Do you think of Permanent Waves as a 70s album or an 80s album?

[Narps]

In response to the eighties sub-discussion. I don't find the eighties as amazing as the seventies personally, mostly for those just SOOO eighties songs (you know the ones) that I can only bear so much of, but it was definitely a great decade for music. I will say, though, that most rock bands from the seventies or even from the late 70s/early 80s period (which is certainly one of the best times in music like ever, just look at all the "best albums ever" by certain bands) died out around the mid eighties as it just started to become apparent where music was headed (alternative and heavy electronic). The seventies, on the other hand, were awesome all the way through for music, you had the Beatles last album, Led Zepp IV, the beginnings and climaxes of tons of bands from Rush to Queen to Journey to Styx to Pink Floyd to just so many others, and you ended it all with the brilliance of finding that perfect blend between the past and the future.

I don't know the 70s had a pretty big fair share of crap with it too. And whereas most of these listed artists were not on the mainstream in the 70s, in the 80s, there was lots of good stuff on the top 40. Also when you say "started to become apparent where music was headed (alternative and heavy electronic)", that point (for me anyway) just further embellishes how better the 80's/90's were compared to the 60's and 70's. I honestly don't listen to much stuff released before permanent waves (not counting Rush albums, but only one 70s album to a higher regard), just because of bland instrumentation, cringe inducing vocal styling, lack of heavy synthesizers, and just poorer sound quality that the decade could afford (keep in mind this is just opinion, and there are many others on here that don't believe what I am writing).

You are not a 70's Yes fan at all?................ :codger:

I actually know very little of Yes's work. I should look more into them at some point, but quite honestly electronic and alternative music is where it is at with me. There is one album of Yes's I do enjoy quite a bit though, and that is Drama. I listened to Drama because I am a big fan of The Buggles, and they basically joined in with Yes on that record, so I was curious to see what they would come up with sound wise. I know Drama is an 80s album, but eh, it's relevant-ish to what you asked. Like I said above, I am very alternative/electronic minded when it comes to music. Rush is very far away from any other band I like.

I you ever get a wild hair, listen to Going For The One. I am a big fan of the pipe organ from growing up in church I guess. It is very powerful and moving and it is all over that album and it is inspirational to me......... :codger:

[Ged Lent's sis]

My favorite quotes from the thread have led (no pun intended) me to the answer...

 

PeW was a transitional album, kinda caught in the middle between 70's and 80's, as were alot of releases around '79 to '81. Not quite the 1980's mentality yet but at the same time awakening from the 70's smoke-filled haze and trying something new. But if you twisted my arm, I'd lump Permanent Waves in the 1970's catagory. I always look at the release date of an album and subtract 4-6 months or so and to me that is when the album was truly created. Rush were creating these songs during the end of the Tour Of The Semispheres, which was very much steeped in all it's 70's glory. :smoke:

 

Of course. A transition... no wait, it's the seventies! YOU'RE HURTING MY ARM!!!!111

 

for the first time ever I agree with gemini

it was rush trying to mix the old with the new, and they did it damn near flawlessly

 

Interesting, yeah, a mixture...

 

As I think about it more, I actually think Side One of Permanent Waves is an 80s album, and Side Two is a 70s Album. It's kind of like Rush is saying, SIDE ONE: This is the Future, Enjoy. SIDE TWO: Here is your last look at the past, Relish in it.

 

...quite literally, a mixture. Yeah, The Spirit of Radio is the first song I heard in the New Year (I fell asleep before Auld Hugh Syme)...

 

I still can't decide which decade I would put Permanent Waves in. Guess it's too much a crossover album.

IMO and all that ;)

 

Or, wait a minute. Crossed over...

 

I love how we can talk about this shit forever

 

That's it! It's forever!!

 

It is beautifully unclassfiable :wub:

 

...and never! I mean, seriously... it's PERMANENT WAVES for chrissakes! It's grey!! It looks grey. It sounds grey. It f-f-feelsss g-grey! There's only one other RUSH album that screams grey and that's Presto and nobody knows when that was made!

 

1. Time Fools

When the effing tribe debates

A long (part cocky) bore, fine!

We'll weave a tale of time-based fools

Spinnin' short-lived fallacy.

Each micromanaged pennant

A complete insanity.

 

A simple kind fear

To reject those not our own.

With the crazy little features

Washing out the decade's seas.

Living like the fools,

They soon forget a seas a sea...

[analog guy]

Cop out answer.... but I think it's both a 70s and an 80s record. It's ambiguous, and intentionally so, because the album straddles both decades in equal amounts.

 

It's a bridge album in every sense of the word. Two decades, two eras.

[tas7]

My introduction to Rush late 1979. I was 17 and had been drinking since 4 in the afternoon. I had a pint race with my mate Emu at The Floral Hall, a heavy rock club with a 10,000 watt P.A. I crashed out after one too many. Some time later I awoke to the sound of the seashore, thought I was back home. Then a 12 string started and this guy started singing as though he'd ingested a load of Helium. Ten minutes later I thought what the hell was that? I ran round like a lunatic asking but no one would tell me what it was but a few days later a friend put me out of my misery and relented, "Oh, it's just Rush."

To me it is my favourite album, a masterpiece from beginning to end.

[jruiz2112]

though realeased in 1980, it's true, all the music and recording happened in the '70's....therefore i feel it's more in the 'prog' era...

[jruiz2112]

Rush On everyone! :dweez:

[jruiz2112]

I don't even think of Moving Pictures as an 80s album. So despite never giving this any thought, I must conclude that Permanent Waves is a 70s album.

 

I sort of think of Signals as both the last 70s album and the first 80s album. But at the same time, I consider Signals the final album of the classic period. In my listening experience P/G, and not Signals, represents the more profound stylistic shift, and is a true 80s album.

 

I'm sure none of this makes any sense. I'm a historian; I'm trained to challenge simple decade-based periodization. ;)

 

I need more coffee...

P/G is Grace under Pressure right? well, if so...i definitely agree with you! :sundog:

[jruiz2112]

I don't even think of Moving Pictures as an 80s album. So despite never giving this any thought, I must conclude that Permanent Waves is a 70s album.

 

I sort of think of Signals as both the last 70s album and the first 80s album. But at the same time, I consider Signals the final album of the classic period. In my listening experience P/G, and not Signals, represents the more profound stylistic shift, and is a true 80s album.

 

I'm sure none of this makes any sense. I'm a historian; I'm trained to challenge simple decade-based periodization. ;)

 

I need more coffee...

[tas7]

I don't even think of Moving Pictures as an 80s album. So despite never giving this any thought, I must conclude that Permanent Waves is a 70s album.

 

I sort of think of Signals as both the last 70s album and the first 80s album. But at the same time, I consider Signals the final album of the classic period. In my listening experience P/G, and not Signals, represents the more profound stylistic shift, and is a true 80s album.

I'm sure none of this makes any sense. I'm a historian; I'm trained to challenge simple decade-based periodization. ;)

 

I need more coffee...

P/G is Grace under Pressure right? well, if so...i definitely agree with you! :sundog:

Agree, Signals still links with Moving Pictures and Permanent Waves. I found Grace Under Pressure disappointing after three absolute stunners of albums but it has aged better than I thought it would.

Edited November 4, 2013 by tas7

[coventry]

I've never thought of PeW as either a 70's or 80's album. To me, the prog era ended with Hemispheres and the synth era began with Signals. I've always viewed PeW and MP as transitional albums: for the most part shorter, more accessible songs, yet both contain longer compositions (e.g., Natural Science and The Camera Eye).

 

This is really quite insightful. It connotes that PeW and MP are their own era of Rush music which, in retrospect, they are. There's much on both of those albums that's all their own and little that is a direct connection to their predecessors or successors.

Edited November 4, 2013 by coventry

[lifeson90]

At the end of the day we know waves is technically a 70s album having been written and produced in that decade but, if you were there at the time, its definitely 80s as we spent a huge proportion of the early 80s listening to it.

 

If you werent there, either werent born then or too stoned to remember it, then its a funny thing isnt it. Released jan 1 1980, actually made '79.. then your personal ideas of what constitute 80s music comes into play.

 

Myself personally, i was there and spent a whole lot of the early 80s listening to Waves.. is quintessential brilliant rush at their very, almost biblical best.

 

Also the general feel of the album just doesnt resonate as 70s with me.. most 70s stuff, however great, sounds just a little old fashioned to me but theres nothing old fashioned about Waves the album still sounds fresh modern and contemporary to me now, so overall the main factor in determining decade for album has to be the one thing i associate most with it that cant be a simple matter of opinion - the fact i was there in the 80s and Waves was the awesome soundtrack for it.

 

The rest of you who werent there and cant think like this got technical production dates and musical style to think about i suppose.

Edited November 4, 2013 by lifeson90

[GeminiRising79]

At the end of the day we know waves is technically a 70s album having been written and produced in that decade but, if you were there at the time, its definitely 80s as we spent a huge proportion of the early 80s listening to it.

 

If you werent there, either werent born then or too stoned to remember it, then its a funny thing isnt it. Released jan 1 1980, actually made '79.. then your personal ideas of what constitute 80s music comes into play.

 

Myself personally, i was there and spent a whole lot of the early 80s listening to Waves.. is quintessential brilliant rush at their very, almost biblical best.

 

Also the general feel of the album just doesnt resonate as 70s with me.. most 70s stuff, however great, sounds just a little old fashioned to me but theres nothing old fashioned about Waves the album still sounds fresh modern and contemporary to me now, so overall the main factor in determining decade for album has to be the one thing i associate most with it that cant be a simple matter of opinion - the fact i was there in the 80s and Waves was the awesome soundtrack for it.

 

The rest of you who werent there and cant think like this got technical production dates and musical style to think about i suppose.

 

Good post!

[KennyLee]

At the end of the day we know waves is technically a 70s album having been written and produced in that decade but, if you were there at the time, its definitely 80s as we spent a huge proportion of the early 80s listening to it.

 

If you werent there, either werent born then or too stoned to remember it, then its a funny thing isnt it. Released jan 1 1980, actually made '79.. then your personal ideas of what constitute 80s music comes into play.

 

Myself personally, i was there and spent a whole lot of the early 80s listening to Waves.. is quintessential brilliant rush at their very, almost biblical best.

 

Also the general feel of the album just doesnt resonate as 70s with me.. most 70s stuff, however great, sounds just a little old fashioned to me but theres nothing old fashioned about Waves the album still sounds fresh modern and contemporary to me now, so overall the main factor in determining decade for album has to be the one thing i associate most with it that cant be a simple matter of opinion - the fact i was there in the 80s and Waves was the awesome soundtrack for it.

 

The rest of you who werent there and cant think like this got technical production dates and musical style to think about i suppose.

 

You are correct. A large part of the genius of Rush is being so far ahead of their time during that era.

[Segue Myles]

Thing is...unless Rush wrote, recorded, designed the artwork, compiled the credits, printed and manufactured the vinyl pressing in the early hours of January 1st 1980 ready for dispatch mid-morning for general release to the public come lunchtime that very same day, yeah: I call it an eightees Rush album.

 

However, I very much doubt it. It would have been manufactured and dispatched to stores at the very earliest in the last days of the 1970's...so I choose to ignore the release date and I call it their final seventies release.

 

 

[LedRush]

At the end of the day we know waves is technically a 70s album having been written and produced in that decade but, if you were there at the time, its definitely 80s as we spent a huge proportion of the early 80s listening to it.

 

If you werent there, either werent born then or too stoned to remember it, then its a funny thing isnt it. Released jan 1 1980, actually made '79.. then your personal ideas of what constitute 80s music comes into play.

 

Myself personally, i was there and spent a whole lot of the early 80s listening to Waves.. is quintessential brilliant rush at their very, almost biblical best.

 

Also the general feel of the album just doesnt resonate as 70s with me.. most 70s stuff, however great, sounds just a little old fashioned to me but theres nothing old fashioned about Waves the album still sounds fresh modern and contemporary to me now, so overall the main factor in determining decade for album has to be the one thing i associate most with it that cant be a simple matter of opinion - the fact i was there in the 80s and Waves was the awesome soundtrack for it.

 

The rest of you who werent there and cant think like this got technical production dates and musical style to think about i suppose.

 

But I guess I've always seen 70's rock music as more timeless than 80's rock music. The synth stuff just screams 80's with every note. PeW has a timeless, classic rock feel to it (which is why it is a staple of classic rock radio). So it retains the 70's feel to me.

[Ged Lent's sis]

It permanently waves from the eighties to the seventies and back again.

Either that or—as I tried, probably unsuccessfully, to posit in my rambling rant a page or so ago—it belongs to neither decade, because it belongs permanently in between...

 

from Somewhere in between off of Kate Bush's Aerial

Somewhere in between

The waxing and the waning wave

Somewhere in between

What the song and silence say

Somewhere in between

The ticking and the tocking clock

Somewhere in a dream between

Sleep and waking up

Somewhere in between

Breathing out and breathing in

Like twilight is neither night nor morning

[Pags]

It's a 70's album to me. Much like Presto is a 90's album even though it was released in '89.

 

:cheers:

[circumstantial tree]

I'm sure I posted about this album earlier, but I think of it as an 80s album. One reason is that it sets the stage for Moving Pictures. They're practically sister albums. And Moving Pictures is definitely an 80s album. Since they went more lean and mean with Permanent Waves and left behind the 70s prog kinda thing with Hemispheres, it fits neatly into an 80s format.

[agubrizbassman]

For Me, of course it was finished by the late 70's, but it was a stepping stone of what was to come in the new decade, so you can say its a transition album, i really enjoy it, I'm actually gonna get the vinyl copy in a few days!

[Rush Cocky]

Without a doubt a 70s album.

 

Rush thinks so too, as they played it in disco style to open the Time Machine show! :laughing guy:

Edited November 8, 2013 by Rush Cocky

[ReRushed]

Since there was no year 0 it is undeniably a 1970's album!

[Rushman14]

it was the doorway to the 80's. I remember it feeling like a pretty significant shift in direction at the time.

[len(songs)]

Half of it was 70's (Freewill, JL, NatSci). Half of it was 80's (TSOR, Freewill, Entre Nous, Different Strings). Overall I usually group it with Moving Pictures as 80s... Edited August 13, 2014 by len(songs)

[Lorraine]

Half of it was 70's (Freewill, JL, NatSci). Half of it was 80's (TSOR, Freewill, Entre Nous, Different Strings). Overall I usually group it with Moving Pictures as 80s...

 

I just got done listening to it and would agree completely with what you wrote - half and half.

[len(songs)]

And then there's Presto, which was released in 1989, but which has more in common with RTB than with anything before it... Edited August 13, 2014 by len(songs)