Alice In Chains - Rainier Fog [2018]

[J2112YYZ]

On my third listen now and everything is starting to click with me more. Definitely an album that needs a handful of listens to fully appreciate.

[stoopid]

I'm

On my third listen now and everything is starting to click with me more. Definitely an album that needs a handful of listens to fully appreciate.

 

I'm further along than that (maybe 6 or 7 listens now, it's on repeat in the car) and I'm starting to develop favorites. That's a decent sign. There's still a couple songs that are very samey to some prior recent material.

[Fridge]

What annoys me is that they insist on harmonies every f***ing song......Duvall is a great singer and is more than capable of being the "lead".....Cantrell should step back a bit.

[J2112YYZ]

What annoys me is that they insist on harmonies every f***ing song......Duvall is a great singer and is more than capable of being the "lead".....Cantrell should step back a bit.

 

I always figured they were doing this as a way for some fans to accept that Layne isn't there anymore by giving them a familiar voice with Cantrell.

[Fridge]

What annoys me is that they insist on harmonies every f***ing song......Duvall is a great singer and is more than capable of being the "lead".....Cantrell should step back a bit.

 

I always figured they were doing this as a way for some fans to accept that Layne isn't there anymore by giving them a familiar voice with Cantrell.

 

Well if that's the case I think it's a sackless choice and diminishes the songs a bit...Duvall is nearly as good as Layne was, and it would benefit their material to have some soaring vocals.

[J2112YYZ]

What annoys me is that they insist on harmonies every f***ing song......Duvall is a great singer and is more than capable of being the "lead".....Cantrell should step back a bit.

 

I always figured they were doing this as a way for some fans to accept that Layne isn't there anymore by giving them a familiar voice with Cantrell.

 

Well if that's the case I think it's a sackless choice and diminishes the songs a bit...Duvall is nearly as good as Layne was, and it would benefit their material to have some soaring vocals.

 

That's just speculation on my part. I don't know if that's the real reason the harmonies are done most of the time now. If that is the reason it made sense to do that on Black Gives Way To Blue. I agree that Duvall should be doing more solo singing on these albums.

[Presto-digitation]

I like it better than the last one. Been in my car on constant rotation.

[stoopid]

... it's a sackless choice...

 

lol That comment made my day. :P

 

Agree that the harmonies are a bit overdone.

[Union 5-3992]

What annoys me is that they insist on harmonies every f***ing song......Duvall is a great singer and is more than capable of being the "lead".....Cantrell should step back a bit.

 

I always figured they were doing this as a way for some fans to accept that Layne isn't there anymore by giving them a familiar voice with Cantrell.

 

Well if that's the case I think it's a sackless choice and diminishes the songs a bit...Duvall is nearly as good as Layne was, and it would benefit their material to have some soaring vocals.

 

That's just speculation on my part. I don't know if that's the real reason the harmonies are done most of the time now. If that is the reason it made sense to do that on Black Gives Way To Blue. I agree that Duvall should be doing more solo singing on these albums.

I heard it was more because Jerry is more comfortable doing lead now since he's released and toured a few solo albums

[J2112YYZ]

I've grown to like this album a lot after multiple listens now. 'Maybe' has become a big favorite.

[cygnify]

I finally got around to giving this disc some dedicated listen time - I quite like it. I wouldn't call it epic; it doesn't have the impact for me that Dirt did when it came out (and that was epic!) but I wouldn't lump it in as same old same old either. I liked BGWTB (gave it a 6/10) - and I liked TDPDH even more (gave it 7.5/10) - not sure yet where this one will end up. Upon first listen, it didn't click - but after a few spins, and particularly at 4 am driving home from a gig, it hit the spot. I agree with Fridge's comment about too many harmony vocals on these tracks. My favorites are Red Giant, Drone, Deaf Ears Blind Eyes, Never Fade - and So Far Under has a classic AIC sound. All I Am is very cool too, as is The One You Know. "Maybe" struck me as a little funny vocally, but is somehow really catchy. All in all a solid effort with potential to grow even more - I'm going to see the band later in October.

[J2112YYZ]

I finally got around to giving this disc some dedicated listen time - I quite like it. I wouldn't call it epic; it doesn't have the impact for me that Dirt did when it came out (and that was epic!) but I wouldn't lump it in as same old same old either. I liked BGWTB (gave it a 6/10) - and I liked TDPDH even more (gave it 7.5/10) - not sure yet where this one will end up. Upon first listen, it didn't click - but after a few spins, and particularly at 4 am driving home from a gig, it hit the spot. I agree with Fridge's comment about too many harmony vocals on these tracks. My favorites are Red Giant, Drone, Deaf Ears Blind Eyes, Never Fade - and So Far Under has a classic AIC sound. All I Am is very cool too, as is The One You Know. "Maybe" struck me as a little funny vocally, but is somehow really catchy. All in all a solid effort with potential to grow even more - I'm going to see the band later in October.

 

Yeah, it's not an epic album but still enjoyable with a lot of very good melodies. You're not gonna get anything too different from the usual from AIC now. They have their own sound and stick with it. I see nothing wrong with that.

[stoopid]

I liked BGWTB (gave it a 6/10) - and I liked TDPDH even more (gave it 7.5/10) - not sure yet where this one will end up...

 

It's fallen right between for me.

[J2112YYZ]

Yeah, I like it better than the last album but not as much as Black Gives Way To Blue. They're all good songs but nothing on the level of songs like Last Of My Kind, Your Decision, A Looking In View, Acid Bubble or Private Hell.

[RUSHHEAD666]

I bought it like a fool.

 

Turned it off half way through the first song

 

 

No Layne. NO DICE!!! FUCKKING JUNK BAND!

 

Thank God I saw the real Alice In Chains.

 

Opened for OZZY.

 

Layne was in a wheelchair with a broken leg. Still kicked ass!!!!!!!

 

f**k FAKE MALICE IN FLAMES

[RUSHHEAD666]

They might as well bring Mother Love Bone back without Wood.

 

SO DUMB!!!!!

[Fridge]

They might as well bring Mother Love Bone back without Wood.

 

SO DUMB!!!!!

 

To be fair, Layne was the one who let them down by his inability to control his addiction.

 

As I've said before, if Duvall was allowed to sing "lead" more it would be a lot better...he's almost as good as Layne, with the added bonus of being a good guitar player.

 

 

 

Is this as good as Layne?.....maybe not quite but it's damn close.

[J2112YYZ]

They might as well bring Mother Love Bone back without Wood.

 

SO DUMB!!!!!

 

To be fair, Layne was the one who let them down by his inability to control his addiction.

 

As I've said before, if Duvall was allowed to sing "lead" more it would be a lot better...he's almost as good as Layne, with the added bonus of being a good guitar player.

 

 

 

Is this as good as Layne?.....maybe not quite but it's damn close.

 

Exactly.

 

As much as we all love Layne, he did let the band down. He's the one who lived in hiding and refused any help in his final few years. The band had every right to continue. Plus, when Cantrell decided to start the band again he did things the right way. He got the blessing of Layne's mother and they toured for a few years with Duvall before they released an album so the fans could get to know the new guy a little bit.

 

Duvall kills it live on the old stuff. Which makes it more of a mystery as to why on the albums he doesn't do more solo singing.

[Entre_Perpetuo]

The tunes aren't bad on this one. I can hear them trying to pull the surprise twists and turns that define a lot of the meat of Dirt on many cuts. The vocals are performed well. Duvall has a fine voice that isn't far from Staley's, but isn't identical either. Some solid riffs and emotive leads as well, and the band isn't exactly lazing about.

 

That all sounds well and fine, but the album itself doesn't. A lot of it feels totally washed out in production. I'm not talking too much layering of parts to the point of indecipherability. I mean the mixing, mastering, heck maybe even the engineering, is sub par at best. The sounds you get on this record are often mushy and distant. As some have pointed out the constant abuse of harmony vocals don't really help this issue, but I'd argue it's not limited to the vocals. Even at the points where Duvall does get to sing solo, his voice has not definition in the mix. It's treated like just another guitar layer or bass track, unhighlighted. What's the point of having a lead vocal if it isn't taking the lead? The guitar solos are given better treatment than this, gliding over the backing track, so obviously the vocals could've been emphasized more. Perhaps their idea of emphasis was to fill out most verses and choruses in full harmony, but this only serves to muddy the mix more and make the vocals even less distinct. But again, this isn't an issue with the vocals alone. At times I could hear there was no more going on than bass, drums, a guitar or two, and a vocal line, but somehow the overall effect was closer to Devin Townsend Project's Transcendance than Dirt. Maybe it's too much reverb, too much echo, too much playing around in the studio rather than hitting record and playing through the song? I'm all for using the studio as an instrument; my favorite band is Queen. But every time you add a new sound, you need to consider how it will impact the whole, and especially how it will affect the listening experience. Will more reverb on the guitar make it sound cooler or drown out the bass? Will mixing the backing track and vocals evenly make it sound more organic or more muddy?

 

It's a good album musically. I'd love to see their live show as I bet some of these tunes (Fly, Drone) really kick butt given the same treatment as their classics. But the production alone keeps it far out of my top ten of the year, and that makes it a very frustrating release for me.

[Entre_Perpetuo]

The tunes aren't bad on this one. I can hear them trying to pull the surprise twists and turns that define a lot of the meat of Dirt on many cuts. The vocals are performed well. Duvall has a fine voice that isn't far from Staley's, but isn't identical either. Some solid riffs and emotive leads as well, and the band isn't exactly lazing about.

 

That all sounds well and fine, but the album itself doesn't. A lot of it feels totally washed out in production. I'm not talking too much layering of parts to the point of indecipherability. I mean the mixing, mastering, heck maybe even the engineering, is sub par at best. The sounds you get on this record are often mushy and distant. As some have pointed out the constant abuse of harmony vocals don't really help this issue, but I'd argue it's not limited to the vocals. Even at the points where Duvall does get to sing solo, his voice has not definition in the mix. It's treated like just another guitar layer or bass track, unhighlighted. What's the point of having a lead vocal if it isn't taking the lead? The guitar solos are given better treatment than this, gliding over the backing track, so obviously the vocals could've been emphasized more. Perhaps their idea of emphasis was to fill out most verses and choruses in full harmony, but this only serves to muddy the mix more and make the vocals even less distinct. But again, this isn't an issue with the vocals alone. At times I could hear there was no more going on than bass, drums, a guitar or two, and a vocal line, but somehow the overall effect was closer to Devin Townsend Project's Transcendance than Dirt. Maybe it's too much reverb, too much echo, too much playing around in the studio rather than hitting record and playing through the song? I'm all for using the studio as an instrument; my favorite band is Queen. But every time you add a new sound, you need to consider how it will impact the whole, and especially how it will affect the listening experience. Will more reverb on the guitar make it sound cooler or drown out the bass? Will mixing the backing track and vocals evenly make it sound more organic or more muddy?

 

It's a good album musically. I'd love to see their live show as I bet some of these tunes (Fly, Drone) really kick butt given the same treatment as their classics. But the production alone keeps it far out of my top ten of the year, and that makes it a very frustrating release for me.

 

Okay, on my second listen. I was a little harsh.

 

The sound is mostly fine, just really everything serves to drown out the vocals, which are already not nearly nimble enough with the constant use of harmonies. Also to me the drums seem peculiarly quiet. The levels just aren't befitting of a record by such a big ticket band. The vocals aren't flattering, they always sound overproduced. The rhythm guitar is too loud for the drums. The bass plays some cool ideas that also get sucked up in the rhythm guitar. The levels, the levels. I don't appreciate the mix, or the sound of the vocals. That's all it really comes down to.

[stoopid]

Duvall kills it live on the old stuff. Which makes it more of a mystery as to why on the albums he doesn't do more solo singing.

 

Just a theory... but it's one thing to play/cop someone else's parts, it's another to be the writer of those parts. Perhaps Duvall isn't of the same mindset or skill level with regards to creating original vocal melodies. There's a million youtube channels of people playing other people's music, some extremely good at replicating it. Many of them don't have their own music. They don't even try. The difference between being in a cover band, and being the band covered [no offense intended cygnify ;) ].

Edited September 18, 2018 by stoopid

[cygnify]

The difference between being in a cover band, and being the band covered [no offense intended cygnify ;) ].

 

Hahaha LOL! Not even close to offense taken. (FWIW, I've played in many original bands and have discs out there - I'll send you a link if you like.) Very valid point about Duvall. I suspect he does have some songwriting skills though as evidenced by "So Far Under" which is pretty darn cool. It is Cantell's band and he is controlling a majority of the songwriting direction. If they're Jerry's songs and lyrics, he is likely going to sing them. AIC is not going to take a new direction; they have their distinctive sound and surely they are going to respect that. Duvall's limited contributions have pretty well fallen in line with that tradition - maybe his other songs don't cut it as AIC songs. The vocal harmonies are certainly distinctive for AIC; they may have pushed that too much on this one. Overall, I like the songs and it works for me.

[RUSHHEAD666]

They might as well bring Mother Love Bone back without Wood.

 

SO DUMB!!!!!

 

To be fair, Layne was the one who let them down by his inability to control his addiction.

 

As I've said before, if Duvall was allowed to sing "lead" more it would be a lot better...he's almost as good as Layne, with the added bonus of being a good guitar player.

 

 

 

Is this as good as Layne?.....maybe not quite but it's damn close.

 

Fair enough! No argument from me Fridge. Your opinions have always been spot on and cool!

[Fridge]

Duvall kills it live on the old stuff. Which makes it more of a mystery as to why on the albums he doesn't do more solo singing.

 

Just a theory... but it's one thing to play/cop someone else's parts, it's another to be the writer of those parts. Perhaps Duvall isn't of the same mindset or skill level with regards to creating original vocal melodies. There's a million youtube channels of people playing other people's music, some extremely good at replicating it. Many of them don't have their own music. They don't even try. The difference between being in a cover band, and being the band covered [no offense intended cygnify ;) ].

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_DuVall

 

 

However, he does have songwriting ability and has had a fairly lengthy musical career before AIC, as well as working with Giraffe Tongue orchestra currently.

[J2112YYZ]

Four songs from the album have made their way into the set.

 

https://www.setlist.fm/setlist/alice-in-chains/2018/comerica-theatre-phoenix-az-23e990a7.html