Why Neil Peart is better than John Bonham

[Tick]

"beauty is in the eye of the beholder."

[Snowman]

Bonham is about brute force while NEP has the technique and touch and is a much much much more complete drummer than Bonham ever was close to.

 

You must not mix up brute force with groove!

 

Doesnt Neil groove on Animate, Limelight, Freewill, and sooooo on? Thats what I combine with groove at least.

 

But, regarding Neils drumsolo; I wish he could change the whole solo in stead of just doing minor changes from tour to tour.

[lerxt1990]

QUOTE (Finbar @ Feb 9 2007, 12:31 PM)

QUOTE (lerxt1990 @ Feb 9 2007, 09:07 AM) QUOTE (Earthshine @ Feb 9 2007, 12:55 AM) They really can't be compared. John was an influence on Neil, but you can't hear much of it. John was a more of a free player with tons of feel, whereas Neil is a very disciplined and organized player who will play the song almost exactly the same each time. Bonzo would often play fills totally different than on the original version of songs. Both approaches have merit and I think that both approaches are appropriate for each of their bands and styles. John was a tremendous drummer. If it were not for John, many of today's  players would not be doing what they are doing. Same with Neil. He has paved the way for many drummers as well. So they are both equal, but in different ways. Within reason this is like trying to prove that Coke tastes better than Pepsi. Its subjective. Good point but...   Neil Peart and John Bonham are both great drummers in their own right who, while being influenced by many others (most obviously Neil Peart by John Bonham) basically invented their own style.   Pepsi-Cola, on the other hand, was one of many Coca-Cola immitation products and is just the one that happens to be about as popular as the original today. I'm not saying Coke tastes better than Pepsi, you're right it is subjective, I prefer Coke personally, I'm just saying that neither of these two great drummers merely copied the other as was the case with Pepsi and Coke.   There are cases when one musician copies another and it's still subjective which one is better. I just thought it should be pointed out that I don't consider either great drummer an immitator. It doesnt make any difference, none of these drummer sinvented drumming so they all emulated someone. Both had influences, even if they werent each other. On the macro, drummers can be better or worse (Bonham and Peart are OBJECTIVELY better than me), but at that level, its a matter of subjective opinion as to who is "better", especially because youre hearing them within the ocnfines of their bands music.   Oh by the way, Coke is better than Pepsi

[rushgoober]

No question Bonham was one of the greats. His sheer power came through loud and clear.

 

When it comes to virtuosity and complexity though, I have to give it to Neil, THE best rock drummer ever...

[Maddy]

QUOTE (paganoman @ Feb 9 2007, 12:45 PM)

btw: Isn't it something worth celebrating that we have the works of BOTH John Bonham AND Neil Peart to enjoy? That's a much better thing to ponder, than who's "better".

[syrinxpriest 2112]

QUOTE (Presto-digitation @ Feb 9 2007, 08:10 AM)

QUOTE (Earthshine @ Feb 9 2007, 12:55 AM) They really can't be compared. John was an influence on Neil, but you can't hear much of it. John was a more of a free player with tons of feel, whereas Neil is a very disciplined and organized player who will play the song almost exactly the same each time. Bonzo would often play fills totally different than on the original version of songs. Both approaches have merit and I think that both approaches are appropriate for each of their bands and styles. John was a tremendous drummer. If it were not for John, many of today's  players would not be doing what they are doing. Same with Neil. He has paved the way for many drummers as well. So they are both equal, but in different ways. I agree with this post.   In the end, don't sell Bonham short. I'm pretty certain Peart wouldn't. The man is the quintessential hard rock/metal drummer...and one of the biggest influences the genre has ever known.   Peart is the greatest because he's the complete package...disciplined with timing, a full range percussionist on all levels...always striving to learn more, improve himself. Almost compulsively and obsessively so.   Bonham was just a natural, who went by feel and energy.   Neil Peart is Peyton Manning to Bonham's Terry Bradshaw. That's the best way I can put it. Don't get me wrong, i'm a huge zeppelin fan and i think that john was one of the best drummers in rock. He just wasn't as good in terms of drumming as Neil.

[lerxt1990]

QUOTE (paganoman @ Feb 9 2007, 12:45 PM)

btw:  Isn't it something worth celebrating that we have the works of BOTH John Bonham AND Neil Peart to enjoy?  That's a much better thing to ponder, than who's "better".

I celebrate their whole catalog, just like Michael Bolton!

http://www.tvsquad.com/media/2006/05/bob1a.jpg

Edited February 9, 2007 by lerxt1990

[Tick]

you have to give the edge to the guy that is still alive, imo.

[ReRushed]

Neil Peart is the perfect drummer for Rush and John Bonham is the perfect drummer for Led Zeppelin, for that matter, Ringo Starr is the perfect drummer for The Beatles. Why compare? It's all great music.

[lerxt1990]

QUOTE (tick @ Feb 9 2007, 04:10 PM)

you have to give the edge to the guy that is still alive, imo.

that makes no sense....

[lerxt1990]

QUOTE (ReRushed @ Feb 9 2007, 04:17 PM)

Neil Peart is the perfect drummer for Rush and John Bonham is the perfect drummer for Led Zeppelin, for that matter, Ringo Starr is the perfect drummer for The Beatles. Why compare? It's all great music.

True. Except for the Ringo part...

[troutman]

QUOTE (Maddy @ Feb 8 2007, 05:25 PM)

They're both so much in their own league that it's hard to compare them, I think.

I have a hard time with this one. I enjoy them both very much for different reasons.

[PuppetKing2112]

It's funny, I was just having this discussion with a friend of mine who's a drummer and likes Neil Peart, but thinks Bonham is better. I lent him my Rio DVD because he said he had never really ever listened to Rush but had seen some of Neil's solos.

 

I generally think it's pointless to compare the technical abilities of musicians. As long as what they play is good for the music they play, that's enough.

[JohnnyBlaze]

QUOTE (syrinxpriest 2112 @ Feb 9 2007, 08:13 PM)

QUOTE (JohnnyBlaze @ Feb 8 2007, 09:31 PM) syrinx, your friend likes LZ more than Rush and he's probably not a drummer, yah?  If so, then convincing him that Peart is better than Bonham may be impossible. actually he's been playing drums for deveral years. Surprising

[Weakly Criminal]

The only comparison I would make between them is that John Bonham was the Neil Peart of drinking. Let's just all be happy that Bonhams' only influence on Pratt was musically.

 

Oh, and Peart most certainly does groove! Just not as often as Bonzo did due to the different musical styles of the bands.

[Grace2Grace]

Neil could never do anything like the drumming in "Rock and Roll"

[Netboy]

I will state objectively that although John Bonham is a very good drummer, but Neil is better. Bonham has a lot of rhythm, or as others described as "feel." But, like many drummers does not inspire. In this case, drumming sounds like a great deal of rhythmic noise with no detail and eccentricity.

 

Besides, Neil has all those attributes of "feel" as well as being very technical, combining many disciplines of drumming. Perhaps, at some point (60's?) there was a shift in rock music, concentrating more on "feel" then on the "technical." Thus, Neil does not get noticed by the normal mainstream. Sure, he is consistently recognized as on top by other rock drummers or aficionados. But, if you ask any average rock music listener they will say: "Neil who?" I know this because the situation has risen many times in music conversations with me winding up saying "never mind."

Edited February 10, 2007 by Netboy

[darrenhigh]

these sorts of comparisons are pointless. might as well say carbon is a better element than hydrogen. they're both great drummers with unique styles and I love listening to each of them for different reasons. I think if you spend your time ranking musicians or bands, you're probably not really listening to them.

[lerxt1990]

QUOTE (darrenhigh @ Feb 10 2007, 10:21 AM)

these sorts of comparisons are pointless. might as well say carbon is a better element than hydrogen. they're both great drummers with unique styles and I love listening to each of them for different reasons. I think if you spend your time ranking musicians or bands, you're probably not really listening to them.

F-ck that, Carbon kicks the crap out of Hydrogen! Cmon - polymorphs man, diamond, graphite, buckyballs, nanotubes....

 

CARBON RULES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[D-13]

They are only 2 different kinds of music! my god. Theres no comparison!

[liquidcrystalcompass]

QUOTE (Ya_Big_Tree @ Feb 9 2007, 12:28 PM)

I don't hate Neil Peart's drumming but I find his drum solos to be always the same. He doesn't spice it up by doing anythign different when they preform live. John Bonham on the other hand, yes his style is very different from Rush but his solos were always different and he also composed one of the best drum solos ever in the recording of Moby Dick Live. But that's just IMHO.

Neil's solos are always the same????????? Huh?

[Finbar]

QUOTE (lerxt1990 @ Feb 9 2007, 04:08 PM)

QUOTE (paganoman @ Feb 9 2007, 12:45 PM) btw:  Isn't it something worth celebrating that we have the works of BOTH John Bonham AND Neil Peart to enjoy?  That's a much better thing to ponder, than who's "better". I celebrate their whole catalog, just like Michael Bolton! http://www.tvsquad.com/media/2006/05/bob1a.jpg "I gotta admit, I'm a Michael Bolton fan."

[Finbar]

QUOTE (PuppetKing2112 @ Feb 9 2007, 07:53 PM)

I generally think it's pointless to compare the technical abilities of musicians. As long as what they play is good for the music they play, that's enough.

True dat...

 

But I think the greatest rock musicians are the ones who act like jazz musicians. They may or may not have their own band, but they make lots of important contributions to many different great musical acts. Guys like Bill Bruford, Les Claypool, Adrian Belew, Cozy Powell, etc.

If these debates should occur, it should be about these guys, not about guys who just do one thing well.

 

I don't even know why people call Neil Peart the world's best rock drummer for. I think it's just become a hipster thing to say, like, "Uh oh, I better say this guy's the best drummer ever or people will think I don't know dick about music." Well sorry. If you don't own any Rush and you've never sat through a full listen of 2112, Moving Pictures, Permanent Waves or Grace Under Pressure, you don't know that he's the best drummer ever. Go out and buy some Rush and support what you're saying if you're gonna say that!

[Finbar]

QUOTE (liquidcrystalcompass @ Feb 10 2007, 12:01 PM)

QUOTE (Ya_Big_Tree @ Feb 9 2007, 12:28 PM) I don't hate Neil Peart's drumming but I find his drum solos to be always the same. He doesn't spice it up by doing anythign different when they preform live. John Bonham on the other hand, yes his style is very different from Rush but his solos were always different and he also composed one of the best drum solos ever in the recording of Moby Dick Live. But that's just IMHO. Neil's solos are always the same????????? Huh? It's true. They really are.   It's one of the few things that turned me off about Rush getting into them.

[Rush!]

QUOTE (Ya_Big_Tree @ Feb 9 2007, 12:28 PM)

He doesn't spice it up by doing anything different when they preform live.

I completely agree. Neil has been drumming for long enough now that he could come up with some new solos and don't make them as long. I mean after 9 minutes it gets a little tedious, at least for me. My favorite live solo of his that I've heard so far is the solo on Working Man/Finding My Way on ATWAS. He ripped on that one.