Geddy's Voice - Question

[anchorman]

Geddy Lee's voice changed throughout his 40 year career and understandably so. I'm not sure anyone could sustain the high-pitched vocals he had in Rush's earliest albums. However, the difference in Geddy's voice over the 6 year period from 1978's Hemispheres to 1984's Grace Under Pressure marked a drastic change.

 

Permanent Waves through Signals was subtle but when GUP came out, you could tell Geddy's voice just wasn't the same. Even the way he pronounced some words was different. I'm not sure how to explain what I'm getting at.

 

QUESTION: Does anyone recall Geddy addressing the change in his singing voice? Was he ever asked about it in interviews? If so, can you please share what he said? I recall there being rumors of throat cancer or some other ailment or surgery that brought about the change but none of that was ever confirmed or given credence. Did he get a nose job? Could that have changed things for him?

 

If the medical issues were false, did he get singing lessons or training to make the transition to a lower register? Even though he took a lot of criticism for it, I loved Geddy's voice from 1974-1983. I thought it was unique and complimented the music and lyrics.

 

I personally didn't care for the change post Signals and by the time R40 came around, his touring voice seemed shot. He appeared to be really struggling (as evidenced by his contorted facial expressions and borderline yodeling).

Eddie Trunk's fanboy comments to Geddy about his voice sounding better than ever was ridiculous and almost patronizing.

 

I think the best I ever heard Geddy sound live was during the Vapor Trails tour.

 

Thanks in advance for any answers.

Edited January 17, 2020 by anchorman

[JohnnyBlaze]

As far as I can remember, it was a conscious change in the early 80s. No throat cancer, no nose job. Voice lessons I’m not sure about though. I can’t imagine him screeching “Red Alert! Red Alert!” with his mid-70s voice. And when you think about it, Tom Sawyer incorporates both his 70s vocals and the direction his vocals would end up taking.

[londonguy]

I agree with the VT tour vocals. I was just watching some YT videos of the VT tour. I'm blown away by the quality of his singing on that tour. A combination of 5 years off, plus the fact that he still wasn't even 50 years old probably helped. IMO the rest of their tours the vocal quality went very downhill.

[Vectorman]

I could look it up for the exact text, but from memory, in a 1984 Keyboard magazine interview, the interviewer said, "You don't sing as high as you used to." And Geddy's response was basically, "No, and that's a conscious decision. It's hard to sing when you're using up all your energy to stay two octaves above mortal man. It takes a lot of work to keep punching your voice up. And I think my voice has a more pleasing sound in my natural speaking register. I can just relax and use my voice and sing." That was the gist of it, anyway.

 

He really sounded great on the VT tour after the long break. But he was entering his 50's and one's anatomy isn't as forgiving at that age as it is when you're younger. IMO it would have behooved them, for the sake of Geddy's vocal longevity, to drop the keys on a lot of their material in concert going forward from that point, not just one or two songs. I know some didn't like hearing Rush tune down a whole step on material like "2112" and "Circumstances," but I think the change in sonic texture hearing something in a different key just makes it a fresh and interestingly different take on it. To me, there's nothing sacred about the original key in which a song was recorded - that just happened to be the key they landed on at the time. If they had written and recorded "The Big Money" starting off in A instead of B, for example, people would just hear that as "how it's supposed to sound."

Edited January 17, 2020 by Vectorman

[jnoble]

Geddy Lee's voice changed throughout his 40 year career and understandably so. I'm not sure anyone could sustain the high-pitched vocals he had in Rush's earliest albums. However, the difference in Geddy's voice over the 6 year period from 1978's Hemispheres to 1984's Grace Under Pressure marked a drastic change.

 

Permanent Waves through Signals was subtle but when GUP came out, you could tell Geddy's voice just wasn't the same. Even the way he pronounced some words was different. I'm not sure how to explain what I'm getting at.

 

QUESTION: Does anyone recall Geddy addressing the change in his singing voice? Was he ever asked about it in interviews? If so, can you please share what he said? I recall there being rumors of throat cancer or some other ailment or surgery that brought about the change but none of that was ever confirmed or given credence. Did he get a nose job? Could that have changed things for him?

 

If the medical issues were false, did he get singing lessons or training to make the transition to a lower register? Even though he took a lot of criticism for it, I loved Geddy's voice from 1974-1983. I thought it was unique and complimented the music and lyrics.

 

I personally didn't care for the change post Signals and by the time R40 came around, his touring voice seemed shot. He appeared to be really struggling (as evidenced by his contorted facial expressions and borderline yodeling).

Eddie Trunk's fanboy comments to Geddy about his voice sounding better than ever was ridiculous and almost patronizing.

 

I think the best I ever heard Geddy sound live was during the Vapor Trails tour.

 

Thanks in advance for any answers.

 

I don't know exactly what changed either but I've always noticed that too. It's not just that he wasn't singing high or screechy anymore but yeah, his...accent? was gone too and he sounded more 'American' for a lack of a better term. I can't really put my finger on it either but I know what you mean

[jnoble]

I agree with the VT tour vocals. I was just watching some YT videos of the VT tour. I'm blown away by the quality of his singing on that tour. A combination of 5 years off, plus the fact that he still wasn't even 50 years old probably helped. IMO the rest of their tours the vocal quality went very downhill.

 

He did sound good on the VT tour although Rush In Rio still sounds like they forgot to turn his mic on :eyeroll:

 

I don't really enjoy listening to most of Rush's live material after RIR because their sound was too muddy and his voice wasn't very good anymore...all straining and creaky and yodel-ey

Edited January 17, 2020 by jnoble

[Narps]

If he got a nose job he should ask for his money back...

[londonguy]

If he got a nose job he should ask for his money back...

LOL

[chemistry1973]

My god on that GuP live recording he sings his ass off! He could’ve easily screeched our I think I’m Going Bald, but it was a conscious decision - they went full pop in the 80s - that played a huge part.

 

However - something was off from 87 through 1990. He had a very strained reedy quality to his voice. When they tuned down for some songs on the T4E tour, he seemed to regain some power.

 

He sounded rad for VT, and not bad for S/A.

 

Time Machine is where the wheels came off.

[thizzellewashington]

My understanding is that he made a change after Hemispheres, because they wrote and recorded all the music without checking to make sure it was in a key he could sing in, and he struggled badly on that tour. The change from Hemispheres to Permanent Waves is obvious.

 

I'm also pretty sure he quit smoking sometime in the early '80s, which can only have helped things.

Edited January 17, 2020 by thizzellewashington

[LeChuck]

I could look it up for the exact text, but from memory, in a 1984 Keyboard magazine interview, the interviewer said, "You don't sing as high as you used to." And Geddy's response was basically, "No, and that's a conscious decision. It's hard to sing when you're using up all your energy to stay two octaves above mortal man. It takes a lot of work to keep punching your voice up. And I think my voice has a more pleasing sound in my natural speaking register. I can just relax and use my voice and sing." That was the gist of it, anyway.

Indeed, this is the explanation I've always gone with (since it did come directly from the man himself). You can't sing like that forever without tearing up your throat .. I'm actually surprised he could do it as long as he did. Bringing his voice down and singing more naturally seems like a good move.

 

On a side note, I've always wondered how he could sing that high with so much power. I can barely sing in the car, and the only way I can sing along with Geddy's higher vocals is via falsetto (which probably sounds like Barry Gibb - good thing the volume is always cranked). I can't even fathom what it must be like for a person to not only be able to hit those notes, but to be able to scream them out like that.

[jnoble]

I could look it up for the exact text, but from memory, in a 1984 Keyboard magazine interview, the interviewer said, "You don't sing as high as you used to." And Geddy's response was basically, "No, and that's a conscious decision. It's hard to sing when you're using up all your energy to stay two octaves above mortal man. It takes a lot of work to keep punching your voice up. And I think my voice has a more pleasing sound in my natural speaking register. I can just relax and use my voice and sing." That was the gist of it, anyway.

Indeed, this is the explanation I've always gone with (since it did come directly from the man himself). You can't sing like that forever without tearing up your throat .. I'm actually surprised he could do it as long as he did. Bringing his voice down and singing more naturally seems like a good move.

 

On a side note, I've always wondered how he could sing that high with so much power. I can barely sing in the car, and the only way I can sing along with Geddy's higher vocals is via falsetto (which probably sounds like Barry Gibb - good thing the volume is always cranked). I can't even fathom what it must be like for a person to not only be able to hit those notes, but to be able to scream them out like that.

 

...and scream them out for show after show after show for months on end during the Hemispheres tour. Its amazing he had any voice left whatsoever after the '70s

[jnoble]

My god on that GuP live recording he sings his ass off! He could’ve easily screeched our I think I’m Going Bald, but it was a conscious decision - they went full pop in the 80s - that played a huge part.

 

However - something was off from 87 through 1990. He had a very strained reedy quality to his voice. When they tuned down for some songs on the T4E tour, he seemed to regain some power.

 

He sounded rad for VT, and not bad for S/A.

 

Time Machine is where the wheels came off.

 

I don't think he had a problem with his voice so much as the type of music they were making at the time didn't require high super high energy "rock" vocals. HYF was like Rush's style of adult easy listening. But you can hear he still had it in him in parts of studio The Big Money, Show Don't Tell, Available Light etc.

The one Rush album where he really played it safe vocally was Roll The Bones. Great song writing for the most part but there is nary song on there where he really let loose with the singing. He started to get more loose and get back up there on Counterparts

[thizzellewashington]

I thought he sounded incredibly good on a night-to-night basis all throughout the Snakes & Arrows tour. After that, he was a lot more inconsistent. I watched R40 again this week and he sounded ROUGH on that DVD, but I remember him sounding great on the two shows I saw that tour. Definitely more hit-or-miss.

[jnoble]

I thought he sounded incredibly good on a night-to-night basis all throughout the Snakes & Arrows tour. After that, he was a lot more inconsistent. I watched R40 again this week and he sounded ROUGH on that DVD, but I remember him sounding great on the two shows I saw that tour. Definitely more hit-or-miss.

 

Rush always seemed to have bad timing with when they filmed their concerts for a future release: I think Geddy was sick around the time GUP tour and ASOH videos were taped, Rush In Rio had no time due to the weather for a sound check and the sound levels and mix were all messed up, R30 was by the band's own admission an off-night and bad (by their own standards, I couldn't tell) performance, Time Machine Tour Geddy was sick, R40 was taped late in the tour when his voice was getting tired.

[anchorman]

Thank you all for the replies. If you haven’t done so lately, do yourself a favor & listen to or watch the video Rush in Rio. UNBELIEVABLE. I knew he sounded great but just hearing him again after all these years... he NEVER sounded better IMO. He seemed to hit all the notes with great energy. I even forwarded to 2112, Free Will, By-Tor and Working Man. Just incredible.

[thizzellewashington]

I thought he sounded incredibly good on a night-to-night basis all throughout the Snakes & Arrows tour. After that, he was a lot more inconsistent. I watched R40 again this week and he sounded ROUGH on that DVD, but I remember him sounding great on the two shows I saw that tour. Definitely more hit-or-miss.

 

Rush always seemed to have bad timing with when they filmed their concerts for a future release: I think Geddy was sick around the time GUP tour and ASOH videos were taped, Rush In Rio had no time due to the weather for a sound check and the sound levels and mix were all messed up, R30 was by the band's own admission an off-night and bad (by their own standards, I couldn't tell) performance, Time Machine Tour Geddy was sick, R40 was taped late in the tour when his voice was getting tired.

R30 is just not a great performance on the part of the band as a whole, and I remember thinking that before they ever commented on it publicly. There's a fan-made DVD of one of their Radio City shows on that tour that's a much better performance. I should try to dig that one up, I have a copy somewhere.

 

GUP and Snakes & Arrows Live are definitely their best live DVDs in terms of the performance/Geddy's voice. Rio is incredible too, for different reasons. The energy of the crowd at that show is unreal.

[LeChuck]

I thought he sounded incredibly good on a night-to-night basis all throughout the Snakes & Arrows tour. After that, he was a lot more inconsistent. I watched R40 again this week and he sounded ROUGH on that DVD, but I remember him sounding great on the two shows I saw that tour. Definitely more hit-or-miss.

Unfortunately I can't really watch the most recent tours. It hurts to hear him reaching for high notes with that yodel (sometimes multiple times per line - like on The Spirit of Radio). I know it makes some songs sound weird, but I always wished they would just drop the keys on more songs so they're easier for him to sing.

 

I remember being amazed the last time they did Freewill and he hit those high notes after the solos - wow! I'm guessing they retired that song for that reason .. although to me it would be perfectly reasonable to just sing that verse in the same range as the rest of the verses.

[taurus]

I'm sure the physical change, wear and tear had a hand in the change in his voice but I really think the attitude in his approach changed, starting with MP. The songs didn't have the attack that previous material did. The urgency and ferociousness simply was not there. Everything to do with getting older. Just my opinion

 

Best Geddy voice - ATWAS tour August 1976-June 1977

Worst Geddy voice - Time Machine 2010/11

 

taurus's favorite Geddy voice - MP tour 1981 (best of both worlds)

[78jazz]

I could look it up for the exact text, but from memory, in a 1984 Keyboard magazine interview, the interviewer said, "You don't sing as high as you used to." And Geddy's response was basically, "No, and that's a conscious decision. It's hard to sing when you're using up all your energy to stay two octaves above mortal man. It takes a lot of work to keep punching your voice up. And I think my voice has a more pleasing sound in my natural speaking register. I can just relax and use my voice and sing." That was the gist of it, anyway.

 

He really sounded great on the VT tour after the long break. But he was entering his 50's and one's anatomy isn't as forgiving at that age as it is when you're younger. IMO it would have behooved them, for the sake of Geddy's vocal longevity, to drop the keys on a lot of their material in concert going forward from that point, not just one or two songs. I know some didn't like hearing Rush tune down a whole step on material like "2112" and "Circumstances," but I think the change in sonic texture hearing something in a different key just makes it a fresh and interestingly different take on it. To me, there's nothing sacred about the original key in which a song was recorded - that just happened to be the key they landed on at the time. If they had written and recorded "The Big Money" starting off in A instead of B, for example, people would just hear that as "how it's supposed to sound."

 

I completely agree. IMNSHO keys aren't sacred. I have put a few 2010s versions of songs in concert in Audacity and moved them down a half step. I think with at least Bravado, this would have helped.

 

IMHO the smart approach would have been like how Sting did it on the reunion tour with the Police - try out different keys rather than just pick a tuning and use that.

 

My god on that GuP live recording he sings his ass off! He could’ve easily screeched our I think I’m Going Bald, but it was a conscious decision - they went full pop in the 80s - that played a huge part.

 

However - something was off from 87 through 1990. He had a very strained reedy quality to his voice. When they tuned down for some songs on the T4E tour, he seemed to regain some power.

 

He sounded rad for VT, and not bad for S/A.

 

Time Machine is where the wheels came off.

 

To my ears, he seemed to sound a bit sharp from about 1987-1994 in concert. Too bad, as I like the Presto shows that circulate.

 

When I saw them in KC in 2010, I noticed a few notes were noticeably off (The Camera Eye in particular). In retrospect, I think the trouble for him vocally started in 2008. That drum take only of Natural Science running around on YouTube has Geddy hitting quite a few flat notes.

 

My understanding is that he made a change after Hemispheres, because they wrote and recorded all the music without checking to make sure it was in a key he could sing in, and he struggled badly on that tour. The change from Hemispheres to Permanent Waves is obvious.

 

I'm also pretty sure he quit smoking sometime in the early '80s, which can only have helped things.

 

As much as people love Geddy's voice from that time, I think in concert he was terribly inconsistent in that era. He seemed to struggle with the Hemispheres material at that time and never seemed to really nail Freewill in concert once that song came about. IMO he finally figured out how to be consistent come 1984.

 

I believe he said he quit smoking in 1983. I wouldn't be surprised if it was really taxing his voice. Yes, I realize he wasn't as consistently high in his register as he was just a few years prior but there were still songs in the set where he had to belt it.

[Narps]

 

 

Best Geddy voice - ATWAS tour August 1976-June 1977

 

 

 

Yep, at least for me anyway and this will never change...

[Wil1972]

 

Time Machine is where the wheels came off.

 

I concur.

[jnoble]

My favorite era for his voice was 1975-'78. AFTK is his best 70s vocal album followed closely by either 2112 or Hemis

[jnoble]

FBN and COS he was still too screechy in parts where he didn't need to be screechy. He learned control and restraint in the albums after

[Jimbo66]

1579258515[/url]' post='4719910']

Geddy Lee's voice changed throughout his 40 year career and understandably so. I'm not sure anyone could sustain the high-pitched vocals he had in Rush's earliest albums. However, the difference in Geddy's voice over the 6 year period from 1978's Hemispheres to 1984's Grace Under Pressure marked a drastic change.

 

Permanent Waves through Signals was subtle but when GUP came out, you could tell Geddy's voice just wasn't the same. Even the way he pronounced some words was different. I'm not sure how to explain what I'm getting at.

 

QUESTION: Does anyone recall Geddy addressing the change in his singing voice? Was he ever asked about it in interviews? If so, can you please share what he said? I recall there being rumors of throat cancer or some other ailment or surgery that brought about the change but none of that was ever confirmed or given credence. Did he get a nose job? Could that have changed things for him?

 

If the medical issues were false, did he get singing lessons or training to make the transition to a lower register? Even though he took a lot of criticism for it, I loved Geddy's voice from 1974-1983. I thought it was unique and complimented the music and lyrics.

 

I personally didn't care for the change post Signals and by the time R40 came around, his touring voice seemed shot. He appeared to be really struggling (as evidenced by his contorted facial expressions and borderline yodeling).

Eddie Trunk's fanboy comments to Geddy about his voice sounding better than ever was ridiculous and almost patronizing.

 

I think the best I ever heard Geddy sound live was during the Vapor Trails tour.

 

Thanks in advance for any answers.

 

I couldn’t believe that either, surely (as we say here in the UK) he must have been taking the piss, who knows. Bizarre to say the least.

 

in answer the question, it appears to me that the change he had with at least his diction might have been down to some dental work he had done? Not sure when it was, or even what he had done, but there was definitely a change. I really enjoyed Geddys voice, even the early screetchy stuff, right up until the more recent live Blu-Rays, when he really sounds like he’s straining to reach some of the notes. Shame really, as you have this wonderful HD technology these days enabling you to enjoy the gigs more than ever before (apart from actually being there of course) but for the most part, Geddys voice just isn’t up to it anymore. Not that anyones voice will be the same at fifty as it is at twenty, but with the Rush back catalogue being as it is, the songs don’t always suit his voice. If I want to watch Rush live and experience the songs more as they should sound, I watch the DVD versions of ESL or ASOH and just put up with the inferior visual quality.

 

It’s maybe a blessing in disguise that they stopped touring when they did really, apart from the obvious health problems that Neil was experiencing, there was also Alexs arthritis and Geddys voice. That’s not to say we shouldn’t hear Geddy singing anything again of course, but maybe something more suitable to his voice. Him trying to reach the notes in TOS, Circumstances etc doesn’t really cut it for me anymore. Obviously Neils health would have been the overriding factor, but IMO even without that they would have been wise to call it a day - certainly as regards Rush anyway.

Edited January 18, 2020 by Jimbo66