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Story I've heard is that one person had Covid unknowingly. Went to a birthday party with 40 people. 3 people at that party died from Covid.

 

Now let's translate that to...40 people went to a bar Saturday night in Wisconsin after restrictions were lifted....you do the math.

 

We had ziltch in the US for infections in January. Now 1.5M confirmed. That's the same as the entire population of Philadelphia.

 

It's pathetic that we choose to ignore concern for anyone else than ourselves. Welcome to America...now go f**k yourself.

 

What's really comical is that we think lifting restrictions is going to bring back the economy. This has mindfucked people any more than other modern events and people aren't going to spend money until there's a vaccine or significant treatment options. People don't spend money, company doesn't hire people...company doesn't hire people, people don't spend money.

 

a job is your livelihood. key word is 'live'.

Edited by HemiBeers
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"If we compare, for instance, the number of people who died in the United States from COVID-19 in the second full week of April to the number of people who died from influenza during the worst week of the past seven flu seasons (as reported to the CDC), we find that the novel coronavirus killed between 9.5 and 44 times more people than seasonal flu. In other words, the coronavirus is not anything like the flu: It is much, much worse."

https://blogs.scient...les-to-oranges/

 

One thing about the "typical " flu, each year we have a vaccine that helps prevent deaths, with COVID 19 there is none and it is debatable when one will arrive despite some magical thinking by the Pres. He wants us to be warriors and go out and get the economy going but most of the states who have been reopening are not even waiting for the cases to have declined before running pell mell into the breach. We don't have a coherent national policy so every state is going to what it wants no matter what. But we all don't exist in our own little bubbles and the virus doesn't care about county lines or state borders.

 

We have to admit that our response to the virus was a mess, we lost precious time in February and March to make changes like the lockdown and ramping up testing to slow down the disease. Now we have to work with what we have and just pretending that it is magically going away is ludicrous. I have been reading some on the 1918 pandemic and the parallels are very similar. Everyone wanted to get back to living, they had the World Series. The final three games were held at Fenway Park, drawing total attendance of more than 62,000. The crowds at games, parades and war rallies became “biological bombs” that helped fuel the course of the epidemic. By the end of the year, 4,800 Bostonians had died.

If we are to open up, we need to do more testing (and we are not doing near enough, regardless of what some say) and not let our guard down. The 1918 pandemic had 3 waves, do we really want to push that possibilty?

 

And what if you discovered that 50-80 times the number of "confirmed cases" you see have already had the virus and didn't even know it?

 

https://www.medrxiv....4.14.20062463v2

 

https://www.livescie...anta-clara.html

 

https://www.mercuryn...-we-knew-about/

 

That could mean that up to 100 million people in the US have already had this and didn't even know it. Meaning the death rate is MUCH MUCH MUCH lower than you think.

 

Look, the bottom line is we have to open the economy - there really isn't a choice. Again, if you want to stay home and not come out then feel free. But your desire to stay home and hide will not trump my freedom. Never.

 

Edit to add: If you want to go for some political debate on this please take it to SOCN. I'd LOVE to debate you on the reactions of certain parties on both sides of the spectrum. But those are not the rules of this board, so hop on into SOCN and let's discuss reactions by our wonderful politicians.

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And speaking of Joe the barber...

https://www.cnn.com/...trnd/index.html

 

And guess what - the barber was going to get it anyway and made his own person choice to open - and the people who went to him made their choice to go. So how about you make your choices and I will make mine, since you and I will most certainly get this virus at some point whether way stay hiding for years or we come out of our caves and start getting back to life again.

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Story I've heard is that one person had Covid unknowingly. Went to a birthday party with 40 people. 3 people at that party died from Covid.

 

Now let's translate that to...40 people went to a bar Saturday night in Wisconsin after restrictions were lifted....you do the math.

 

We had ziltch in the US for infections in January. Now 1.5M confirmed. That's the same as the entire population of Philadelphia.

 

It's pathetic that we choose to ignore concern for anyone else than ourselves. Welcome to America...now go f**k yourself.

 

What's really comical is that we think lifting restrictions is going to bring back the economy. This has mindfucked people any more than other modern events and people aren't going to spend money until there's a vaccine or significant treatment options. People don't spend money, company doesn't hire people...company doesn't hire people, people don't spend money.

 

a job is your livelihood. key word is 'live'.

 

Did anyone force the 40 people to go to the bar? Or did they go on their own and make their own choice to go, which affected you in no way whatsoever?

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Story I've heard is that one person had Covid unknowingly. Went to a birthday party with 40 people. 3 people at that party died from Covid.

 

Now let's translate that to...40 people went to a bar Saturday night in Wisconsin after restrictions were lifted....you do the math.

 

We had ziltch in the US for infections in January. Now 1.5M confirmed. That's the same as the entire population of Philadelphia.

 

It's pathetic that we choose to ignore concern for anyone else than ourselves. Welcome to America...now go f**k yourself.

 

What's really comical is that we think lifting restrictions is going to bring back the economy. This has mindfucked people any more than other modern events and people aren't going to spend money until there's a vaccine or significant treatment options. People don't spend money, company doesn't hire people...company doesn't hire people, people don't spend money.

 

a job is your livelihood. key word is 'live'.

 

Did anyone force the 40 people to go to the bar? Or did they go on their own and make their own choice to go, which affected you in no way whatsoever?

 

Did anyone force the 40 people to go to the birthday party?

 

If your freedom of choice affects me by spreading Covid to me or my loved ones, I think i have a problem with that. People fail to comprehend how a single act, even seemingly benign, could affect others.

 

I HAVE to go to certain places like grocery stores...really no choice in that matter. But no one HAS to go to birthday parties or bars.

 

People want to wrap this up as Freedom of Choice, but it's really just stupid obstinance.

Edited by HemiBeers
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Story I've heard is that one person had Covid unknowingly. Went to a birthday party with 40 people. 3 people at that party died from Covid.

 

Now let's translate that to...40 people went to a bar Saturday night in Wisconsin after restrictions were lifted....you do the math.

 

We had ziltch in the US for infections in January. Now 1.5M confirmed. That's the same as the entire population of Philadelphia.

 

It's pathetic that we choose to ignore concern for anyone else than ourselves. Welcome to America...now go f**k yourself.

 

What's really comical is that we think lifting restrictions is going to bring back the economy. This has mindfucked people any more than other modern events and people aren't going to spend money until there's a vaccine or significant treatment options. People don't spend money, company doesn't hire people...company doesn't hire people, people don't spend money.

 

a job is your livelihood. key word is 'live'.

 

Did anyone force the 40 people to go to the bar? Or did they go on their own and make their own choice to go, which affected you in no way whatsoever?

 

Did anyone force the 40 people to go to the birthday party?

 

If your freedom of choice affects me by spreading Covid to me or my loved ones, I think i have a problem with that. People fail to comprehend how a single act, even seemingly benign, could affect others.

 

I HAVE to go to certain places like grocery stores...really no choice in that matter. But no one HAS to go to birthday parties or bars.

 

People want to wrap this up as Freedom of Choice, but it's really just stupid obstinance.

 

No of course no one forced the 40 people to go to a birthday party. They chose to go and take the perceived "risk" of being around 39 other people.

 

So should we stop all driving based on your example too? I mean 1.35 million people are killed in car accidents in the world every year, 38,000 just in the US. Many victims are innocent and were killed by someone either distracted, drunk, etc. Are you failing to comprehend that a single act, even seemingly benign, could affect others? I mean by your logic, let's ban all cars immediately. I mean no one HAS to drive cars, right? We can walk and ride bikes like we did just over 100 years ago and prior.

 

I choose my freedom every single time over some media and government driven perceived emergency. Or should I start choosing what is really necessary in your life too?

 

Edit to add: This is really simple - you don't want to go out? Don't go out. You don't want to open your business because of your fear? Then don't. My actions don't affect you in any way if you are staying home and away from everyone.

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Colorado amends coronavirus death count - says fewer have died of COVID-19 than previously thought

 

https://kdvr.com/new...categorization/

While they may be over counting deaths, there are also under-counted deaths because people who die from it at home and were not tested do not count as covid 19 deaths. It's impossible to tell if the actual number of deaths is higher or lower than the given numbers. Edited by snowdogged
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Colorado amends coronavirus death count - says fewer have died of COVID-19 than previously thought

 

https://kdvr.com/new...categorization/

While they may be over counted deaths, there are also under-counted deaths because people who die from it at home and were not tested do not count as covid 19 deaths. It's impossible to tell if the actual number of deaths is higher or lower than the given numbers.

 

Then you admit that the numbers given are not correct, right?

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Colorado amends coronavirus death count - says fewer have died of COVID-19 than previously thought

 

https://kdvr.com/new...categorization/

While they may be over counted deaths, there are also under-counted deaths because people who die from it at home and were not tested do not count as covid 19 deaths. It's impossible to tell if the actual number of deaths is higher or lower than the given numbers.

 

Then you admit that the numbers given are not correct, right?

Absolutely, but it's impossible for us to know if the actual deaths from it are higher or lower than the figures given. I think that we have to be cautious opening things up. While I agree that businesses have to start reopening, there should still be measures taken to try and practice social distancing. Last I read scientists had found over 200 mutations of this virus. It rapidly mutates and could mutate into something much worse.
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Move this thread to SOCN

 

Absolutely not. This is not a political issue. It is a social issue as well as a health issue.

 

What if we have another huge natural disaster, like another hurricane or an earthquake? Should we also discuss it in that dysfunctional Forum?

 

Don't make it into a political issue, and there will be no problem.

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Move this thread to SOCN

 

Absolutely not. This is not a political issue. It is a social issue as well as a health issue.

 

What if we have another huge natural disaster, like another hurricane or an earthquake? Should we also discuss it in that dysfunctional Forum?

 

Don't make it into a political issue, and there will be no problem.

 

It's a public health issue that has been made political.

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Move this thread to SOCN

 

Absolutely not. This is not a political issue. It is a social issue as well as a health issue.

 

What if we have another huge natural disaster, like another hurricane or an earthquake? Should we also discuss it in that dysfunctional Forum?

 

Don't make it into a political issue, and there will be no problem.

 

It's a public health issue that has been made political.

Some of us are intellectually capable of separating the two. It hasn't turned into much of a political issue in this thread from what I have read. Why does it even matter to you? You seem to be the only one trying to start an argument here.
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Move this thread to SOCN

 

Absolutely not. This is not a political issue. It is a social issue as well as a health issue.

 

What if we have another huge natural disaster, like another hurricane or an earthquake? Should we also discuss it in that dysfunctional Forum?

 

Don't make it into a political issue, and there will be no problem.

 

It's a public health issue that has been made political.

 

Not by me, and hopefully not by you, either. :)

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Colorado amends coronavirus death count - says fewer have died of COVID-19 than previously thought

 

https://kdvr.com/new...categorization/

While they may be over counting deaths, there are also under-counted deaths because people who die from it at home and were not tested do not count as covid 19 deaths. It's impossible to tell if the actual number of deaths is higher or lower than the given numbers.

 

I just have to revisit this... So you think that people are dying at home of a respiratory illness in the midst of this very widely known pandemic and medical examiners and coroners are not performing a simply Covid-19 blood test during the autopsy to see why they died? I just want to make sure I am understanding you correctly on this.

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Move this thread to SOCN

 

Absolutely not. This is not a political issue. It is a social issue as well as a health issue.

 

What if we have another huge natural disaster, like another hurricane or an earthquake? Should we also discuss it in that dysfunctional Forum?

 

Don't make it into a political issue, and there will be no problem.

 

It's a public health issue that has been made political.

Some of us are intellectually capable of separating the two. It hasn't turned into much of a political issue in this thread from what I have read. Why does it even matter to you? You seem to be the only one trying to start an argument here.

 

I'm not starting an argument. I'm stating facts. There has been plenty of political comment in this thread, from criticism/defence of the government's response to the outbreak (or lack thereof), lockdown policy, civil liberty, economic impact and so on. These are all political issues. Some people may be intellectually capable of separating the two spheres, but some clearly aren't or don't want to.

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Colorado amends coronavirus death count - says fewer have died of COVID-19 than previously thought

 

https://kdvr.com/new...categorization/

While they may be over counting deaths, there are also under-counted deaths because people who die from it at home and were not tested do not count as covid 19 deaths. It's impossible to tell if the actual number of deaths is higher or lower than the given numbers.

 

I just have to revisit this... So you think that people are dying at home of a respiratory illness in the midst of this very widely known pandemic and medical examiners and coroners are not performing a simply Covid-19 blood test during the autopsy to see why they died? I just want to make sure I am understanding you correctly on this.

There is a thread about it.

http://www.therushforum.com/index.php?/topic/109562-staggering-surge-of-nyers-dying-in-their-homes-suggests-city-is-undercounting-coronavirus-fatalities/

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Colorado amends coronavirus death count - says fewer have died of COVID-19 than previously thought

 

https://kdvr.com/new...categorization/

While they may be over counting deaths, there are also under-counted deaths because people who die from it at home and were not tested do not count as covid 19 deaths. It's impossible to tell if the actual number of deaths is higher or lower than the given numbers.

 

I just have to revisit this... So you think that people are dying at home of a respiratory illness in the midst of this very widely known pandemic and medical examiners and coroners are not performing a simply Covid-19 blood test during the autopsy to see why they died? I just want to make sure I am understanding you correctly on this.

There is a thread about it.

http://www.therushfo...rus-fatalities/

 

No, I'm not asking you for a thread or some article you read or anything. I am asking You if you believe that people are dying in their homes from respiratory illness and the medical examiner and coroners are not testing them for Covid 19. Do you believe that? Does that really make sense to you? That in the middle of a respiratory illness pandemic, people dying in their homes who didn't go to the doctor even though they were ill, are not tested for something like Covid 19 when the reason for death is unknown?

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Colorado amends coronavirus death count - says fewer have died of COVID-19 than previously thought

 

https://kdvr.com/new...categorization/

While they may be over counting deaths, there are also under-counted deaths because people who die from it at home and were not tested do not count as covid 19 deaths. It's impossible to tell if the actual number of deaths is higher or lower than the given numbers.

 

I just have to revisit this... So you think that people are dying at home of a respiratory illness in the midst of this very widely known pandemic and medical examiners and coroners are not performing a simply Covid-19 blood test during the autopsy to see why they died? I just want to make sure I am understanding you correctly on this.

There is a thread about it.

http://www.therushfo...rus-fatalities/

 

No, I'm not asking you for a thread or some article you read or anything. I am asking You if you believe that people are dying in their homes from respiratory illness and the medical examiner and coroners are not testing them for Covid 19. Do you believe that? Does that really make sense to you? That in the middle of a respiratory illness pandemic, people dying in their homes who didn't go to the doctor even though they were ill, are not tested for something like Covid 19 when the reason for death is unknown?

Based on the article linked to that thread they were not doing so at that time in NYC. There were something like 8 times more deaths in people's homes per day than usual in NYC at that time. Edited by snowdogged
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Move this thread to SOCN

 

Absolutely not. This is not a political issue. It is a social issue as well as a health issue.

 

What if we have another huge natural disaster, like another hurricane or an earthquake? Should we also discuss it in that dysfunctional Forum?

 

Don't make it into a political issue, and there will be no problem.

 

Totally.

I said this earlier:

 

Move this thread to SOCN

 

I hope not. It’s only natural that this topic would creep into other parts of TRF.

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