Why did 70s prog rock bands turn to new wave in the 80s as a sound change?

[The K Man]

Selling England.... is great on the strength alone of Dancing..., Firth of Fifth and Cinema Show, but I would agree that the rest ranges from good to just okay. I actually think the Lamb is the better overall record, and A Trick of the Tail is probably their most stunningly consistent record, but as individual songs go, they never topped the Big 3 of Supper's Ready, Firth of Fifth and Cinema Show.

[Entre_Perpetuo]

Selling England.... is great on the strength alone of Dancing..., Firth of Fifth and Cinema Show, but I would agree that the rest ranges from good to just okay. I actually think the Lamb is the better overall record, and A Trick of the Tail is probably their most stunningly consistent record, but as individual songs go, they never topped the Big 3 of Supper's Ready, Firth of Fifth and Cinema Show.

 

I still need to hear Lamb, but yeah I agree. I'd take Firth, Cinema Show, and Dancing over most individual cuts on Trick (maybe Squonk, Volcano, and Ripples aside, it's pretty close there), but then I'd take Mad Man Moon, Entangled, RAB, Los Endos, and heck, maybe even the title track on Trick over most of the rest of Selling, especially Epping Forrest.

 

And Supper's Ready is the greatest thing they ever did, and one of the greatest songs of all time, and possibly second only to the immovable Bohemian Rhapsody in my all-time favorite songs.

[bluefox4000]

Selling England.... is great on the strength alone of Dancing..., Firth of Fifth and Cinema Show, but I would agree that the rest ranges from good to just okay. I actually think the Lamb is the better overall record, and A Trick of the Tail is probably their most stunningly consistent record, but as individual songs go, they never topped the Big 3 of Supper's Ready, Firth of Fifth and Cinema Show.

 

I still need to hear Lamb, but yeah I agree. I'd take Firth, Cinema Show, and Dancing over most individual cuts on Trick (maybe Squonk, Volcano, and Ripples aside, it's pretty close there), but then I'd take Mad Man Moon, Entangled, RAB, Los Endos, and heck, maybe even the title track on Trick over most of the rest of Selling, especially Epping Forrest.

 

And Supper's Ready is the greatest thing they ever did, and one of the greatest songs of all time, and possibly second only to the immovable Bohemian Rhapsody in my all-time favorite songs.

 

Supper's Ready is my fav prog song ever. Not a Gabriel era guy......but major props to them.

 

Mick

[RushFanForever]

Not all bands can be AC/DC and survive musically by recording the same type of songs/albums throughout their career.

[Tony R]

Not all bands can be AC/DC and survive musically by recording the same type of songs/albums throughout their career.

 

I agree. Conventional wisdom suggests they should have floundered long ago. British bands Motörhead and Status Quo had a similar philosophy and they prospered too. The exceptions that prove the rule?

 

[Segue Myles]

Not all bands can be AC/DC and survive musically by recording the same type of songs/albums throughout their career.

 

I agree. Conventional wisdom suggests they should have floundered long ago. British bands Motörhead and Status Quo had a similar philosophy and they prospered too. The exceptions that prove the rule?

 

Tom Petty too.

 

If the band or artist write great songs, and continue to be inspired, a force change of sound is unnecessary.

[bluefox4000]

Not all bands can be AC/DC and survive musically by recording the same type of songs/albums throughout their career.

 

I agree. Conventional wisdom suggests they should have floundered long ago. British bands Motörhead and Status Quo had a similar philosophy and they prospered too. The exceptions that prove the rule?

 

Tom Petty too.

 

If the band or artist write great songs, and continue to be inspired, a force change of sound is unnecessary.

 

yea.......unless album sales are REALLY tanking.

 

some artists are all but forced too.

 

but i got the gist.

 

Mick

[New_World_Man]

Maybe Jethro Tull did(not overly familiar with that part of their history though) and King Crimson sounded similar to the Talking Heads to some degree but other then that no prog bands I can think of sounded new wavish. I wouldn't even categorize Rush's eighties albums as new wave sounding or at least not full blown new wave. The influences were there but I wouldn't put them in that same category as most new wave bands.

[The K Man]

Selling England.... is great on the strength alone of Dancing..., Firth of Fifth and Cinema Show, but I would agree that the rest ranges from good to just okay. I actually think the Lamb is the better overall record, and A Trick of the Tail is probably their most stunningly consistent record, but as individual songs go, they never topped the Big 3 of Supper's Ready, Firth of Fifth and Cinema Show.

 

I still need to hear Lamb, but yeah I agree. I'd take Firth, Cinema Show, and Dancing over most individual cuts on Trick (maybe Squonk, Volcano, and Ripples aside, it's pretty close there), but then I'd take Mad Man Moon, Entangled, RAB, Los Endos, and heck, maybe even the title track on Trick over most of the rest of Selling, especially Epping Forrest.

 

And Supper's Ready is the greatest thing they ever did, and one of the greatest songs of all time, and possibly second only to the immovable Bohemian Rhapsody in my all-time favorite songs.

 

Supper's Ready is my fav prog song ever. Not a Gabriel era guy......but major props to them.

 

Mick

 

Supper's Ready is definitely in my top 3 album-side prog epics of the 70's (along with 2112 and Gates of Delirium).

 

Quite a few modern "album-side" epics would be up there as well.

[RushFanForever]

 

Tom Petty too.

 

If the band or artist write great songs, and continue to be inspired, a force change of sound is unnecessary.

 

That's not true about Tom Petty. He expanded his musical vocabulary with incorporating strings in 'It's Good To Be King' and a horn section with background singers on Southern Accents. As well, he played in the 'Traveling Wilbury's'.

[Digital Dad]

I never thought selling Was that hot of a record.

 

I mean you have Firth and Cinema Show....ok got me there but the rest. Never Liked Wardrobe all that much. HATE Battle of Epping Forrest. Moonlight Knight is OK.

 

5/10 at BEST for me.

 

Mick

 

Dude, Epping Forest is awesome. Listen to that bassline.

 

 

[custom55]

I never thought selling Was that hot of a record.

 

I mean you have Firth and Cinema Show....ok got me there but the rest. Never Liked Wardrobe all that much. HATE Battle of Epping Forrest. Moonlight Knight is OK.

 

5/10 at BEST for me.

 

Mick

 

Dude, Epping Forest is awesome. Listen to that bassline.

 

Just saw The Musical Box ( Genesis cover band ) with The Cat 3 and they played Epping Forest. WOW.

 

Selling England is second to Lamb Lies Down.

[custom55]

If you've never attended a Genesis concert with Peter Gabriel on vocals, then go see The Musical Box.

 

Just ask "The Cat 3".

 

http://youtu.be/XffjmoaQd_U

Edited March 13, 2018 by custom55

[bluefox4000]

Naw can't STAND Epping. but oh well.

 

Mick

[Digital Dad]

Naw can't STAND Epping. but oh well.

 

Mick

 

Then you suck.

[bathory]

if you can approach the topic of your favorite band honestly, rush were never "trendsetters," and always a few years late to whichever party they were crashing.

 

if you listen to songs like "more fool me," "counting out time," "lilywhite lilith," its not really surprising that genesis took the direction they did - for all the talk of pretension, those songs sound closer to the beatles than any of rush's quasi-zeppelin farts. its not surprising at all that two of the most popular songwriters of all-time come from that group.

 

hell, yes also had hooks. tull had hooks. close to the edge is a long tune but it's catchy and not an alienating listen. roundabout gets played on the radio every day.

 

I would've been more surprised if king crimson or frank zappa or hawkwind came out with some bullshit like big generator or invisible touch.

 

the short answer is the bands mentioned in the OP always had hooks and melodies, and over time they didnt want to be backed into a corner so they had to adapt or fade into obscurity. obviously rush weren't gonna sound like the ramones, but you had bands like talking heads and the police who were great players and wrote concise, catchy songs. plus, these dudes weren't high schoolers and probably didnt feel like they were part of some prog club, where its "prog against the world" or some nonsense. they were musicians and songwriters. you're supposed to evolve

[New_World_Man]

^I don't know, I'd rather listen to Big Generator than Beat or Three of a perfect pair(not that those are bad just not terribly exciting to me for the most part and TOAPP while I like it has some wtf material on it like nuages). I guess ymmv.

[By Tor]

My question is...I wonder what was the attraction that bands like Yes, Rush, Genesis, and Jethro Tull had to that sort of Kraftwerk/Gary Numan-esque sound?

 

What a bloody good question !

 

I wish I had an answer for it that makes sense

As as far I was concerned it did`nt make any sense

It almost destroyed Yes , Rush , Jethro Tull , Mike Oldfield ( out for debate on Mike ) finished Floyd , and many more

I had to live through that decade and as it went on I thought Music was dead and I even started selling off my albums as you could`nt buy decent record players anymore and they even stopped selling flared Jeans , my life was in a right state , so much I got married and settled down

Edited April 8, 2018 by By Tor

[Mosher]

Having a successful career is important if you don't want that career to end.

 

Playing around with new things is sort of part of what prog was about.

 

Combined, it made sense to try those things out.

 

And Genesis got the pop part right.

 

Rush and Yes were great at keeping it prog and yet making it new.

 

Jethro Tull- one of my favorite bands- did a terrible job. Under Wraps is unlistenable.

[By Tor]

Good points Mosher

 

I just think that the bands such as Rush and Yes did`nt need to follow down that horrid road of that 80`s soulless sound

 

Peter Gabriel still shone in the 80`s and he was probably at his most successful period then as a solo artist

[HemiBeers]

I'm gonna say it. I really don't like 90125. it comes across as Yes trying to be current and just failing. The pop sound wasn't a good look on yes....and to suggest it's their best album lowkey kinda hurts me, lol

 

Mick

 

I actually think with Rabin their songs were not so much "pop" as they were a little heavier.

I give Rabin his due as a great guitarist, but Yes without Howe is just...'Maybe'.

 

Alot of the prog bands moved beyond that to more accessible material around that time. some did better than others (kansas..pop band...ugh fail).

Edited April 9, 2018 by HemiBeers

[Entre_Perpetuo]

I'm gonna say it. I really don't like 90125. it comes across as Yes trying to be current and just failing. The pop sound wasn't a good look on yes....and to suggest it's their best album lowkey kinda hurts me, lol

 

Mick

 

I actually think with Rabin their songs were not so much "pop" as they were a little heavier.

I give Rabin his due as a great guitarist, but Yes without Howe is just...'Maybe'.

 

Alot of the prog bands moved beyond that to more accessible material around that time. some did better than others (kansas..pop band...ugh fail).

 

I always thought Rabin did great guitar work all over 90125, but to imagine Howe's take on the same songs and riffs and melodies...I can't help but think it could be even better.

[Entre_Perpetuo]

Naw can't STAND Epping. but oh well.

 

Mick

 

I think it's probably better than I tend to give it credit for, but come on. Ain't no way it stands up to Supper's Ready, Get 'Em Out By Friday, or The Musical Box, not to mention Firth Of Fifth or Dancing With The Moonlit Knight.

[bluefox4000]

I'm gonna say it. I really don't like 90125. it comes across as Yes trying to be current and just failing. The pop sound wasn't a good look on yes....and to suggest it's their best album lowkey kinda hurts me, lol

 

Mick

 

I actually think with Rabin their songs were not so much "pop" as they were a little heavier.

I give Rabin his due as a great guitarist, but Yes without Howe is just...'Maybe'.

 

Alot of the prog bands moved beyond that to more accessible material around that time. some did better than others (kansas..pop band...ugh fail).

 

Kansas DID suck at pop rock. God were the 80's awful for them.

 

Mick

[bluefox4000]

Naw can't STAND Epping. but oh well.

 

Mick

 

I think it's probably better than I tend to give it credit for, but come on. Ain't no way it stands up to Supper's Ready, Get 'Em Out By Friday, or The Musical Box, not to mention Firth Of Fifth or Dancing With The Moonlit Knight.

 

it's starts off pretty good. but man it meanders after that. it's like....this is STILL going. and it just feels WAY longer than it's runtime.

 

Mick