef to carry over into anything on this forum related to Neil . . . . . ooooooh looks like three other people and I raised our hands.

To everyone else who didn't raise their hand, and you know who you are, how about turning off the hate once and awhile. Not only is it annoying and childish, it really makes it unenjoyable for the rest of the people on this site who read through these threads.

Relax, curb your anger and judgement, and move on.

trink39.gif

It has nothing to do with disliking Neil, his personality or his beliefs. The fact of the matter is that he simply cannot improvise comfortably, nor play other styles well, other than what he plays with Rush.

 

Neil is fabulous as a drummer/lyricist with Rush. Outside of the band, he generally seems insecure and nervous.

 

He has gone on and taken lessons from Freddie Gruber and then on the advice of bassist Jeff Berlin (who has played with several great drummers and knows what makes a great drummer) took lessons from Peter Erskine. Good for him. But it seems he is getting all these much needed lessons a little late in his career. His style has changed drastically from pre-1996. I don't know why he felt the need to try to be somebody else other than Neil. I think he should have just stuck with his own way of playing and not try to become trendy.

 

I also think he should have taken lessons from the late, great Joe Morello.

 

What cracks me up is that back in April 1984, Neil gave a most depressing interview in Modern Drummer magazine where he stated that he had gotten as good as he was ever going to get as a drummer and learnt all he had to learn. rofl3.gif

 

Now he is going and taking lessons from anyone who is willing to teach him and keeps flip-flopping. For example, he quit playing matched grip back in 1996 on the advice of Freddie and then switched back to it in 2002. Why would he spend all those years playing matched grip, then revise his whole technique, only to switch backed to matched grip again. And the fact that he switches to traditional grip when he has to play anything delicate and rudimental (as he himself says) shows a tremendous weakness in his matched grip after all.

 

Then after years of having a very well arranged framework for his solo, he goes and decides he wants to basically improvise it. This in itself shows his lack of ideas and lack of originality. He keeps reverting to The Drum Also Waltzes and relying on gimmicks such as the big band effects and film in his solo. He should just PLAY!

 

 

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QUOTE (Tommy Sawyer @ Jul 22 2011, 10:28 PM)
QUOTE (1-0-0-1-0-0-1 @ Jul 22 2011, 10:53 PM)
QUOTE (Earthshine @ Jul 22 2011, 10:07 AM)
Neil is not washed up. He just can't improvise nor play jazz or classical.

Classical? Can you give an example of a classical drummer?

rofl3.gif That's what I thought, too.

Ummm vic Firth...?

 

How about Evelyn Glennie??

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gzR2XfxOUGg

 

I can't believe no one has ever heard of these two?

Edited by druid13
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QUOTE (Earthshine @ Jul 24 2011, 03:29 AM)
QUOTE (Dobner has assumed control @ Jul 23 2011, 08:38 PM)
*In sarcastic tone* Man Neil just sounds awful, he looks so uncomfortable and out of place. He needs to learn to loosen up and have fun instead of being precise and planned out. He has really gone downhill with his drumming.

Ok raise your hand if you don't have some beef with Neil just because you don't like his personality and allow that beef to carry over into anything on this forum related to Neil . . . . . ooooooh looks like three other people and I raised our hands.

To everyone else who didn't raise their hand, and you know who you are, how about turning off the hate once and awhile. Not only is it annoying and childish, it really makes it unenjoyable for the rest of the people on this site who read through these threads.

Relax, curb your anger and judgement, and move on.

trink39.gif

It has nothing to do with disliking Neil, his personality or his beliefs. The fact of the matter is that he simply cannot improvise comfortably, nor play other styles well, other than what he plays with Rush.

 

Neil is fabulous as a drummer/lyricist with Rush. Outside of the band, he generally seems insecure and nervous.

 

He has gone on and taken lessons from Freddie Gruber and then on the advice of bassist Jeff Berlin (who has played with several great drummers and knows what makes a great drummer) took lessons from Peter Erskine. Good for him. But it seems he is getting all these much needed lessons a little late in his career. His style has changed drastically from pre-1996. I don't know why he felt the need to try to be somebody else other than Neil. I think he should have just stuck with his own way of playing and not try to become trendy.

 

I also think he should have taken lessons from the late, great Joe Morello.

 

What cracks me up is that back in April 1984, Neil gave a most depressing interview in Modern Drummer magazine where he stated that he had gotten as good as he was ever going to get as a drummer and learnt all he had to learn. rofl3.gif

 

Now he is going and taking lessons from anyone who is willing to teach him and keeps flip-flopping. For example, he quit playing matched grip back in 1996 on the advice of Freddie and then switched back to it in 2002. Why would he spend all those years playing matched grip, then revise his whole technique, only to switch backed to matched grip again. And the fact that he switches to traditional grip when he has to play anything delicate and rudimental (as he himself says) shows a tremendous weakness in his matched grip after all.

 

Then after years of having a very well arranged framework for his solo, he goes and decides he wants to basically improvise it. This in itself shows his lack of ideas and lack of originality. He keeps reverting to The Drum Also Waltzes and relying on gimmicks such as the big band effects and film in his solo. He should just PLAY!

Says you.

 

Dont know how long you have been playing drums, or any instrument for that matter, but Ive played bass for 25 years. And as you grow older, your opinion/outlook/views change, and I can clearly see that Neil feels that he doesnt have to prove anything anymore. When I was younger, I was a really "busy" player, but these days in my band, I try to serve the songs much more and that has resulted in big changes in playing style and tone.

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QUOTE (Earthshine @ Jul 24 2011, 03:29 AM)
QUOTE (Dobner has assumed control @ Jul 23 2011, 08:38 PM)
*In sarcastic tone* Man Neil just sounds awful, he looks so uncomfortable and out of place. He needs to learn to loosen up and have fun instead of being precise and planned out. He has really gone downhill with his drumming.

Ok raise your hand if you don't have some beef with Neil just because you don't like his personality and allow that beef to carry over into anything on this forum related to Neil . . . . . ooooooh looks like three other people and I raised our hands.

To everyone else who didn't raise their hand, and you know who you are, how about turning off the hate once and awhile. Not only is it annoying and childish, it really makes it unenjoyable for the rest of the people on this site who read through these threads.

Relax, curb your anger and judgement, and move on.

trink39.gif

It has nothing to do with disliking Neil, his personality or his beliefs. The fact of the matter is that he simply cannot improvise comfortably, nor play other styles well, other than what he plays with Rush.

 

Neil is fabulous as a drummer/lyricist with Rush. Outside of the band, he generally seems insecure and nervous.

 

He has gone on and taken lessons from Freddie Gruber and then on the advice of bassist Jeff Berlin (who has played with several great drummers and knows what makes a great drummer) took lessons from Peter Erskine. Good for him. But it seems he is getting all these much needed lessons a little late in his career. His style has changed drastically from pre-1996. I don't know why he felt the need to try to be somebody else other than Neil. I think he should have just stuck with his own way of playing and not try to become trendy.

 

I also think he should have taken lessons from the late, great Joe Morello.

 

What cracks me up is that back in April 1984, Neil gave a most depressing interview in Modern Drummer magazine where he stated that he had gotten as good as he was ever going to get as a drummer and learnt all he had to learn. rofl3.gif

 

Now he is going and taking lessons from anyone who is willing to teach him and keeps flip-flopping. For example, he quit playing matched grip back in 1996 on the advice of Freddie and then switched back to it in 2002. Why would he spend all those years playing matched grip, then revise his whole technique, only to switch backed to matched grip again. And the fact that he switches to traditional grip when he has to play anything delicate and rudimental (as he himself says) shows a tremendous weakness in his matched grip after all.

 

Then after years of having a very well arranged framework for his solo, he goes and decides he wants to basically improvise it. This in itself shows his lack of ideas and lack of originality. He keeps reverting to The Drum Also Waltzes and relying on gimmicks such as the big band effects and film in his solo. He should just PLAY!

The reason I posted my comment was because some of the people in this thread picking Neil apart, do it in just about every thread pertaining to Neil. As for his career in drumming I know all about it, I don't need any lessons I've followed these guys for a long while now.

 

I understand if you or others get bored of his drumming and that's fine, but some people on here are just overly critical. It seems ridiculous that people are so judgmental toward a guy who they don't know personally and who is a vital member of the great band, that we all enjoy, and to whom this site is dedicated (which I thought was a site where fans could share their love and enthusiasm for the band). It seems to me this site is more about criticizing the band rather than enjoying them, but I'm digressing from the subject of this thread.

 

Now I'm not a Peart fanboy by any means, I just know where the line between being analytical and just being a d**khead is drawn.

 

Long live 2.gif

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QUOTE (druid13 @ Jul 24 2011, 09:02 AM)
QUOTE (Tommy Sawyer @ Jul 22 2011, 10:28 PM)
QUOTE (1-0-0-1-0-0-1 @ Jul 22 2011, 10:53 PM)
QUOTE (Earthshine @ Jul 22 2011, 10:07 AM)
Neil is not washed up. He just can't improvise nor play jazz or classical.

Classical? Can you give an example of a classical drummer?

rofl3.gif That's what I thought, too.

Ummm vic Firth...?

 

How about Evelyn Glennie??

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gzR2XfxOUGg

 

I can't believe no one has ever heard of these two?

I have heard of them and seen them live many times. Also, Ed Mann, Ruth Underwood, James Blades, Arthur Press, Anthony J. Cirone. Lots of them out there.

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QUOTE (Earthshine @ Jul 24 2011, 01:27 PM)
QUOTE (druid13 @ Jul 24 2011, 09:02 AM)
QUOTE (Tommy Sawyer @ Jul 22 2011, 10:28 PM)
QUOTE (1-0-0-1-0-0-1 @ Jul 22 2011, 10:53 PM)
QUOTE (Earthshine @ Jul 22 2011, 10:07 AM)
Neil is not washed up. He just can't improvise nor play jazz or classical.

Classical? Can you give an example of a classical drummer?

rofl3.gif That's what I thought, too.

Ummm vic Firth...?

 

How about Evelyn Glennie??

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gzR2XfxOUGg

 

I can't believe no one has ever heard of these two?

I have heard of them and seen them live many times. Also, Ed Mann, Ruth Underwood, James Blades, Arthur Press, Anthony J. Cirone. Lots of them out there.

Ah, Ruth Underwood played on one of my Zappa favorites: Zoot Allures.

 

Also some pretty good drumming by some slacker named Bozzio?

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QUOTE (theredtamasrule @ Jul 24 2011, 02:43 PM)
Also some pretty good drumming by some slacker named Bozzio?

Now Bozzio is an example of a guy who can pretty much do it all.

 

The guy is classically trained, yet grew up on Miles Davis, John Coltrane and Weather Report. Passes a gruelling audition for Zappa, can read better than Steve Gadd, and has the chops and finesse pretty close to Cobham. Goes and joins Group 87, replaces Bruford in UK, gets asked to join Thin Lizzy but does not do it out of musical integrity (though admits he "would have made millions") forms and produces Missing Persons (a perfect band for the 80's), gets asked by non-other than Jeff Beck to join his band, plays with Duran Duran, comes up with the very original idea of doing solo drum performances using an enormous melodic drumset and percussion instruments, then comes back to being asked to rejoin UK (which he turns down, again feeling it is not right) and then joins Holdsworth and Levin. Now he can do pretty much whatever he wants.

 

The guy has just about covered it all. Not bad for 60.

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QUOTE (Earthshine @ Jul 25 2011, 06:06 AM)
QUOTE (theredtamasrule @ Jul 24 2011, 02:43 PM)
Also some pretty good drumming by some slacker named Bozzio?

Now Bozzio is an example of a guy who can pretty much do it all.

 

The guy is classically trained, yet grew up on Miles Davis, John Coltrane and Weather Report. Passes a gruelling audition for Zappa, can read better than Steve Gadd, and has the chops and finesse pretty close to Cobham. Goes and joins Group 87, replaces Bruford in UK, gets asked to join Thin Lizzy but does not do it out of musical integrity (though admits he "would have made millions") forms and produces Missing Persons (a perfect band for the 80's), gets asked by non-other than Jeff Beck to join his band, plays with Duran Duran, comes up with the very original idea of doing solo drum performances using an enormous melodic drumset and percussion instruments, then comes back to being asked to rejoin UK (which he turns down, again feeling it is not right) and then joins Holdsworth and Levin. Now he can do pretty much whatever he wants.

 

The guy has just about covered it all. Not bad for 60.

I hate to say this, cause its a cliche, but when it comes to "truly underrated" by the masses, Bozzio fits the bill perfectly, IMO.

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QUOTE (theredtamasrule @ Jul 25 2011, 08:16 PM)
I saw Bozzio give a clinic in Lexington some 20 or so years ago. I was about 5 rows back.

It. Was. Impressive.

Cool. I have seen him from about 20 rows back and also front row on 2 occasions. He is really out of this world and doing things nobody else is doing. And it is all musical, enjoyable and entertaining.

 

 

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